Monarch Boots off 2 Arab/Asian men AGP - MAN due pax complaints
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Monarch Boots off 2 Arab/Asian men AGP - MAN due pax complaints
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/5267884.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/5269106.stm
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...&icc=NEWS&ct=5
Poor form by MON. Yes we leave in troubled times but that does not mean you kick people off because your pax feel uncomfortable due racial profiling. If they're not happy with the situation they should get off.
The airline seems to be on a role, in regards negative press, the media reportingthat they let a kid with no boarding pass get on board one aircraft and booting off 2 legitimate pax off another.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/5269106.stm
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...&icc=NEWS&ct=5
Poor form by MON. Yes we leave in troubled times but that does not mean you kick people off because your pax feel uncomfortable due racial profiling. If they're not happy with the situation they should get off.
The airline seems to be on a role, in regards negative press, the media reportingthat they let a kid with no boarding pass get on board one aircraft and booting off 2 legitimate pax off another.
Last edited by Easy Ryder; 20th Aug 2006 at 20:24.
That's the point. Some Pax did get off, which prompted an investigation by the security services, and the two Asians were held for a while. Until something is done this type of situation could become more frequent, not saying it's right or wrong, just a fact.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: London, UK
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Apparently (according to BBC TV news reporters), the passengers' suspicions were arroused when they saw the two gentlemen wearing clothes that set them apart from everyone else (who were predominantly UK holiday makers in shorts and flip flops), and talking Arabic.
Terrorism has won if you're afraid to fly in the company of people who don't dress like you or talk your language.
Terrorism has won if you're afraid to fly in the company of people who don't dress like you or talk your language.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
True MarkJF, but thats where it should end. They get off have their bags removed and catch the next flight. At no consequence to the 'percieved threat'.
One things for sure. The TERRORISTS of this world now realise they dont even HAVE to succeed in causing an OUTRAGE to achieve their aims. The effects are still felt from their demented plans. And whats more this kind of behaviour will result in further racial/cultural divisions, breeding more and more resentment.
What a crappy world to live in.......
In refernce to the clothes - i mean how stupid. They must have had the forsight to find out the weather in MAN was.........cold (Highly unusual i know)! And dressed accordingly, i know i do!
I better leave my jacket at home whenever i'm going to work now. God help me if a PAX sees me on the flt deck with a jacket on. Sheesh
One things for sure. The TERRORISTS of this world now realise they dont even HAVE to succeed in causing an OUTRAGE to achieve their aims. The effects are still felt from their demented plans. And whats more this kind of behaviour will result in further racial/cultural divisions, breeding more and more resentment.
What a crappy world to live in.......
In refernce to the clothes - i mean how stupid. They must have had the forsight to find out the weather in MAN was.........cold (Highly unusual i know)! And dressed accordingly, i know i do!
I better leave my jacket at home whenever i'm going to work now. God help me if a PAX sees me on the flt deck with a jacket on. Sheesh
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Upagumtree
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The airline seems to be on a role, letting a kid with no boarding pass get on board one aircraft
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I suspect, as is generally the case with the media, the information is incomplete and ALL the facts surrounding the incident have not been reported. This incident is something everyone is going to have to get use to, the positive side is that those who intend to harm will find it more difficult to achieve their aim, and the negative side is the innocent will have to accept the disruption, regardless of political correctness. Well done to the crew and the vigilance of the passengers. 
EasyR
, I think the crew who detected the 12 year old who had slipped through all the ‘professional’ security checks are to be congratulated on doing their job properly.
EasyR
, I think the crew who detected the 12 year old who had slipped through all the ‘professional’ security checks are to be congratulated on doing their job properly.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes your right the crew did do well, and will edit the above post to reflect this.
However to applaud the pax for their racism (and call it 'vigilance')...........??? WHAT A LOAD OF S#!T!!!!!!
However to applaud the pax for their racism (and call it 'vigilance')...........??? WHAT A LOAD OF S#!T!!!!!!
