PPL training /SFH in South Africa
I say there boy
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I did my hour building with them two years ago. A slick, well run club with a well-maintained fleet, and a good bunch of people to boot. You won't go far wrong.
E-mail me if you want to know anything else.
cheers!
foggy.
E-mail me if you want to know anything else.
cheers!
foggy.
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Flight Training In South Africa
I am interested in doing my JAA flight training in South Africa with the Flight Training College of South Africa at Midrand.
Does anyone have any experiences of training in S.A, or indeed with FTC that they are prepared to share (good or bad)?
Does anyone have any experiences of training in S.A, or indeed with FTC that they are prepared to share (good or bad)?
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I flew with Avex at Midrand back in April this year. They are a small outfit but recommended by a South African who learnt there.
The Flight Training College you mentioned looked a nice set up, with a smart newish building etc. Good fun taxxing out when 5500' up!
One thing I was impressed with was the fact that there is no LARS as such, just a common freq where people make blind calls of a/c type, level, position and direction. Sure aids your nav skills and location awareness!
The only problem with the cheap price at Avex etc, is really old aircraft. I flew in an old PA28-140 (possibly construction number 001!!) which felt a little underpowered.
Another option is Lanseria airport on the other side of Jo'burg - a big bizjet/charter centre (similar to Luton but more redeveloped)
Enjoy either way......
AM
The Flight Training College you mentioned looked a nice set up, with a smart newish building etc. Good fun taxxing out when 5500' up!
One thing I was impressed with was the fact that there is no LARS as such, just a common freq where people make blind calls of a/c type, level, position and direction. Sure aids your nav skills and location awareness!
The only problem with the cheap price at Avex etc, is really old aircraft. I flew in an old PA28-140 (possibly construction number 001!!) which felt a little underpowered.
Another option is Lanseria airport on the other side of Jo'burg - a big bizjet/charter centre (similar to Luton but more redeveloped)
Enjoy either way......
AM
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Africa You say?
Hey there,
Iv recently done tonnes of research on african flying schools, and the best one I found was...The European Flying school in Port Elizabeth. I am only 18, and seriously considering moving to Africa for a year or so to study to be a pilot. Im half way through my PPL in the UK and finding it a increasing finacial strain. Iv asked my flying instructor a few questions about training overseas and he seems optimistic. He believes that some schools are like "factorys" producing poorly trained pilots for stupidly little money. The thought of that has not really fazed me and im still looking at the European Flying school in Port Elizabeth.
On a more positive note I believe there are many positive sides to learning to fly in Africa. Some schools have excelent locations which make the flying even more enjoyable, and the exchange rate is rather cool too. The £ to the African Rand is currently about £1=14Rand, and that makes the training light on your wallet. The school stated above offers accomadation, food, and a working VISA once obtaining a Commercial licence. The aircraft are in reasonable condition and look well maintained. PPL- ATPL would normaly cost £50,000...Africa on the other hand PPL-ATPL around 25,000 Rand, do your maths and you can see the money saving bonus of african training. I hope this helps
Regards
Brad
Iv recently done tonnes of research on african flying schools, and the best one I found was...The European Flying school in Port Elizabeth. I am only 18, and seriously considering moving to Africa for a year or so to study to be a pilot. Im half way through my PPL in the UK and finding it a increasing finacial strain. Iv asked my flying instructor a few questions about training overseas and he seems optimistic. He believes that some schools are like "factorys" producing poorly trained pilots for stupidly little money. The thought of that has not really fazed me and im still looking at the European Flying school in Port Elizabeth.
On a more positive note I believe there are many positive sides to learning to fly in Africa. Some schools have excelent locations which make the flying even more enjoyable, and the exchange rate is rather cool too. The £ to the African Rand is currently about £1=14Rand, and that makes the training light on your wallet. The school stated above offers accomadation, food, and a working VISA once obtaining a Commercial licence. The aircraft are in reasonable condition and look well maintained. PPL- ATPL would normaly cost £50,000...Africa on the other hand PPL-ATPL around 25,000 Rand, do your maths and you can see the money saving bonus of african training. I hope this helps
Regards
Brad
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Hi There
I have been looking extensively into SA aswell to do my PPL. I plan on going in October 2003 for 2-3 months - flying and travelling. I have info on several schools but have no heard about the European one in PE. Have got good recommendations though on Algoa and Progress in PE and from the Good Hope school in CPT. I recommend you go the the African Aviation forum. I did better there with my questions. PM me if you want to hear my stories!
