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Koreanair A380 tail strike NRT

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Koreanair A380 tail strike NRT

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Old 24th Jul 2011, 20:14
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Wow; 2 KAL engine pod contact incidents and some real funny videos on the B777 kangaroo landings at NRT. Looks like NRT will be a place to avoid for the Koreans. I heard they had a B777 heavy tail strike not too long ago too.

Coming back to the earlier engine pod strike, was that a B777 or B747? From an earlier post it seem that it was an expat, not a loca...can anyone confirm that. If it's an expat then the expats too had their fair share of boo boos too. I heard that one expat was summarily sacked after some botched non precision approach at ZSSS leading to near CFIT, another was sacked after loss of radio comm in China, and another after line check failure from an expat checker. A friend told me that these were only a few of the boo boos by expats; there were many others too. These, if true at all, certainly put paid to the notion that the expats are any better than the locals. Small wonder Mr/Mrs/Ms haejangkok and admiral shin make much of the riff raff thingy!
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Old 24th Jul 2011, 20:40
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2) there was an airbus instructor onboard
The fact that someone stated an Airbus instructor pilot was onboard HAS COOLED DOWN ALL THE INSINUATIONS AND INNUENDOES
I landed in NRT on the 21. The conditions were very chalenging. I have 18000+hrs and have flown Boeing, Douglas, Lockheed, and now Airbus. It was possibly the most difficult landing I have ever done. I am not supprised that someone touched a pod.

The met report does not do justice to the gusting cross wind conditions
Ace hit it right on, the fact that they had an Airbus Instructor onboard certainly curtailed a lot of racially charged innuendoes to be lobbed over in this thread.
Thank you to the very level headed, fair minded and brave individuals who dare to go against bigotry with their sensible and rational posts. We Koreans/Asians did not make any derogatory remarks or cast aspersions on the unfortunate Fed-Ex MD11 crew despite their level of experience vis-a-vis our newbies on the A380 who had the misfortune of encountering the nasty conditions on July 21. Neither did we celebrate the misfortunes of all the first world pilots who had come to grief in other unfortunate accidents or incidents. We have the human respect and professional courtesy of not wishing others ill in times of misfortune.
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Old 25th Jul 2011, 03:04
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bcflyer,
Have you flown FBW? I'm guessing by the naivety of your posts that you haven't.
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Old 25th Jul 2011, 05:01
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Having flown with a pilot who quit KAL after only 3 months there, I don't think it has anything to do with Expat or Local. The culture there is wrong and that is what needs to be fixed.

CRM is non-existent and they still rely on the old "saving face" way of doing things. It is hard to believe in this day and age that we still have major airlines behaving like this, but I guess old habits die hard.

It strikes me as unusual that an aircraft with a pod strike can take-off again without a full teardown of the engine. Regardless of the visible damage, I thought they would at least do a thorough check of the wing structure and pylon before the aircraft is released into service again.

But I guess these questions will be answered when the full investigation is released... Oh yeah, that won't happen at KAL.
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Old 25th Jul 2011, 17:14
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Johnee26

Korean Air as yet employ no expats on A380
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Old 26th Jul 2011, 02:27
  #66 (permalink)  
 
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I can't agree with you more.

Neither did we celebrate the misfortunes of all the first world pilots who had come to grief in other unfortunate accidents or incidents. We have the human respect and professional courtesy of not wishing others ill in times of misfortune.
You're saying what I wanted to say exactly.
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Old 26th Jul 2011, 02:36
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J26 , I think what you meant to say is that KAL has no expats on the 380 at this time.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 01:22
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Aye, aye Captain!

I can't agree with you more.
Quote:
Neither did we celebrate the misfortunes of all the first world pilots who had come to grief in other unfortunate accidents or incidents. We have the human respect and professional courtesy of not wishing others ill in times of misfortune.
You're saying what I wanted to say exactly.
Three cheers to that! It always irks me no end to see selfish fellas trying to run down others to further their agendas. Just see those miscreants trying to run down HKA on the fragrant harbour forum, with their misguided vindictiveness hoping to shatter the rice bowls of ALL the HKA employees.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 02:17
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Heard from someone in kimchiland it was it ended up with a skid mark on the #4 engine drain mast. I guessed the grease monkeys determined that there was no cause for alarm and off they went back to ICN.

