To lose one bag is careless…
Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum
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To lose one bag is careless…
…but to lose an entire aircraft full is impressive
KL965 last night from AMS to NCL. After arrival at NCL, luggage handler looks inside hold, sees nothing and goes away. Not a good sight for those of us just off the flight and watching this from the baggage reclaim area. Could only hope that hold previously emptied and baggage about to appear on conveyor. However, only things to appear on conveyor were five musical instruments marked ‘fragile’. One remained unclaimed to continuously, and pathetically, circle alone watched by an increasingly unhappy crowd of passengers. Eventually, supervisor tells us not to expect our bags and make a claim at the Groundstar desk.
Entire flight duly descends upon Groundstar desk to demand baggage irregularity forms. While I was content in my amused acceptance of the situation (too much reading of PPRuNe leads to tolerance, plus it delays having to do accumulated washing from a long trip), a number of fellow passengers were less amused to the point of anger by the whole business. Cannot imagine that the Groundstar staff found it amusing either, and when I phoned later got clearly stressed person at Groundstar, so guess sorting out the mess provided ‘entertainment’ for some poor sod.
Amused tolerance ran out this afternoon. Groundstar continuously engaged, so decided to go to the airport to find out what is happening. Met big pile of luggage stacked in front of Groundstar desk. Apparently expedite labels printed for entire flight were attached at random to the luggage, so the delay informing passengers was Groundstar staff having to double check each bag by original and expedite label. Guess their sense of humour was taking a further knock, especially judging by the relief when I told one member of staff that I could see my bag sat on top of the pile. Expedite label did not have my name, but enough of the original label survived for positive identification. Exit one happy Evening Star with his bag. However, judging by size of the pile and the checking required, imagine that some passengers are still waiting.
KL965 last night from AMS to NCL. After arrival at NCL, luggage handler looks inside hold, sees nothing and goes away. Not a good sight for those of us just off the flight and watching this from the baggage reclaim area. Could only hope that hold previously emptied and baggage about to appear on conveyor. However, only things to appear on conveyor were five musical instruments marked ‘fragile’. One remained unclaimed to continuously, and pathetically, circle alone watched by an increasingly unhappy crowd of passengers. Eventually, supervisor tells us not to expect our bags and make a claim at the Groundstar desk.
Entire flight duly descends upon Groundstar desk to demand baggage irregularity forms. While I was content in my amused acceptance of the situation (too much reading of PPRuNe leads to tolerance, plus it delays having to do accumulated washing from a long trip), a number of fellow passengers were less amused to the point of anger by the whole business. Cannot imagine that the Groundstar staff found it amusing either, and when I phoned later got clearly stressed person at Groundstar, so guess sorting out the mess provided ‘entertainment’ for some poor sod.
Amused tolerance ran out this afternoon. Groundstar continuously engaged, so decided to go to the airport to find out what is happening. Met big pile of luggage stacked in front of Groundstar desk. Apparently expedite labels printed for entire flight were attached at random to the luggage, so the delay informing passengers was Groundstar staff having to double check each bag by original and expedite label. Guess their sense of humour was taking a further knock, especially judging by the relief when I told one member of staff that I could see my bag sat on top of the pile. Expedite label did not have my name, but enough of the original label survived for positive identification. Exit one happy Evening Star with his bag. However, judging by size of the pile and the checking required, imagine that some passengers are still waiting.
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Not familar with AMS or NCL or KLM either. But looks like a wild rush to beat some night curfew (if AMS has one that is ) or the crws FDTL or something similar? "Let the pax go home atleast. luggage can wait!".
Wonderful thing - the possibilites you can dream up when you are nowhere near the picture.
(No I am not a tabloid journalist nor training to be one!)
Cheers
Wonderful thing - the possibilites you can dream up when you are nowhere near the picture.
(No I am not a tabloid journalist nor training to be one!)
Cheers
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Without any further information at my fingertips I would place the blame on AMS; When I was travelling AMS-LHR and the flight got cancelled we had to get our baggage back and re-check onto another flight, just one small problem........ they had even managed to lose the bag before we actually went anywhere!
