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Brexit

Old 7th Feb 2021, 11:57
  #81 (permalink)  
 
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If the Brexit EASA issue is caused by the inflexible and autocratic 'political dogma' of the UK then why do EASA licences pilots continue to be allowed to fly G-reg in UK? Surely EASA licences must be considered to be third country by UK?
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Old 7th Feb 2021, 12:44
  #82 (permalink)  
 
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So... from what I can see....it seems if you have a UK CAA issued EASA CPL/ATPL, or a UK CAA CPL/ATPL you can fly a G-reg aircraft in the UK and abroad, all fine.

But.... again, from what I can see....if you want to fly an F-reg aircraft in France, or a D-reg in Germany or a PH registered aircraft in Holland (etc) then you will need your licence "verified" by the state you want to fly in, and maybe a new licence issued by that state.

This may involved an Air Law exam and a flight test. You may also need some kind of of work visa (depending what passport you hold)

So... just like the pre-JAR days?

And probably you will be required to speak the language too (although I suspect this has always been the case, especially in France or Germany)

I imagine if you are current, type-rated and experienced up the ying-yang it won't trouble European employers too much to do the paperwork to hire you.

Last edited by hargreaves99; 7th Feb 2021 at 15:46.
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Old 7th Feb 2021, 14:28
  #83 (permalink)  
 
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I imagine if you are current, type-rated and experienced up the ying-yang it won't trouble European employers too much to do the paperwork to hire you.
Having put that hypothesis to the test recently, I would not rely on it.
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Old 7th Feb 2021, 15:49
  #84 (permalink)  
 
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ah, you also need to be aged under 40


Originally Posted by Same again View Post
Having put that hypothesis to the test recently, I would not rely on it.
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Old 7th Feb 2021, 16:39
  #85 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by hargreaves99 View Post
ah, you also need to be aged under 40
why under 40?
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Old 7th Feb 2021, 16:53
  #86 (permalink)  
 
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At the risk of thread creep..

What i mean is many employers are reluctant to hire "mature" people.

I know one European offshore company who took over another around 2014 and all the pilots had to "re-apply" for their jobs. It was well known that there was a management memo/email leaked that said "don't hire anyone over 40". hence...none of the pilots aged over 40 were hired.

Originally Posted by Medevac999 View Post
why under 40?
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Old 7th Feb 2021, 17:09
  #87 (permalink)  
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If the Brexit EASA issue is caused by the inflexible and autocratic 'political dogma' of the UK then why do EASA licences pilots continue to be allowed to fly G-reg in UK? Surely EASA licences must be considered to be third country by UK?
As the UK chose to leave EASA, surely even with the most red, white and blue tinted glasses you can find, you can accept that the ‘Brexit EASA’ issue is caused by the UK?

I agree, EASA licences in the UK are now licences issued by a third country. As to why we’re still accepting them. I don’t kniw, perhaps UK gov were hoping that this little bit of largesse might earn the UK some reciprocity from the EU, perhaps it turns out we need them slightly more than they need us. However, UK chose to leave EASA ( and many other EU institutions such as Euratom and the EMA), because of the political dogma of the conservative party. That is the cause of UK licences no longer being EASA licences.
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Old 7th Feb 2021, 21:27
  #88 (permalink)  
 
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perhaps it turns out we need them slightly more than they need us.
I doubt that very much. Your credentials are clearly on display but mine was not a political statement. I only raised this here so that others who may be unaware of licence issues are informed that the angle of inclination of the EU playing field has not changed. The 'largess' demonstrated has been treated in the same way as many other unilateral gestures by our former masters.
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Old 8th Feb 2021, 00:41
  #89 (permalink)  
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Well, I’ve certainly no intention of hiding my ‘credentials’ but they are irrelevant to this discussion. All I’ve done is write down the facts of where we are. The potential issues have been quite clearly highlighted by the CAA on their website since the withdrawal agreement was signed. I’m guessing that you were fairly happy to leave the EU, well this is what it meant. I don’t say that as a dig, or as an attempt to score some political point, I just can’t work out why you seem surprised.
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Old 8th Feb 2021, 08:24
  #90 (permalink)  
 
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As an exercise in democracy I am happy that we have finally left the Titanic on our speedboat (their description). No doubt the EU still will do whatever it can to stymie the progress of UK to dissuade other states from leaving. The CAA highlighted 'potential' issues in terms of a no-deal scenario but no-one seemed to know exactly what the terms of a trade deal would mean for licences. Now we know. My surprise (although I suppose I shouldn't be) stems from the fact that the CAA allow EASA licence holders to fly here. If permission was was withdrawn then maybe there would be some incentive for EASA to change their stance. As it is why should they?
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Old 8th Feb 2021, 10:13
  #91 (permalink)  
 
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So the CAA allow a French/Dutch/German (etc) EASA CPL holder to fly a G-reg machine in the UK....yet a UK CAA CPL holder can't fly a foreign registered machine in Europe?

