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CRJ down in Sweden

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CRJ down in Sweden

Old 8th Jan 2016, 04:03
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CRJ down in Sweden

In the early hours local radio is reporting freight plane between Oslo and Tromsö has come down in northern Sweden. A crash site has been located. Swedish registered a/c. Is Westair still flying freight in Norway with CRJs? Could be way off, not so familiar with who his doing what these days.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 04:13
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some links

A CRJ-200

Plane crashed in northern Sweden after issuing a distress call | Stuff.co.nz

https://twitter.com/flightradar24/st...534720/photo/1

Svenskt postflyg störtat i fjällen | Nyheter | Aftonbladet
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 04:23
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What a harsh location for trouble! A friend and I flew it last summer, magnificent beauty, but not somewhere you want to have to put down! While thinking of the crew, think of the job ahead for the search and rescue crews too...
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 06:56
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Crash site located

Crash site located on a mountain plateau by Norwegian Air Force F-16 between northwest corner of Lake Akkajaure (in Sweden) and the Norwegian border. "It is an obvious crash site with a diameter of 50 meters." says Daniel Lindblad, an official spokesperson for the Swedish Sjöräddningen (SAR).
Norskt postplan störtade i Sverige | Västerbottens-Kuriren

Looks like something dramatic happened. The LKP according to Flightradar24 is at FL330, there was a brief mayday, and then nothing. Let's hope the flight recorders survived.

The recovery operations may be difficult since it is mountainous terrain and the temperature is around -30C and predicted to remain so for a few days.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 07:14
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From local media in Norway:
- Aircraft lost altitude very quickly
- Crash site 9 km from Norwegian border
- 15 by 20 m crater, wreckage within 50 m radius, no large pieces
- Spanish and French crew
- Mayday just before 23:30z picked up at BOO
- Crash site found at 02:15z by RNoAF F16
- No longer a rescue mission

I'll add it's cold in the area, below -30C this morning. This is only about 60 km (due west) from the RNoAF C130 crash at Mt. Kebnekaise a few years ago.

Last edited by RYFQB; 8th Jan 2016 at 09:50. Reason: links
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 08:36
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West Atlantic press release

The aircraft departed Oslo on route to Tromsö and declared mayday at 23:31 whereby the Swedish and Norwegian search and rescue teams were notified. The crash site was located at 03:10 near the Norwegian border by the lake Akkajaure in the Swedish Lapplandsfjällen by air rescue services with support from Hovedredningssentralen in Norway.**

The search has been taken over by the Swedish police which are on their way to the accident site. The internal process is coordinated by the Company’s Emergency Response Team.

Route*
Flight no: SWN 294
Route: Oslo – Tromsö
Crew members on board: 2
Type of freight: General freight / Post

Aircraft*
Registration: SE-DUX
Aircraft Type: Bombardier CRJ200 PF
Year of manufacture: 1993
Manufacturer’s serial number: 7010
Hours flown since manufactured: 38 601:49
Total flight cycles since manufactured: 31 036

West Atlantic Sweden AB has operated the aircraft since 2007 and flown approximately 10*000 hours.

Crew*
Age: Captain 42, First Officer 34*
Employed with the company: 2011 and 2008
Flight hours: Captain 2 050 hours on type, total hours 3 173
First officer: 900 hours on type, total hours 3 050
Newsroom
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 08:55
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the aircraft was flying at FL330 along T65 route

jacdec.de has a story of it
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 09:12
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It will be interesting to see what they carried in the cargo holds.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 09:52
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That will take some time since it carried parcels from the Norwegian Postal service and you do not have to specify content when sending domestic parcels. Probably have to contact all the senders. Some of the senders may even be unknown for unregistered parcels.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 10:05
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Crash site at 1000 masl, aerial view from Swedish TV.


Poliskälla: ?Planet har störtat rätt ner i backen? - Nyheter | SVT.se
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 10:33
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From the pictures, that went in near vertical, high-energy. Possible elevator/rudder failure?
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 10:46
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From Dagens Nyheter, a Swedish paper.

Norskt postplan störtade i Sverige - DN.SE

Räddningsarbetet är besvärligt eftersom haveriplatsen bara kan nås via helikopter eller snöscooter.Postflyget, som flög på uppdrag av norska postverket, hade en last på fyra och ett halvt ton bestående av brev och paket. Enligt räddningsmanskapet, som var först på plats, totalförstördes planet vid det kraftiga nedslaget.
My translation:

Rescue work is hard because the accident site can be accessed only via helikopter or snow mobile.
The postal flight, flying on behalf of Norwegian Postal Service, was loaded with 4500 kgs of letters and parcels. According to the rescue team first accessing the site, the plane was completely destroyed by the impact.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 10:49
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Unlikely to have anything to do with weather as the information provided here puts them at FL330 when they declared mayday.

