The never-ending 'Modular vs. Integrated' debate - merged ad nauseam
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The never-ending 'Modular vs. Integrated' debate - merged ad nauseam
I know there are a lot of threads out there going over modular vs integrated training, but it would take ages to go through it all and note all the advantages & disadvantages.
Can anyone who can think of pros & cons for each submit them here (assume we don't go to war with Saddam) as there are a lot of people trying to make up there mind and this would be an easy reference.
Thanks
Can anyone who can think of pros & cons for each submit them here (assume we don't go to war with Saddam) as there are a lot of people trying to make up there mind and this would be an easy reference.
Thanks
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Check out the following document which specifies approved FTO's and lists integrated and modular courses.
CAA approved FTO's (integrated and modular)
CAA approved FTO's (integrated and modular)
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Modular pilots are less rich, work harder, and are motivated(it is a fact), when integrated students are living in a castle, have a rolex and a ferrari paid by dady.
And as for saying that Modular pilots work harder and are more motivated than Integrated pilots, don't get me started.........
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Hello all.
Basically, after researching this topic to the point of insanity, I have narrowed my choice down to two options:
Option 1 (Modular)
Bear in mind that I'm currntly employed by an airline ops and earn quite good money (for this industry). I'm not in a rush to quit. So, my modular plan is:
Save £5k in the next few months and then go to the US to finish off my PPL. There is a fast track course which claims to do it within a month run by EFT (Florida). I could take the month off as holiday.
When I come back, go down to part time hours at work and enrol on a distance learning course to complete my ATPL exams (Im still deciding which of 2 schools to use). Although hard to say, I think I can do this in 8 months.
Once those are out of the way, I will have fairly easily saved another 5K. This will enable me to go and do my hour building (SA, Canada perhaps).
Once ready for the big boy stuff, either take unpaid leave for 13 weeks (if the boss lets me) or quit my job. Buy a CPL/IR/MEP/MCC package at a reputable school (maybe one of the ones that do integrated). For this I would take out a £20k-£25k loan. Still a lot of money but I could sleep at night.
Then ask for my old job back and be yet another dispatching pilot!
Compare with option 2 (Integrated)
FTE at Jerez where I've already been accepted. I would put forward £20k and take a loan for the rest. Obviously a lot more debt as the course is more expensive, I can work for most of the modular route AND live at home.
Less chance (still some) of the dispatching pilot scenario.
I know a lot of you will say the modular route is the best one. I have to say that it looks very appealing to me for lots of different reasons. The main one is that I can structure it to my timescale and therefore maximising income and minimising out goings.
Just wondered what people's thoughts were, particularly on the realism of my modular option as there are lots out there who have bought the teeshirt.
Thanks,
EK
Basically, after researching this topic to the point of insanity, I have narrowed my choice down to two options:
Option 1 (Modular)
Bear in mind that I'm currntly employed by an airline ops and earn quite good money (for this industry). I'm not in a rush to quit. So, my modular plan is:
Save £5k in the next few months and then go to the US to finish off my PPL. There is a fast track course which claims to do it within a month run by EFT (Florida). I could take the month off as holiday.
When I come back, go down to part time hours at work and enrol on a distance learning course to complete my ATPL exams (Im still deciding which of 2 schools to use). Although hard to say, I think I can do this in 8 months.
Once those are out of the way, I will have fairly easily saved another 5K. This will enable me to go and do my hour building (SA, Canada perhaps).
Once ready for the big boy stuff, either take unpaid leave for 13 weeks (if the boss lets me) or quit my job. Buy a CPL/IR/MEP/MCC package at a reputable school (maybe one of the ones that do integrated). For this I would take out a £20k-£25k loan. Still a lot of money but I could sleep at night.
Then ask for my old job back and be yet another dispatching pilot!
Compare with option 2 (Integrated)
FTE at Jerez where I've already been accepted. I would put forward £20k and take a loan for the rest. Obviously a lot more debt as the course is more expensive, I can work for most of the modular route AND live at home.
Less chance (still some) of the dispatching pilot scenario.
I know a lot of you will say the modular route is the best one. I have to say that it looks very appealing to me for lots of different reasons. The main one is that I can structure it to my timescale and therefore maximising income and minimising out goings.
Just wondered what people's thoughts were, particularly on the realism of my modular option as there are lots out there who have bought the teeshirt.
Thanks,
EK
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I'd say you're plan for modular sounds OK. If it were me I'd not be going down to part time hours at work during the ATPL ground school - but each to their own. It will undoubtedly make the studying easier and if you can cope with the drop in income thats OK I guess.
Again from a purely personal point of view, the 8 months without flying would annoy me awaiting to go to SA or similar for the hours building. If you could hour build whilst over here for a cheap rate then that might be worth considering. Still - thats a way off yet. Step 1 is to get your PPL. Good luck.
Again from a purely personal point of view, the 8 months without flying would annoy me awaiting to go to SA or similar for the hours building. If you could hour build whilst over here for a cheap rate then that might be worth considering. Still - thats a way off yet. Step 1 is to get your PPL. Good luck.