Anyhow, more power to your elbow for remaining so calm about it all - in my (quite considerable) experience of lost/mislayed luggage most airlines seem to do their utmost to p!ss everyone off, rather than trying to make amends. (KLM even had the cheek to tell me that they were no worse than everyone else in such circumstances!)
Glad you're sorted now.....
Anyhow, more power to your elbow for remaining so calm about it all - in my (quite considerable) experience of lost/mislayed luggage most airlines seem to do their utmost to p!ss everyone off, rather than trying to make amends. (KLM even had the cheek to tell me that they were no worse than everyone else in such circumstances!)
Glad you're sorted now.....
mostly harmless
I too guessed that AMS would come into the story somewhere. They have been saying for years that they are in the process of fixing the baggage problem but the situation does not get better, presumably due to lack of funds. As with Mike Southern, I have encountered a poor attitude from KLM to the problem.
Frankly, other things being equal, I try to avoid connecting at AMS.
I remember when KLM were the best things with two wings...
answer=42
Frankly, other things being equal, I try to avoid connecting at AMS.
I remember when KLM were the best things with two wings...
answer=42
Supercalifragilistic
expialidocious
expialidocious
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AMS a common factor.
I too lost a bag on a connection via AMS.
The really annoying thing was that having waited until the next flight's bags showed up on the carousel before going to report it lost I was told by the BA baggage query desk that they knew the bag had not been loaded. The could not explain why no one had thought to tell me on the aircraft or to page me in arrivals. They did however say that loosing bags connecting via amsterdam was quite a regular occurence.
Having waited for the bag, completed forms etc. I had missed my pre booked ground transport - and on calling the company could not get on another run with them for about 4 hours.
So went and had a chat with the BA customer service desk, basically to complain that I had not been told in advance that the bag was not loaded, which would have reduced the hassle factor.
I was very plesantly surprised to be told that they would arrange a car to take me home! (This was June 2002 - wonder if the same would happen now on a full fare economy AMS to LGW?)
I was much less surprised when about 8 hours later the bags had not turned up at home as promised - apprently LGW luggage for deliver has to go via LHR - even to Essex. I should have kept my mouth shut then, instead I got the depot number and told them to deliver on their promise, put the bag in a cab if necessary...
...regreted it at about 3am when they delivered the bag!
The really annoying thing was that having waited until the next flight's bags showed up on the carousel before going to report it lost I was told by the BA baggage query desk that they knew the bag had not been loaded. The could not explain why no one had thought to tell me on the aircraft or to page me in arrivals. They did however say that loosing bags connecting via amsterdam was quite a regular occurence.
Having waited for the bag, completed forms etc. I had missed my pre booked ground transport - and on calling the company could not get on another run with them for about 4 hours.
So went and had a chat with the BA customer service desk, basically to complain that I had not been told in advance that the bag was not loaded, which would have reduced the hassle factor.
I was very plesantly surprised to be told that they would arrange a car to take me home! (This was June 2002 - wonder if the same would happen now on a full fare economy AMS to LGW?)
I was much less surprised when about 8 hours later the bags had not turned up at home as promised - apprently LGW luggage for deliver has to go via LHR - even to Essex. I should have kept my mouth shut then, instead I got the depot number and told them to deliver on their promise, put the bag in a cab if necessary...
...regreted it at about 3am when they delivered the bag!
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KLM losing bags? What's new ... especially if Northwest are involved.
I've had friends who've had bags lost from YYZ via AMS to BOM, and also BOM to LHR via AMS .... at least KLM/Northwest made a good deal of effort to get the bags back soon, but it was still a pain.
Jordan
I've had friends who've had bags lost from YYZ via AMS to BOM, and also BOM to LHR via AMS .... at least KLM/Northwest made a good deal of effort to get the bags back soon, but it was still a pain.
Jordan
Shining Example, apparently...
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I use AMS regularly and haven't yet - touch wood - had a baggage problem.
However, I've seen baggage fall off moving carts on two occasions. I dunno if all AMS carts are alike, but I've seen many of the non-sided type, with barriers only at the front and rear. Nothing to stop bags sliding loose on a turn, and nothing to stop them getting wet...
