BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions III

[Litebulbs]

AlpineSkier

I believe your pay range of £25-55K may be wrong at the lower end.

Betty Girl is giving her observations and feelings, which she is entitled to do and are almost always what you would expect from somebody who enjoys her job, knows that it has good terms and conditions and is against the current dispute.

It may not have been your intention to imply that she had an acceptance of sickness fraud, but that is the way it reads. Maybe it was your intention and if so, all it will mean is that there could be one less reasonable crew member posting here.

[Shack37]

Litebulbs, just what I would have said if I'd been articulate and quick enough

[wowzz]

Christmas travel

Can just ask why so many of the BASSA work force go on so much about working at Christmas?
Here in the real world, policemen, firemen [also many other BA staff] and many others work over the festive season. Surely it cannot be a surprise to be asked to work over Christmas, especially as BA seems to be more considerate than others about recompense for Christmas working.
In the US and many other countries Christmas is not considered to be worth more than a one day holiday, and many of us SLF have to be at our desks on Boxing Day to deal with our over-seas customers.
After all this time I still do not understand why striking BA crew believe they they have a right to better T&C's than anyone else.

[LD12986]

Cabin crew sickness has long been a problem at BA LHR. It is certainly not helped on the Worldwide fleet by the fact that there are wild variations in the allowances paid on routes (hence the terms "charity" and "money" trips) and that there is no bidding system to allow crew to bid for trips based on personal preferences etc.

Replacing the archaic and utterly uncomprehensible system of allowances with an hourly rate and introducing a bidding system would help a lot, but it would mean the cake will be cut more equally and some will lose out.

[Neptunus Rex]

In one particular neck of the woods, going sick is known as a "PRA" - Personal Roster Adjustment.

[AV Flyer]

Originally Posted by LD12986

Tony Woodley will still be in situ for another year so Len will not be the sole Gen Sec yet, so regardless of the sabre rattling I would not assume a change in strategy at the top because of Len's election.

If the above is true then there was no reason for TW to delay approaching BA pending the outcome of the Unite election so TW must be prevaricating.

The so-called counter offer that DH has bullied TW into agreeing to deliver back to BA is no such counter offer at all rather it is an "if you will concede yet further on the following issues then we will not call a strike ballot and will continue pushing for even more concessions until you eventually restore all conditions prior to this dispute and we will have secured our power base back" and TW knows it only too well.

TW also knows that, having moved considerably on ST and disciplinaries, BA is not going to move one further millimetre as he stated to DH this is your best offer. I suspect he will placate DH and take his non counter-offer back to BA just so DH can hear the "hell no!" back from BA and then the big Union internal fight and fireworks can begin.

DH has to convince LM/TW/(DS?) to call a strike ballot on some issue or other..........

My guess would be this is what LM's survey of CC for BA's alleged bullying and harrassment tactics is all about in order to be able to call a ballot over something different and thus claim another 12 weeks of protection. Does anyone know if specifically BA's alleged B & H tactics used against the Union's poor and defenseless militant members was part of the previous action?

[RTR]

Its as plain as the nose of DH's face!

[TW also knows that, having moved considerably on ST and disciplinaries, BA is not going to move one further millimetre as he stated to DH this is your best offer. I suspect he will placate DH and take is non counter-offer back to BA just so DH can hear the "hell no!" back from BA and then the big Union internal fight and fireworks can begin.

Holley wants EVERYTHING back in place so that he and his 'minions' can control BA once again. The stupid thing is that it will never happen ever again but he is in denial. Woodley and co have a problem with DH and its going to take balls to tell him how it is, that his time is over and trying to dream up another of his beloved strikes is a lost cause and its time to become a tomato farmer or a samosa supplier and run a burger stall if that is his wish.

As for being part of the airline industry its over but for some reason we all seem to be unfamiliar with, but take guesses at it, he is hanging on for dear life. He cannot represent BASSA's members with the slightest degree of authority, has been sacked by BA and as each day and week passes his previous power base erodes like a sandcastle on the incoming tide, and that tide will sweep him into oblivion when the re-elections for Gen Sec of BASSA are made.

He is a militant. Infamously placed in the higher echelon of that dubious position but as always militants are beaten. That will happen to Holley and the sooner the better - for the well-being and sanity of the remaining BASSA members. Holley is NOT wanted but his problem is himself. He couldn't care less what the members want - its what Holley wants that keeps him going. He is possessed by the power to destroy BA.

[Entaxei]

Holley's also obsessed with hanging on as branch secretary for another 12 months to get his union salary (plus % of subs?), then collect his union pension!! otherwise he will have to survive the next year with only his BA pension and tomato sales. I can't help thinking how instructive it would be to read a copy of the Bassa rulebook, as amended over the past few years of course, if such a thing exists.