Best of luck
DQ
I have been looking extensively into SA aswell to do my PPL. I plan on going in October 2003 for 2-3 months - flying and travelling. I have info on several schools but have no heard about the European one in PE. Have got good recommendations though on Algoa and Progress in PE and from the Good Hope school in CPT. I recommend you go the the African Aviation forum. I did better there with my questions. PM me if you want to hear my stories!
Best of luck
DQ
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Fly Boy
When quoting costs for ATPL in South Africa bear in mind that it is for their national ATPL and not for the JAR one. This will mean hefty conversion costs if you wish to be able to use your licence commercially in UK or Europe.
As far as I am aware their is not a JAR approved FTO in SA. If anyone wishes to correct me I would be happy to hear about it as having citizenship I would be more than happy to work there. However I would prefer to have the JAR ATPL for the long term.
When quoting costs for ATPL in South Africa bear in mind that it is for their national ATPL and not for the JAR one. This will mean hefty conversion costs if you wish to be able to use your licence commercially in UK or Europe.
As far as I am aware their is not a JAR approved FTO in SA. If anyone wishes to correct me I would be happy to hear about it as having citizenship I would be more than happy to work there. However I would prefer to have the JAR ATPL for the long term.
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I'm told that FTC has JAR approval, UK FTO number 265, haven't checked it though.
43 Air School in Port Alfred are also worth a mention - very good training and JAR-approval in the pipeline.
Cheers for now
JD
43 Air School in Port Alfred are also worth a mention - very good training and JAR-approval in the pipeline.
Cheers for now
JD
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I instruct in the west country and we have a very switched on staff member who completed his ppl in South Africa but at a guess to convert,ie for a school to let him fly here he has spent nigh on £1000.
Their simply is not a way of getting good flight training on the cheap,i tried it and now have the bills to prove otherwise.
The other thing to consider is what any interview board might think,imagine i get a jet job 6-12 months before yourself earning 35k any saving thats been made is quickly swallowed up.
I've flown in Florida and that was a great experience,to be treated like a customer on arrival was,well refreshing so we have lots to learn here but the landscape,history and variety of airfields makes it one of the nicest,most interesting places to fly.And remember it's YOUR airspace over YOU house!
Their simply is not a way of getting good flight training on the cheap,i tried it and now have the bills to prove otherwise.
The other thing to consider is what any interview board might think,imagine i get a jet job 6-12 months before yourself earning 35k any saving thats been made is quickly swallowed up.
I've flown in Florida and that was a great experience,to be treated like a customer on arrival was,well refreshing so we have lots to learn here but the landscape,history and variety of airfields makes it one of the nicest,most interesting places to fly.And remember it's YOUR airspace over YOU house!
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S.A
Rubbish!
You can fly a G registered aircraft using a South African PPL in UK airspace. You DO NOT need to convert it! I have rented planes from 2 different clubs using my South African PPL. All it took was a normal check ride. I have no intention to converting to a UK PPL as I can renew my licence with Irv Lee at Popham as well as do my medical in London. Flight schools in the UK will tell you that you wont save money going abroad because they want you to spend your money with them. They will also tell you that you wont know how to land in a crosswind, and that navigation is different. All rubbish as well. When I got back to the UK I did 2 hours with Irv Lee so he could explain the differences of UK airspace, and after that I was out on my own and had no problems. I got my PPL at Algoa flying club in P.E, over all I had an amazing 5 week holiday, got my licence for all just under 2500 quid. Including my flight over there. Email Algoa flying club if want reliable information. Don’t always believe what UK schools tell you, if I had of I would have never got my licence.
You can fly a G registered aircraft using a South African PPL in UK airspace. You DO NOT need to convert it! I have rented planes from 2 different clubs using my South African PPL. All it took was a normal check ride. I have no intention to converting to a UK PPL as I can renew my licence with Irv Lee at Popham as well as do my medical in London. Flight schools in the UK will tell you that you wont save money going abroad because they want you to spend your money with them. They will also tell you that you wont know how to land in a crosswind, and that navigation is different. All rubbish as well. When I got back to the UK I did 2 hours with Irv Lee so he could explain the differences of UK airspace, and after that I was out on my own and had no problems. I got my PPL at Algoa flying club in P.E, over all I had an amazing 5 week holiday, got my licence for all just under 2500 quid. Including my flight over there. Email Algoa flying club if want reliable information. Don’t always believe what UK schools tell you, if I had of I would have never got my licence.
