easyJet Morale Rock Bottom
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NTE, you write..
'It is high time the rostering and other people management issues at easyJet were given a good hard safety based assessment by qualified people other than those within the eJ system.'
We are, they are called the CAA! They conduct regular audits of all UK airlines and it includes an evaluation of rostering practice and FTL records.
Further, you make the allegation that crewing are insisting crews go into discretion, do you honestly believe we have Captain's who are so weak willed as to bend over on this subject at the whim of a crewing officer? You may be fooling yourself but I doubt you're fooling anyone else who reads these pages. I don't believe you do have any evidence to this fact, but if you do, report it to your base manager, and we'll pull the tapes in the investigation.
'It is high time the rostering and other people management issues at easyJet were given a good hard safety based assessment by qualified people other than those within the eJ system.'
We are, they are called the CAA! They conduct regular audits of all UK airlines and it includes an evaluation of rostering practice and FTL records.
Further, you make the allegation that crewing are insisting crews go into discretion, do you honestly believe we have Captain's who are so weak willed as to bend over on this subject at the whim of a crewing officer? You may be fooling yourself but I doubt you're fooling anyone else who reads these pages. I don't believe you do have any evidence to this fact, but if you do, report it to your base manager, and we'll pull the tapes in the investigation.
Last edited by no sig; 25th Oct 2002 at 17:17.
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Crewing may not be insisting, but to have " If you can't do this duty then the flight will be cancelled" is far from satisfactory! Have crewing been instructed to stop this.
Oh then there is the perpetual problem of having your rest disrupted by incoming calls on you Day Off. Roster changes..........
Oh then there is the perpetual problem of having your rest disrupted by incoming calls on you Day Off. Roster changes..........
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I don't work for easyJet but have seen this issue of 'perceived pressure' raise its ugly head in other airlines. It is insidious and usually stems from board level via the media of 'compliant' senior middle management.
Good examples are, refusing (or delaying) command opportunities, getting rostering to give you a hard line, enquiries about the cause of sick leave and issues of basing . Other tactics are sarcastic remarks in the simulator or the odd little comment from a line manager.
These tactics are quite effective at keeping pilots in line. We are, lets face it, a relatively easy group to control!
The nub of this problem is that it can lead to muddled thinking on safety issues. If you are thinking of going into discretion (or perhaps not putting something in the tech log on the last sector home . . .) then the only issue is safety. No one would support you with the argument that 'I was trying to keep things going for the company'
'no sig' makes mention of the CAA and FTL issues. I have only known the CAA intervene in extremis. They too seem interested more in legalities than sorting out working practices. Being even handed with rival airlines might be an issue when addressing a particular FTL for example.
Of course, a well run airline gets the job done with the use of good practice and management. If only there were more of them.
So what can you do to effect change for the better in these airlines?
Well. leave of course.
Joining BALPA and supporting the CC - providing they too are not trying to feather their nests.
For your own interest never, never break a safety rule or do anything to compromise the validity of your licence.
Good examples are, refusing (or delaying) command opportunities, getting rostering to give you a hard line, enquiries about the cause of sick leave and issues of basing . Other tactics are sarcastic remarks in the simulator or the odd little comment from a line manager.
These tactics are quite effective at keeping pilots in line. We are, lets face it, a relatively easy group to control!
The nub of this problem is that it can lead to muddled thinking on safety issues. If you are thinking of going into discretion (or perhaps not putting something in the tech log on the last sector home . . .) then the only issue is safety. No one would support you with the argument that 'I was trying to keep things going for the company'
'no sig' makes mention of the CAA and FTL issues. I have only known the CAA intervene in extremis. They too seem interested more in legalities than sorting out working practices. Being even handed with rival airlines might be an issue when addressing a particular FTL for example.
Of course, a well run airline gets the job done with the use of good practice and management. If only there were more of them.
So what can you do to effect change for the better in these airlines?
Well. leave of course.
Joining BALPA and supporting the CC - providing they too are not trying to feather their nests.
For your own interest never, never break a safety rule or do anything to compromise the validity of your licence.
Last edited by Yarpy; 26th Oct 2002 at 08:01.
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Hear Hear BTB,
It is surprising that this thread still exists on the "front page" - perhaps if it was any other company the moderators would have seen fit to move it?
Ah well that's what censorship's all about I s'pose.