[hellsbrink]

Question.

Since DH and others have been kicked out of BA, would it not be possible for TW/whoever at UNITE to FORCE Bassa to hold an immediate (as in, as soon as is feasibly possible) election for these posts as these people are, afaik, now not eligible to be in these posts. That would get rid of any problems they will be causing UNITE in negotiations as well as showing BA that UNITE means business as they are putting their own house in order as far as eligibilty, etc, goes and could help make any future negotiations go more smoothly. It would also kybosh any more of the "WE WANT TO STRIKE (whether it's legal or not)" cries from a certain corner until new people were elected which, hopefully, would mean that those doing all the shouting would shut up so this dispute could be settled by people at least pretending to act like adults and not the toddler tantrums we have seen so far.


I guess it would cause ructions in unionland, but UNITE have to take full control of this mess and while Holley & Co are around that cannot happen.

[SamYeager]

@@hellsbrink

Since DH and others have been kicked out of BA, would it not be possible for TW/whoever at UNITE to FORCE Bassa to hold an immediate (as in, as soon as is feasibly possible) election for these posts as these people are, afaik, now not eligible to be in these posts.

Somewhere along the line I believe that Unite/BASSA agreed that elections to replace DH should be deferred until the current dispute was resolved. Given that only BASSA (DH and other reps) can agree to a dispute being ended then in practice it appears that DH is "sitting pretty" unless outvoted by the other BASSA reps. If I'm correct then you can see that DH may have what is called a conflict of interest with respect to this dispute.

[MCOflyer]

@ Hellsbrink and SamYeager

I guess being in another country with different labor laws I don't understand how DH can remain in a union office if he is compromised as far a being impartial. I have been following this for several months and keep wondering how the membership puts up with his juvenile rants that are aimed at destroying the company that the members work for.

To what end? If DH gets his way he will leave with a pension from BA and from the union and everyone else will be in the unemployment queue.

Please, if you can, explain how this keeps going on.

Thanks


Edit: Sorry, but I have mentioned this to you before. Please do NOT use unreadble fonts! The type is too small. The standard font is Verdana size 2. You have used an obscure one called Trebuchet 1. Any such future posts will be deleted.

[Entaxei]

MCO Flyer

To maybe get some glimmering of the snarled background to this lot, suggest possibly try reading posts 599,600,614,622,623,780. and in general around this area.

It seems that over the years the Bassa branch rules were gradually changed to place all the powers into the hands of the union chairman, Lizanne living in LA and Duncan the Branch Secretary, also regardless of Unite, only Bassa can call off a dispute/strike - no body appears to have seen a copy of the rule book or indeed of any accounts - nor any up to date list or information about reps, a large number of which appear to have possibly been dismissed for various disciplinary offences.

Where decisions have been taken in this dispute, other than by Duncan, it has been by a show of hands at a meeting on a small local football club pitch - obviously a democratic method of decision making for strike action, with a membership that is reported variously between maybe 6,000 to 10,000.

Enjoy gentlemen, you don't often come across a script as devious and convoluted as this!! - be very interested to see your reactions.

[PAXboy]

MCOflyer

Please, if you can, explain how this keeps going on.

Ah, if anyone has the answer to that - then they might have the answer as to how to stop the madness! Speaking as UK pax, this dispute has, for the most part, every hall mark of having nothing to do with a genuine dispute with the employer.

Whilst the dispute started as giving concerns about safety and security on board, as well as other aspects of the way the company is run, it seems that it is a good old fashioned p*****g contest of one little boy against another.

As per usual in industrial disputes everyone (inside the company and out) is going to lose and many already have. Loss of value and service and money all p****d down the drain.

[rethymnon]

Carry on up the .......

much earlier, i suggested that when this dispute was finally over, it would be a good subject for an academic dissertation or book. lately, on the cabin crew forum, the level of debate - everything from 'hats' to (esoteric) social groups -sounds more like a lame comedy script.

after 'made in dagenham', could we be heading for a revival of the 'carry on' series? would anyone, with an inventive turn of mind, care to suggest a suitable title and offer a few contempory names to replace the original stars?

[hellsbrink]

Somewhere along the line I believe that Unite/BASSA agreed that elections to replace DH should be deferred until the current dispute was resolved. Given that only BASSA (DH and other reps) can agree to a dispute being ended then in practice it appears that DH is "sitting pretty" unless outvoted by the other BASSA reps. If I'm correct then you can see that DH may have what is called a conflict of interest with respect to this dispute.