However, I've seen baggage fall off moving carts on two occasions. I dunno if all AMS carts are alike, but I've seen many of the non-sided type, with barriers only at the front and rear. Nothing to stop bags sliding loose on a turn, and nothing to stop them getting wet...
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only things to appear on conveyor were five musical instruments marked ‘fragile’. One remained unclaimed to continuously, and pathetically, circle alone
Losing Bags
Bags are ment to be lost and both SLF and the industry should be prepared to minimize the consequences. When I travel I always carry on a backpack or on a carry on extra clothe for a day and my shaving gear and any other stuff that I may need fast upon arriving at the destination.
If it comes to the worst I can make it for a day before I run into difficulties. Additionnaly I am aware about the first night allowance offered and I use it whenever I can.
Even more within a year I have lost my bagage twice (once every piece I use when I travel) and I feel I meet the statistical requierements for not loosing a hold bag again.
Anyway the most ridicilous case of lost bag was in the summer of 94 in BRU where the baggage arrived with the incoming flight but the handlers did not bother to put it on the conveyor belt.
Rwy in Sight
If it comes to the worst I can make it for a day before I run into difficulties. Additionnaly I am aware about the first night allowance offered and I use it whenever I can.
Even more within a year I have lost my bagage twice (once every piece I use when I travel) and I feel I meet the statistical requierements for not loosing a hold bag again.
Anyway the most ridicilous case of lost bag was in the summer of 94 in BRU where the baggage arrived with the incoming flight but the handlers did not bother to put it on the conveyor belt.
Rwy in Sight
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"Well it's not lost, we just haven't been able to find it yet."
Has anyone ever had a bag never return to owner? Excepting those blown up as a precaution.
Has anyone ever had a bag never return to owner? Excepting those blown up as a precaution.
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Sage words, Rwy in Sight. Problem is that airlines are becoming more picky about hand baggage and my laptop is definitely not going in the hold! This limits the amount of 'extras' I can carry.
Murphy's Law suggests that planning for it ensures that it won't happen - I've only had one lost bag (for a day) in 20 years of flying.
Murphy's Law suggests that planning for it ensures that it won't happen - I've only had one lost bag (for a day) in 20 years of flying.
Paxing All Over The World
Having spent 90% of my life living close to major hubs (mainly LHR) I have had the good fortune to travel point-to-point almost all the time. I gather that it is the transfers that can cause the problems.
In the 38 years since I first paxed, I have only lost one bag. I was MUC~FRA~DTW and the schedule was tight anyway. We were late in to FRA, so I was not a bit surprised when my bag (and many others) did not arrive. I waited for the inevitable announcement and went to fill in the form. Since LH only had one flight a day, it was going to be 24 hour minimum.
All the other pax were Outraged and Very Cross and What am I going to do for the Easter weekend?. They hand delivered the bag to a town 2.5 hours drive from DTW the next afternoon. So I thought that LH did well.
Even in my travels in Africa they have not managed to steal (Ooops, lose) a bag.
In the 38 years since I first paxed, I have only lost one bag. I was MUC~FRA~DTW and the schedule was tight anyway. We were late in to FRA, so I was not a bit surprised when my bag (and many others) did not arrive. I waited for the inevitable announcement and went to fill in the form. Since LH only had one flight a day, it was going to be 24 hour minimum.
All the other pax were Outraged and Very Cross and What am I going to do for the Easter weekend?. They hand delivered the bag to a town 2.5 hours drive from DTW the next afternoon. So I thought that LH did well.
Even in my travels in Africa they have not managed to steal (Ooops, lose) a bag.
