BA cabin crew threaten to poison pilots
food quality control
From my experience the food 'as is' is pretty dodgy anyway so I don't think
a few eye drops will do much worse ?
From my point of view I always treated EVERY member of crew with respect
including the guys & gals on the ramp - I'm old school (which is sadly boring these days I guess), but in my book everyone is equal, irrespective of role -
I never experienced the problems reported - times change I guess - but
progress sucks in that case !
Keep safe everyone !
a few eye drops will do much worse ?
From my point of view I always treated EVERY member of crew with respect
including the guys & gals on the ramp - I'm old school (which is sadly boring these days I guess), but in my book everyone is equal, irrespective of role -
I never experienced the problems reported - times change I guess - but
progress sucks in that case !
Keep safe everyone !
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Like the posts above, I very seldom had much of a problem with CC, but when I did, they were offloaded, PDQ.
Simple as that.
As for catering, if I suspected a slight 'problem', I would stroll back and cook my own, and serve it up, accordingly.
THEN, offload any malcontent in sight.
Period.
GONE.....
PS: The company backed me up, every damn time.
Strange as it seems, it worked, without fail.
Malcontents....color 'em just that, and bye bye.
Simple as that.
As for catering, if I suspected a slight 'problem', I would stroll back and cook my own, and serve it up, accordingly.
THEN, offload any malcontent in sight.
Period.
GONE.....
PS: The company backed me up, every damn time.
Strange as it seems, it worked, without fail.
Malcontents....color 'em just that, and bye bye.
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You are being quoted in the People newspaper if you can call it that, guy's and gal's. "BA CABINCREW POISION PILOTS" or something like that. 
Time to stop being petty and get on with our jobs. The public are looking at this and they probably don't like what they are seeing.
Stop trying to damage the reputation of the company. It's a free world and we can all express our opinions but trying to rile a section of our work colleagues is out of order and bad CRM.
Time to stop being petty and get on with our jobs. The public are looking at this and they probably don't like what they are seeing.
Stop trying to damage the reputation of the company. It's a free world and we can all express our opinions but trying to rile a section of our work colleagues is out of order and bad CRM.
Warning Toxic!
Disgusted of Tunbridge
Disgusted of Tunbridge
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Yes, it is horrible, isn't it? Why does it happen (allegedly)? How does someone actually DO that to another human being? And one who is actually flying them at that? Is it possibly the most stupid human act on record? 'HeHeHe' (to quote StohdohRayMeFahSoLahTeeDoh......just read the last post on page 5). Immensely sad, but most of all, utterly moronic.
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Originally Posted by NLB
Sadly yes, when I started in this business 20 years ago cabin crew were generally, well educated decent people. This has deteriorated gradually to the situation now where to be cabin crew is a last resort for most.
The majority of Cabin Crew are well-educated and respectful people. Me? I have a degree in Geology but enjoy flying. One of my friends gave up a good job for a major telecoms company and who also has a degree in Management. Several other of my friends attended college prior to choosing flying.
Most crew have chosen to be crew as it is something we enjoy and want to do; it is not a "last resort". It is still a difficult job to get into, as the number of poeple who are rejected year-on-year will testify to.
Perhaps if you are of the opinion that you seem to be, commercial aviation is maybe not your best niche. Maybe it is your last resort as clearly you lack the interpersonal skills most other jobs require.
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Originally Posted by NLB
At least the media have picked up on this at last.
http://www.people.co.uk/news/news/tm...name_page.html
http://www.people.co.uk/news/news/tm...name_page.html
NLB, why are you happy that the media have picked up on this? Are you one of the people who is trying to destroy BA and the airline industry? BA are conducting an internal investigation and that is exactly where this should lie, INTERNALLY, if it has to be investigated at all. I find an investigation completely over the top anyway.
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Originally Posted by NLB
Today, 23:47 #131
'britanniaboy', calm down, no offence intented, your reply is hardly relevant to this discussion.
'britanniaboy', calm down, no offence intented, your reply is hardly relevant to this discussion.
You posted it.
I replied to it.
Therefore: relevant.
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In my opinion this is all a massive overreaction. How often has a pilot become ill during a flight due to food being tampered with? I have NEVER heard of someone actually doing anything, despite hearing the odd joke made.
If you are genuinely worried about this happening to you then I suggest you simply look at the way you treat the cabin crew. If you are polite and value them and their job then you have nothing to worry about. If, like a minority of pilots, you look down your nose at them and speak to them like they are idiots then you may have more of a problem, BUT it is highly highly unlikely that anyone would do anything.
The fact that pilots often eat out in places (especially in Africa) where hygiene is very poor and then fly home is much more of a worry for me. A steak wiped round the bog is probably safer than a meal at some of the places that pilots like to frequent, often eating the same thing!