CP
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 10:55
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Information about the accident unfolding:

Räddningsledaren: ?De kunde inte göra någonting? | Nyheter | Aftonbladet

Det har gått nedåt väldigt fort. Från 33 000 fot har de störtat i en hastighet av ungefär 9 000 fot i minuten.
My translation:
It has gone down really fast. From 33 000 feet they fell with a speed of about 9 000 feet per minute.

And also:

Planet har inte kraschat in i ett berg utan nedslagsplatsen indikerar att man störtat ned i backen med nosen först.
–Enligt svenska försvarets radar gjordes en svag högersväng innan kraschen men man har gått rakt ned. Kratern vid haveriplatsen är femton meter djup och tjugo meter bred. Det är ett väldigt stort hål, säger Anders Lännholm.
My translation:

The plane did not crash into a mountain, but the impact site indicates a nose down attitude.
- According to radar from the Army, they did a slight turn to the right before the crash, otherwise it was straight down. The impact crater is 15 metres deep and 20 metres wide. That is a very big hole, says Anders Lännholm. (Comment: Anders is SAR chief.)
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 11:06
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Unlikely to have anything to do with weather as the information provided here puts them at FL330 when they declared mayday.
Clear skies and light winds at the time of the accident. Doubt weather has anything to do with this one.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 11:08
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Maybe we shouldn't blame the crew, until we know what happened and probably not even then.
Night freight pilots tend not to amass hours as quickly as the rest of us, but they had five and eight years experience with the company presumably flying in the area.
It would seem that something catastrophic happened at High altitude and resulted in a near vertical impact. Quite likely a crew with twenty thousand hours each could have done nothing about it either.
RIP guys, and condolences to family and friends.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 11:28
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sitting in the cruise for 5 hours at a time doesn't make you experienced
Very true.

Doesn't matter how many hours you have in your logbook, only the next one's important. If you train people sufficiently, they can have enough experience, even with very few hours. Look at Air Force pilots, flying Fast Jets. Cruising the airways is a discipline, but it ain't difficult!

If only 'experience' protected the 'experienced'?! But it doesn't does it!
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 12:15
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I think this might be West Atlantics first accident.

Thoughts to the crew members families, and to their colleagues too. This will be a tough time ahead.

Stay strong.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 12:18
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9000ft rate of descent is going some. A tangle with weather and stall? At FL330: probably not but then again, Air France managed it. Looks like an elevator failure to me, or maybe a trim runaway and break up. Three thousand hours each is plenty if the crews are decent, I don't believe that they were to blame. Now the plane. Must be elderly, or it wouldn't be flying freight. I'm sure the investigators will be all over the maintenance records. It's not just helicopters that hang by a bolt you know.
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Old 8th Jan 2016, 12:32
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I worry, sometimes, at the responses that come from some ppruners. Often, they criticise the professionalism or qualifications of those unable to defend themselves, when in reality, their response speaks more for their own lack of experience or professionalism.
Why are some people so hasty to damn others with so little information?


2 colleagues, whom some of us may have met, and many have not, are no longer with us. This should be a moment of reflection for every single one of us. There are likely less than a handful of people at this time who know anything of what happened, and two of them can no longer tell us.

As for experience, and first job?
2 pilots who have each about 3000hrs, and between 4 and 7 years flying experience in freight Ops, with their company. In other branches of commercial flying, they would likely have between 4000 and 6000 hrs total time each. It has already been mentioned that the nature of our business tends to mean lower hours with similar number of sectors when compared to our peers.
I would be inclined to suggest that these two colleagues are more likely to be quite well experienced, when compared to others.
Sadly, aviation is rather blunt in its understanding of people's qualities; never mind the quality, feel the width! Unfortunately, Hours count higher than all other aspects of experience, which is a very sloppy approach to assessing a person's ability. A trap that a number of our 'colleagues' have already fallen into within this thread.
Is this a sort of keyboard Tourette's? Take a moment before hitting enter.

The facts are few at this time, but speculation is rife. However, there is probably scope for very informative discussion, without trashing people that we hardly know.
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