Travelled from LHR to FRA and thence to FDH last Sunday. An extremely hot day at LHR, the LH Business Class lounge ran out of ice and the air-con could barely cope. Very hot at FRA, then on to stifling Eurowings ATR72. Flight to FDH absolutely chokka - all seats full. Arrive at very warm FDH at 2215 and wait at baggage carousel.....and wait.....and wait.... Together with several other passengers, descend on LH agent who does a grand job of sloping shoulders "It is not our fault...." Fill out delayed luggage form, then ask about compensation. "Nothing we can do, we are only the handling agent" comes the lame excuse..... Demand address of someone who can discuss the matter. Try to ring - all offices closed at that time on Sunday. Get to sweltering hot hotel with no bag and nowhere to buy basic overnight kit. Next day have to go to important business meeting in the only clothes with me..... Manage to borrow a car and buy the necessary socks, underwear and shirt to look respectable. More phone calls to LH - they still don't know where my bag is. Eventually told it will arrive at 1320 and will be delivered to where I'm working. Still nothing at 1530, so more calls to LH. Finally a cab arrives at 1630 with my luggage which has taken 3 hours to travel 10 km......
At no time did anyone at LH apologise or offer any sympathy. A very strange way to treat their Business Class customers - or any other passenger for that matter. So, what compensation is it reasonable to expect? I've billed them for the cost of having to buy the things I needed, the business time lost and €30 for personal discomfort and inconvenience, a total of around €130. They'll get a further bill for all my phone calls when my cellphone bill turns up in a few weeks' time.....
In the past I would have taken all my luggage in a small cabin bag. But since the restrictive security procedures following 9/11, that's virtually impossible nowadays - because some officious bottom-fondling failed wheel clamper will no doubt find something he doesn't like in my bag....
At no time did anyone at LH apologise or offer any sympathy. A very strange way to treat their Business Class customers - or any other passenger for that matter. So, what compensation is it reasonable to expect? I've billed them for the cost of having to buy the things I needed, the business time lost and €30 for personal discomfort and inconvenience, a total of around €130. They'll get a further bill for all my phone calls when my cellphone bill turns up in a few weeks' time.....
In the past I would have taken all my luggage in a small cabin bag. But since the restrictive security procedures following 9/11, that's virtually impossible nowadays - because some officious bottom-fondling failed wheel clamper will no doubt find something he doesn't like in my bag....
Three years ago KLM , I believe , lost my baggage (ie. not put on the flight) between Eindhoven and Amsterdam enroute to Las Vegas . I was fully booked between Eindhoven and Amsterdam and Stand-by AMS-LAS. (Reason - wanted to overnight in AMS due early departure but hotels full so booked domestic flight) . I am to this day convinced that KLM was economical with the truth when I checked the situation in AMS , personally with the baggage office - twice - if my bag had arrived , and then when it didn't turn up in Minneapollis and further in Las Vegas. It eventually turned up 5 days later. The (poor) NWA baggage guy in Las Vegas said -' 80% of our baggage claims (in LAS) originate in Amsterdam with KLM' (!!!!!) . When will the problem be solved - seemingly not in my lifetime. Another lost customer. ( I must add that I PAY Business Class travel now that my stand-by days are over , by choice , but not to KLM)
My best (worst?)was American, who lost a bag for 11 weeks. Cost them a total of over GBP800 for repairs to bag, ruined clothes etc - they'd thrown the bag around so much a can of beer split, and they had to wash everything out as well. Still ruined a load of stuff.
America West are good at losing and damaging bags, while the last 13 flights I've had with United and/or United Express have seen my bag go missing on no less than 10 occasions. American's average is once every 30 flights.
So far BA have managed to lose a bag twice in over 150 flights. Obviously, they need more training!
America West are good at losing and damaging bags, while the last 13 flights I've had with United and/or United Express have seen my bag go missing on no less than 10 occasions. American's average is once every 30 flights.
So far BA have managed to lose a bag twice in over 150 flights. Obviously, they need more training!
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Compensation?
What sort of compensation should one expect, or rather claim, if an airline manages to loose your baggage? I appreciate that no compensation is likely to be paid out if the bags arrive a few hours later, but let's for arguments sake say that it's lost for a number of days. Can one demand compensation for the purchase of a new wardrobe? How would it work; would the airline dish out a fixed amount per day the bag is lost or would you have to foot the bill yourself and then claim the cost? Could one claim for trauma too 
Me? In 30 years travelling on a large number of airlines, I've only had my bag go lost once and that was on a very short connection in FRA arriving from JNB and continuing to BRU. It arrived on the next flight and was promptly delivered to my office.
