Dont know where you get your figures from Far East but the average UK wage before tax is about £31000.

UK Average Salary Graphs | Career Advice | Monster.co.uk

You could always get a woman to do the job and pay even less!!!!!!!!!!!!

Knock off NI and income tax and it comes to about £26,000; the figure I mentioned.

Crab,

Have you put in for it? Would have thought it was a perfect opportunity for you to ensure future standards of SAR and with your gold plated pension and people in SAR don't do it for the money attitude, the salary is irrelevant to you surely...

Of course maybe you are trying to put others off to improve your chances :ok:

What has a service pension got to do with a subsequent salary????

Jobs for people who don't need jobs. Very British.


(Similar example. Good technical civilian job advertised in a public organisation several years ago. Apparent job content and conditions are good but the salary band is not impressive. I approach a gentleman retired from a related department. First comment: "That job'll be for so-and-so, he's due to retire this year.")

Quite a lot actually as it can affect your tax position :ugh::rolleyes:

so easy...:E

Hmmmm - £41K plus pension for 4 years as SAR coordinator or £80-100K as a SAR Captain - I think I'll take my chances with managed transition thanks;)

Having spent a considerable part of my life as a contract pilot after retirement can you give me an example where the extra tax one pays is more than the extra salary one earns.

In all my various negotiations if anybody mentioned income from pensions I started getting up from the chair.

Fareastdriver: Hear hear. You do your 'bit' in a previous life, build up a pension pot in so doing then some jealous creep thinks it should be used to offset against another full time job working for peanuts.
Get a life guys.

Shouldnt the job spec justify the remuneration or vice versa.?

Since when does one sacrifice their pension to keep working??

Blood* annoys me that thorny issue................

Shortlisting
 

Has anyone heard from Bristow on shortlisting yet?

Cheers.

I think they were pretty swamped - I have heard the number of applications in the managed transition to be in the high 200s and those outwith that 6 times that number!

Strangely, I thought that the managed transition was for those of us actually in the mil SAR Force - there most certainly aren't 200 plus of us even if everyone applied - where have all the hangers-on come from?

My take on how competitive it is likely to be:

10 Bases, 10 pilots per base plus approx 10 trg staff = 110 pilots total

3 Bases already manned, not unreasonable to assume that most will TUPE

10 Trg staff probably already in place/nominated or identified

Leaves 70 places available

Captain to Co-Pilot ratio probably 6:4

42 Captain positions and 28 Co-pilot positions to be filled - doesn't even consider the availability of Portland personnel.

Some co-pilots have already been shortlisted....

Some captains have already been shortlisted too...

The mil managed transition is for anyone within the mil who considers they have appropriate SAR experience. Not just those currently engaged in SAR duties.

Clearly, the immense stupidity of the whole situation is that, after the government has stumbled about trying to get this going for a whole decade, we find ourselves approaching the time when the chief executioner of military SAR, JHC, is going to arrive back from the hot sandy places and have bu99er all to do.



(At one stage the DfT documents asked the contractor to explain how they would provide for SAR aircrew serving at CHIVENOR who wished to continue to do SAR there, or in the vicinity ... . It's therefore not surprising that Crab is interested in this question!)

Hardly matters if there's nobody in the back.

Experienced rear-crew on PA Scales may not be interested in terms and conditions like some kind of trolley dolly in goretex.

Spanish - that's not how it was sold to us - I thought it was supposed to be a method of de-risking the project for the DfT by taking on current UK SAR crews with all the requisite skills and experience except time on type.

Anyone can say they have done SAR if they have hovered over the water but doesn't cut the mustard when it comes to real UK SAROPs! My last rescue was 5 days ago (multi-agency, winching through trees 500' up a cliff) how many of those who have applied will have any recent or relevant experience?

Rearcrew were/are always going to be the more difficult positions to fill.

Crab,

....and breathe....

If you re-read my post, anyone in the military who considers they have appropriate experience...can apply via the military managed transition route. Doesnt mean that Bristow need to employ them.

I was simply answering your post about the number of applications. Its Bristow's job to now filter those applications in order to ensure a suitable mix of appropriate experience is available at each Unit to de-risk the project iaw DfT requirements.

Then again surely by now you, of all people, know that you shouldn't believe everything you are told/sold by your senior officers...:ok:

Managed transition for those who are unsure is:

Thats from the full article from the Government at https://www.gov.uk/government/news/f...-rescue-agreed

Read into it what you wish but the whole reason for it would seem to be

Spanish - as I said, that is not how it was sold to the RAF SAR Force, access to the roadshows was tightly controlled and the emphasis was on taking current SAR crews.

Snakepit - I wouldn't put too much stock by that article, it is a news story and as such doesn't have to paint an accurate or fair picture. If someone outside the SAR community read it they would come away with the belief that the RAF and RN are equal partners in the service provision rather than the actual 6 to 2 ratio that exists. Additionally, the understanding we had was that as well as ensuring a smooth handover of service to Bristow, the managed transition was to keep the DfT happy that taking a number of current SAR crews would prevent too much dilution of UKSAR experience, especially on NVD.

