Employment Predicament
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Employment Predicament
Yep another one of those threads, well maybe a tad different.
I sit here trolling every website for jobs and contacting all my resources to find employment as a charter pilot in Australia/Oceania/Asia. But still to no avail as yet.
It's a story you've probably all heard, but what is one to do? I've got 1000hrs TT worked as an instructor and decided charter is what I wanted to do.
Completed my ATPL theory working part time and I find myself sitting here desperate for that charter gig. Gained the ME and a CIR to try boost my chances, hiring a cheap twin for twin time to hopefully boost the chance of twin employment.
Let's cut to the chase, I'm keen and I've contacted nearly everyone I mean everyone, it's slow at the moment. I'm either too qualified for the entry job for the desk (I'm told) or not qualified enough for the next gig.
I'm keen to do the hard yards, I'm the hard worker who gets in and does the work that most call in sick for.
Is it just timing right now? Do we have to wait for the airline (CX) influx to start?
I'm happy to jump into the singles its career progression hopefully to twins I expect that, I don't expect to be given the job just because I've got a few more hours than the fresh CPL but what else can one do to gain employment?
Am I to just fly up north and door knock DN, CS, AS and the likes?
Just a rant but would love to hear discussion, advice or banter. Am currently on the iPad on the road, sorry for potential poor grammar.
I sit here trolling every website for jobs and contacting all my resources to find employment as a charter pilot in Australia/Oceania/Asia. But still to no avail as yet.
It's a story you've probably all heard, but what is one to do? I've got 1000hrs TT worked as an instructor and decided charter is what I wanted to do.
Completed my ATPL theory working part time and I find myself sitting here desperate for that charter gig. Gained the ME and a CIR to try boost my chances, hiring a cheap twin for twin time to hopefully boost the chance of twin employment.
Let's cut to the chase, I'm keen and I've contacted nearly everyone I mean everyone, it's slow at the moment. I'm either too qualified for the entry job for the desk (I'm told) or not qualified enough for the next gig.
I'm keen to do the hard yards, I'm the hard worker who gets in and does the work that most call in sick for.
Is it just timing right now? Do we have to wait for the airline (CX) influx to start?
I'm happy to jump into the singles its career progression hopefully to twins I expect that, I don't expect to be given the job just because I've got a few more hours than the fresh CPL but what else can one do to gain employment?
Am I to just fly up north and door knock DN, CS, AS and the likes?
Just a rant but would love to hear discussion, advice or banter. Am currently on the iPad on the road, sorry for potential poor grammar.
Just a rant but would love to hear discussion, advice or banter. Am currently on the iPad on the road, sorry for potential poor grammar.
You can't effectively network from afar. Get in a car and drive north. You need to be the guy who's around when the senior pilot moves on and everybody moves up a rung.
The CP has probably already turfed your resume and/or email s/he got last week.
Times were probably harder 16 years ago, but with the same background and hours as you I drove north and visited company with 210s just as a guy had failed a line check...
The CP has probably already turfed your resume and/or email s/he got last week.
Times were probably harder 16 years ago, but with the same background and hours as you I drove north and visited company with 210s just as a guy had failed a line check...
Issue one.
I sit here trolling every website for jobs and contacting all my resources to find employment as a charter pilot in Australia/Oceania/Asia. But still to no avail as yet.
I'm happy to jump into the singles its career progression hopefully to twins I expect that, I don't expect to be given the job just because I've got a few more hours than the fresh CPL.
Happy to "jump" into them or happy to be employed as a full time single driver for an extended period of time? 1000hrs of instructing I would be surprised if you would be considered for a twin gig up north, lots of high time single drivers around with all charter.
Am I just to fly up north and door knock?
Yes.
I sit here trolling every website for jobs and contacting all my resources to find employment as a charter pilot in Australia/Oceania/Asia. But still to no avail as yet.
I'm happy to jump into the singles its career progression hopefully to twins I expect that, I don't expect to be given the job just because I've got a few more hours than the fresh CPL.
Happy to "jump" into them or happy to be employed as a full time single driver for an extended period of time? 1000hrs of instructing I would be surprised if you would be considered for a twin gig up north, lots of high time single drivers around with all charter.
Am I just to fly up north and door knock?
Yes.
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I second what compressor stall said.
You phoning up or emailing is pretty much useless. You *may* get lucky, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
You may have 1000 hours, but for charter you're less desirable right now than someone with 400 hours a bit of charter or scenic flying experience in a 200 series or airvan, unless of course you have META, then you're in a different basket all together.
