Tracey Curtis-Taylor (Merged threads)
I have seen no evidence in following the fascinating saga of anything posted about T C-T that was not demonstrably true.
Perhaps her ardent defenders can give me at least one example to help change my mind.
Perhaps her ardent defenders can give me at least one example to help change my mind.
... If the aim was to discredit her because the "solo" word appeared in the media, and went uncorrected,this has been achieved. However TCT has expressed her regrets about that.
...I also find the personal abuse against me (and others who dare to speak up for her - not defend), and in particular a threatening phone call to me to be totally unacceptable. That in itself speaks volumes about the calibere and personal qualities of some of the anonymous people who post here.
...I also find the personal abuse against me (and others who dare to speak up for her - not defend), and in particular a threatening phone call to me to be totally unacceptable. That in itself speaks volumes about the calibere and personal qualities of some of the anonymous people who post here.
As for threatening phone call being unacceptable...that is the one and only point where you and I are in full agreement.
Are you still working on the list of lies on here?
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If the aim was to discredit her because the "solo" word appeared in the media, and went uncorrected,this has been achieved. However TCT has expressed her regrets about that.
Tracey Curtis-Taylor may have expressed her regrets about not correcting the media but I do not believe she has expressed her regrets about lying to the crowd at Herne Bay.
I'm afraid that you continuing to ignore this point is helping to fuel this thread, not calm it down.
Thread Starter
I think I need to correct Terry Holloway on a couple of points.
In case you have not seen it can I suggest you read this editorial from Phillip Whiteman at Pilot magazine.
I have not received a penny from the TCT story nor do I intend to.
I have merely acted as a conduit for those inside HCAP and others who have wished the truth to emerge.
I confess that as a retired journalist I have passed on and discussed this story with many former colleagues.
This includes information from Duxford, Shuttleworth and Ardmore in New Zealand where TCT claimed she was trained 'by military pilots' which is a lie.
My motive has only be to investigate and reveal the truth behind the bulls**t.
If the aim was to discredit her because the "solo" word appeared in the media, and went uncorrected,this has been achieved. However TCT has expressed her regrets about that. The Air League gave her an award last May for a flight which was well known to have been "not a solo flight" and that was made very clear when he award was made.
I have not received a penny from the TCT story nor do I intend to.
I have merely acted as a conduit for those inside HCAP and others who have wished the truth to emerge.
I confess that as a retired journalist I have passed on and discussed this story with many former colleagues.
This includes information from Duxford, Shuttleworth and Ardmore in New Zealand where TCT claimed she was trained 'by military pilots' which is a lie.
My motive has only be to investigate and reveal the truth behind the bulls**t.
Last edited by Mike Flynn; 20th Feb 2017 at 16:07.
that sums it up Jay -
i see no issue with TCT getting some decent recognition for making her ''tribute flights'' and making nice TV programmes but under no circumstances should she be accredited with nor make utterance she did anything ''solo''
there in lies the issue we have on here to the the tune of 182 pages and leaving many people spluttering their sherries still
i see no issue with TCT getting some decent recognition for making her ''tribute flights'' and making nice TV programmes but under no circumstances should she be accredited with nor make utterance she did anything ''solo''
there in lies the issue we have on here to the the tune of 182 pages and leaving many people spluttering their sherries still
If the aim was to discredit her because the "solo" word appeared in the media, and went uncorrected,this has been achieved. However TCT has expressed her regrets about that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZD6IsGmGgw
That video is what we call a 'smokin' gun'.
From Mr Holloway however, who is ready to disparage Jay Sata, Sam Rutherford and anyone who dares to suggest T-CT is basically a con-merchant, the silence is deafening.
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Mr Holloway.
I don't post much on this particular thread because I have nothing to add, I do not subscribe to twit face so cannot follow that line of verification, and it has all been said by others anyway.
However that Utube video at Herne Bay is absolute, you cannot refute that, not even God himself can refute that.
By itself it is enough to convince a court of law that she uttered the solo word herself.
And yet you still seem to be in denial of that fact, citing vitriol, lies, deceit etc.
I understand you are an aviator of some considerable repute.
I just cannot get my head round your motives.
So, come on, be a man, show us the lies, show us the proof of the lies, make everyone on this forum eat their words and apologise on their bended knees to TCT.
When you do that we will have respect for you. We will bow to your wisdom and integrity.
Until then we are still waiting!!!!
I don't post much on this particular thread because I have nothing to add, I do not subscribe to twit face so cannot follow that line of verification, and it has all been said by others anyway.
However that Utube video at Herne Bay is absolute, you cannot refute that, not even God himself can refute that.
By itself it is enough to convince a court of law that she uttered the solo word herself.
And yet you still seem to be in denial of that fact, citing vitriol, lies, deceit etc.
I understand you are an aviator of some considerable repute.
I just cannot get my head round your motives.