It is surprising that this thread still exists on the "front page" - perhaps if it was any other company the moderators would have seen fit to move it?
Ah well that's what censorship's all about I s'pose.
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You missed the point Karaoke, censorship comes in many forms.
At times it is more significant as to what is not censored, than what is. There is no doubt that this particular whinge thread has been left on the front page for a specific reason - IMHO.
The thread is neither newsworthy, nor is it the grist of the rumourmill - it is simply a succession of complainants whinging about what is wrong with their particular employer - in their own opinion.
Ipso Facto it is not likely to be reliable reporting (in so far as there is balance represented in the viewpoints) and would be more appropriately placed on the company forum.
Again it's only my opinion and I agree entirely with the freedom of speech principle, however you have to consider that this is a Global forum. As such, you have to ask yourself the question does the average pilot on the other side of the world, really want to read about the alleged poor rostering during the summer season of a shorthaul Low Cost operator in Europe?
At times it is more significant as to what is not censored, than what is. There is no doubt that this particular whinge thread has been left on the front page for a specific reason - IMHO.
The thread is neither newsworthy, nor is it the grist of the rumourmill - it is simply a succession of complainants whinging about what is wrong with their particular employer - in their own opinion.
Ipso Facto it is not likely to be reliable reporting (in so far as there is balance represented in the viewpoints) and would be more appropriately placed on the company forum.
Again it's only my opinion and I agree entirely with the freedom of speech principle, however you have to consider that this is a Global forum. As such, you have to ask yourself the question does the average pilot on the other side of the world, really want to read about the alleged poor rostering during the summer season of a shorthaul Low Cost operator in Europe?
Join Date: Dec 2001
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Mad Max,
Utter B*ll*x mate. Most of the people posting on this thread appear to be EASYJET EMPLOYEES
If you want this thread to die, stop posting on it. You (for one) have now ensured it remains right there at the top for at LEAST another couple of days.
If easyjet guys want to wash their dirty laundry in public so be it.
Personally I have found it very informative as an indicator of the current status of the Low Cost sector, and current management policies during the takeover of GO.
I notice you havn't been defending your employer with your usual enthusiasm.
Utter B*ll*x mate. Most of the people posting on this thread appear to be EASYJET EMPLOYEES
If you want this thread to die, stop posting on it. You (for one) have now ensured it remains right there at the top for at LEAST another couple of days.
If easyjet guys want to wash their dirty laundry in public so be it.
Personally I have found it very informative as an indicator of the current status of the Low Cost sector, and current management policies during the takeover of GO.
I notice you havn't been defending your employer with your usual enthusiasm.
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MAD MAX
As a pilot with a different airline, I'd like to say that this thread is interesting, usefull and informative. Don't you like to keep up with what's going on in the rest of the industry?
As a pilot with a different airline, I'd like to say that this thread is interesting, usefull and informative. Don't you like to keep up with what's going on in the rest of the industry?
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Thanks for the abuse your majesty – I will try not to take it personally 
The point is that this thread is not news and it is in the wrong place. The administrators of this forum are obviously aware of that and therefore we are left to our own conclusions as to why they do not wish to move it. As it says in big letters on the way in here – everybody has their own agenda. (Or words to that effect).
As far as my defending my employer is concerned, I do not feel that I have to do that. Let the facts speak for themselves. Look at the company growth rate (including IPO) over the last few years and tell me it’s not a success story.
No company is perfect of course and I for one have witnessed many imperfections in this company, as I have in others I have worked for before. Although I have moved companies several times in the past, I, like many of my colleagues who have been employed from the early days, am still here. On balance I can say that there have been (and still are) plenty of worse places to work.
As usual the vocal minority with strongly felt opinions may appear to be speaking for us all. However, you’ve got to say, that if it was really SO bad as they (NTE & others) make out, then the airline would be unable to operate its aircraft as the majority of the drivers would have voted with their feet!
How many of EZY’s pilots have left in the last 12 months? The answer is very few. The reason cannot be entirely attributable to the effects of 9/11. Note that the company does not seem to feel the need currently to accept DECs, instead they are planning to promote all of their 2003 Commanders from within. With perhaps another 12 or so airframes on the way this coming year, that is another 150 pilot jobs created – all the new Commands from pilots already employed in the right-hand seat!