Heard that someone big at Air Asia X who was formerly from KAL says that the company only want young Korean skippers on the A380; the older folks are almost untrainable for such high tech aircraft.

Last edited by Telur Belacan; 29th Jul 2011 at 06:18.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 04:12
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Heard from someone in kimchiland it was it ended up with a skid mark on the #4 engine drain mast. I guessed the greased monkeys determined that there was no cause for alarm and off they went back to ICN.
probably only rubbed some blade tips in the compressors due to ovalization.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 04:45
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Well, as someone who currently flies the A380, but who has lots of time on both the 747 and the 767, plus numerous flights into Tokyo...I can say that I sympathise with the crew. The 380 is easily the worst aircraft that I've ever flown in gusty crosswinds.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 05:55
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Does anyone think the change of Control Law (from Normal Flight Mode to Normal Ground Mode) could have played a part here, as in the Hamburg tip strike?

Last edited by Roseland; 27th Jul 2011 at 06:35.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 08:12
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probably only rubbed some blade tips in the compressors due to ovalization
Why, when only the drain mast got scraped.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 08:16
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Heard that someone big at Air Asia X who was formerly from KAL

Now who can that be except for that g string who pranged the 744 engine pod on the same flight no. KE 701 circa 2004/2005

The 380 is easily the worst aircraft that I've ever flown in gusty crosswinds.
The so called flight control laws that transitioned during flare from roll rate demand to direct surface deflection can become quite a handful I guess.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 11:22
  #75 (permalink)  
 
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An aeroplane strikes a pod and we defend the crew for the wx environment. I operate into all these ports in Asia and experience weather extremes. I operate the aircraft to its certified limit and walk away without filing a safety report.

The weather exceeds my aircraft limitations and I delay the the approach or conduct a missed approach. To use the weather as a reason for aircraft damage is an excuse for poor decision making and piloting skill.

I operate with pilots of Far East origin and the problem lies in the culture, something that has developed over 100's of years. Unfortunately this culture conflicts with the modern day flight deck.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 11:30
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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I tend to agree with the above post, wise words. No wonder KAL need to dilute their pilot workforce with expats.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 11:52
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I operate with pilots of Far East origin and the problem lies in the culture, something that has developed over 100's of years. Unfortunately this culture conflicts with the modern day flight deck.
What about JAL? Or ANA? Or Asiana? Or Singapore Airlines, or MAS, or Vietnam Airlines? Sure, these airlines had their share of incidents and accidents, but so have Air France, American Airlines, KLM etc.

Is it really a stand alone Asian culture problem or perhaps more of a company culture problem with KAL?

Give these guys a break, being new on type, gusty crosswinds (on a FBW Airbus!) on a challenging airport like NRT!
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 13:03
  #78 (permalink)  
 
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This will definitely hasten the arrival of expats on the fleet.

They have blamed the pilot for his excessive use of rudders and sidestick causing increasing bank.

The most unsurprising aspect about it is the 'real' story that they have blamed the Airbus instructor who did not intervene and should have maintained control.

At low altitude in the flare it is virtually impossible for an instructor to correct such an unexpected adverse roll input but clearly a local instuctor would have been able to do so....mmmmm

So take that Airbus- KAL telling them they should have done better!!!!

Last edited by Maisk Rotum; 27th Jul 2011 at 14:18.
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 13:29
  #79 (permalink)  
 
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Maisk rotum, the almighty airbus 380 instructor is on the right seat. Who log as p.i.c for this flight? Therefore, you can never fault the commander for such mishap below 50'? This make my job as p.i.c as easy as pie. Unbelievable!
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Old 27th Jul 2011, 15:20
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Heard from someone in kimchiland it was it ended up with a skid mark on the #4 engine drain mast. I guessed the greased monkeys determined that there was no cause for alarm and off they went back to ICN.
So, Telur Belacan who are the 'greased monkeys' ?

The KAL ground engineers who were there, the Japanese engineers who were there, the Airbus field rep(s) who were there and inspected the aircraft.
Or the KAL flight crew?

Please let us know.

Yes, for info, it kissed the drain mast on #4 and the engine pod/cowls suffered no damage.

I suggest you have a close look at your English, as well.
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