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psmd0311
In total agreement, if purely wanting a ppl.
Silverknapper talks of hour building which gives me the impression he may want to go on and do commercial training at a later point, in which case at present I dont believe the case is as simple as with the ppl.
Maybe someone could confirm??
In total agreement, if purely wanting a ppl.
Silverknapper talks of hour building which gives me the impression he may want to go on and do commercial training at a later point, in which case at present I dont believe the case is as simple as with the ppl.
Maybe someone could confirm??
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T-T: Forgetting foreign licences for a second, I found a West Country club with their own special interpretation of JAR currency which they imposed on their JAR pilots. ( Funnily enough it worked financially in the clubs favour... 
) I don't challenge they have the right to impose whatever they want on their members, (who can take theirtrade elsewhere if they don't like it) but this was very definitely passed off as a legal requirement due to JAR rather than a local club policy - great idea for causing general confusion and arguments.
Back to foreign licences:
The easiest thing is to have an aircraft registered in the same country as your licence was issued, then things are 'perfect'. However for a SA licence and 'G' reg aircraft in the UK, if you want it from the (UK) horse's mouth, try CAA FAQ on using foreign ICAO Licences in the UK
For those who would fall asleep if they clicked on that link, basically, a fully valid S.A. PPL (including medical) is good without extra paperwork for renting for fun in UK registered aircraft in the UK FIRs, providing you obey your licence privileges and relevant Uk law. SA PPL with SA I/R will NOT let you go IFR in Controlled Airspace. SA CPL, ATPL give private privileges only (so no money earning in G reg unless you also have a UK/JAA professional licence).
If you have a SA PPL and decide to stay a fun flier in UK airspace, you are not forced to convert to a JAA PPL, but many do convert to be able to add things like UK IMC ratings or perhaps to fly in Europe. It is easier to convert after 100 hours than before, so many rent on a foreign PPL in the UK up to 100 hours, then convert. If you intend to start a JAA CPL flying course once you have the extra required hours, I don't think you need to convert to a JAA PPL at all - you can keep the SA PPL all the way until you get your JAA CPL issued (I believe).
I can quickly think of 3 main reasons why some rental clubs want you to convert, and I think number 1 is the main one - some genuinely don't know the rules.
1- Clubs have not actually asked the question recently. Our CAA (10 years ago) used to be a little bit deaf and somehow always 'mis-heard' the question. Question posed by either the club with a potential renter or the renter: "can a pilot fly in the Uk on a foreign PPL?" Answer: "To convert your licence to a UK licence, what you need to do is pay us £192, pass the following... etc etc"
This answer not only earned money for the CAA, but money for the clubs, so everyone was happy (funnily enough, including the PPL holder who just wanted to do whatever was necessary and had no idea he had been conned with an answer to a different question!).
I used to have fun briefing the foreign PPL holder before they phoned the CAA. They would then ask the question, listen politely to the standard misleading answer, then when that was finished, just say 'fascinating - now can you answer the question I asked you' and of course there would a short silence and finally the real answer came. Anyway, staff and attitudes have changed and now you get the true answer on the CAA FAQ page.
2- Occasionally you might find a club may have had a problem in the past with one or two new pilots trained in the USA and just decided to 'blanket' everyone. Purely their own commercial decision - they can have whatever rules they want on their aircraft. Loss on some rentals will be partially offset with extra training and conversion by others. From what I can gather though the problem can often be traced to the attitude of the pilot rather than the training of the pilot.
3- Sometimes long time renters with foreign PPLs have been found after an incident not to be fully legal, (eg: some foriegn licences are type rated, some are not, some last 2 years, some last one, etc etc) and the school cannot keep up with all the requirements of different foreign authorities so it decides not to try.
) I don't challenge they have the right to impose whatever they want on their members, (who can take theirtrade elsewhere if they don't like it) but this was very definitely passed off as a legal requirement due to JAR rather than a local club policy - great idea for causing general confusion and arguments.Back to foreign licences:
The easiest thing is to have an aircraft registered in the same country as your licence was issued, then things are 'perfect'. However for a SA licence and 'G' reg aircraft in the UK, if you want it from the (UK) horse's mouth, try CAA FAQ on using foreign ICAO Licences in the UK
For those who would fall asleep if they clicked on that link, basically, a fully valid S.A. PPL (including medical) is good without extra paperwork for renting for fun in UK registered aircraft in the UK FIRs, providing you obey your licence privileges and relevant Uk law. SA PPL with SA I/R will NOT let you go IFR in Controlled Airspace. SA CPL, ATPL give private privileges only (so no money earning in G reg unless you also have a UK/JAA professional licence).
