RAF announces Puma Replacement plan
Evalu8ter, Did you know that the Wildcat is almost universally called the "Mildcat" by the RAF who regard it with a certain amount of derision. I suspect there would be strong opposition if that was suggested as a Puma replacement!
TF
TF
TF, wrong end of the stick chap. The extra Wildcats are to keep Yeovil afloat and provide more FIND/light utility capability. The additional Chinooks backfill the Pumas (queue wails about urban ops and false inefficiencies of flying half empty Chinooks …..)
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: London
Posts: 35
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Bearing in mind that the Wildcat production line depended on quite a few components recovered from the former Mk 9 fleet, is it even possible to build any more?!
Notwithstanding whether they could be made, and in what timescales, it's suitability for the Cyprus/Brunei (and the 'other one') roles is non-existent.
Notwithstanding whether they could be made, and in what timescales, it's suitability for the Cyprus/Brunei (and the 'other one') roles is non-existent.
Let's not pretend that any country selling arms to any other country really gives a sh*t about what they are used for and who they are used on.
Buy only the best !
All of this buy X to save jobs at—- is a false logic. The primary role of the armed services is to protect the U.K. from those that will do it harm. Specific manufacturers viability must come second to that.
so IF for example the latest Blackhawk is adjudged the best that is the one we should buy!
Saving the Leonardo factory at Yeovil must come way down the list. The Mildcat is next to useless.
if necessary build the most suitable aircraft under license at Yeovil. It needs to be able to deliver at least as many fully equipped troops as the Puma.
TF
so IF for example the latest Blackhawk is adjudged the best that is the one we should buy!
Saving the Leonardo factory at Yeovil must come way down the list. The Mildcat is next to useless.
if necessary build the most suitable aircraft under license at Yeovil. It needs to be able to deliver at least as many fully equipped troops as the Puma.
TF
All of this buy X to save jobs at—- is a false logic. The primary role of the armed services is to protect the U.K. from those that will do it harm. Specific manufacturers viability must come second to that.
so IF for example the latest Blackhawk is adjudged the best that is the one we should buy!
Saving the Leonardo factory at Yeovil must come way down the list. The Mildcat is next to useless.
if necessary build the most suitable aircraft under license at Yeovil. It needs to be able to deliver at least as many fully equipped troops as the Puma.
TF
so IF for example the latest Blackhawk is adjudged the best that is the one we should buy!
Saving the Leonardo factory at Yeovil must come way down the list. The Mildcat is next to useless.
if necessary build the most suitable aircraft under license at Yeovil. It needs to be able to deliver at least as many fully equipped troops as the Puma.
TF
Russian Helicopters JSC are no-comment at Dubai Air Show recently when I asked about the KA52K export to the same country. I explained there’s plenty of photos and the odd article showing the Alligator on the Nile. They said that’s fine but until they officially issue a press release then as far as the world is concerned it is what it is.
cheerd
Seen as Australia is dumping their entire MRH90 fleet and replacing with Blackhawk, does it not make sense for the UK to do the same under AUKUS?
Leonardo is no more British than LIDL; yes they employ people in the UK, but that’s no reason to hamstring the military with another helicopter that’s no use on the battlefield.
Leonardo is no more British than LIDL; yes they employ people in the UK, but that’s no reason to hamstring the military with another helicopter that’s no use on the battlefield.
Bearing in mind that the Wildcat production line depended on quite a few components recovered from the former Mk 9 fleet, is it even possible to build any more?!
Notwithstanding whether they could be made, and in what timescales, it's suitability for the Cyprus/Brunei (and the 'other one') roles is non-existent.
Notwithstanding whether they could be made, and in what timescales, it's suitability for the Cyprus/Brunei (and the 'other one') roles is non-existent.
Avoid imitations
Seen as Australia is dumping their entire MRH90 fleet and replacing with Blackhawk, does it not make sense for the UK to do the same under AUKUS?
Apparently they have flown the Wildcat simulator in Brunei conditions and the feedback was that it performed a lot better than expected.
And just because a simulator says it will work is not that much of a recommendation.
BERP blades and tight jungle clearings are not a good mix.
