BA CityFlyer driver jailed for dodgy logbook
The look on someone’s face who is pressing the APU off button without external power, then realises as it’s pressed in and has the presence of mind not to release it…
stuck there like the kid with his finger in the Dutch dyke.
stuck there like the kid with his finger in the Dutch dyke.
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I did the same on a classic 747 many years ago. Having just got back into the seat after a couple of hours kip on a long range to JNB (I had literally just got back in the seat). A member of Cabin Crew asked for first aid oxygen. Well I moved the wrong switch and the whole lot came down, including of course the automatic announcement.
It was then that I learned there are some switches you can move, but if you think you have moved the wrong switch, or moved the switch in error, you can just move it back again - not so with the pax oxy switch.
An interview without tea and biccies for me back at LHR - and rightly so.
Kind regards
Exeng
It was then that I learned there are some switches you can move, but if you think you have moved the wrong switch, or moved the switch in error, you can just move it back again - not so with the pax oxy switch.
An interview without tea and biccies for me back at LHR - and rightly so.
Kind regards
Exeng
Incidentally , I believe that I know all about the character Olster referred to in post 24: "Long haul Walter Mitty type gets fired from very well known uk long haul airline for logbook falsification. No prosecution as the ceo a very well known Uk entrepreneur with prior links to the record industry didn’t want adverse publicity. Some years later miscreant reappears on a training course for wannabe instructors working for well known but now defunct holiday airline.".
If in fact he was the same character, he was interviewed by said "holiday airline" management who had been tipped off and asked him outright if it was true. Wisely he confessed. Unwisely they gave him a second chance. I say unwisely because although very capable, he went on to confirming what a total a*se of an individual he clearly was. Instead of keeping a low profile and quietly beavering away and serving his time, to regain some credibility, within months of joining, he applied for everything going and could not be more high profile if he tried. This included applications for Management and Training positions as well BALPA council chair to boot. His original misdemeanour was actually "boosting" P1 hours to achieve level required for command upgrade course.
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I've seen several doubtful flying hours and promotions to Captain related to the noticeably youthful age of the pilots. It happens repeatedly as long as there is no centralized register of the authorities, where airlines can check the qualification. It's sad, but nowadays trust becomes increasingly a risk for airlines and it's clients....
Had to deal with the aftermath of a rubber jungle deployment on a BA jumbo at LHR Terminal 1 on departure.... cabin crew had asked for passenger oxygen but fo selected emergency instead as switches were very close to each other.
Cotton gloves, cleaning wipes & talcum powder seemed to be forgotten as BA in their wisdom decided to leave the passengers on, stowing them always reminded me of trying to get 10 pounds of potatoes in a 5 pound bag & of course with a lot of people watching not easy.
Until they are deployed you don’t really realise just how many & in so many places there are!
Cotton gloves, cleaning wipes & talcum powder seemed to be forgotten as BA in their wisdom decided to leave the passengers on, stowing them always reminded me of trying to get 10 pounds of potatoes in a 5 pound bag & of course with a lot of people watching not easy.
Until they are deployed you don’t really realise just how many & in so many places there are!
As far as the switch “no pilot would press” could it have been the gear retract override? I realize pressing it does not retract the gear, but wouldn’t the attempt to press it or demonstrate its purpose warrant questioning?
One of my first instructors boasted he was an airforce pilot, he was actually an assistant on a Suffolk airfield but that didn’t stop him from working for the regulator. Last I heard was from a Concorde trainer who had overheard him boasting that he flew spits…which was challenged as obviously too young. Real Walter Mitty.
As for wrong switches I only did it once and that was during an approach at night through some nasty weather when I was ordered to put the engine anti icing on, got the right switches but turned them off. Only noticed when I was ordered to turn them off so turned one on, waited to see if said engine stopped then did the second.
As for wrong switches I only did it once and that was during an approach at night through some nasty weather when I was ordered to put the engine anti icing on, got the right switches but turned them off. Only noticed when I was ordered to turn them off so turned one on, waited to see if said engine stopped then did the second.
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safest thing is...don't touch anything, let the other guy do it and just monitor
Person Of Interest
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My question exactly. What button?
Hi there is an article in The Times (UK) today on this. Basically it says Ii've removed his name) A pilot who lied about his flying experience to get a job with British Airways was found out after pressing a button that “no qualified pilot would do”, sources have told The Times.