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Thanks topcat,
I have to agree, the weakest point of my plan is the groundschool phase. I'm pretty focused when it comes to these sorts of things but I understand that there is a hell of a lot to learn.
I guess you just have to bite the bullet at some point and actually do it. I could sit here weighing up my options for another 18 months but I already get the feeling I'm going around in circles. I'll probably make some choices I'll regret. But at least I'm on the road to the fATPL.
In all honesty, my personal and financial situation make the decision for me. Modular it is! (a few who have read my posts over the last 2 weeks will be utterly flabagasted I'm sure!!
)
Also disproves claims that Integrated 'sympathisers' have a snobby attitude towards mod bods!
EK.
I have to agree, the weakest point of my plan is the groundschool phase. I'm pretty focused when it comes to these sorts of things but I understand that there is a hell of a lot to learn.
I guess you just have to bite the bullet at some point and actually do it. I could sit here weighing up my options for another 18 months but I already get the feeling I'm going around in circles. I'll probably make some choices I'll regret. But at least I'm on the road to the fATPL.
In all honesty, my personal and financial situation make the decision for me. Modular it is! (a few who have read my posts over the last 2 weeks will be utterly flabagasted I'm sure!!
)Also disproves claims that Integrated 'sympathisers' have a snobby attitude towards mod bods!
EK.
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EK4457,
I think a good point is made by reading between the lines of your last couple of posts.
One person's best route is not necessarily another's. God bless choice - each to his/her own. Some routes may be impossible for some whereas otheres tick all the right boxes.
V1R
I think a good point is made by reading between the lines of your last couple of posts.
One person's best route is not necessarily another's. God bless choice - each to his/her own. Some routes may be impossible for some whereas otheres tick all the right boxes.
V1R
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EK
I'm studying for my ATPL theory with Bristol; so I'm not in a 'flying stage' of training at the moment but, in the mean time I'm keeping the hours ticking over and keeping my costs relatively low by taking friends and family on trips. After-all, you're permitted to split the cost of aircraft hire.
It keeps you interested when the books start getting a bit heavy!
APO
I'm studying for my ATPL theory with Bristol; so I'm not in a 'flying stage' of training at the moment but, in the mean time I'm keeping the hours ticking over and keeping my costs relatively low by taking friends and family on trips. After-all, you're permitted to split the cost of aircraft hire.
It keeps you interested when the books start getting a bit heavy!
APO
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What a thread!! I too am totally unsure about the difference between the courses.
In terms of modular, I was thinking maybe Riverside all-in package in 46 weeks (including fees, food and accom) - works out to £31000 with 195hrs (100twin - is that useful???) and do the GS at home with the odd hour building in the UK to keep ticking over.
Then do the MCC and JOC at OAT or maybe the Airline Bridge Course at Jerez.
I agree with many posts that it's horses for courses, but for me I'd like to be flying outside Europe asap as one of my main motivations for flying is the chance to travel to far-flung destinations so the faster I can get into an airline that allows that the better.
Hmm, that doesn't really help me much does it? Am at the penultimate stage for OAT, Jerez and WAAC so a bit confuzzled and I get the feeling it will be a case of making a choice and sticking to it, just making sure that you nag airlines whichever route you go.
The one thing is favour perhaps is that in modular you have to go looking whereas integrated they don't necessarily come looking but they at least will have heard of the school and some airlines do look to sponsor/keep close tabs on the recruits going through their schools so you are more in the wannabees loop?
In terms of modular, I was thinking maybe Riverside all-in package in 46 weeks (including fees, food and accom) - works out to £31000 with 195hrs (100twin - is that useful???) and do the GS at home with the odd hour building in the UK to keep ticking over.
Then do the MCC and JOC at OAT or maybe the Airline Bridge Course at Jerez.
I agree with many posts that it's horses for courses, but for me I'd like to be flying outside Europe asap as one of my main motivations for flying is the chance to travel to far-flung destinations so the faster I can get into an airline that allows that the better.
Hmm, that doesn't really help me much does it? Am at the penultimate stage for OAT, Jerez and WAAC so a bit confuzzled and I get the feeling it will be a case of making a choice and sticking to it, just making sure that you nag airlines whichever route you go.
The one thing is favour perhaps is that in modular you have to go looking whereas integrated they don't necessarily come looking but they at least will have heard of the school and some airlines do look to sponsor/keep close tabs on the recruits going through their schools so you are more in the wannabees loop?
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Modular V's integrated
Please also can anyone tell me the diffrence please
http://digital-reality.co.uk/acf/
oh and the click on courses and then fATPL
Thanks all
Can any one help me please
http://digital-reality.co.uk/acf/
oh and the click on courses and then fATPL
Thanks all
Can any one help me please
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That's an American school, isn't it? They're speaking FAA licences, I'm not sure that's what you want..
Anyway, the difference is rather easy:
modular - you get your licences one by one. First PPL, then CPL/IR, then the ground course for the fATPL.
integrated - One BIG course including every aspect from scratch up to the fATPL (in case of an ATPL integrated course).