So, come on, be a man, show us the lies, show us the proof of the lies, make everyone on this forum eat their words and apologise on their bended knees to TCT.
When you do that we will have respect for you. We will bow to your wisdom and integrity.
Until then we are still waiting!!!!
There are absolutely amazing people out there who walk the walk and actually avoid the talk the talk - that's what makes the "sole" pilot so embarrassing.
Have a read ;
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...=.83f0069bdcec
PS - just on the talk the talk - Do you know any fellow pilots that would write this about themselves - "A highly accomplished pilot " - Jeez
Have a read ;
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...=.83f0069bdcec
PS - just on the talk the talk - Do you know any fellow pilots that would write this about themselves - "A highly accomplished pilot " - Jeez
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I also find the personal abuse against me [Terry Holloway] (and others who dare to speak up for her - not defend), and in particular a threatening phone callto me to be totally unacceptable.
Also, and much more important, these actions provide excellent cover for Ms Curtis-Taylor to use to avoid answering the questions that have been asked of her.
To be clear about these: it is NOT that there was a misunderstanding about whether the flights were solo or not. It IS about Ms Curtis-Taylor's personal claims that they were as witnessed by her appearance here
And the Hearne Bay video here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZD6IsGmGgw
In both cases she is clearly claiming that the flights were solo and despite many requests for an explanation, she has resolutely refused to provide one despite Terry Holloway having confirmed here that the questions have been passed to her.
Beyond that, there is also the question of her wearing RAF wings which she also refuses to explain.
In all my posts to this thread so far I have tried to present a balanced view, and to use temperate language, as I think that this represents a stronger argument that simply ranting, although I can well understand why some people have become frustrated enough to do that!
So come on, Terry: please use the influence that I know you have to get Ms Curtis-Taylor to face up to this and deal with it honestly. If you can't get her to do that, I would suggest that you stop trying to defend the indefensible and accept the old adage:
“If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck: it probably is a duck".
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I'm not defending TCT either. I am however offering the thought that nobody on this thread seems prepared to recognise any positive comments about her, and mosthave not even met her!
I really have said enough, and although I could probably tell you more than I have, I won't. That's up to her and I won't encourage her to come here. Therefore this really is good bye! Good bye.
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I have however publicly asked why this thread keeps going over and over the old ground.
The funny thing about this whole sorry saga is that by trying to hide the truth by refusing to address it, all she has achieved is to shine an ever brighter light on it. The level of sheer anger and outrage expressed by so many posters must surely be the clearest demonstration of that.
I have had a number of private e mail exchanges with "the real Jay Sata" and have not "disparaged" him either.
As far as asking people here to 'recognise' positive comments about Curtis-Taylor, you first need to identify some positive aspects. Given that her sponsorship and personal presentations are based on a whopper of a lie, that might be a bit challenging.
No, the ATA comments will not be let go.
FWIW, if experience is all that matters, TH has about 2/3 of the flying hours I have, according to his biog.
Originally Posted by Clare Prop
So Terry, would TCT have been accepted into the ATA do you think? You had to be a bit more than just a jolly super gel with royal connections.
So Terry, would TCT have been accepted into the ATA do you think? You had to be a bit more than just a jolly super gel with royal connections.
Yes she would.
Actually she has more flying hours and experience than many who joined the ATA, and actually if you really want to be bitchy, most of the females got in through their connections. Amy was an exception who got in through experience - which was less than TCT's.
Actually she has more flying hours and experience than many who joined the ATA, and actually if you really want to be bitchy, most of the females got in through their connections. Amy was an exception who got in through experience - which was less than TCT's.
Unless he has just left to put some time in compiling the obviously extensive list of lies that are posted on here. Judging by what he was saying there are many and it could take him a while.
He only needed to ask and I would have helped him out. In fact I will anyway...
Lies posted about TCT by us in this thread.
1. There are none.
2. (See 1)
3. (See 1 and 2)
4. (See 1, 2 and 3)
I could go on and make it an extensive list, but I am sure you get the drift Terry, it might save you some time and effort searching.
However if we were to look at the lies surrounding TCT, Bird in a Biplane, accidents, incidents and subterfuge etc I guess you could get a whole 3500+ post thread, attracting 700,000 views and involving 350+ aviation professionals up and running quite easily.
He only needed to ask and I would have helped him out. In fact I will anyway...
Lies posted about TCT by us in this thread.
1. There are none.
2. (See 1)
3. (See 1 and 2)
4. (See 1, 2 and 3)
I could go on and make it an extensive list, but I am sure you get the drift Terry, it might save you some time and effort searching.
However if we were to look at the lies surrounding TCT, Bird in a Biplane, accidents, incidents and subterfuge etc I guess you could get a whole 3500+ post thread, attracting 700,000 views and involving 350+ aviation professionals up and running quite easily.