The pilot who has been jailed for fraud, worked for BA CityFlyer, a British Airways subsidiary, and Stobart Air, a former Aer Lingus subsidiary, between April 2016 and March 2018. He worked for each airline for about a year. He obtained work as a pilot after entering false details and altering entries in his flight logbook so it appeared that he was more experienced than he was, Snaresbrook crown court in east London was told.
He was jailed for 12 months on Monday after pleading guilty to four charges of fraud and two breaches of the Air Navigation Order 2016. Sources said that BA CityFlyer bosses became concerned about him after an incident in Switzerland in which he “pressed a button on the ground that no qualified pilot would” and they launched an internal investigation.
My question is, what was the button that the pilot pushed, that no pilot would touch??
The pilot who has been jailed for fraud, worked for BA CityFlyer, a British Airways subsidiary, and Stobart Air, a former Aer Lingus subsidiary, between April 2016 and March 2018. He worked for each airline for about a year. He obtained work as a pilot after entering false details and altering entries in his flight logbook so it appeared that he was more experienced than he was, Snaresbrook crown court in east London was told.
He was jailed for 12 months on Monday after pleading guilty to four charges of fraud and two breaches of the Air Navigation Order 2016. Sources said that BA CityFlyer bosses became concerned about him after an incident in Switzerland in which he “pressed a button on the ground that no qualified pilot would” and they launched an internal investigation.
My question is, what was the button that the pilot pushed, that no pilot would touch??
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All forgiven at J2?
Globespan which went bust in 2009, hired a FO, knowing that he had been convicted on Parker Pen flying.
It first came to light when ‘Gibbo’ was going for promotion at Airtours, claiming military flying time based on actual flights carried out. The CAA revoked his licence, & he began again from scratch. The story broke again in the Daily Express whilst at GSM. Google search will reveal further details.
Had the equivalent crime been committed in medicine, it is doubtful if the GMC would ever have restored his name to the Register?
It first came to light when ‘Gibbo’ was going for promotion at Airtours, claiming military flying time based on actual flights carried out. The CAA revoked his licence, & he began again from scratch. The story broke again in the Daily Express whilst at GSM. Google search will reveal further details.
Had the equivalent crime been committed in medicine, it is doubtful if the GMC would ever have restored his name to the Register?
This one now works for a friendly low fares airline.
I wonder if they know of his CRIMINAL history?
The Daily Express article is titled:
“Cheating pilot’s new career is flying high”
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A few folks saying the dates don’t line up for Stobart because they didn’t get the E190 until later.
They had E195s during the period reported based at Southend.
They had E195s during the period reported based at Southend.
de minimus non curat lex
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Perhaps the CAA could do some regulation by having an anonymous helpline or somesuch? Or via this link:
https://www.centreforaviationpsychol...other-services
Could concern about a colleague fall under those kinds of services? I have flown with people who IMHO couldn't have passed the ATPLs and skills tests to get them RHS on a jet. Makes you wonder...
https://www.centreforaviationpsychol...other-services
Could concern about a colleague fall under those kinds of services? I have flown with people who IMHO couldn't have passed the ATPLs and skills tests to get them RHS on a jet. Makes you wonder...
Perhaps the CAA could do some regulation by having an anonymous helpline or somesuch? Or via this link:
https://www.centreforaviationpsychol...other-services
Could concern about a colleague fall under those kinds of services? I have flown with people who IMHO couldn't have passed the ATPLs and skills tests to get them RHS on a jet. Makes you wonder...
https://www.centreforaviationpsychol...other-services
Could concern about a colleague fall under those kinds of services? I have flown with people who IMHO couldn't have passed the ATPLs and skills tests to get them RHS on a jet. Makes you wonder...
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THE TRUE STORY
The guy was grassed up.
I believe the CAA used their power to make an example of someone and deflect any accountability or responsibility in the industry that is known and rifled with 'finding a way'. Whether its the so-called 'feedback' from all the ATPL schools, yes where all the students are knowingly given the question bank and answers to all the ATPL questions. Does that mean all pilots are criminals and fraudsters from the outset for knowingly cheating ? Who hasn't 'Parker Penned' their logbook even if by 1 flight or 1 hour. Its still a crime. Is everyone's logbook fully accounted for and perfectly correct - if not its still a crime. Apparently 'everyone' glorifies their CV and application form right according to legal teams - Wrong, that's still a crime too, it doesn't matter how many people do it, it's still a fraudulent crime, according to the law and the CAA.