There is movement happening, maybe not in the numbers of 2007, but there is definite movement happening. You'll just have to look around in areas that aren't your typical seasonal hiring places.
Flying up for a day or two is also not something I'd recommend, as you want to be johnny on the spot who's ready to start right away, not the guy that says "oh I fly back home in two days time and then can pack up my car and be back up in 10 days time".
Best of luck in your venture
You phoning up or emailing is pretty much useless. You *may* get lucky, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
You may have 1000 hours, but for charter you're less desirable right now than someone with 400 hours a bit of charter or scenic flying experience in a 200 series or airvan, unless of course you have META, then you're in a different basket all together.
There is movement happening, maybe not in the numbers of 2007, but there is definite movement happening. You'll just have to look around in areas that aren't your typical seasonal hiring places.
Flying up for a day or two is also not something I'd recommend, as you want to be johnny on the spot who's ready to start right away, not the guy that says "oh I fly back home in two days time and then can pack up my car and be back up in 10 days time".
Best of luck in your venture
Happy to add a little to this...
Firstly, I agree with all the others have identified above. During my initial read of the OP, I thought that this would have been the lament of one who had actually gone north looking for work and, having come up empty handed, asked the general audience about how to go about improving chances for the next attempt...
Please be aware that many of your peer group (ie competition) are already hanging around Darwin, Broome, etc waiting for an opportunity. Industry is funny at the moment, there is a definite feeling of movement, but nothing definitive yet. Certainly, the "start of Dry" recruitment drive in Darwin this year has been more subdued than previous, but there is optimism that the larger operators (ie Virgin, et al) will recruit and therefore create space in GA. I think you need to be there, establish a network with the pilots in location, develop a rapport with the Chief Pilots and convince them (without appearing desperate) that you are the "hard worker, etc" that you purport to be... From what I've seen thus far in this thread, but don't take it harshly because I don't mean it in a nasty way, I would more likely categorise you as a talker with an over-inflated sense of entitlement to a spot in the northern Australian charter industry (but I do appreciate and empathise with the dilemma of leaving a current flying job to chase a possibility!).
Certainly the e-mail you likely sent me (today?) has already been dragged-and-dropped into the "solid hours but pending a visit" directory on my MS Outlook. I extract these once I have a face to a name and that gets things started. You need to follow such e-mails up with a visit and although I acknowledge the sacrifices made by pilots starting their careers and respect them for it, you need to be aware that while ever there are boys and girls willing to chase the work hard - you will need to match them for commitment, as job hunting is (make no mistake) a competition amongst job-hunters. Don't approach it as a "beat the Chief Pilot" thing - most of us detest being brought into a battle of wits with job seekers. Strongest course of action - get to a location with opportunity, make a reason to stay there (get a job doing something else to keep the dollars coming in) and settle in. Genuinely good prospects will always get a go, it's just the timing that's variable. Enjoy the adventure as best you can.
Bring "happy to jump into a single" or hiring a cheap twin, is not what I'm after - makes it clear to me that you will only do this as a stepping stone and not fully respect the role that such a pilot has in my operation. That does not sound humble professionally, and you need to appear thus. I respect the single engine pilots for what they do as much as the twin pilots, they are both professionals with role specific skill sets (when was the last time a purely M/E pilot needed to practice a glide approach into a postage stamp sized paddock?). I look for a good temperament in people with a realistic outlook (have an awareness of what is involved in being a charter pilot and living / working remotely, as well as expectations given the current industry climate), strong work ethic, commitment to the profession and dignity (that means, don't offer to work for free and don't criticise other pilots, operators, etc).
Last tip - try not to discuss with a CP what you expect regarding progression in their Company at the drop in visit - concentrate on just laying the ground work to getting an opportunity to be a part of the team. That same CP will WANT to progress you if you are actually as good as you think / say you are when / if you start. Remember, it's in their best interest to have the most competent pilots flying the "big stuff"...
Don't talk about what you are and what you can / will do - best you just take steps to show us! Knocking on doors, in person, is a really good start.
All the best.
Firstly, I agree with all the others have identified above. During my initial read of the OP, I thought that this would have been the lament of one who had actually gone north looking for work and, having come up empty handed, asked the general audience about how to go about improving chances for the next attempt...