Avoid imitations
Belize…. various Army brains there thought they knew more about helicopters than the RAF.
I recall a certain non air crew Major at Rideau who couldn’t understand why Pumas (the underpowered HC1 back then) couldn’t fly with the full complement of 16 seats, put soldiers on all of them, add luggage or an underslung load and fill right up with fuel. We normally flew in 12 seat fit. He was convinced we were “short changing” him.
Having been advised otherwise he later claimed that the RAF were over estimating the weight of the average soldier and therefore more soldiers should be carried than we said we could.
As far as he was concerned, if a helicopter had floor space, it could be filled!
He instigated a formal “checkout” procedure where every soldier was individually weighed before flight. He shot himself right in the foot with that because his men were actually considerably heavier than the average weights previously used, so it was decreed from on high that we carried fewer than before. He deservedly earned the nickname “The bathroom scales Major”.
One particular flight we were regularly tasked for on Fridays was to take soldiers and a local policeman to an offshore island for “R & R” barbecue over the weekend (we weren’t invited). The load included passengers, various equipment but most importantly a large (cubic metre?) heavyweight aluminium trunk containing their food and drinks, in ice. Loading was supervised as usual by my crewman just before planned departure but the army delayed their flight by some hours. When we finally lifted off from the raised helipad, which was actually only just big enough to get the wheels on with care, being sized for a skidded Scout, I realised we were very much overweight and the Puma wouldn’t transition away as normal. I had no option but to continue trying to fly because the helipad was just behind us and the ground ahead was riddled with vegetation covering deep drainage ditches. We got very, very close to crashing into the ammo compound but just scraped over the trees!
When we landed at the island the soldiers couldn’t lift the food trunk off the aircraft. We shut down and then found that it was inexplicably full almost right to the brim with water! It had to be bailed out to get the weight down.
An investigation discovered that the Army, concerned about the delay causing their beers to get warm, had kept going back to the aircraft and topping up the ice as it melted without telling us. A cubic metre of water weighs a great deal!
I recall a certain non air crew Major at Rideau who couldn’t understand why Pumas (the underpowered HC1 back then) couldn’t fly with the full complement of 16 seats, put soldiers on all of them, add luggage or an underslung load and fill right up with fuel. We normally flew in 12 seat fit. He was convinced we were “short changing” him.
Having been advised otherwise he later claimed that the RAF were over estimating the weight of the average soldier and therefore more soldiers should be carried than we said we could.
As far as he was concerned, if a helicopter had floor space, it could be filled!
He instigated a formal “checkout” procedure where every soldier was individually weighed before flight. He shot himself right in the foot with that because his men were actually considerably heavier than the average weights previously used, so it was decreed from on high that we carried fewer than before. He deservedly earned the nickname “The bathroom scales Major”.
One particular flight we were regularly tasked for on Fridays was to take soldiers and a local policeman to an offshore island for “R & R” barbecue over the weekend (we weren’t invited). The load included passengers, various equipment but most importantly a large (cubic metre?) heavyweight aluminium trunk containing their food and drinks, in ice. Loading was supervised as usual by my crewman just before planned departure but the army delayed their flight by some hours. When we finally lifted off from the raised helipad, which was actually only just big enough to get the wheels on with care, being sized for a skidded Scout, I realised we were very much overweight and the Puma wouldn’t transition away as normal. I had no option but to continue trying to fly because the helipad was just behind us and the ground ahead was riddled with vegetation covering deep drainage ditches. We got very, very close to crashing into the ammo compound but just scraped over the trees!
When we landed at the island the soldiers couldn’t lift the food trunk off the aircraft. We shut down and then found that it was inexplicably full almost right to the brim with water! It had to be bailed out to get the weight down.
An investigation discovered that the Army, concerned about the delay causing their beers to get warm, had kept going back to the aircraft and topping up the ice as it melted without telling us. A cubic metre of water weighs a great deal!
I completely empathise with your story of the ‘scales Major’s’ ignorance towards your professional advice but I find it very rich that a crab is complaining about a few Army blokes having a BBQ and a few beers on the beach. I’ve never met a crab yet that’s willing to get their feet wet.
LZ
LZ