As far as news of what’s happening in the Low Cost Sector, maybe you’re right – this thread’s just the place to find out how the LCAs are eating into territory held by the “Trads”. There is only one way to do short-haul and make a profit and that is the way we are doing it – the writing’s on the wall.
So as far I am concerned, in respect of adverse comment from a minority, it’s not so much a case of Nil Taurus Excretus, more like Nil Carborundum Illegitimae!
Cheers, Max
The point is that this thread is not news and it is in the wrong place. The administrators of this forum are obviously aware of that and therefore we are left to our own conclusions as to why they do not wish to move it. As it says in big letters on the way in here – everybody has their own agenda. (Or words to that effect).
As far as my defending my employer is concerned, I do not feel that I have to do that. Let the facts speak for themselves. Look at the company growth rate (including IPO) over the last few years and tell me it’s not a success story.
No company is perfect of course and I for one have witnessed many imperfections in this company, as I have in others I have worked for before. Although I have moved companies several times in the past, I, like many of my colleagues who have been employed from the early days, am still here. On balance I can say that there have been (and still are) plenty of worse places to work.
As usual the vocal minority with strongly felt opinions may appear to be speaking for us all. However, you’ve got to say, that if it was really SO bad as they (NTE & others) make out, then the airline would be unable to operate its aircraft as the majority of the drivers would have voted with their feet!
How many of EZY’s pilots have left in the last 12 months? The answer is very few. The reason cannot be entirely attributable to the effects of 9/11. Note that the company does not seem to feel the need currently to accept DECs, instead they are planning to promote all of their 2003 Commanders from within. With perhaps another 12 or so airframes on the way this coming year, that is another 150 pilot jobs created – all the new Commands from pilots already employed in the right-hand seat!
As far as news of what’s happening in the Low Cost Sector, maybe you’re right – this thread’s just the place to find out how the LCAs are eating into territory held by the “Trads”. There is only one way to do short-haul and make a profit and that is the way we are doing it – the writing’s on the wall.
So as far I am concerned, in respect of adverse comment from a minority, it’s not so much a case of Nil Taurus Excretus, more like Nil Carborundum Illegitimae!
Cheers, Max
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Max
I don't disagree with most of the stuff you say, except the paranoid notion that the moderators of this site have some "agenda" against easyjet (bearing in mind at least two of the moderators work for easyjet)
Looking down the current list of topics on page one of this forum, I see similar discussions involving Virgin , KLMUK, BA/Sabena, Delsey, and MyTravel.
I suspect this thread will shortly be binned anyway as it appears to have wandered into a discussion on PPRuNe Editorial policy.
I'll try not to mention the fact that I've read (or even contributed to) this thread when I go for my interview in the next few weeks.
I don't disagree with most of the stuff you say, except the paranoid notion that the moderators of this site have some "agenda" against easyjet (bearing in mind at least two of the moderators work for easyjet)
Looking down the current list of topics on page one of this forum, I see similar discussions involving Virgin , KLMUK, BA/Sabena, Delsey, and MyTravel.
I suspect this thread will shortly be binned anyway as it appears to have wandered into a discussion on PPRuNe Editorial policy.
I'll try not to mention the fact that I've read (or even contributed to) this thread when I go for my interview in the next few weeks.
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How many easyJet employees have left in the last twelve months? - not many we are informed.
How many easyJet employees will leave within the next twelve months? Who knows - although I hear Channel Express are awash with applications from easyJet flight crews. Manchester and Leeds/Bradford bases for their new low-cost start-up "Fly To", or so the rumour goes! (Philip Meeson speaking on local radio apparently).
How many easyJet employees will leave within the next twelve months? Who knows - although I hear Channel Express are awash with applications from easyJet flight crews. Manchester and Leeds/Bradford bases for their new low-cost start-up "Fly To", or so the rumour goes! (Philip Meeson speaking on local radio apparently).
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I have to say Mad Max's protestations are a bit much! easyJet love publicity, good or bad! You only have to see the TV programme 'Airline' to see that! A naff TV programme, telephone numbers all over the side of their aircraft and their (previous) Chairman always seen protesting outside banks, protesting about Luton Airport, about the governments airport tax, etc..
Mad Max I think you aren't in line with your management. They love publicity and would love this thread!
Mad Max I think you aren't in line with your management. They love publicity and would love this thread!