Please be aware that many of your peer group (ie competition) are already hanging around Darwin, Broome, etc waiting for an opportunity. Industry is funny at the moment, there is a definite feeling of movement, but nothing definitive yet. Certainly, the "start of Dry" recruitment drive in Darwin this year has been more subdued than previous, but there is optimism that the larger operators (ie Virgin, et al) will recruit and therefore create space in GA. I think you need to be there, establish a network with the pilots in location, develop a rapport with the Chief Pilots and convince them (without appearing desperate) that you are the "hard worker, etc" that you purport to be... From what I've seen thus far in this thread, but don't take it harshly because I don't mean it in a nasty way, I would more likely categorise you as a talker with an over-inflated sense of entitlement to a spot in the northern Australian charter industry (but I do appreciate and empathise with the dilemma of leaving a current flying job to chase a possibility!).
Certainly the e-mail you likely sent me (today?) has already been dragged-and-dropped into the "solid hours but pending a visit" directory on my MS Outlook. I extract these once I have a face to a name and that gets things started. You need to follow such e-mails up with a visit and although I acknowledge the sacrifices made by pilots starting their careers and respect them for it, you need to be aware that while ever there are boys and girls willing to chase the work hard - you will need to match them for commitment, as job hunting is (make no mistake) a competition amongst job-hunters. Don't approach it as a "beat the Chief Pilot" thing - most of us detest being brought into a battle of wits with job seekers. Strongest course of action - get to a location with opportunity, make a reason to stay there (get a job doing something else to keep the dollars coming in) and settle in. Genuinely good prospects will always get a go, it's just the timing that's variable. Enjoy the adventure as best you can.
Bring "happy to jump into a single" or hiring a cheap twin, is not what I'm after - makes it clear to me that you will only do this as a stepping stone and not fully respect the role that such a pilot has in my operation. That does not sound humble professionally, and you need to appear thus. I respect the single engine pilots for what they do as much as the twin pilots, they are both professionals with role specific skill sets (when was the last time a purely M/E pilot needed to practice a glide approach into a postage stamp sized paddock?). I look for a good temperament in people with a realistic outlook (have an awareness of what is involved in being a charter pilot and living / working remotely, as well as expectations given the current industry climate), strong work ethic, commitment to the profession and dignity (that means, don't offer to work for free and don't criticise other pilots, operators, etc).
Last tip - try not to discuss with a CP what you expect regarding progression in their Company at the drop in visit - concentrate on just laying the ground work to getting an opportunity to be a part of the team. That same CP will WANT to progress you if you are actually as good as you think / say you are when / if you start. Remember, it's in their best interest to have the most competent pilots flying the "big stuff"...
Don't talk about what you are and what you can / will do - best you just take steps to show us! Knocking on doors, in person, is a really good start.
All the best.
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Thanks for your detailed post Flying Bear - that kind of advice really helps. Within the next twelve months finances and a few other things permitting I plan on doing the drive through the Pilbara/Kimberley/NT/FNQ myself with a stack of resumes (and a well-stocked iPod!). My only question is this - as a CP yourself, is a 'drive through' where you are based enough to help or do you prefer prospective employees to be based in your location for a longer period of time?
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Didn't expect such an in depth answer, thanks for that Flying Bear.
Well some may talk the talk, I'm the guy who busts his chops to get the job done. I find that quite a bad assumption, but of course the saying "Prove me I'm wrong" would be a good fit.
Again thanks for the input, see you in a few weeks
I would more likely categorise you as a talker with an over-inflated sense of entitlement to a spot in the northern Australian charter industry
Again thanks for the input, see you in a few weeks
Ruddegar,
I'm not so presumptuous as to tell a prospective pilot what they ought to do regarding hanging around a location waiting for my Company, or any other... It's your life and no CP should interfere with that BEFORE taking you on - after that, though - he / she might own a little bit more of you and be more direct with where you will / won't be!!
All I insist on is meeting all prospective pilots - I won't consider them before that. Because my Company will not pay for people to travel to see us for specific interviews, I restrict myself to the pool of pilots that come through initially on an unsolicited basis. Experience has taught me there are enough suitable candidates amongst them to not have to worry about applicants from afar.
Once I've met someone and think they will be okay in our team, I don't really mind where they are after that - provided they can get back to us for a start within a reasonable timeframe (ie 2-4 weeks) from when they get the nod. Having said that, often the rapport that will put me in that position is not established on the first visit for a ten minute chat - which may make it worthwhile being around for a while to take a couple of bites at the cherry.
I'm not so presumptuous as to tell a prospective pilot what they ought to do regarding hanging around a location waiting for my Company, or any other... It's your life and no CP should interfere with that BEFORE taking you on - after that, though - he / she might own a little bit more of you and be more direct with where you will / won't be!!
