Orlando Flight Training
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Top Draw, Right Hand Side
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hijack - Unknown deductions? Now farbeit my place to comment on your situation but, mate, seriously, you let them get away with taking $4k without chasing them up! If a letter didn't work I would be banging on their door asking why they thought they could simply keep my money. Thats a serious amount of money so I would not be a happy chappy, as I'm sure you're not!!!!
Jock 113 - Comments are a bit personal but I'm not getting into an argument on here. However I have to say that as the guy above said, we are the customer and it isn't unreasonable for us to discuss any possible safety issues to do with operating an advanced bit of kit that could kill when all is said and done.
Anyway, depsite all of this I've made the decision to still go to OFT. Afterall they are JAA approved and if things were that bad then I'm sure they wouldn't be allowed to carry on instructing. When all's said and done I'm going out there to get a PPL and come home. As long as OFT deliver that at a price not disimilar from the published $8220 then I'm happy. But like any prudent pilot on ANY aircraft I will be carefully pre-flighting and making sure things are 110% ok before I taxi anywhere!!
Jock 113 - Comments are a bit personal but I'm not getting into an argument on here. However I have to say that as the guy above said, we are the customer and it isn't unreasonable for us to discuss any possible safety issues to do with operating an advanced bit of kit that could kill when all is said and done.
Anyway, depsite all of this I've made the decision to still go to OFT. Afterall they are JAA approved and if things were that bad then I'm sure they wouldn't be allowed to carry on instructing. When all's said and done I'm going out there to get a PPL and come home. As long as OFT deliver that at a price not disimilar from the published $8220 then I'm happy. But like any prudent pilot on ANY aircraft I will be carefully pre-flighting and making sure things are 110% ok before I taxi anywhere!!
Join Date: Nov 2003
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Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not having a go but just trying to find out exactly how they managed to rob you of 4k! Just incase I need to be watching out for any sligh manouvers when im out there that's all! But as I said before; $4k is alot of money and if that were me I would be either banging on their door or instructing a solicitor.
The way I see it, $4k (£2k) represents an MCC! Well whatever happens, good luck fella. Hope you manage to get it back!
The way I see it, $4k (£2k) represents an MCC! Well whatever happens, good luck fella. Hope you manage to get it back!
Join Date: Mar 2006
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First i will like to address the issue of OFT quoting less than what you will eventually pay for.Being an ex OFTstudent, i think the problem has to do with communication.OFT gives you a quote for only the minimums required and i believe if you are able to complete within the required minimums, you should be fine.However, this is not realistic because of two reasons.One has to do with not flying for some days as a result of weather,mtx issues,or instructor unavailablity.As a result, you incur more money on accomodation and other incidentals.The second reason has to do with your ability to learn fast and the kind of instructor you have.You might be lucky to have a good instructor and you are not been able to fly well at the beginning,not soloing till maybe after 25 hours,or failing your checkride,etc.As result, it it might take you more than 50hours to get your ppl.You might also be unlucky to have a bad instructor whose only interest is to get hours from you and will rather sign you off at a late stage after getting many hours from you and teaching nonsense to you.(that i was a victim of)
However, above is what you can find in any flight school around.
What we normally did at that time was to request for our account printout on daily basis.I recall that on several occassions when something was wrong,Jessica Roldan will always refund the money back.And in most cases,it was as a result of the despatchers making a wrong posting into your account.
When i decided to leave OFT to another school, i had like 5,000USD in my account but Jessica was able to send my check to me on my time.
On the issue of safety, aircraft availability, guys you get what you pay for.If you desire something cheap or want to cut costs, it always gets back to you.You get what you pay for.And as Chris Squire suggested, he will ensure he does his preflight very well, which is key to your survival.
And i think the ladies working at OFT are wonderful people and will always make you smile..I rest my case, but please i am not pro-oft.I have just stated the facts as they are.
However, above is what you can find in any flight school around.
What we normally did at that time was to request for our account printout on daily basis.I recall that on several occassions when something was wrong,Jessica Roldan will always refund the money back.And in most cases,it was as a result of the despatchers making a wrong posting into your account.
When i decided to leave OFT to another school, i had like 5,000USD in my account but Jessica was able to send my check to me on my time.
On the issue of safety, aircraft availability, guys you get what you pay for.If you desire something cheap or want to cut costs, it always gets back to you.You get what you pay for.And as Chris Squire suggested, he will ensure he does his preflight very well, which is key to your survival.