If you have a SA PPL and decide to stay a fun flier in UK airspace, you are not forced to convert to a JAA PPL, but many do convert to be able to add things like UK IMC ratings or perhaps to fly in Europe. It is easier to convert after 100 hours than before, so many rent on a foreign PPL in the UK up to 100 hours, then convert. If you intend to start a JAA CPL flying course once you have the extra required hours, I don't think you need to convert to a JAA PPL at all - you can keep the SA PPL all the way until you get your JAA CPL issued (I believe).
I can quickly think of 3 main reasons why some rental clubs want you to convert, and I think number 1 is the main one - some genuinely don't know the rules.
1- Clubs have not actually asked the question recently. Our CAA (10 years ago) used to be a little bit deaf and somehow always 'mis-heard' the question. Question posed by either the club with a potential renter or the renter: "can a pilot fly in the Uk on a foreign PPL?" Answer: "To convert your licence to a UK licence, what you need to do is pay us £192, pass the following... etc etc"
This answer not only earned money for the CAA, but money for the clubs, so everyone was happy (funnily enough, including the PPL holder who just wanted to do whatever was necessary and had no idea he had been conned with an answer to a different question!).
I used to have fun briefing the foreign PPL holder before they phoned the CAA. They would then ask the question, listen politely to the standard misleading answer, then when that was finished, just say 'fascinating - now can you answer the question I asked you' and of course there would a short silence and finally the real answer came. Anyway, staff and attitudes have changed and now you get the true answer on the CAA FAQ page.
2- Occasionally you might find a club may have had a problem in the past with one or two new pilots trained in the USA and just decided to 'blanket' everyone. Purely their own commercial decision - they can have whatever rules they want on their aircraft. Loss on some rentals will be partially offset with extra training and conversion by others. From what I can gather though the problem can often be traced to the attitude of the pilot rather than the training of the pilot.
3- Sometimes long time renters with foreign PPLs have been found after an incident not to be fully legal, (eg: some foriegn licences are type rated, some are not, some last 2 years, some last one, etc etc) and the school cannot keep up with all the requirements of different foreign authorities so it decides not to try.
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Flight Schools in S. Africa
Hi,
I am looking into getting my ppl in South Africa, just wondering if anyone has anyone gotten their ppl there and if so could they recommend a flight school.
Thank You.
I am looking into getting my ppl in South Africa, just wondering if anyone has anyone gotten their ppl there and if so could they recommend a flight school.
Thank You.
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I did my PPL at Phoebus Apollo, Johannesburg. It cost me £2,350 and included accomodation, medical, landing fees etc etc. Excellent airport and instructors. I'd totally recommend it.
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43 Air School in Port Alfred is one of the best schools in SA.
Excellent facilities and a great training environment. Not many schools that offer the chance of whale-watching during your cross-countries along the coast!!
Also have a look at Progress in PE, and FTC in Johannesburg, all schools with a good reputation.
Good luck!
CM
Excellent facilities and a great training environment. Not many schools that offer the chance of whale-watching during your cross-countries along the coast!!
Also have a look at Progress in PE, and FTC in Johannesburg, all schools with a good reputation.
Good luck!
CM
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There are some good recommendations for schools by recent pupils in the African section of PPRUNE - have a look down this thread:
PPRUNE SA PPL topic
PPRUNE SA PPL topic
Over 1000 posts and I bought this Personal Title to try and tell my mother the embarrassing news that I am a closet Jazz fan.
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Add a month worth of cricket coaching and some time for drinking / carousing etc and you have the perfect holiday .
.
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www.stelfly.co.za
Stellenbosch Aero Club (FASH) was great! Lovely people, lovely part of the world.
Planes a bit rickety but hell, it's Africa.
Chap there called Mark Storey is the oldest member of the club, and is a very kind chap who should sort you out!
Cheers.
Stellenbosch Aero Club (FASH) was great! Lovely people, lovely part of the world.
Planes a bit rickety but hell, it's Africa.
Chap there called Mark Storey is the oldest member of the club, and is a very kind chap who should sort you out!
Cheers.