So what happened. C had 10 years of experience in the corporate jet world, covering, Europe, the Middle East, Eastern Europe, Africa and North Atlantic. Qualified as a Captain but left as there were no left seat jobs, as in passed his command line check as well as command ground course. BA Cityflyer were advertising for F O jobs that required 500 hours. He applied, passed the sim check, was offered the job. He did not have the aircraft weight behind him when asked about Capt opportunities but they said if he could pass the left seat sim check which was with a BA 777 Captain, then he could have the left seat job and they would waiver the weight restriction and if he failed he could still have the FO job. Who wouldn't take that opportunity? So he did, passed with flying colours, got the job, passed line training and signed off with, "he'll be an asset to the company" ! So yes, he applied for a First Officer and it was BACF that put him forward to DEC.
The button - he pressed was the transfer of APU to GPU on an Embrarer EJET, what they didn't tell you is the GPU malfunctioned and the lights went out in the Cabin for a few seconds, then the power was transferred back to APU. All this was during a bright sunny day in Zurich. The CAA's barrister reported to the judge, "the plane plunged into darkness."
THE LOGBOOK - During the internal investigation after the whistle blower, BACF told C to remove all his PICUS P1 hours saying they don't count as P1 hours. This was charge 1 - Knowingly Altering the logbook). A few weeks later C was told to put them back after BACF admitted that the hours could be used after all towards P1 hours. As he couldnt exactly remember 1000 odd flights, the equivalent hours were re-entered into the logbook to the best of his knowledge. This was charge no.2- Knowingly falsyfying flights, NOW because it was his hand that altered and entered the logbook entries, it was a fraudulent crime even though he was told to do it by the Head of Flight Operations, a training Capt himself. During that process, Excel, Data, Sort muddled up the logbook where the data sort range scrolled off the screen and was omitted from the sort process. It didn't seem to matter in court, but that is what led to the Stobart charge, them claiming the logbook was incorrect even though he had done a year as Captain at BACF. Charge no. 3
THE FAKE REFERENCE - C was unable to get a reference from his previous Corporate Jet company he worked for as in their words, "he was not an employee, only a contractor". Therefore C wrote his own reference from his own company and signed it in someone else's name. The actual information was not false. Charge no. 4
THE APPLICATION -. Some background first. Some airlines applications have columns asking for Captain/Command/PIC hours to include P1, PICUS, SPIC, PIC hours all in the same box/category. Ryanair for example.
Because C put all his P1 hours in one box like the example above, he was told that, that was the false representation. (3 month later BA now advertises their hour requirement "excluding PICUS hours")
THE FAKE CERTIFICATE - C did a command course with his previous company. The certificate was lost and it was replicated to the best of his knowledge albeit the company and dates were wrong. Even though the core information was correct, eg he had passed a Command Course, because it was not the original document, it was fraud, even though he had completed a Command course. Charge 5
So there it is folks. C's license was revoked forever and he will never fly again or get an airside pass. On top of that, all the tabloids and press published the story to make new and what the CAA told them, not how it was, all to make the news without all the facts. He has to live with that too, and then the CAA's Investigation Officer did a documentary on the BBC with their somewhat glorified and twisted version of the story to make them look good.
Fake it until you make it is a load of nonsense, it should be fake it until your caught or banged up if you think its worth the risk.
Now with the facts you can now make your own conclusions. It doesn't change what's happened, he has had the ultimate punishment of being locked up and never to fly again. "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone.” Or criticise only if you have never done any wrong, even if its just the case you havent been found out yet or caught, because that doesnt count. Even infidelity down route...! LOL
The guy was grassed up.
I believe the CAA used their power to make an example of someone and deflect any accountability or responsibility in the industry that is known and rifled with 'finding a way'. Whether its the so-called 'feedback' from all the ATPL schools, yes where all the students are knowingly given the question bank and answers to all the ATPL questions. Does that mean all pilots are criminals and fraudsters from the outset for knowingly cheating ? Who hasn't 'Parker Penned' their logbook even if by 1 flight or 1 hour. Its still a crime. Is everyone's logbook fully accounted for and perfectly correct - if not its still a crime. Apparently 'everyone' glorifies their CV and application form right according to legal teams - Wrong, that's still a crime too, it doesn't matter how many people do it, it's still a fraudulent crime, according to the law and the CAA.
