Be realistic, my friends...
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I wonder how many airliners where is service 40, 30, 20, and 10 years ago and how many we have in the world today? How many airline pilots 40, 30, 20, and 10 years ago? Maybe someone needs to put numbers together and see any trends.....
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I love flying but THERE IS more to life...
My two pence... When I started out 8 years ago, my old man used to say "flying is just a hobby, get a proper job". Till this day and even knowing that I now have my prof licenses he says the same thing. And he is right (but probably for the wrong reasons 
)
In this day and age, you are a fairly useless human being if all you know is how to fly a plane. Make sure you have a backup career path. I know a lot of people say this but it's also true not a lot of people actually listen to this advice. By backup career path I don't mean a mere qualification. I'm talking about practical, hands on real life experience.
Having been exposed to around 100+ student pilots over the course of my training, it defies belief how many think flying a jet is the only skill they need in life. Hard times like these prove that to be woefully untrue.
In short then, those of you who start at 18, 19, 20 or 21 (if you're a Uni leaver) and move on to airlines (as your first job) you're asking for trouble. Being this age and commencing a flying career you're likely to have a lot of debt. If you're airline folds you are left in the doodoo to roast (unless you follow WWW's school of thought but we'll leave that for a rainy day!). This matters now more than ever as the cost of living has spiralled. Even 18 hour shifts at Burger King are not gonna help. What would've helped is 4-5 years experience in another field.
The best advise I can give budding school/uni leaver wannabes is delay your career by around 5 years. You can clearly see how the airline industry goes from boom to bust. There are so many opportunities out there to make real, hard, fast cash in other careers it's almost untrue. And you should take the opportunity to, cos you'll need it!
)In this day and age, you are a fairly useless human being if all you know is how to fly a plane. Make sure you have a backup career path. I know a lot of people say this but it's also true not a lot of people actually listen to this advice. By backup career path I don't mean a mere qualification. I'm talking about practical, hands on real life experience.
Having been exposed to around 100+ student pilots over the course of my training, it defies belief how many think flying a jet is the only skill they need in life. Hard times like these prove that to be woefully untrue.
In short then, those of you who start at 18, 19, 20 or 21 (if you're a Uni leaver) and move on to airlines (as your first job) you're asking for trouble. Being this age and commencing a flying career you're likely to have a lot of debt. If you're airline folds you are left in the doodoo to roast (unless you follow WWW's school of thought but we'll leave that for a rainy day!). This matters now more than ever as the cost of living has spiralled. Even 18 hour shifts at Burger King are not gonna help. What would've helped is 4-5 years experience in another field.
The best advise I can give budding school/uni leaver wannabes is delay your career by around 5 years. You can clearly see how the airline industry goes from boom to bust. There are so many opportunities out there to make real, hard, fast cash in other careers it's almost untrue. And you should take the opportunity to, cos you'll need it!
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Dog congrats on the job.
But which part of the thread do you disagree with... do you not think that getting a job as a low houred wanabee over the next few years is going to be extremely difficult?? if you disagree please tell us why??
If you are just here to rub your success in the noses of those that are struggling best you do go elsewhere...
But which part of the thread do you disagree with... do you not think that getting a job as a low houred wanabee over the next few years is going to be extremely difficult?? if you disagree please tell us why??
If you are just here to rub your success in the noses of those that are struggling best you do go elsewhere...
