Banner Towing
Join Date: Sep 2004
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If there are any operators interested in doing this type of flying in Europe and North America please PM me and I can put you in touch with the ops Manager. Not the most exciting flying but good hours and good rates.
Paco,
If you allowed a B206 to drag 25,000 sq ft, I'd seriously suggest having the poor thing inspected
No wonder it only managed 20kts, the drag on the hook and airframe would have been way over limits.
If you allowed a B206 to drag 25,000 sq ft, I'd seriously suggest having the poor thing inspected
No wonder it only managed 20kts, the drag on the hook and airframe would have been way over limits.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: England
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The banner was towed by one heli G-OHMS (AS355, orange) operated (for this job) by CABAIR HELICOPTERS. The second helicopter was G-CHUM (R-44, blue and silver) just watching for a while as this was only the second time an AS-355 has been used to tow the banner it has previously been towed by a bell 206.
The banner is 25000 sq ft.
The operating speed is 30-40 kt, the banner displays best when the helicopter has a descent rate of approx 100-200 ft/min.
Quite an impressive sight, a great advertisement for both the sponsor and helicopters. I personally hope we see much more of this sort of thing .both in the U.K and worldwide.
The banner is 25000 sq ft.
The operating speed is 30-40 kt, the banner displays best when the helicopter has a descent rate of approx 100-200 ft/min.
Quite an impressive sight, a great advertisement for both the sponsor and helicopters. I personally hope we see much more of this sort of thing .both in the U.K and worldwide.
Last edited by 3 D; 19th Apr 2005 at 09:48.
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John - as the man says, it was a 355 - our 206s are good in a tight spot but not that good! 
I was misinformed about the size - sorry
phil
I was misinformed about the size - sorry
phil
Paco,
I guess it was 12,500 (125,000 sounds way too grand!), which would be manageable in a 206, and easy for the 355. The cut and manufature of the flag makes an enormous difference to the drag, and the way it flies: one local maker creates a product that needs 2/3rds the power that a competitor's flag does, same size and helicopter!
BK117 and a 38,000 sq ft flag. Absolute PITA to fly, 35kias and the helicopter wanted to oscillate around the forward cargo hook points:
Two of the JetRanger with a c10,000 sq ft flag with the overland rig:
I guess it was 12,500 (125,000 sounds way too grand!), which would be manageable in a 206, and easy for the 355. The cut and manufature of the flag makes an enormous difference to the drag, and the way it flies: one local maker creates a product that needs 2/3rds the power that a competitor's flag does, same size and helicopter!
BK117 and a 38,000 sq ft flag. Absolute PITA to fly, 35kias and the helicopter wanted to oscillate around the forward cargo hook points:
Two of the JetRanger with a c10,000 sq ft flag with the overland rig:
Join Date: Aug 2000
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Chinese whispers I love it.
Our company did the job on behalf of Cabair with my boss flying it. The aircraft was in fact a 355 (G-OHMS) borrowed kindly from Paco.
The air speed limit was 20 Knots and in fact registered 0 for the entire flight. The flag was 25,000 sq ft though plans are in hand for a 100,000 sq ft flag.
The flag is weighted with 100 Kg of fine sand. In the event of a problem the flag is dropped and during this procedure the sand is released from its container and blows away on the wind causing no problems. The flag as stated streams and comes down as described.
It had also been flown twice for the FA cup matches in Cardiff on the Saturday and that Sunday morning.
Yes it is obviously fully approved by the CAA and all permissions granted. After all would be silly to think no one would notice us, that being the point of the advert. Oh and for anyone interested it is simply mounted by a conventional hook system as used on the 355 for normal underslung work.
Cheers
Banjo (and thanks again for the aircraft Paco, I'll get those video clips for you this week)
Our company did the job on behalf of Cabair with my boss flying it. The aircraft was in fact a 355 (G-OHMS) borrowed kindly from Paco.
The air speed limit was 20 Knots and in fact registered 0 for the entire flight. The flag was 25,000 sq ft though plans are in hand for a 100,000 sq ft flag.
The flag is weighted with 100 Kg of fine sand. In the event of a problem the flag is dropped and during this procedure the sand is released from its container and blows away on the wind causing no problems. The flag as stated streams and comes down as described.
It had also been flown twice for the FA cup matches in Cardiff on the Saturday and that Sunday morning.
Yes it is obviously fully approved by the CAA and all permissions granted. After all would be silly to think no one would notice us, that being the point of the advert. Oh and for anyone interested it is simply mounted by a conventional hook system as used on the 355 for normal underslung work.
Cheers
Banjo (and thanks again for the aircraft Paco, I'll get those video clips for you this week)
Last edited by Banjo; 19th Apr 2005 at 07:02.
Gnome de PPRuNe
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Ahhhh! Saw it in the distance from outside East Croydon Station and wondered what the hell it was - then went into the Porter and Sorter (pub) and, for reasons I cannot divulge, promptly forgot about it! Mystery solved...
Thanks folks.
Thanks folks.
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Banner towing with heli's
Any of you have experience with towing banners with a helicopter? what did you have to do to get the rating for it? I know it's not a JAR-FCL rating and would be a national one, so any information about how the various countries apply it would be greatly appreciated.
I know it's being done in some places. I tried to google it but didn't find any decent info (in fact none!), so I turn to you guys.
Thanks!
Westy
I know it's being done in some places. I tried to google it but didn't find any decent info (in fact none!), so I turn to you guys.
Thanks!
Westy
Join Date: May 2004
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In Australia it is a function of "Specialised Operations" that must be included as Part D of a company's operations manual.
The pilot requires a sling endorsement on their endorsement to be able to carry out the procedure.
UK - sorry. A bit unsure of what the CAA requires. No doubt it is completely over the top like all their other requirements.
The pilot requires a sling endorsement on their endorsement to be able to carry out the procedure.
UK - sorry. A bit unsure of what the CAA requires. No doubt it is completely over the top like all their other requirements.
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I do believe John Eacott is "The Man" to talk too ....
Speak to Rod wood who is cheif pilot for cabair helicopters who do all the helicopter flag flying in the UK.
?)I myself have a tow rating for fixed-wing (not for banner, just for getting those gliders up there...) but would the same required training be suffice for a heli? is it tricky with heli's? does the CAA or other authority stamp it in your licence?
question over question... sorry...
Westy
P.S. no, I don't want to do it, but I know someone who does....
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The email address for Cabair Heles is below. It will probably go through to their ops, but I am sure they will pass it on. Incidentally, there are 1 or 2 photos of their banner towing on their website too
[email protected]
[email protected]
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Cabair
Rod Wood, Marion or Ian Burningham are the people to speak to, have worked with them before on the underslugng banner stuff. I think it was developed in Australia (very clever bit of kit).
0208 953 4411
0208 953 4411
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It seems WestWind is looking for a bit of a discussion on heli banner tow flying. I too would be interested in hearing from those whom have experience, if you wouldn't mind continuing the thread outside PMs.
What equipment is preferred, is it particularly difficult, what are some of the pitfalls, how does the market compare to fixed-wing banner tow, etc.?
What equipment is preferred, is it particularly difficult, what are some of the pitfalls, how does the market compare to fixed-wing banner tow, etc.?