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Like many others, I've returned to this thread from time to time. With the latest departure of terry_holloway who, for whatever reason has tried to provide some defence to Ms Curtis Taylor, I wonder if there much more to be served by the direction of discussion on this thread?
From original media and website material, it's clear that these were to be solo flights. Added to that are the Herne Bay video and various images of her standing in front of wall charts with the word solo on them - and of course, certificates saying the same. When Ms Curtis Taylor told the world she flew 'sole' she effectively proved the lie. If she was 'sole', she wasn't solo. Then, Mr Gritsch told us that 'Yes, I flew in the aircraft but I never flew it'. Whether you believe that or not, is irrelevant, that statement again shows she didn't fly solo.
Reading back on this thread, the word 'libel' has been mentioned many times. To libel someone, the damage caused must be of significant detriment to the person being libelled and of course, the allegation must be untrue. It would appear that the lawyers or powers that be at Internet Brands, the owners of PPRuNe, have decided that there is no risk of libel as they have allowed a number of strong accusations in posts to remain. Ms Curtis-Taylor herself has threatened legal action against who she saw as her main accusers but this has now fallen away - in itself an admission. This must also cover the so-called 'outreach program' which again has been called into doubt by many here.
So what is left?
If Ms Curtis Taylor tries to gain further sponsorship or carry out more flights while referring to her previous flights as something other than what they were, she will be once again attacked by this board and others. If she tries to gain speaking engagements based on untrue 'escapades', the same will happen.
All that is really left for many people is the sour taste from honours received, degrees handed and certificates presented. If this is of great importance, then it probably needs a concerted effort to the media to raise the issue - but will they be interested?
In any event, as our US cousins are wont to say, she is now a busted flush as far as paid aviation is concerned. I think Ms Curtis Taylor may well cut her losses, admit defeat and fade away. The alternative, should she try to continue as before, is to be constantly called to account.
From original media and website material, it's clear that these were to be solo flights. Added to that are the Herne Bay video and various images of her standing in front of wall charts with the word solo on them - and of course, certificates saying the same. When Ms Curtis Taylor told the world she flew 'sole' she effectively proved the lie. If she was 'sole', she wasn't solo. Then, Mr Gritsch told us that 'Yes, I flew in the aircraft but I never flew it'. Whether you believe that or not, is irrelevant, that statement again shows she didn't fly solo.
Reading back on this thread, the word 'libel' has been mentioned many times. To libel someone, the damage caused must be of significant detriment to the person being libelled and of course, the allegation must be untrue. It would appear that the lawyers or powers that be at Internet Brands, the owners of PPRuNe, have decided that there is no risk of libel as they have allowed a number of strong accusations in posts to remain. Ms Curtis-Taylor herself has threatened legal action against who she saw as her main accusers but this has now fallen away - in itself an admission. This must also cover the so-called 'outreach program' which again has been called into doubt by many here.
So what is left?
If Ms Curtis Taylor tries to gain further sponsorship or carry out more flights while referring to her previous flights as something other than what they were, she will be once again attacked by this board and others. If she tries to gain speaking engagements based on untrue 'escapades', the same will happen.
All that is really left for many people is the sour taste from honours received, degrees handed and certificates presented. If this is of great importance, then it probably needs a concerted effort to the media to raise the issue - but will they be interested?
In any event, as our US cousins are wont to say, she is now a busted flush as far as paid aviation is concerned. I think Ms Curtis Taylor may well cut her losses, admit defeat and fade away. The alternative, should she try to continue as before, is to be constantly called to account.
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Jeez, what a bunch of vultures. Have none of you ever made a mistake?
OK so she forgot about Ewald sitting in front of her on 40 out of 42 flights, easily done.
She stood in front of a poster saying alone in an open cockpit, well.. it was behind her so she may not have seen those words.
She forgot to mention that he went to Australia in the same seat, probably because she was so used to him being there that she forgot all about him, easy mistake to make. That's not really lying!
T C-T has made it clear that she was the sole pilot, what could be clearer?
She said she was flying with "Stick and Rudder" and "Basic Instruments", well every aircraft that I have flown had a stick and a rudder, and almost all of them have GPS and a moving map so that's really basic.
Herne Bay video....................
Oh erm, nothing to see here, move along.
OK so she forgot about Ewald sitting in front of her on 40 out of 42 flights, easily done.
She stood in front of a poster saying alone in an open cockpit, well.. it was behind her so she may not have seen those words.
She forgot to mention that he went to Australia in the same seat, probably because she was so used to him being there that she forgot all about him, easy mistake to make. That's not really lying!
T C-T has made it clear that she was the sole pilot, what could be clearer?
She said she was flying with "Stick and Rudder" and "Basic Instruments", well every aircraft that I have flown had a stick and a rudder, and almost all of them have GPS and a moving map so that's really basic.
Herne Bay video....................
Oh erm, nothing to see here, move along.