All I insist on is meeting all prospective pilots - I won't consider them before that. Because my Company will not pay for people to travel to see us for specific interviews, I restrict myself to the pool of pilots that come through initially on an unsolicited basis. Experience has taught me there are enough suitable candidates amongst them to not have to worry about applicants from afar.
Once I've met someone and think they will be okay in our team, I don't really mind where they are after that - provided they can get back to us for a start within a reasonable timeframe (ie 2-4 weeks) from when they get the nod. Having said that, often the rapport that will put me in that position is not established on the first visit for a ten minute chat - which may make it worthwhile being around for a while to take a couple of bites at the cherry.
Dilemma
My thoughts! Get back into instructing. With your experience you wont have too much trouble getting a foot in the door, I wouldn't think. Choose a Company that is doing the transition to a 142 organisation. They will be the ones taking on a lot of the contracted, check and training for charter companies. You will gain significant exposure to Charter organisations through that connection. It might still be a good 18 months away before many Companies transition, but it will happen. That will lead to the connections. Another 18 months instructing would have you primed and ready.
I realise you may think you've done instructing, but a different environment with career opportunities may get your passion fired up again. And before anyone gets stuck into me with "you have to love instructing and have a passion for teaching" I counter "you don't have to love flying beat up, poorly maintained, possibly overweight 206s in thunderstorms to be a charter pilot". When your at work just don't give anyone an inkling your not mad passionate about it, in either role.
I realise you may think you've done instructing, but a different environment with career opportunities may get your passion fired up again. And before anyone gets stuck into me with "you have to love instructing and have a passion for teaching" I counter "you don't have to love flying beat up, poorly maintained, possibly overweight 206s in thunderstorms to be a charter pilot". When your at work just don't give anyone an inkling your not mad passionate about it, in either role.
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Thanks Flying Bear,
Much appreciated solid advice to take into consideration for in about 9 months time. Are there any things which someone coming in to get face time with your organisation can do that immediately makes them seem more appealing or on the flipside anything that candidates do that results in a resume being shredded? (I am aware that I will need to remove my ATPL-study beard)
Much appreciated solid advice to take into consideration for in about 9 months time. Are there any things which someone coming in to get face time with your organisation can do that immediately makes them seem more appealing or on the flipside anything that candidates do that results in a resume being shredded? (I am aware that I will need to remove my ATPL-study beard)
I don't know your age/situation etc, but keep applying and def do the trip. Dress sharp and don't bull****. It's a different job than you've been doing in so many ways.
Cheap flights booked in advance and 4 or 5 days in a backpacker or caravan park will keep costs down.
Nepotism is awesome! Know anyone at any joint? Get on to them.
Make sure your CV is succinct and to the point. 1 page is great.
The move is a challenge, and will take some adjustment particularly coming from the safe confines / routine of a flying school. Hang in there at the 3-6 month mark as the homesickness will pass.
If it takes too long, get a job instructing again. 1500 looks better than a 1000 and so on.
Grade 1,META and IRTA are all good things to aim at and will enhance your prospects although if you hate instructing, do everyone a favour and steer clear.
Good Luck.
Cheap flights booked in advance and 4 or 5 days in a backpacker or caravan park will keep costs down.
Nepotism is awesome! Know anyone at any joint? Get on to them.
Make sure your CV is succinct and to the point. 1 page is great.
The move is a challenge, and will take some adjustment particularly coming from the safe confines / routine of a flying school. Hang in there at the 3-6 month mark as the homesickness will pass.
If it takes too long, get a job instructing again. 1500 looks better than a 1000 and so on.
Grade 1,META and IRTA are all good things to aim at and will enhance your prospects although if you hate instructing, do everyone a favour and steer clear.
Good Luck.
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I never hated instructing, I loved the work and built up such a good rapport with my students. It was honestly the best work I've done in over 15yrs employment.
It was other employer reasons, I will not go into detail. Suffice to say I've been advised most employers are nothing alike.
Regards to resume, I was always told that 1 page is great for the guy who has no experience in business/life.
My resume is 2 pages, 1 page with qualifications experience and introduction. Another with aviation and non aviation experience, key roles etc. (Not the McDonalds, burger flipping kind of experience either.)
Thanks for the advice will continue plugging away.
It was other employer reasons, I will not go into detail. Suffice to say I've been advised most employers are nothing alike.
Regards to resume, I was always told that 1 page is great for the guy who has no experience in business/life.
My resume is 2 pages, 1 page with qualifications experience and introduction. Another with aviation and non aviation experience, key roles etc. (Not the McDonalds, burger flipping kind of experience either.)
Thanks for the advice will continue plugging away.