Last edited by Easy Ryder; 20th Aug 2006 at 20:32.
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: here there and everywhere
Posts: 898
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With all due respect to those passengers that nowadays feel nervous about flying due to the current situation, until I know for certain what exactly these people were doing to alarm the other passengers and the crew I will consider this simply a case of ignorance, intolerance and possibly racism.
I see nervous people fly every day, british, european, middle eastern, asian, african, america etc. If you are nervous of flying it doesn't matter what part of the world you're from. I have a few Arabian friends who don't feel comfortable flying these days because they too could be victims!!
I have been a cabin crew for several years and I have met thousands and thousands of people. I have been in difficult situations, including having to calm down a nervous, panicking passenger post 9/11 as she was scared that the middle eastern passengers that she had seen on boarding were going to blow up the plane.
She would not reason with me and at the end I had to carefully explain that since I speak arabic I would have understood if they had actually been talking about such plans 
There's a limit to everything, and until I read exactly what these people were doing to be taken off a flight, this will be my opinion.
I just hope, for the captain's/senior crew member's sake, that their behaviour was really endangering the aircraft, the passengers and the crew.
Otherwise.......monarch, you'd better save some money for the court case
FBW
And to those people who are scared/do not approve/are not able to tolerate other culture's way of dressing, language etc what the hell are they doing on a plane, going around the world?! One wonders....
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by flybywire
And to those people who are scared/do not approve/are not able to tolerate other culture's way of dressing, language etc what the hell are they doing on a plane, going around the world?! One wonders....
I have to agree with FBW, well said.
By the way, since not all terrorists are as dumb as people think. Is it possible that theses fiendish creatures might decide to disguise themselves?
Shave off the beard? Go blond? Wear a smart suit and tie? A clerical collar? Change their name to Fred Bloggs?
On a similar note,
I have an acquaintance who is a world renowned specialist in diseases of the blood who has an Arab name and is of arab appearance. He no longer attends conferences in the U.S. because of the hassle he receives when travelling. The community is poorer because of it.
God help us all if passengers are encouraged to "profile" their nieghbours.
By the way, since not all terrorists are as dumb as people think. Is it possible that theses fiendish creatures might decide to disguise themselves?
Shave off the beard? Go blond? Wear a smart suit and tie? A clerical collar? Change their name to Fred Bloggs?
On a similar note,
I have an acquaintance who is a world renowned specialist in diseases of the blood who has an Arab name and is of arab appearance. He no longer attends conferences in the U.S. because of the hassle he receives when travelling. The community is poorer because of it.
God help us all if passengers are encouraged to "profile" their nieghbours.
Ohcirrej
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: This is the internet FFS.........
Posts: 2,921
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by flybywire
And to those people who are scared/do not approve/are not able to tolerate other culture's way of dressing, language etc what the hell are they doing on a plane, going around the world?
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 183
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well said FbW!
Surely an appropriate response would have been to request the 2 Pax to de-plane so their ID could be verified and luggage/person searched again, whilst the aircraft & pax waited for them?
I know .. money!
Surely an appropriate response would have been to request the 2 Pax to de-plane so their ID could be verified and luggage/person searched again, whilst the aircraft & pax waited for them?
I know .. money!
What we have here is mob rule.
A sensible course would be to offer those passengers who feel uncomfortable with travelling in the company of other ethnic groups the option of disembarking, retrieving their luggage and finding their own way home.
And before the stones start flying.....
On the assumption, of course, that adequate security procedures were in place at the airport and that the "suspicious" passengers were doing nothing more threatening than talking in a non-English language
A sensible course would be to offer those passengers who feel uncomfortable with travelling in the company of other ethnic groups the option of disembarking, retrieving their luggage and finding their own way home.
And before the stones start flying.....
On the assumption, of course, that adequate security procedures were in place at the airport and that the "suspicious" passengers were doing nothing more threatening than talking in a non-English language
Last edited by RevMan2; 21st Aug 2006 at 06:32.
