Crash near Harrogate, UK: January 2008
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And this is the crap being reported when people start making assumptions on Forums.
Online Daily Mail,
However Internet forums used by helicopter pilots have suggested the windy weather was a factor, and some who claimed to know Mr Spencer said he was an inexperienced pilot and had only just taken delivery of the aircraft.
Strong winds had buffeted much of the north of England on Friday, and although they had begun to die down, conditions were still blustery. One, calling himself Nigel H, wrote: "Gazelle just delivered today. Sounds like he couldn't resist having a play later on. I would not have been up there today.
Will we ever learn to shut up online and wait for the AIB to publish their findings instead of writing such rubbish for newspaper hacks to pick up on and distort!!!
Online Daily Mail,
However Internet forums used by helicopter pilots have suggested the windy weather was a factor, and some who claimed to know Mr Spencer said he was an inexperienced pilot and had only just taken delivery of the aircraft.
Strong winds had buffeted much of the north of England on Friday, and although they had begun to die down, conditions were still blustery. One, calling himself Nigel H, wrote: "Gazelle just delivered today. Sounds like he couldn't resist having a play later on. I would not have been up there today.
Will we ever learn to shut up online and wait for the AIB to publish their findings instead of writing such rubbish for newspaper hacks to pick up on and distort!!!
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Kwachon
You have a point....to a degree.
However, I have read the Daily Mail piece and cannot see any "distortion" it merely directly quoted some of the posts.
Myself and at least two other posters on this thread are current or former Gazelle pilots and live local to and know the accident site terrain. It has merely been commented on that any crosswind/downwind element in the prevailing high gust conditions yesterday would have been very demanding in a Gazelle.
If you think that is "rubbish"- will be interested to hear why.
You have a point....to a degree.
However, I have read the Daily Mail piece and cannot see any "distortion" it merely directly quoted some of the posts.
Myself and at least two other posters on this thread are current or former Gazelle pilots and live local to and know the accident site terrain. It has merely been commented on that any crosswind/downwind element in the prevailing high gust conditions yesterday would have been very demanding in a Gazelle.
If you think that is "rubbish"- will be interested to hear why.
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Fake Sealion
newspaper hacks to pick up on and distort!!!
"Gazelle just delivered today. Sounds like he couldn't resist having a play later on.
Look, I am not going to get into a pissing contest over this but just feel that sometimes armchair quarterbacks should go and log on to the NFL forum.
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The Daily Mail have excelled themselves with the photograph, couldn't even find a picture of a Gazelle! A squirrel production line was the best that they could muster!
What a load of sh*t
What a load of sh*t
Kwackon, maybe we should ask the owners of this site to change the name to UPPFaNe?? (Unprofessional Pilots Fact Network?). The things we post do usually have some relevance. I think there is very often a wx element when we hear of an incident. SO is everyone saying the wx is never a factor? Always seems to be foggy/windy/raining/low cloud/icing conditions.
Do we also never take low experience on type into account, in the exact conditions which cause particular types to be more of a handful than at other times?
When you factor certain things together they sometimes make a lot of sense. That's all that people usually work with on here without knowing all of the facts. Hell, it's called a 'rumour' network. Yes we should always wait for the investigators to come up with their findings, but while we wait, is there really any harm in speculating sensibly?
I think not.
Do we also never take low experience on type into account, in the exact conditions which cause particular types to be more of a handful than at other times?
When you factor certain things together they sometimes make a lot of sense. That's all that people usually work with on here without knowing all of the facts. Hell, it's called a 'rumour' network. Yes we should always wait for the investigators to come up with their findings, but while we wait, is there really any harm in speculating sensibly?
I think not.
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A sad conclusion
Not a big speeker but I sometime get a bit anooyed with loads of oppinions,
as a pilot with a good few hours, not sure weather this fault truly lies with the pilot, but it seems that someone with such a great experiance of comercial flight would take such a risk.The conclusion may never be known, a very sad inccident.
Thoughts with everyone
Mark
as a pilot with a good few hours, not sure weather this fault truly lies with the pilot, but it seems that someone with such a great experiance of comercial flight would take such a risk.The conclusion may never be known, a very sad inccident.
Thoughts with everyone
Mark
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May i remind people that two people have lost their lives in an accident involving machinery that most of us use/have used on a regular basis, whilst speculation is human nature the accident is just over 24hrs old, the family of those involved may well trawl the internet for answers to their grief (maybe they wont), good old google will point them in this direction if the relevant "keywords" are used,i for one enjoy the various debates in the site but feel on this occasion that we need to draw a line
A time and place for a debate maybe but not just yet?...dont wish to start arguments just remember that what is written may be read at some point in time by family of those deceased,i suggest we keep this back on track, let the thread develop when prelim findings are out maybe??
Sincere condolences to the family.
A time and place for a debate maybe but not just yet?...dont wish to start arguments just remember that what is written may be read at some point in time by family of those deceased,i suggest we keep this back on track, let the thread develop when prelim findings are out maybe??
Sincere condolences to the family.
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Don't get involved too often with thread discussions but I'm with kwachon on this one. Yes it's a rumour network but we're all adults and we know how the press don't always report the bare facts when there's much more interesting speculation which makes better copy.