And i think the ladies working at OFT are wonderful people and will always make you smile..I rest my case, but please i am not pro-oft.I have just stated the facts as they are.
Join Date: Jan 2003
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Jaa Atpl
Hi Sloan,
Really appreciate the heads up again. I think the ATPL is a Modular Course with Cabair so no real OFT approval but may I ask if Miguel is the FAA instructor your referring too please?
Considering the ATPL with other providers works out to be around 52k GBP I think OFT still is a good deal?
Really appreciate the heads up again. I think the ATPL is a Modular Course with Cabair so no real OFT approval but may I ask if Miguel is the FAA instructor your referring too please?
Considering the ATPL with other providers works out to be around 52k GBP I think OFT still is a good deal?
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
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It is not Miguel i that i am talking about. Im not gonna name the person (it used to be my co-worker...) My point in saying this isnt to talk bad about the instructor but to share my consern having someone teaching subjects they have never gone through themself.
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OFT
Sloan,
Appreciate your information. I'm trying to acertain whether the chool is still run this way. Obviuosly concerned with the amount of cash I'm outlaying. Could you possibly just let me know whether your co-worker is still at OFT. Complete discretion assured.
Also, how are job prospects looking for you after OFT?
Appreciate your information. I'm trying to acertain whether the chool is still run this way. Obviuosly concerned with the amount of cash I'm outlaying. Could you possibly just let me know whether your co-worker is still at OFT. Complete discretion assured.
Also, how are job prospects looking for you after OFT?
Join Date: Apr 2007
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Watch out for things like "Garbage left in aircraft" $50 fine, appearing on your bill. I had three of these appear on mine and I never once left any rubbish in one of the planes. Also I'd budget for more like $10k rather than $8k.
It will come down to whether you get lucky and get a good instructor. Mine left half way through my PPL which screwed me up as the new instructor I was assigned made me relearn everything his way, pointlessly accruing more hours than was necessary.
Just make sure you come back with the PPL, it will cost you considerably more if you come back without and have to re learn here.
It will come down to whether you get lucky and get a good instructor. Mine left half way through my PPL which screwed me up as the new instructor I was assigned made me relearn everything his way, pointlessly accruing more hours than was necessary.
Just make sure you come back with the PPL, it will cost you considerably more if you come back without and have to re learn here.
Join Date: Apr 2007
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I agree On the JP guy. He's not interested in anything but misleading you.
His biggest line : I'll see what I can do
That doesn't mean he is going to look into it.
This line was given to me to keep me quiet I kept coming back and checking that he understood my situation but later I get billed for something he was going to sort out, Infact he knowingly knew I wanted to switch packages he knew that there was an alterantive and a cheaper package but didnt offer it me.
His biggest line : I'll see what I can do
That doesn't mean he is going to look into it.
This line was given to me to keep me quiet I kept coming back and checking that he understood my situation but later I get billed for something he was going to sort out, Infact he knowingly knew I wanted to switch packages he knew that there was an alterantive and a cheaper package but didnt offer it me.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
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I am pretty sure the instructor is working there still... Dont get me wrong, she might do a good job in the classroom, but i am surprised it is completly by the book.... You shouldnt have any problems getting work there after you are done... They are always looking for instructors, and there is a shortage in US in general. On the positive note, OFT pays the instructors pretty good as far as instructors go.
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OFT
Hi again,
Any provider can get CAA approval to run a modular course. The Chief Ground Instructor has to be CAA approved and choses who is suited for Instruction.
I'm doing the ATPL route so not becoming an instructor. I'll be doing my MCC and IR in the UK for direct Airline entry.
Any provider can get CAA approval to run a modular course. The Chief Ground Instructor has to be CAA approved and choses who is suited for Instruction.
I'm doing the ATPL route so not becoming an instructor. I'll be doing my MCC and IR in the UK for direct Airline entry.
Join Date: Jan 2004
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The school has to be approved of course, which OFT is. For this approval the requirements are:
A HOT (they have one)
An approved CGI (got one of those too!)
An quality manual, and a theoretical training manual (They are Cabair, so they use the same approved documents)
The CAA requires notification of all instructors that will deliver the theoretical knowledge, but they cannot actually approve or deny the suitability of an instructor. This is the CGI's responsibility to deem them suitably trained for the task. The notification is however, not a JAA requirement, so the CAA cannot enforce the notification process of instructors used. But the CGI and HOT do have to prove that instructors are trained, deemed suitable to solo in class, and are periodically checked for competence, knowledge, and instructional technique.