Thought police antagonist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Where I always have been...firmly in the real world
Posts: 1,378
Received 127 Likes
on
92 Posts
Originally Posted by RevMan2
What we have here is mob rule.
A sensible course would be to offer those passengers who feel uncomfortable with travelling in the company of other ethnic groups the option of disembarking, retrieving their luggage and finding their own way home.
And before the stones start flying.....
On the assumption, of course, that adequate security procedures were in place at the airport and that the "suspicious" passengers were doing nothing more threatening than talking in a non-English language
A sensible course would be to offer those passengers who feel uncomfortable with travelling in the company of other ethnic groups the option of disembarking, retrieving their luggage and finding their own way home.
And before the stones start flying.....
On the assumption, of course, that adequate security procedures were in place at the airport and that the "suspicious" passengers were doing nothing more threatening than talking in a non-English language
When I watched the report on TV last night, my initial response was
with regard to the pax who decided the two gentlemen concerned were "suspicious" and duly, it seems, acted as judge and jury. Then I started thinking a bit more. Given the circumstances, the choices the Captain, or whoever made the final decision of course, were limited I suppose. The report said they were off loaded for security reasons---possibly their own security ??--given that as of yet we know nothing about the pax involved in initiating the "mutiny"
and lets's face it, a 4 hr flight with a lot, or even a few, disgruntled or totally bigoted / paranoid tabloid readers has the potential to turn very nasty, very quickly doesn't it ?. A tough set of circumstances for all involved at the time and with no easy option or simple solution readily apparent. Me ? I would take a long, hard and detailed look at the those who decided to walk off in the first place. I also suspect that in the very near future, a letter from Messr's Sue, Grabbit and Run "acting on behalf of our clients" will be passing into the Monarch mail box. The other problem of course, is that a precedent ( of sorts ) has now been set and it doesn't take much, given the level of stupidity prevalent here in the UK--one area we are truly "world class" in
--for others to orchestrate a repeat performance at some point.
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Tea green International
Posts: 563
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Monarch pax reject pax in jackets
According to a BBC interview the ejected pax were incorrectly dressed;
"wearing suits" and looked out of place on a Monarch flight from Malaga.
They were chatting between themselves...not screaming to the kids to shut the %%%% up....
Also looking at their watches.......perhaps the flight was " on time", and they were confused....
Thats just how down market air travel is going....
Pass me my VJL..... ....
Bumz
"wearing suits" and looked out of place on a Monarch flight from Malaga.
They were chatting between themselves...not screaming to the kids to shut the %%%% up....
Also looking at their watches.......perhaps the flight was " on time", and they were confused....
Thats just how down market air travel is going....
Pass me my VJL..... ....
Bumz
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
EasyR,
Racism or ‘profiling’? If it was racism shame on them. If it was due to something they had physically seen or heard I stand by my comments. If the professionals who work in security can make the ‘gaffs’ we have seen over the past 2 weeks I would prefer passengers and crew to maintain a self-preservation level of vigilance. Stuff political correctness!
Racism or ‘profiling’? If it was racism shame on them. If it was due to something they had physically seen or heard I stand by my comments. If the professionals who work in security can make the ‘gaffs’ we have seen over the past 2 weeks I would prefer passengers and crew to maintain a self-preservation level of vigilance. Stuff political correctness!
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 189
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Is it me or are airplanes usually pretty damn cold inside? I can't say I've ever been comfortable wearing just a t-shirt on a flight, and I've been on literarly thousands of them. Also, as already pointed out, Manchester would be way too cold to be prancing around in shorts and flip flops upon the supposedly early morning arrival of the flight. So I think the jackasses in shorts were the ones dressed suspiciously and if I were the captain I would have ejected all the passengers with shorts, bitch-slapped the ones who disembarked voluntarily, and been on my merry way. If the captain was concerned for the safety of the two asians he should have gotten rid of the passengers posing a threat to them, even if that meant getting rid of half the passengers, that would have been the RIGHT thing to do, but not economical. Monarch and the passengers owe a huge apology to these mistreated young gentlemen. This is all assuming that the event was reported correctly, and judging by an interview on the BBC with a couple of passengers in which the only cause for suspicion mentioned was language and dress, I believe it was reported correctly. Brits are notoriously racist by the way... is it racist of me to say that?