Then surely those at the top at Unite can see that conflict of interest, can see the membership dropping because of the handling of the "dispute" by DH, can see the monthly income dropping because of lower members, and, of course, can see their PR image being ruined by someone who was sacked and is not eligible to be part of the union in the position he holds. That could surely allow the "big men" at Unite the opportunity to say "ENOUGH" and force the issue as Unite are the ones allegedly in charge of the Unite union and not Bassa, who are merely a small part of that union.

Someone has to pull the plug on the current situation before the antics cause more issues to the entire Unite union as you can be sure that others, not Bassa people, will be leaving Unite too and they will be saying that the way things have gone in this dispute is the reason they've had enough.

How long will Unite be able to live with the "satus quo"...........

[LD12986]

On the settlement, BA is clearly in no hurry to expedite a resolution.

In part, I think BA wants to keep the moral high ground and will not use the often quoted 90 days notice to force a resolution and will want to clear resolution through an agreed settlement.

Ultimately, it will know the impact of the strike threat on forward bookings and market share (its own figures show that bookings recover sharply once a strike has passed) and on the company's reputation and brand through tracking surveys etc. The traffic figures for the past couple of months have shown a good recovery in year on year numbers and yields are also improving. It also has plenty of other things to getting on with (Iberia merger, TATL ATI etc).

The company also has the costs savings it was looking to achieve and it has been able to introduce Mixed Fleet at LHR on entirely its own terms. This would have been absolutely unthinkable a few years ago.

BA is not really losing much at the moment from there being no settlement (indeed it doesn't have to give the pay rises to union members in the offer).

I don't believe DH has any intent to settle this dispute, he gains nothing from doing so and whatever moves BA makes there will always be something else to add to the list of grievances.

[Landroger]

From somewhere to somewhere from somewhere else.

The following has been posted recently on 'the other thread', purporting to be from an open letter to Len McCluskey, from a concerned onlooker.

"Dear Mr McCluskey,

I am writing to congratulate you on becoming the new General Secretary of Unite the Union.

As you are aware, I have published open letters arguing that the quality of BA’s professional and experienced cabin crew is one of the few advantages left in flying with British Airways. Because of these letters and my subsequent involvements, I have witnessed first-hand the passion and enthusiasm of the cabin crew against a management that were trying to destroy the premium airline so loved by the crew.

However, I hope you would agree that Unite should and could have done better to help and represent the cabin crew in their dispute with BA’s management. It is undeniable that Unite’s badly organised campaign to convince the public that the cabin crew had no choice but to strike, has been most ineffective. Against a well managed and efficient BA publicity machine, Unite’s attempts looked amateurish.

Furthermore, Unite’s legal advisors have continuously failed to protect the cabin crew members against the brutal and most probably illegal behaviour of BA’s management. More importantly, Unite have lost important grounds to BA management during their negotiations probably because they lacked the benefit of competent professional and business advisors that BA had the support of.

I have read with interest your recent comments in the Financial Times. You stated that in your experience there is no such thing as an “irresponsible strike”. However, in modern day Britain there are many better ways than striking to protect the interest of your members . For example, in the case of British Airways, there was a golden opportunity for your Union to persuade BA’s large shareholders that contrary to what BA management were telling them, it made financial sense for BA to agree a fair settlement with the cabin crew long before there was a need to strike.

I hope you do not mind me writing this open letter criticizing the performance of your Union and agree that it is good to receive constructive criticism from an outsider with no vested interest.



Yours sincerely,"

Given that it expresses a view from a passenger/shareholder not seen on here in the history of the thread; that it mentions BASSA not at all; and that it actually accuses BA of illegal action vis:

Furthermore, Unite’s legal advisors have continuously failed to protect the cabin crew members against the brutal and most probably illegal behaviour of BA’s management.

Does anyone else get a whiff of fish and feel, like me, that the writer has anything but "no vested interest"?

Roger.

[LD12986]

What a brilliant letter from an "outsider"! How reassuring for BASSA that outsiders know that nothing is ever BASSA's fault and somebody else is always to blame.

[Alsacienne]

Crystal ball time, but why not ask folk who are more informed than I am ....

Is it worth 'investing' my hard earned cash in BA tickets for Christmas and New Year 2011 for a wedding in East Africa, when they become available ... or is a strike risk too great?

Can one insure against strikes or disruption caused by trades union action - or inaction?

And ... if I buy my tickets in January, is this likely to be the time when the tickets are cheapest or should I wait ... and if so, when might be the best time to buy? (I don't know if BA operate a yield management stategy like certain low cost airlines.)

[Llademos]

Alsacienne,

BA has consistently stated that, in the event of another CC strike, they will operate 100% of their long haul schedule and 'most' of the shorthaul.

I would book with confidence that this will be the case.

Ll