Anyway, the difference is rather easy:
modular - you get your licences one by one. First PPL, then CPL/IR, then the ground course for the fATPL.
integrated - One BIG course including every aspect from scratch up to the fATPL (in case of an ATPL integrated course).
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The full list of approved schools is in this link
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/SRG_FCL_APPROVEDFTOS.PDF
cheers
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/SRG_FCL_APPROVEDFTOS.PDF
cheers
The answer is that it is neither an integrated course nor a modular course within the meaning of JAR-FCL 1 - it is no course at all. This outfit would appear to be acting as some sort of agent, directing training to other approved organisations in the UK (apparently BGS and Tayflite).
If you wish to throw money at someone to organise your modular courses for you then Angel City Fliers are probably as good, or bad, as any other agency. However, you would probably find it a great deal cheaper to do your own research and organise your own training. You may end up doing groundschool with BGS and the flying with Tayflite but at least you would not be paying a premium to Angel City Fliers for the privilege.
If you wish to throw money at someone to organise your modular courses for you then Angel City Fliers are probably as good, or bad, as any other agency. However, you would probably find it a great deal cheaper to do your own research and organise your own training. You may end up doing groundschool with BGS and the flying with Tayflite but at least you would not be paying a premium to Angel City Fliers for the privilege.
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Can anyone tell me why airlines prefer Integrated than Modular?
Integrated=Someone who fell out of bed and wants to be a pilot, prepared to take out a stupid size loan, they might have done a 30 min trial lesson and they want to get a licence in 150 hours!!
Modular=Someone who has tried the flying thing, liked it wants to progress and is prepared to change their career for it. Has experienced over 12 months (general) of weather, good and bad!! Plus 200 hours experience before they are given the keys to a few peoples lives!! Also the difference in price you pay for the type rating if needed?
NDB
P.S. Can anyone tell me why BA and some others don't touch modular??
Integrated=Someone who fell out of bed and wants to be a pilot, prepared to take out a stupid size loan, they might have done a 30 min trial lesson and they want to get a licence in 150 hours!!
Modular=Someone who has tried the flying thing, liked it wants to progress and is prepared to change their career for it. Has experienced over 12 months (general) of weather, good and bad!! Plus 200 hours experience before they are given the keys to a few peoples lives!! Also the difference in price you pay for the type rating if needed?
NDB
P.S. Can anyone tell me why BA and some others don't touch modular??
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P.S. Can anyone tell me why BA and some others don't touch modular??
Don't believe all the marketing and advertising some of the large FTOs put out.
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Integrated=Someone who fell out of bed and wants to be a pilot, prepared to take out a stupid size loan, they might have done a 30 min trial lesson and they want to get a licence in 150 hours!!
I hope your going to back that statement up because you have just offended alot of pilots. If you had any sense of reality then you would know that it takes more "than falling out of bed" to decide to become an airline pilot.
For some, integrated is the preferred option, for others, modular may be the preferred option. Its a matter of personal circumstance.
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You're so right ndb. The reason airlines choose integrated people is because they were intelligent enough to take the easy route. You just write a cheque for £60k or so and a few weeks later a nice shiny licence drops through your door, it's great! It shows initiative for getting the job done as efficiently as possible and that's what the airlines want.
Next week, I'm going to the bank for a £25million loan because this morning when I woke up I decided I wanted to be an astronaut.
Next week, I'm going to the bank for a £25million loan because this morning when I woke up I decided I wanted to be an astronaut.
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NDB
They do, they just don't want a flood of CVs so they stipulate integrated. Very rarely done anyway - e.g. Citiexpress specifically ask for JAA modular. They often don't even know what course you've done, nor do they care. Most recruiters know nothing about the flight-training system.
They do, they just don't want a flood of CVs so they stipulate integrated. Very rarely done anyway - e.g. Citiexpress specifically ask for JAA modular. They often don't even know what course you've done, nor do they care. Most recruiters know nothing about the flight-training system.
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Modular V's integrated
Hi all, I am currently weighing up the options of working up to a frozen ATPL by both the modular and integrated routes.
I am aware of the advantages/ disadvantages of each in term of cost, time, continuity etc, however I have read various things (mostly written by the integrated training organisations themselves) which say that airlines prefer pilots to have done integrated training. Other sources however say it does not make much difference.
Does anyone have any opinions on this, and if it is true that airlines prefer integrated traing why might that be the case?Surely at the end of the day a license is a license, no matter how you got hold of it?
Cheers, I look forward to some interesting replies.
Hedges
I am aware of the advantages/ disadvantages of each in term of cost, time, continuity etc, however I have read various things (mostly written by the integrated training organisations themselves) which say that airlines prefer pilots to have done integrated training. Other sources however say it does not make much difference.
Does anyone have any opinions on this, and if it is true that airlines prefer integrated traing why might that be the case?Surely at the end of the day a license is a license, no matter how you got hold of it?
Cheers, I look forward to some interesting replies.
Hedges