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cheer up guys
hey guys i jus said id post on here to try and help some of the guys really itching to start the atpls ,About 8ys ago i was in your boots came out of school was looking forward to start my training but the first problem that hit me was this 100k you needed 
parents wouldnt just hand it over as i was young or guarantor it as i was still fallin in the door after discos, went became a sparky saved some money then did it, now flying 320 for nice big company wont have command for a goodwhile but i dont mind im in no rush not like the other monkeys on here who think they are ready with 1500hrs, my point here is i would be very careful at the minute what you decide to do. I know its your dream it was mine too but i had to hold out for 4yrs and it all worked out in end, like the other posts are sayin here too get a job, do a degree(outside of aviation) flyabout in your cessna building hours maybe go on flying holiday in florida(best time of my life) but i would not like to be forking our so much money in the current climate recruitment had dried up completely and i think it will get worse, now what i find quite amazing is guys on this site saying my company is getn 3a/c a month so loads of jobs etc etc and at same time those same places askin there pilots to take leave....something astray somewhere 
, but the bigger picture is in the boeing and airbus sites look at deliverie dates for a/c lots of jobs in coming years so you will just have to be in "right place at right time"
The best of luck to everyone on here i hope ye all get to where you want to go and i dont mean my post in any negative way at all,
safe flyin
parents wouldnt just hand it over as i was young or guarantor it as i was still fallin in the door after discos, went became a sparky saved some money then did it, now flying 320 for nice big company wont have command for a goodwhile but i dont mind im in no rush not like the other monkeys on here who think they are ready with 1500hrs, my point here is i would be very careful at the minute what you decide to do. I know its your dream it was mine too but i had to hold out for 4yrs and it all worked out in end, like the other posts are sayin here too get a job, do a degree(outside of aviation) flyabout in your cessna building hours maybe go on flying holiday in florida(best time of my life) but i would not like to be forking our so much money in the current climate recruitment had dried up completely and i think it will get worse, now what i find quite amazing is guys on this site saying my company is getn 3a/c a month so loads of jobs etc etc and at same time those same places askin there pilots to take leave....something astray somewhere , but the bigger picture is in the boeing and airbus sites look at deliverie dates for a/c lots of jobs in coming years so you will just have to be in "right place at right time"The best of luck to everyone on here i hope ye all get to where you want to go and i dont mean my post in any negative way at all,
safe flyin
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Congratulations on the job Dog.
Just to avoid confusion and giving people false hopes, what you are implying is that it's OK to start training if you have mates in the industry who will guarantee you a job regardless of whether there are positions available (and assumiming the airline is guranteed not to go bust) . Sounds reasonable to me.
Do you have any sensible advice for the other 99.999% of wannabees ?
Just to avoid confusion and giving people false hopes, what you are implying is that it's OK to start training if you have mates in the industry who will guarantee you a job regardless of whether there are positions available (and assumiming the airline is guranteed not to go bust) . Sounds reasonable to me.
Do you have any sensible advice for the other 99.999% of wannabees ?
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Hey Pantera,
If you think that a corporate job is safe, careless and well paid, well actually you may be an idiot !
There's no free lunch, my studies weren't and I'm still paying for it ! Pilots are incredible by thinking that they are the only ones paying 100K$ for study. Go and apply for engineering shool then MBA...
I've just stated that at least you are FLYING, not spendind time in front of a computer or worse, travelling for your job all the time and watching the others flying... I take the plane every weeks, and incidentally I sell them...
Anyway people are free to believe and act as they want to, I respect every opinion but implying that it is easy to find a careless, well paid, safe corporate job while poor, mortgaged to the hilt pilots are struggling for life in an airclub earning **** is just bull**** from someone who never entered into a company.
I know mainly business aviation, as I am specialized into. I can tell you that pilots -even unexperienced- starting on Hawker or similar are earning much more money than I do after almost 10 years of work with half the hours as my boss does't give a sh*t of how many hours I spend in a plane or hotels or nights working to sell aircrafts that I wish you to fly one day ! (I'd prefer piloting smaller ones
)
If you think that a corporate job is safe, careless and well paid, well actually you may be an idiot !
There's no free lunch, my studies weren't and I'm still paying for it ! Pilots are incredible by thinking that they are the only ones paying 100K$ for study. Go and apply for engineering shool then MBA...
I've just stated that at least you are FLYING, not spendind time in front of a computer or worse, travelling for your job all the time and watching the others flying... I take the plane every weeks, and incidentally I sell them...