I wasn't there so I don't know whether the wind was a factor or not. With over 6000 hours rotary I don't know if I would have flown in the prevailing conditions or not because I wasn't there. In fact no one was there except the pilot in question. Surely it's common decency when we know that our conjecture could well be published that we refrain from being armchair AAIB investigators especially when the unfortunate pilot concerned is deceased. How much better will his relatives feel when the Mail reports in the weeks to come that the engine failed at a crucial point in the transition and that the outcome was unavoidable; when the pilot's reputation has already been smeared, helped on however unwittingly by ourselves. The engine may not have failed but just like the weather being a factor we don't know. Have the grace to give a dead pilot who can't defend himself the benefit of the doubt, at least until the professionals prove otherwise.
I wasn't there so I don't know whether the wind was a factor or not. With over 6000 hours rotary I don't know if I would have flown in the prevailing conditions or not because I wasn't there. In fact no one was there except the pilot in question. Surely it's common decency when we know that our conjecture could well be published that we refrain from being armchair AAIB investigators especially when the unfortunate pilot concerned is deceased. How much better will his relatives feel when the Mail reports in the weeks to come that the engine failed at a crucial point in the transition and that the outcome was unavoidable; when the pilot's reputation has already been smeared, helped on however unwittingly by ourselves. The engine may not have failed but just like the weather being a factor we don't know. Have the grace to give a dead pilot who can't defend himself the benefit of the doubt, at least until the professionals prove otherwise.
Last edited by YOP; 29th Jan 2008 at 14:45.
Kwachon...you quote me .......One, calling himself Nigel H, wrote: "Gazelle just delivered today. Sounds like he couldn't resist having a play later on. I would not have been up there today.
I believe it was just delivered. I did say "sounds like " due to the fact that there are other methods of transport and it had been left by a professional just hours before and been tied down for the night ....as i am told.
I repeat that i would not have wanted to fly that day in a squirrel which has similar performance . Even today, with less wind, the turbulence flying near to that area was extreme at times to the extent that i called leeds atc to warn other pilots. I am not saying that the wind WAS a factor but what i am saying is that he should have shut down for the night OR kept his safety pilot for that last fateful flight.
As pointed out before , this is a rumour network ....are you saying we should effectively be closed down due to the possibility of press reading ?? With the initiative of the safety meetings maybe something positive could come out of this dreadful thing.
I believe it was just delivered. I did say "sounds like " due to the fact that there are other methods of transport and it had been left by a professional just hours before and been tied down for the night ....as i am told.
I repeat that i would not have wanted to fly that day in a squirrel which has similar performance . Even today, with less wind, the turbulence flying near to that area was extreme at times to the extent that i called leeds atc to warn other pilots. I am not saying that the wind WAS a factor but what i am saying is that he should have shut down for the night OR kept his safety pilot for that last fateful flight.
As pointed out before , this is a rumour network ....are you saying we should effectively be closed down due to the possibility of press reading ?? With the initiative of the safety meetings maybe something positive could come out of this dreadful thing.
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Nigelh
I did not quote you, I quoted what was written in the Mail who quoted you, if you read your original quote you will see that the newspaper was selective in what they printed. Had they printed the full quote the context would have been much different.
Of course you should be free to say what you want, but in the early part of the thread (#24) a reporter did identify himself as looking for any information, that my friend is always a flag that what is to be written might not truly reflect what was said and indeed was the case here.
Of course you should be free to say what you want, but in the early part of the thread (#24) a reporter did identify himself as looking for any information, that my friend is always a flag that what is to be written might not truly reflect what was said and indeed was the case here.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
"Leave it to the AAIB"
Firstly, who's to say it wasn't a technical problem?
Must we always blame the pilot first?
Looking at the picture below and going on the post by 'AndrewTaylor', as a generalisation, the wind was 220/18 Gusting 34.
The 'H' is to the right of the concrete circle, top left of centre.
Firstly, who's to say it wasn't a technical problem?
Must we always blame the pilot first?
Looking at the picture below and going on the post by 'AndrewTaylor', as a generalisation, the wind was 220/18 Gusting 34.
The 'H' is to the right of the concrete circle, top left of centre.
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Hi Guys,
Does anybody know the reg of the aircraft? Was it a recently registered Hungarian machine? I have a sneaking suspecion that I used to fly this aircraft.
Throughly sad to see two more members of our aviation community die in such tragic circumstances.
Sincere condolences to the family.
Does anybody know the reg of the aircraft? Was it a recently registered Hungarian machine? I have a sneaking suspecion that I used to fly this aircraft.
Throughly sad to see two more members of our aviation community die in such tragic circumstances.
Sincere condolences to the family.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/...302563,00.html
"Their family and friends have been left devastated by the tragedy, but can take comfort that at the time of the accident they were in one of their favourite places together and doing something they both loved."
Last edited by Senior Pilot; 28th Jan 2008 at 12:05. Reason: remove offensive comment
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Hiduly Damper
it wasnt a hungarian registered machine and was not 241 as you thought
it was a ex uk registered [G,SKUL ] a stretch gazelle 341g now on the yugo reg it was flown to the hotel by its owner who also had a safety pilot with him .
steve
it wasnt a hungarian registered machine and was not 241 as you thought
it was a ex uk registered [G,SKUL ] a stretch gazelle 341g now on the yugo reg it was flown to the hotel by its owner who also had a safety pilot with him .
steve