Me? In 30 years travelling on a large number of airlines, I've only had my bag go lost once and that was on a very short connection in FRA arriving from JNB and continuing to BRU. It arrived on the next flight and was promptly delivered to my office.
Too mean to buy a long personal title
Once BA misconnected a bag of mine between longhauls and between LGW and LHR. After filling in the PIR, they were going to let me go. Just in time, I remembered to ask for a cash allowance to buy necessities and got handed some cash - HKD 300, I think. Obviously, the lesson I learned was that you have to ask or you won't get.
As it happened the bag arrived on the next flight (less than 24 hours later).
The other misconnect was again at LHR, from BA to IB. I didn't think I was going to get anything out of the IB staff, so I left it. The bag was about 18 hours late. I wrote a suggestion letter to BA based on the tags that were and weren't on the bag, about how they might make an improvement. They responded with an unexpected voucher for GBP 50 (I think).
The other good BA compensation-for-baggage experience I have had was when they broke one handle on an old and already-worn suitcase, making it very difficult to lift it onto its wheels. After some other airlines had done some more minor damage to it over the following few months, I replaced it with a new and much more expensive case. I wrote an entirely honest letter showing that I'd bought the new case but pointing out that the damage I was claiming for was only part of the overall damage to the old and much cheaper case, and asking only for a small contribution. I got a cheque (not voucher) back for rather more than the old case had originally cost. Needless to say it didn't take long for BA to get that money back.
As it happened the bag arrived on the next flight (less than 24 hours later).
The other misconnect was again at LHR, from BA to IB. I didn't think I was going to get anything out of the IB staff, so I left it. The bag was about 18 hours late. I wrote a suggestion letter to BA based on the tags that were and weren't on the bag, about how they might make an improvement. They responded with an unexpected voucher for GBP 50 (I think).
The other good BA compensation-for-baggage experience I have had was when they broke one handle on an old and already-worn suitcase, making it very difficult to lift it onto its wheels. After some other airlines had done some more minor damage to it over the following few months, I replaced it with a new and much more expensive case. I wrote an entirely honest letter showing that I'd bought the new case but pointing out that the damage I was claiming for was only part of the overall damage to the old and much cheaper case, and asking only for a small contribution. I got a cheque (not voucher) back for rather more than the old case had originally cost. Needless to say it didn't take long for BA to get that money back.
Well, despite 4 faxes and a phone call, still not even an acknowledgement from LH Customer Relations cocnerning the baggage they mislaid a month ago......
Funny way to attract Business Class travellers.....
Funny way to attract Business Class travellers.....
Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum
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Well, the experience cannot have scarred (or even scared!) me too much as just booked through AMS again for a trip in November. Includes a 40 minute connection outbound so really tempting fate, even though done same connection before and everything went well. Trouble is, from NCL, connecting through AMS is just too convenient .
Previously always very careful about ensuring can survive for a few days on the contents of my hand luggage. Suspect going to be paranoid this time!
. Previously always very careful about ensuring can survive for a few days on the contents of my hand luggage. Suspect going to be paranoid this time!
Paxing All Over The World
At a wedding reception a couple of days ago... chatting to a bloke who regularly commutes from London to Syria. Naturally, I asked about his choice of carrier and routing. I mean, not much else to talk about at a wedding!
He said that he always tried to go BA but sometimes it was KLM via AMS. But he said the problem with KLM was that he could, "Either wait four hours for the connection and get my bag - or half an hour and they loose my bag!" I thought of all you dear folk and reminded myself to add this to the thread when I got back.
The wedding was 50km south of Toulouse so I took BA from LGW. Nice and simple, cabin service was fine the Deli bag going out was better than coming back EXCEPT that the return bag had a Chunky Sized Kit-Kat.
He said that he always tried to go BA but sometimes it was KLM via AMS. But he said the problem with KLM was that he could, "Either wait four hours for the connection and get my bag - or half an hour and they loose my bag!" I thought of all you dear folk and reminded myself to add this to the thread when I got back.
The wedding was 50km south of Toulouse so I took BA from LGW. Nice and simple, cabin service was fine the Deli bag going out was better than coming back EXCEPT that the return bag had a Chunky Sized Kit-Kat.