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Cellphone Monitoring
It seems the US can track cellphones from drones, likely based in Diego Garcia, and occasionally dispatches a Hellfire to a target identified from a drone and/or satellite.
Perhaps a number of cellphone pings were picked up and associated with the errant flight. We can expect that any information derived from such activities will be carefully sanitised. The destroyer sent out on the track most likely has at least one helicopter equipped for searching the ocean surface and underneath. |
On CNN it has been suggested that whoever turned everything off / whatever disabled everything failed only on the ACARS system. In which circumstances could the only remaining system be ACARS after a genuine accident?
After which we are now being told the plane flew in a different direction for some time. |
P-8A Poseidon
Once the P-8A gets on station in the Indian Ocean I hope we get answers quickly. It sounds to me U.S officials have more info than we know after receiving the raw radar returns from the Malaysians.
U.S. Navy to Add P-8A Poseidon Longer-Range Plane to Search Effort - China Real Time Report - WSJ |
Pretty interesting the US Navy is sending a P-8A Poseidon to the Indian Ocean. That plane is bristling with antennaes and advanced electronics for ELEINT and SIGINT and could be a vital tool in the search for electronic signatures. Clearly the search is now electronic, not visual....
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I find some of the theories with 100's of posts a bit to hard too accept, and there is no single point of failure and too many things have to line up just right. I've been reading this thread since the beginning, and I am one of the crazy ones who go thru every single post I missed after a good night sleep, I can provide some explanations, but I won't dare to speculate on what happened. Too many variables, too many things I don't know, and too many things nobody knows. Let's just hope, for a bit. Even if just for them to find the aircraft. Explanations will come much later... |
Quote from US authorities:
"Boeing offers a satellite service that can receive a stream of data during flight on how the aircraft is functioning. Malaysia Airlines didn't subscribe to that service, but the plane still had the capability of connecting with the satellite and was automatically sending pings, the official said." |
Depending on the type of surface (mountains, etc.), if you are at the limit of the radar coverage, a descend could be enough to lose the VHF communication and Transponder signal with the air traffic control.
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Long time lurker, have absolutely no experience in the industry other than by association. I'm totally in awl of the expertise and knowledge of the professionals here.
I'm inclined to believe that there was a decompression as this seems to be the most logical reason for the disappearance. I have just one question that after 150 odd pages doesn't seem to have been addressed. That is if in the early stages of hypoxia and associated confusion just how easy would it be to switch off the transponder in either error or in confusion with another procedure? ie is it just a simple switch or more elaborate process? Thanks! |
Big problem with this theory, why didn't the few passenger phones that were almost certainly on, not get a signal over Malaysia or anywhere else. Some phones very likely did register with the network if they passed in range. Passengers may have tried to use their phones if they realised there was a problem. But they may have tried to call, and voice contact would likely be fleeting. SMS is more reliable with marginal network, but I think your first instinct would be to call. Plus passengers can use (non assisted) GPS even if no network coverage - although there likely would be no external evidence of this. |
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Concord 002. It would take turning 1 rotary switch about 90 degrees ccw. So not hard at all
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Wx radar would have been on I presume as per company SOPs, as it's non passive does any one know if that Doppler could be picked up by any one or thing looking at that bandwidth at that time?
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Search Organisation
It's easy to sit back & be critical of all the various agencies presently involved with the search for the B777, but to me it does appear, the Malaysian Authorities are well out of their depth. There appears to be a division of action & responsibility between both the Military & Civilian sections Does that surprise you? At this stage, all of the local authorities appear to be running about , but doing little & achieving less. All this demonstrates, that the local agencies in Malayisia, have absolutely no idea of what happened to the missing 777 & where it is. The Thais, Vietnamese, Singaporeans, Australians, Burmese, Americans, Chinese don't know either. But everyone has to follow up every possible lead, don't they? |
knob on transponder
LAS Jayhawk: Yet, it appears that operators of the -2ER could order different avionics suites; some transponders are push-button. In that case, pushing in one button would disable the xpndr, presumably by accident or confusion.
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@Opsmarco
We're talking about low likelihood mechanical errors not human error. In such mechanistic error/systems it's always much more likely that a single problem with widespread manifestations has occurred than 2-3 unrelated problems with their own manifestations occurring simultaneously. I think this is what the OP sought to look for a single point of failure rather than numerous disparate but coincidental mechanical failures in a relatively modern and safe aircraft. With regard to human errors - then yes, often initial errors are compounded by subsequent errors by the same or different persons due to various types of cognitive bias, inexperience and situational factors. |
Reaching the end?
As someone who in his professional capacity has been closely involved in investigations and trials of both aviation and maritime casualties, I commend (as others have) the mods for keeping this forum sane in the face of perhaps repetitive, incendiary or unhelpful posts. The breadth of expertise residing here is breathtaking and the measured and knowledgable posts on technical issues ranging from VHF coverage maps to inter connectivity of electrical systems, a/c behavior and satcoms is helpful in getting to the bottom of what is going on through rapid brainstorming and analysis (and debunking) of various theories. I have been at the centre of these storms when information is coming in thick and fast, often too fast to evaluate, and have immense sympathy for the Malaysians here - particularly when their task is made all the harder by having to chase down false leads (satellite pics) or to respond on the spot to the worlds press on the status of what turn out to be irrelevant ADs for the aircraft. So don't underestimate the value of what you're doing, and please keep it coming.
Despite all the (very harsh) criticisms of early coordination efforts it does now look as if we are reaching a point where the Malaysians are being given genuine international assistance from all directions and a picture is coming together. It's not necessarily a pretty one, but if the Americans really have (remarkably) been able to isolate the pings of this aircraft's attempts to communicate even whilst out of radio coverage, then we may soon know where it, and the poor souls on board, are. |
Re turning off transponder
I believe there are 3 options for the transponder control panel, all from Gables, and all have a rotary control for mode control, such that STBY is at least a 2 position turn from the normal operating position. It certainly is NOT a simple push button or toggle switch. As a current T7 pilot previously noted, no one turns the transponder to STBY in normal ops.
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Actions for Rapid / Emergency Descent
May be a few minor differences with varying aircraft types, but basically I would think., - Oxy Masks on. - Transfonder 7700 - Throttles closed (A/T out) - Turn out of airway or away from other traffic. - Vert Speed to maintain IAS on barber's pole, initially 6000ft/min plus??? - Communicate with Cabin Crew (if possible, but may well not be an option at this time) - Maintain this config to at least 10'000ft or MSA if higher. - Assess situation & take appropriate action. Possibly of course, the very nature of the problem that required a rapid descent in the first place, may well prevent all the above actions being taken in order. |
@MrAntarctica
I agree. As you must agree that sometimes a technical fault with a very low probability of happening happens, and since the probability for that issue to arise, crew wasn't ready and did not respond the way they should (I'm speaking theoretically, as I said, I won't speculate on what happened here), starting a chain reaction... But remember also something : the Boeing 777 is an amazing aircraft, we all agree on that. But if you look at the numbers, statistically, a problem that has an extremely low probability of happening on the 777, the more aircraft fly, and the longer the model is in service, the higher the probability that same issue arises... Sorry if I wasn't clear enough, I think I better go to bed, now... |
I cannot confirm which type of XPDR is installed in the 777 in question.
With my operator we have this one on our -200s: http://i765.photobucket.com/albums/x...corel4_rsz.jpg This is the "push type" some posters are referring to. |
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