Anyway people are free to believe and act as they want to, I respect every opinion but implying that it is easy to find a careless, well paid, safe corporate job while poor, mortgaged to the hilt pilots are struggling for life in an airclub earning **** is just bull**** from someone who never entered into a company.
I know mainly business aviation, as I am specialized into. I can tell you that pilots -even unexperienced- starting on Hawker or similar are earning much more money than I do after almost 10 years of work with half the hours as my boss does't give a sh*t of how many hours I spend in a plane or hotels or nights working to sell aircrafts that I wish you to fly one day ! (I'd prefer piloting smaller ones
)
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I think any wannabe is happy to 'brown nose' to get a seat with an airline, I'll happily move to anywhere in the world to get my first job. But with current pilots being unable to guarantee their own seat with the airline I find it hard to understand how 'dog' can have a guaranteed RHS with them?
I'm guessing he is either related to the owner, CEO, President of the airline OR He's paying for his RHS with somebody like EagleJet? Which in all honesty isn't a job (A regular activity performed in exchange for payment, especially as one's trade, occupation, or profession.)
I'm guessing he is either related to the owner, CEO, President of the airline OR He's paying for his RHS with somebody like EagleJet? Which in all honesty isn't a job
(A regular activity performed in exchange for payment, especially as one's trade, occupation, or profession.)Join Date: Aug 2006
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Airlines did furlough thousands of pilots, many never made it back to flying.
It was bad, but not as bad as it is now...The world economy today is in a worse shape, than it was in 1929.
Even though Wall Street still does not want to admit it... Their pride...?
Economy is certainly worse than the 1974-1980s' period.
And why is that? This certainly becomes a real battlefield of wannabe economics, but everybody has a right for his own opinion, still i would rather hear some arguments with it..
And despite all that you will train for the next 2 years as pilot...
And spend anywhere between $60,000 to $100,000+ for a licence...?
JAA or FAA, what are your plans, frame it and show it to friends...?
If you get a job flying, is it CFI and earn $1,200 per month...?
Yes, that is right. How much you pay in states to study medicine? There is nothing wrong with CFI position, and it is valuable experience - and of course you gain lot of hours, and your CV is not anymore with 250h guys.
The way I see it, things will get back to normal 10 years from now (maybe).
Like i said, everybody has a right to his own opinion, mine is that put it half, and half again.
You love airplanes and flying... ok.
So, invest in medical studies, or law. When rich, buy yourself a little airplane.
So is this it, the "American dream"?
And medical and law careers doesn't interest us here.
What I know about airlines now...? Well, I would not dream of an airline career.
I will. I have talk with many pilots ( for my current work i meet them daily), flying with Lufthansa, Finnair, Finncomm Airlines, SAS, Austrian, Blue1, Air Pulmantur, KLM, Aeroflot etc.. I often ask would they still go for it, everyone would. I'd rather observe in a "field" than here.
I understand that there is many risks and downsides consedering career as a pilot, but if i really want to do it, i will, i can, and i will succees with it, thats it, all what matters to me. With hard work (save the money, read and learn), a proper career planning and with a finnish "sisu" there is no doubt that i would not succees.
Dont let other people tell to you cant do it, you should not do it etc.. So guys get out of pprune and work hard,plan carefully and go for it.
Happy debating about downturns and everything, i am going to take off.
It was bad, but not as bad as it is now...The world economy today is in a worse shape, than it was in 1929.
Even though Wall Street still does not want to admit it... Their pride...?
Economy is certainly worse than the 1974-1980s' period.
And why is that? This certainly becomes a real battlefield of wannabe economics, but everybody has a right for his own opinion, still i would rather hear some arguments with it..
And despite all that you will train for the next 2 years as pilot...
And spend anywhere between $60,000 to $100,000+ for a licence...?
JAA or FAA, what are your plans, frame it and show it to friends...?
If you get a job flying, is it CFI and earn $1,200 per month...?