I hope a passenger on that flight reads this (slim chance), but if you are one of them, you are a jackass, do the world a favor and go jump off a cliff.
I hope a passenger on that flight reads this (slim chance), but if you are one of them, you are a jackass, do the world a favor and go jump off a cliff.
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Stuck in the middle...
Posts: 1,638
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Maybe one way to shut everyone up would've been to offload everyone and give them all a pat-down?
SO now when my employer demands that I travel Ryanair on co. business and I'm dressed in a suit rather than casuals, I can expect demands from other punters that I be off-loaded. Especially if I pull out my religious book (not saying what type) and start thumbing through it.
SO now when my employer demands that I travel Ryanair on co. business and I'm dressed in a suit rather than casuals, I can expect demands from other punters that I be off-loaded. Especially if I pull out my religious book (not saying what type) and start thumbing through it.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BISH,
This case definitely stinks of racism period.... You can hide behind the banner of profiling all you want. But if someone is dressed differently and speaking another language warrants a terror alert then your living in la la land. Chinese, South Americans and Africans must all be terrorists too! Not to mention most of Europe! All they say they heard as far as we know is that they spoke Arabic. I wouldnt be suprised if the average holiday maker, couldnt tell the difference between Arabic, Urdu, Hindi and the many other Asian languages. It also didnt occur to me that Arabic was the official terrorist language.... if someone speaks it they must want to blow something up right?
Yes political correctness has gone too far in SOME respects, but i strongly feel you would feel otherwise (about profiling) if the shoe was on the other foot, and you were continuously pulled aside by security at airports because of your ethnicity, gawked at by fellow pax when boarding & sitting on trains, and ulimately being booted off a flight because of others bigoted/ignorant attitudes.
You can claim all you want, that if you were in that position you'd be quite happy to put up with it given the circumstances. For a little while yes. But then you'll seen get tired of being judged for the colour of your skin or religion.
You will never understand how it feels because you will never be in that position.
Now before someone says if you dont like it you should go back 'home'! The answer to that is..... ONE SHOULDN'T HAVE TO!
This case definitely stinks of racism period.... You can hide behind the banner of profiling all you want. But if someone is dressed differently and speaking another language warrants a terror alert then your living in la la land. Chinese, South Americans and Africans must all be terrorists too! Not to mention most of Europe! All they say they heard as far as we know is that they spoke Arabic. I wouldnt be suprised if the average holiday maker, couldnt tell the difference between Arabic, Urdu, Hindi and the many other Asian languages. It also didnt occur to me that Arabic was the official terrorist language.... if someone speaks it they must want to blow something up right?
Yes political correctness has gone too far in SOME respects, but i strongly feel you would feel otherwise (about profiling) if the shoe was on the other foot, and you were continuously pulled aside by security at airports because of your ethnicity, gawked at by fellow pax when boarding & sitting on trains, and ulimately being booted off a flight because of others bigoted/ignorant attitudes.
You can claim all you want, that if you were in that position you'd be quite happy to put up with it given the circumstances. For a little while yes. But then you'll seen get tired of being judged for the colour of your skin or religion.
You will never understand how it feels because you will never be in that position.
Now before someone says if you dont like it you should go back 'home'! The answer to that is..... ONE SHOULDN'T HAVE TO!
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Tea green International
Posts: 563
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was not happy with fellow pax last week
They were wearing white robes, beards, and holding books with words I could not understand....and muttering under their breath.....
Not surprising, from Jeddah to Dubai......
I was the odd one out....reading a computer magazine....
Perhaps I should have been removed.....
Bumz
Not surprising, from Jeddah to Dubai......
I was the odd one out....reading a computer magazine....
Perhaps I should have been removed.....
Bumz