Crab - Yes I know what you mean, but I think we are talking the same thing anyway. I.E the reason for managed transition will by its nature (hopefully) result in the SAR experience of those in the mil who want to, being part of the future.
I only hope powers that be in the mil allow that to happen that way :ugh:

Have Bristow confirmed they will follow the 6:2 ratio when they transition the mil chaps......:ooh:

Crab

As a retired RAF SAR pilot and 20yr offshore pilot I would put your interest foremost. The civilian market is totally different to the services with its constant movement of aircrew on posting. Once a civilian company has the required number of pilots that is it, it doesn't matter how qualified and attractive to the company you are they won't offer you a job as all positions are filled. The churn rate of companies can also be small, depending on the economy and job situation, so it could be years before a opening appears.

Timing is everything. I went to look round Bond on a Monday and they offered me a job starting the next day as they had vacancies - a lot of their pilots had gone fixed wing - and I was already NS qualified having spent 3 yrs flying in all weathers from Lossie - oil companies at that time required Commanders to have at least 1 winter operating in the NS before they would allow you to fly on their contracts.

I also became a Commander in Sep that year - right place, time and qualifications.

About 1 year later the fixed wing opportunities dried up so nobody left and therefore Bond recruitment became virtually non-existent.

If you have the chance to leave the RAF now with a job offer from Bristows which suits you I would go because the RAF will only be interested in trying to keep the SAR flights going until Bristows have taken over. If by then Bristows is full then it could be "sandy side" or OIL and GAS if they need pilots!!

HF

Spanish - we have been told that the ratio will be 33%/33%/33% civ/RAF/RN on the flights, I guess the RN have bigger friends in important places than us!

Hummingfrog - thanks for the info, I naively hoped that such a vital govt contract would require a different approach in order to assure safety of the crews and those to be rescued.

You can't just grow SAR experience on trees, as you well know, and surely the safest option is to employ those already current in UKSAR now (those that want to go of course). There are clearly an awful lot of people out there who want to be SAR pilots and rearcrew but in the short term you need to transfer the existing experience because all the training (apart from that on type) has already been done and any other crewmembers will be playing catch-up on the job which is not ideal.

When people talk about RAF Rescue I always think about the yellow Sea Kings but there are also the grey Griffins which are less talked about.

Could anyone tell me roughly how many rescue Griffins the RAF have across how many bases and how their tasking varies from the Sea King?

Duff gen Jim.

RAF - Griffin HAR2

In my opinion Managed Transition was primarily devised as a tool for MOD manning to maintain SAR cover during the handover phase. An added benefit is that it aIlows Bristow to cherry-pick the military element of their crewing solution. The notion that only current crews should be eligible is nonsense; of course it makes sense for a large chunk of crews to be in current practice but it doesn't take an awful lot of effort to get those (of appropriate skill and attitude) who are non-current up and running again. Despite the belief of some, SAR is neither a black art nor a discipline that those who have had some time elsewhere are unable to return to successfully.

true indeed but it depends very much on how much you did, when and where and how long ago - I guess that is what the Bristow selection will be based on.

It certainly is, unless you read the first two letters of the thread title!


(Of course, the same issue helps to obscure the true workload of the mixed UK SAR fleet, as highlighted by the Provision and Coverage Report of 2001, and again in 2006, but still not acted upon in 2013.)

Shortlisting
 

Cheers Crab, guessed as much!

Not true, as proven by the number of people from Shawbury inter alia present at the Valley roadshow.

Only in terms of anything commercial in confidence - some of those at the Valley roadshow had, shall we say, tenuous links to SAR! How much chance they stand is anyone's guess but there's nothing to stop them applying.

I hope for your sake that your assumption turns out to be right!

Err, that will be one of the considerations, but only one!

Well of course it was - why else would they bother?!

And I refer you gentlemen back to post 748

Yes to avoid a mass PVR as everyone jumped ship and applied to Bristow for jobs.

But the process benefits everyone, not least the Govt, since peaks and troughs of availability of SAR service in the UK could be catastrophic; if there was a disaster in 2014/15 and the mil couldn't provide the aircraft and crews because so many had left and the new SAR service wasn't stood up in its place, the Govt would be asked why it contracted out SAR without a credible plan to cover contingencies.

As I said before - it has a lot to do with de-risking this contractorisation of SAR for the DfT.

Balfour Beatty to build new SAR bases

BBC News

Did they mention if they're going to procure Xbox or PS3?

Cos we're gagging to know!!!!!! Ahem.

Just me?? Wrong impression? Anyone seen my coat?

Shouldn't that be Xbox One or PS4 for a forward thinking organisation.....?

...I need more detail on which Sky TV package is being introduced! Sports, Movies, a +package, HD.... I demand to know!!

What about details such as planning permission, is it taken for granted that there will be on objections?

Also take Caernarfon, it doesn't have the best road access, there is a road but it's narrow and winding (for approx 2+ miles), not the best for construction traffic ... or maybe there will be a new road to provide access from the A499 :ok:

http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/511282-uk-sar-2013-privatisation-new-thread-39.html#
 

Could anyone tell me what will happen to the Scottish SAR bases if Scotland votes for independence?