Yes, that is right. How much you pay in states to study medicine? There is nothing wrong with CFI position, and it is valuable experience - and of course you gain lot of hours, and your CV is not anymore with 250h guys.
The way I see it, things will get back to normal 10 years from now (maybe).
Like i said, everybody has a right to his own opinion, mine is that put it half, and half again.
You love airplanes and flying... ok.
So, invest in medical studies, or law. When rich, buy yourself a little airplane.
So is this it, the "American dream"?
And medical and law careers doesn't interest us here.
What I know about airlines now...? Well, I would not dream of an airline career.
I will. I have talk with many pilots ( for my current work i meet them daily), flying with Lufthansa, Finnair, Finncomm Airlines, SAS, Austrian, Blue1, Air Pulmantur, KLM, Aeroflot etc.. I often ask would they still go for it, everyone would. I'd rather observe in a "field" than here.
I understand that there is many risks and downsides consedering career as a pilot, but if i really want to do it, i will, i can, and i will succees with it, thats it, all what matters to me. With hard work (save the money, read and learn), a proper career planning and with a finnish "sisu" there is no doubt that i would not succees.
Dont let other people tell to you cant do it, you should not do it etc.. So guys get out of pprune and work hard,plan carefully and go for it.
Happy debating about downturns and everything, i am going to take off.
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Dog
Best wishes for the new job, please share with us the aircraft ype that you have been lucky enough to get a RHS in....
Your success is against the tide, so congrats but you knowing somebody who "helped you in" doesnt change the fact that everybody else is going to struggle.
People forget that simply getting on a course doesn't mean you you get to fly the aircraft, probably not a good idea to kick off your sim sessions with that attitude with your instructor.......Lets just hope the LST goes ok shall we........
Best wishes for the new job, please share with us the aircraft ype that you have been lucky enough to get a RHS in....
Your success is against the tide, so congrats but you knowing somebody who "helped you in" doesnt change the fact that everybody else is going to struggle.
I can tell you now MATEY I will be in a RHS in under 3 months "FACT"
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What a bunch of FRUSTRATED AND JEALOUS LITTLE PEOPLE!
You lot really do make me laugh...
It really is great reading just to sitting here watching you all attack like the nasty little creatures you are ..
Do you want me to hold your hand???
begrudging know it alls>>>> thats better
You lot really do make me laugh...
It really is great reading just to sitting here watching you all attack like the nasty little creatures you are ..
Do you want me to hold your hand???
begrudging know it alls>>>> thats better
Last edited by dog.101; 25th Sep 2008 at 18:55.
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Whatever dog get back to your little dream world.
If you were so cock sure of yourself then what are you doing on this forum thought you didn't have time for us losers?
A little tip for you. I would update your details to show your ratings and then it would give you a little more cred.
Don't bother do reply I don't care what you think but you obviously care what we think but can't admit that your chum can't offer you a faster track to RHS than he can to anyone else, because you see friends or no friends when there ain't no jobs there ain't no jobs.
I suspect someone has hit a raw nerve with you which is why you have come out all guns blazing.
If you were so cock sure of yourself then what are you doing on this forum thought you didn't have time for us losers?
A little tip for you. I would update your details to show your ratings and then it would give you a little more cred.
Don't bother do reply I don't care what you think but you obviously care what we think but can't admit that your chum can't offer you a faster track to RHS than he can to anyone else, because you see friends or no friends when there ain't no jobs there ain't no jobs.
I suspect someone has hit a raw nerve with you which is why you have come out all guns blazing.
Last edited by chickentikkamasala; 25th Sep 2008 at 19:07.
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No English test.
And English is NOT my first language I'm VERY Proud to say!
But thanks for the tip and the rest will do as it it.
Should you not be out looking for a job and not sitting at home moaning to strangers over the internet?
And English is NOT my first language I'm VERY Proud to say!
But thanks for the tip and the rest will do as it it.
Should you not be out looking for a job and not sitting at home moaning to strangers over the internet?