Instructors are sampled without prior notice of who or when, during CAA inspections. They can then deem the lecturer as either satisfactory or unsatisfactory. All sampled instructors at OFT have been found to be satisfactory.
Incidentally S10an, the lady you are referring too is also a JAA approved flight instructor, a position that does require approval and a fixed training program.
Why question a product that is producing over 90% first time pass rates time after time, and in one month accomplished a 100% first time pass rate?
I hope this clears up any confusion.
IBR
A HOT (they have one)
An approved CGI (got one of those too!)
An quality manual, and a theoretical training manual (They are Cabair, so they use the same approved documents)
The CAA requires notification of all instructors that will deliver the theoretical knowledge, but they cannot actually approve or deny the suitability of an instructor. This is the CGI's responsibility to deem them suitably trained for the task. The notification is however, not a JAA requirement, so the CAA cannot enforce the notification process of instructors used. But the CGI and HOT do have to prove that instructors are trained, deemed suitable to solo in class, and are periodically checked for competence, knowledge, and instructional technique.
Instructors are sampled without prior notice of who or when, during CAA inspections. They can then deem the lecturer as either satisfactory or unsatisfactory. All sampled instructors at OFT have been found to be satisfactory.
Incidentally S10an, the lady you are referring too is also a JAA approved flight instructor, a position that does require approval and a fixed training program.
Why question a product that is producing over 90% first time pass rates time after time, and in one month accomplished a 100% first time pass rate?
I hope this clears up any confusion.
IBR
Join Date: Feb 2007
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"Its the FAA PPL theory that we still need to pass. This is what i'm studying with Gleim. Just friendly pointer, you could arrive at study it all there."
There's also a oral exam involved on an FAA checkride that can be pretty tough if you're not prepared for it.
There's also a oral exam involved on an FAA checkride that can be pretty tough if you're not prepared for it.
Join Date: Aug 2007
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I'll Be Realistic
I know that she is a JAA approved instructor... As i already stated, i used to work there, and i was a JAA approved instructor as long as i worked there..
I never said the instructors dont know what they are doing. Getting certified as a JAA instructor when you already are a FAA flight instructor is a joke... There is no difference flying the airplane JAA or FAA.
What i am pointing out is that you have someone teaching you the ATPL groundschool which never did go through that specific program. They dont posess the JAA ATPL/Frozen ATPL.
There is a BIG difference between FAA & JAA ground/written exams..
My point is... Would you spend your money learning French from a french native or someone that took classes in highschool????
I know that she is a JAA approved instructor... As i already stated, i used to work there, and i was a JAA approved instructor as long as i worked there..
I never said the instructors dont know what they are doing. Getting certified as a JAA instructor when you already are a FAA flight instructor is a joke... There is no difference flying the airplane JAA or FAA.
What i am pointing out is that you have someone teaching you the ATPL groundschool which never did go through that specific program. They dont posess the JAA ATPL/Frozen ATPL.
There is a BIG difference between FAA & JAA ground/written exams..
My point is... Would you spend your money learning French from a french native or someone that took classes in highschool????
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What if the French Native doesn't speak Engligh? 
I know what you are saying, but its the point that you are making that is wrong. If you didn't go through the process yourself, and didn;t see the results, how can you pass judgment on their ability, or the schools ability to deliver the product. I'm all in favour of wannabes being cautious, and having direct feedback from people in the know, who have had experience. Where possible, these people should make an informed decision themselves with the best available information to them.
What that may mean, before investing 1000's of dollars is to get on a flight to the school, and go and visit for a few days. Consider it a holiday if you will. If the school has something to hide, they will be found out. If not, they have a new customser.
But what they must not do, is listen to someone who has an opinion of the training process, and to it's relativity or indeed quality. What you are questioning, is the JAA system ("how did they get that one approved"). They did, where they were required to. Now the only question left is, does it work? Only two things can be satifactory for that question. 1. School results, which can be shown to them, and to a lessor extent, 2. students opinions. I say lessor extent, because I have seen too many students over there on daddys money who treat it like a vacation. If they fail exams due to not putting in the work, the only thing you can blame the school for is not thowing themout!