If you are genuinely worried about this happening to you then I suggest you simply look at the way you treat the cabin crew. If you are polite and value them and their job then you have nothing to worry about. If, like a minority of pilots, you look down your nose at them and speak to them like they are idiots then you may have more of a problem, BUT it is highly highly unlikely that anyone would do anything.
The fact that pilots often eat out in places (especially in Africa) where hygiene is very poor and then fly home is much more of a worry for me. A steak wiped round the bog is probably safer than a meal at some of the places that pilots like to frequent, often eating the same thing!
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Once again the stories of crew meals being interfered with comes up and everyone adopts their fighting position. On the one side we have the pilots who mostly accept that this happens and the cabin crew on the other side who mostly assert that it does not. In the middle we have those who don't know, those who want to sidetrack to other issues, and those who just want to make smart comments. Battle stations everyone.
Surprisingly, in spite of clear evidence that eye drops can not and do not cause a person to "get the runs" people are choosing to ignore that and are still trying to keep the myth going. Those who have understood that the myth has been sprung have moved on to other horrible things that cabin crew are alleged to have done (to the food) in an attempt to "make their point."
Some have asserted that they know from experience, or have been told, or have heard about these things - without even stopping to think that the person telling the story might just be having a lend of them. It seems to me that the same old thing about human nature is holding true - why believe something good of a person when there might be something bad you can talk about?
I've been hearing these stories for years and would be extremely reluctant to give them credit. As others have said, some sort of proof is needed and proof does not arise from stories told in a bar or in any situation where people have been drinking. Most of the cabin crew have denied outright that this sort of behavior exists but there are people here who prefer to believe the minority who like to tell their stories. Interestingly, it seems that a lot of the pilots who have posted here have believed the stories almost without question. Some pretty senior pilots amongst them too. I am not sure if this demonstrates the truth of the tales or the gullibility of pilots.
I was somewhat surprised though to see a mod from the helicopter division enter the fray - I mean, helos are not normally known for carrying cabin crew or serving meals are they? Unless a person has worked in the specific environment, they cannot be expected to know too much about it - just my opinion of course. Mind you, nobody who visits here on a regular basis could really fail to notice Heliport's antagonistic attitude towards cabin crew so it is not surprising that he prefers to be in the "I believe every word of it" camp regardless of his lack of experience in the arena. He never misses an opportunity to snipe at cabin crew.
I am more of a lurker than a poster, I know, but I just wanted to add my ten cents' worth to the discussion. For what it's worth - I've never heard of it happening and I don't know anyone who has ever done anything like that.
Surprisingly, in spite of clear evidence that eye drops can not and do not cause a person to "get the runs" people are choosing to ignore that and are still trying to keep the myth going. Those who have understood that the myth has been sprung have moved on to other horrible things that cabin crew are alleged to have done (to the food) in an attempt to "make their point."
Some have asserted that they know from experience, or have been told, or have heard about these things - without even stopping to think that the person telling the story might just be having a lend of them. It seems to me that the same old thing about human nature is holding true - why believe something good of a person when there might be something bad you can talk about?
I've been hearing these stories for years and would be extremely reluctant to give them credit. As others have said, some sort of proof is needed and proof does not arise from stories told in a bar or in any situation where people have been drinking. Most of the cabin crew have denied outright that this sort of behavior exists but there are people here who prefer to believe the minority who like to tell their stories. Interestingly, it seems that a lot of the pilots who have posted here have believed the stories almost without question. Some pretty senior pilots amongst them too. I am not sure if this demonstrates the truth of the tales or the gullibility of pilots.
I was somewhat surprised though to see a mod from the helicopter division enter the fray - I mean, helos are not normally known for carrying cabin crew or serving meals are they? Unless a person has worked in the specific environment, they cannot be expected to know too much about it - just my opinion of course. Mind you, nobody who visits here on a regular basis could really fail to notice Heliport's antagonistic attitude towards cabin crew so it is not surprising that he prefers to be in the "I believe every word of it" camp regardless of his lack of experience in the arena. He never misses an opportunity to snipe at cabin crew.
I am more of a lurker than a poster, I know, but I just wanted to add my ten cents' worth to the discussion. For what it's worth - I've never heard of it happening and I don't know anyone who has ever done anything like that.
Last edited by Linden; 25th Apr 2006 at 00:22.
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Originally Posted by NLB
Sadly yes, when I started in this business 20 years ago cabin crew were generally, well educated decent people. This has deteriorated gradually to the situation now where to be cabin crew is a last resort for most.
i have flown with this f.o who wrote the letter about crew not being utilalised efectively and all i can say is (I disagree with him.)
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Touchy no not at all.
Having been involved in the Kegworth incident I really think good crm between pilots and cabin crew is vital. Posts like yours do nothing to help.
I am not going to say anything more on the matter.
Having been involved in the Kegworth incident I really think good crm between pilots and cabin crew is vital. Posts like yours do nothing to help.
I am not going to say anything more on the matter.