It sounds like the CAA has shafted us
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Old 8th Feb 2021, 11:33
  #92 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by hargreaves99 View Post
So the CAA allow a French/Dutch/German (etc) EASA CPL holder to fly a G-reg machine in the UK....yet a UK CAA CPL holder can't fly a foreign registered machine in Europe?

It sounds like the CAA has shafted us
Agreed! Absolutely shafted!!!!
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Old 8th Feb 2021, 18:07
  #93 (permalink)  
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To find out who has shafted you, I think you probably need to look to the government rather than the CAA.
Although the webpage below has been withdrawn, the replacement hyperlink leads to a dead end (a metaphor if ever there was one). Anyway, the webpage below relates to what would happen to the aviation sector in the event of a no deal. Although we have a basic Trade and Cooperation Agreement, for the purposes of aviation regulation, it is pretty much like no deal, so the options are the same/ very similar. The end result is the same, it is the Government, not the CAA who have shafted you.
https://www.gov.uk/government/public...no-brexit-deal
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Old 14th Feb 2021, 10:21
  #94 (permalink)  
 
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I may be missing something, the but the general validation for EU licence holders states ‘outside U.K. airspace’, where as the Swiss validation states ‘inside and outside U.K. airspace’. What is the mechanism to allow EU licence holders to fly within the U.K. ON G-REG aircraft?
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Old 14th Feb 2021, 13:52
  #95 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by highrpm View Post
I may be missing something, the but the general validation for EU licence holders states ‘outside U.K. airspace’, where as the Swiss validation states ‘inside and outside U.K. airspace’. What is the mechanism to allow EU licence holders to fly within the U.K. ON G-REG aircraft?
CAP1714 provides your answer (my emphasis) "All EASA certificates, approvals and licences in effect on 31 December 2020 for use in the UK aviation system and on UK-registered aircraft will be recognised by the CAA for up to two years."


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Old 14th Feb 2021, 14:15
  #96 (permalink)  
 
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All we have to do is threaten to close our airspace to any EU operator transatlantic flights, unless they grant UK pilots the right to fly EU registered aircraft, as we are allowing EU pilots to fly UK registered craft.


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Old 14th Feb 2021, 16:11
  #97 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Uplinker View Post
All we have to do is threaten to close our airspace to any EU operator transatlantic flights, unless they grant UK pilots the right to fly EU registered aircraft, as we are allowing EU pilots to fly UK registered craft.
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Old 15th Feb 2021, 00:06
  #98 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Uplinker View Post
All we have to do is threaten to close our airspace to any EU operator transatlantic flights, unless they grant UK pilots the right to fly EU registered aircraft, as we are allowing EU pilots to fly UK registered craft.
I’m reminded of the expression “ it’s better to remain silent and allow people to think you are stupid, rather than open your mouth and dispel all doubts “

Last edited by 212man; 15th Feb 2021 at 13:59.
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Old 15th Feb 2021, 09:33
  #99 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Uplinker View Post
All we have to do is threaten to close our airspace to any EU operator transatlantic flights, unless they grant UK pilots the right to fly EU registered aircraft, as we are allowing EU pilots to fly UK registered craft.
Are you perhaps familiar with the Chicago Convention's article 5?


Last edited by WillyPete; 15th Feb 2021 at 10:10.
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Old 15th Feb 2021, 09:36
  #100 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by hargreaves99 View Post
So the CAA allow a French/Dutch/German (etc) EASA CPL holder to fly a G-reg machine in the UK....yet a UK CAA CPL holder can't fly a foreign registered machine in Europe?

It sounds like the CAA has shafted us
Don't blame the CAA, they're a civil service with no real teeth or bargaining power.
Blame the current government who negotiated these terms, likely after being leaned on by UK operators who hire those foreign pilots.
The airlines simply wouldn't have wanted to sack them and have to replace them with UK pilots.
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