But what a prospective student must not do, is take the opinion of someone who has not done the course themselves at the school, and who may be an ex-employee, from a different department. Thats just asking for here-say, which is
IBR
I know what you are saying, but its the point that you are making that is wrong. If you didn't go through the process yourself, and didn;t see the results, how can you pass judgment on their ability, or the schools ability to deliver the product. I'm all in favour of wannabes being cautious, and having direct feedback from people in the know, who have had experience. Where possible, these people should make an informed decision themselves with the best available information to them.
What that may mean, before investing 1000's of dollars is to get on a flight to the school, and go and visit for a few days. Consider it a holiday if you will. If the school has something to hide, they will be found out. If not, they have a new customser.
But what they must not do, is listen to someone who has an opinion of the training process, and to it's relativity or indeed quality. What you are questioning, is the JAA system ("how did they get that one approved"). They did, where they were required to. Now the only question left is, does it work? Only two things can be satifactory for that question. 1. School results, which can be shown to them, and to a lessor extent, 2. students opinions. I say lessor extent, because I have seen too many students over there on daddys money who treat it like a vacation. If they fail exams due to not putting in the work, the only thing you can blame the school for is not thowing themout!
But what a prospective student must not do, is take the opinion of someone who has not done the course themselves at the school, and who may be an ex-employee, from a different department. Thats just asking for here-say, which is
IBR
Join Date: Aug 2007
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I'll Be Realistic,
You are extremly defensive on this subject. Makes me think you work @ OFT in recruiting. I never said what they are doing is illegal, i was wondering how it was done.
As i said, I did work there, up to the point when they started the ATPL groundschool. I also KNOW that they have done JAA ppl training for students before the FAA instructor received any type training or checkout. The topic is OFT, and I give my experience in this field.
Who is more reliable? Someone selling the program or students and instructors living it first hand.
You are extremly defensive on this subject. Makes me think you work @ OFT in recruiting. I never said what they are doing is illegal, i was wondering how it was done.
As i said, I did work there, up to the point when they started the ATPL groundschool. I also KNOW that they have done JAA ppl training for students before the FAA instructor received any type training or checkout. The topic is OFT, and I give my experience in this field.
Who is more reliable? Someone selling the program or students and instructors living it first hand.
Join Date: Nov 2007
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any student from oft(orlando flight training)
hi guys i'm looking for students from oft to know more about the school the planes the instructors, because i'm from spain and i'm thinking going there for my jaa license . please sent me a private message or an email to proseller11 @hotmail.com
thanks guys
thanks guys
Join Date: Jan 2004
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s10an
Nope, I don't work there, but I did when you were there, and I just don't see the point in mindless "mud slinging" or the reporting of gossip. It doesn't help students get informed information.
I maintain the best thing some one can do before investing thousands in a career is to ay a few hundred quid and visit all the places they are thinking about.
I see you use the same name on APC forums. Care to PM me with who you are? I am suspecting you worked there twice before moving to the EMB 145. Am I close?
Nope, I don't work there, but I did when you were there, and I just don't see the point in mindless "mud slinging" or the reporting of gossip. It doesn't help students get informed information.
I maintain the best thing some one can do before investing thousands in a career is to ay a few hundred quid and visit all the places they are thinking about.
I see you use the same name on APC forums. Care to PM me with who you are? I am suspecting you worked there twice before moving to the EMB 145. Am I close?
Join Date: Nov 2003
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Hi All
I've opted to stay well clear of OFT. As mentioned in my previous posts, its difficult to pass too much judgement on an FTO that I haven't actually been to but I'm just not prepared to risk it with the hurrendous reports that have been posted and have been PM'd to me. I'm not looking for an argument on here but reports of instructors verbally abusing students really bothers me and that isn't my idea of good customer service when spending £10k or more!
I spoke to Cabair today....the "21 day PPL" is soon to be axed due to the lack of instructors. In my somewhat humble opinion this isn't necessarily a bad thing anyway.
So on that note....anyone planning to start JAA PPL Course in Moncton on 24th March?
Cheers
Chris
I've opted to stay well clear of OFT. As mentioned in my previous posts, its difficult to pass too much judgement on an FTO that I haven't actually been to but I'm just not prepared to risk it with the hurrendous reports that have been posted and have been PM'd to me. I'm not looking for an argument on here but reports of instructors verbally abusing students really bothers me and that isn't my idea of good customer service when spending £10k or more!
I spoke to Cabair today....the "21 day PPL" is soon to be axed due to the lack of instructors. In my somewhat humble opinion this isn't necessarily a bad thing anyway.
So on that note....anyone planning to start JAA PPL Course in Moncton on 24th March?
Cheers
Chris