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Good crm can be categorised as follows: (CAA)
Co-operation - teambuilding, consideration, supporting, conflict resolution
- Leadership/Managerial Skills - assertiveness, providing & maintaining standards, planning & coordination, workload management
- Situational Awareness - anticipation, awareness of system, environment
- Decision Making - problem definition & diagnosis, generation of options, risk assessment, choice of options, review of outcome
Having one of my colleagues referred to as a t*sser by a cc member causes me to dig deeply into my 'co-operation' resources as listed above, that's all.
It's best we all leave this now, I guess.
Co-operation - teambuilding, consideration, supporting, conflict resolution
- Leadership/Managerial Skills - assertiveness, providing & maintaining standards, planning & coordination, workload management
- Situational Awareness - anticipation, awareness of system, environment
- Decision Making - problem definition & diagnosis, generation of options, risk assessment, choice of options, review of outcome
Having one of my colleagues referred to as a t*sser by a cc member causes me to dig deeply into my 'co-operation' resources as listed above, that's all.
It's best we all leave this now, I guess.
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Originally Posted by woodpecker
These are the same CC trainers that teach the new entrant CC to remember the extinguisher locations in the flight deck of a 757 by.... "Water behind the W*nk*r and BCF behind the B*rst*rd".
Perhaps I'm of a different generation but I object to such practises, am I wrong?
No wonder when the new CC they get on line they have already been indoctrinated.
Perhaps I'm of a different generation but I object to such practises, am I wrong?
No wonder when the new CC they get on line they have already been indoctrinated.
I wish I had met such trainers in BA who use these innovative teaching methods!! My trainers instead were professionals, and the training course so good and intense that when we finally got tested for evacuation procedures it felt real.
There are about 16000 cabin crew in BA, and even if what you guys have been saying is true, you cannot generalise on such numbers.
BA cabin crew are always bashed for things like money, rosters or perks etc. but we are a group of professionals, and we would NEVER endanger the aircraft and our own lives! If this is the idea you have of us then maybe it's YOUR CRM trainers that have to do some extra work!
I have just come back from a day trip. We weren't busy on the way out and I spent 15 mins in the F/D chatting to the Captain and a brand new F/O.
We had a laugh. Yesterday I was the galley slave (term regularly used by pilots in BA to identify the forward galley CC position, by the way, but none of us gets upset by it!
) and had a great day. I cannot speak for LHR but at LGW we have an excellent relationship with our Flight Crew. Of course there are exceptions, but the majority of CC and FC enjoy each other's company downroute and during the flight. We look after each other and despite our fleet is the one that works the most we end up having a very good time at work almost every day. It's not unusual for who works at the back of the plane to receive a call from the F/D asking how we are and vice versa.To say that BA trainers are doing such a bad job like somebody else has mentioned in another post (and giving such details) is an accusation that if it's true you have to prove it and then it would be your responsibility to report it to the company. As far as I am concerned they're professional people who know their job inside out. The CRM training I received in BA was the best of all the companies I worked for and nobody said anything bad about FC.
As for being jealous of FC money....hahaha. I don't see all this jealousy that you guys are talking about...I just don't see it. We do different jobs, full stop. Besides, there are some CSDs at LHR that earn more than some pilots!!!!
And this unfortunately might create some resentment on your side of the F/D door....
This is the first time I've read something that not only isn't true, but also isn't interesting at all and I am surprised how some people that I would call professional pilots can even bother to start a thread like this and keep stirring things up more and more.......I think I err the opposite way, and I might have to start thinking a bit less of you
Just call it a day, please, and if you have problems with your CC during your flights, just approach them and talk to them. You can obtain that a) you solve the possible conflict situation before it can develop and you might gain more respect, and b) you might even discover that you get along after all as you've only misunderstood each other.
You have a tongue, USE IT!!!! (and this can be interpreted the way you like it
)Enough now, I am off for some serious CRM with my very own Water Extinguisher.
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FBW....What an excellent last post on the matter.
And Chewie, Im also with you on this one.
This is another example of this PC world gone mad where one group of people are totally unable to say something with a pinch of salt and not have it thrown back in their face! We jest all the time about doing things to those who disagree or confront us in ALL walks of life...but it does not mean we will actually act upon them. Its simply a way of venting out emotions and the crew forum is simply a tool for that.
If people are going to take everything seriously then they really need a smack in the face....ooohhh, actually, maybe I should clarify, no im not going to hunt you all down to smack you in the face!!!! GRRRR
And Chewie, Im also with you on this one.
This is another example of this PC world gone mad where one group of people are totally unable to say something with a pinch of salt and not have it thrown back in their face! We jest all the time about doing things to those who disagree or confront us in ALL walks of life...but it does not mean we will actually act upon them. Its simply a way of venting out emotions and the crew forum is simply a tool for that.
If people are going to take everything seriously then they really need a smack in the face....ooohhh, actually, maybe I should clarify, no im not going to hunt you all down to smack you in the face!!!! GRRRR