So what happened. C had 10 years of experience in the corporate jet world, covering, Europe, the Middle East, Eastern Europe, Africa and North Atlantic. Qualified as a Captain but left as there were no left seat jobs, as in passed his command line check as well as command ground course. BA Cityflyer were advertising for F O jobs that required 500 hours. He applied, passed the sim check, was offered the job. He did not have the aircraft weight behind him when asked about Capt opportunities but they said if he could pass the left seat sim check which was with a BA 777 Captain, then he could have the left seat job and they would waiver the weight restriction and if he failed he could still have the FO job. Who wouldn't take that opportunity? So he did, passed with flying colours, got the job, passed line training and signed off with, "he'll be an asset to the company" ! So yes, he applied for a First Officer and it was BACF that put him forward to DEC.
The button - he pressed was the transfer of APU to GPU on an Embrarer EJET, what they didn't tell you is the GPU malfunctioned and the lights went out in the Cabin for a few seconds, then the power was transferred back to APU. All this was during a bright sunny day in Zurich. The CAA's barrister reported to the judge, "the plane plunged into darkness."
THE LOGBOOK - During the internal investigation after the whistle blower, BACF told C to remove all his PICUS P1 hours saying they don't count as P1 hours. This was charge 1 - Knowingly Altering the logbook). A few weeks later C was told to put them back after BACF admitted that the hours could be used after all towards P1 hours. As he couldnt exactly remember 1000 odd flights, the equivalent hours were re-entered into the logbook to the best of his knowledge. This was charge no.2- Knowingly falsyfying flights, NOW because it was his hand that altered and entered the logbook entries, it was a fraudulent crime even though he was told to do it by the Head of Flight Operations, a training Capt himself. During that process, Excel, Data, Sort muddled up the logbook where the data sort range scrolled off the screen and was omitted from the sort process. It didn't seem to matter in court, but that is what led to the Stobart charge, them claiming the logbook was incorrect even though he had done a year as Captain at BACF. Charge no. 3
THE FAKE REFERENCE - C was unable to get a reference from his previous Corporate Jet company he worked for as in their words, "he was not an employee, only a contractor". Therefore C wrote his own reference from his own company and signed it in someone else's name. The actual information was not false. Charge no. 4
THE APPLICATION -. Some background first. Some airlines applications have columns asking for Captain/Command/PIC hours to include P1, PICUS, SPIC, PIC hours all in the same box/category. Ryanair for example.
Because C put all his P1 hours in one box like the example above, he was told that, that was the false representation. (3 month later BA now advertises their hour requirement "excluding PICUS hours")
THE FAKE CERTIFICATE - C did a command course with his previous company. The certificate was lost and it was replicated to the best of his knowledge albeit the company and dates were wrong. Even though the core information was correct, eg he had passed a Command Course, because it was not the original document, it was fraud, even though he had completed a Command course. Charge 5
So there it is folks. C's license was revoked forever and he will never fly again or get an airside pass. On top of that, all the tabloids and press published the story to make new and what the CAA told them, not how it was, all to make the news without all the facts. He has to live with that too, and then the CAA's Investigation Officer did a documentary on the BBC with their somewhat glorified and twisted version of the story to make them look good.
Fake it until you make it is a load of nonsense, it should be fake it until your caught or banged up if you think its worth the risk.
Now with the facts you can now make your own conclusions. It doesn't change what's happened, he has had the ultimate punishment of being locked up and never to fly again. "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone.” Or criticise only if you have never done any wrong, even if its just the case you havent been found out yet or caught, because that doesnt count. Even infidelity down route...! LOL
Thanks for letting us know. I'm puzzled - it's taken you a year to give us your thoughts…. where have you been for the past year?
Is this 'inside' knowledge? Have you been out of / away from / not allowed internet access? A bit of 'time out'? Couldn't you have used a Parker pen to put down your thoughts?
It must feel good to get these idea 'out' after being having them 'locked up' for the past year.
Is this 'inside' knowledge? Have you been out of / away from / not allowed internet access? A bit of 'time out'? Couldn't you have used a Parker pen to put down your thoughts?
It must feel good to get these idea 'out' after being having them 'locked up' for the past year.
I confess to having logged what officially would be considered P-51 time, I used to do a lot of maintenance runs, some were short and some quite lengthy, my reason for putting it in the log was for my own record should a question arise in an investigation as to who was responsible, maintenance of course had their records signing off work, but no record of the pilot conducting the run, anyone who thinks ground running a helicopter is not flying, as officialdom decrees, should have another think.
