Long Service Medal for Officers
 

Guys. i remember about a year ago reading that the LSGC medal or at least some form of LS medal was to be awarded to officers with 15yrs or more service.

Did anything come of this or was it quietly dropped.

This is all I could find.

Personally I think it's a bad idea; if everyone gets a medal then it carries no weight or significance with those that receive them i.e. jubilee medals.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/n...litary-service

Almost agree, but the LS&GC medal carries significance as it depicts that the wearer has completed 15 years service without being caught for doing anything wrong. It is not just a token medal (Jubilee Medal) for being "in" for five years, and the majority of those who receive it are proud to wear it; particularly those who get the clasp for 30 years service.

Well it wouldn't be 'everyone' getting the medal - just those who have served for the required time. I'm not sure 15 years would be long enough though - I would think it would need to recognise service some way beyond the IPP to make any sense.

And anyway, I thought officers were expected to show good conduct. :hmm:

Everybody already does get it. That is unless you are in the single cohort of direct entry officer. If you join in the ranks you get it; if you then commission from the ranks with sufficient time under your belt but less than you need to get it purely in the ranks, you then get it as an officer. If you're a Reservist, of whatever rank, you apparently get it. It seems the only people not to get it are officers coming straight in off the street.

It's always struck me that we have gone too far in the opposite direction to the US, and it seems any medal these days should only be awarded having sacrificed at least 2 internal organs whilst living face down in a muddy ditch for at least a year whilst being force fed rat packs and being made to listen to the speeches of Gordon Brown on endless loops. Even then some would complain it was still too easy.

Whilst my experience of medals is limited, from what I have seen, critics seem to be divided between those who already have medals and don't want to mount another (pull the ladder up Jack as it were), those who don't have any medals and are envious, and collectors who seem to think that medals exist solely to give them a hobby.

Dont forget dealers - medals made up a fair proportion of my income for 30 years! I remember reading a letter from some retired colonel or other who was complaining about "this trafficking in medals!" The fact is that a fair proportion of servicemen and women couldn't give a rats about their medals once they leave, and see no reason why they shouldn't raise some money on them. British medals are more valuable to the collector than almost all countries' medals because they are relatively scarcely awarded, and also for the most part they are named, and thus have potential for research.

Re officers' LS&GC, I tend to agree with Background Noise's second point.

An automatic 20% discount on their bar bill.

FED, only because they drink more?

Or because they have learnt the hard truth that their livers can't take it so they don't drink?

edit

Of course stopping drinking =100% discount.

Jubilee Medals
 

heights good,

Not all Jubilee medals were given to everyone as the Golden medal was.

In 1977, the Silver Jubilee medal was allocated on a limited basis to unit commanders to distribute amongst the unit personnel. I was in command of a Flight of about 120 men and women and I was allocated one medal to hand out for the whole flight.

I recommended a Jnr Tech, who was probably the most talented propulsion fitter I ever came across in my career. But he had a phobia about promotion exams. He had taken the Cpl's exam about 4 or 5 times and barely got beyond writing his name on the answer paper before he froze.

Recommendation accepted; he was the only one on the flight who wore the medal and the girls and guys respected him for it.

Rgds SOS

Re the initial post by Welcome1;

This officer appears to have LS&GCM and clasp and then got to at least AVM (going by the bit of scrambled egg visible). Who is he btw?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...ures-mmgrk83kb

Air Officer Scotland, AVM Ross Paterson perhaps? Can't find another picture that matches his medals though.

Avtur (#2) et al,

"When Everbody is Somebody, then Nobody is Anybody" (W.S.Gilbert).

I've got two year's airman service, 26 year's commissioned service (no detected crime) plus 45 years on retired list (67 years seniority as a Flt.Lt.)

What's in it for me ?

Danny.

Nothing new for you, Danny. But then you already have a collection of significnt medals, so you mustn't be greedy. And think of the cost of having everything remounted!! :)

So all of those with a commission who have never gone on ops, hid under their desks, dodged the redundancy bullets etc get a LS&GC - the GC for commissioned is a given as said above. There are plenty around still.

Yet those who are repeatedly doing LITTENs, KIPION, SHADERs, etc are told 'it is all too difficult to work out and don't expect a decision soon and you might not like it.

See the other thread. WTF?

gijoe

What exactly is your beef? Is it against Officers or against people who don't deploy? Or is it a general whinge about the lack of medal for Ops such as Shader?

I'm not arguing just struggling to see what your point is.

BV

If I had had forced to have Air Force life like that I would deserve a medal.

It certainly looks like AVM Paterson, wrathmonk. However I've googled him and found a few pics where his medal ribbons are visible and they appear not to include the RAF LS & GC. Very odd, because this chap is quite definitely wearing the RAF LS & GC and clasp, which must be a first for a 2 star I'd have thought, whoever he is.

Saw AM Sir Baz North in uniform recently, complete with pilots wings, RAF Reg't mudguards and LS gong plus bar.

One assumes there is a "not before" date to save strain (spelled m-o-n-e-y) on production, and to avoid giving the odd bauble to old farts comme moi.;) [seem to remember reading that somewhere but can't find it - but then there's an increasing number of things I can't find these days .........:8]

So my 37 yrs regular commissioned service (presumably 35 as under 21 won't count!) and nearly another 10 as a Reservist will give me nothing more to pin on my shabby blazer in November ...... :ugh:

Ah well, make do with the current 5, and won't need the cost of another miniature and remounting! :ok:

We're getting more like the Yanks every day.

We don't wear shiny plastic shoes yet, so there's still hope.

Officers never wore shiny shoes full stop!:E

CG

An Anomaly not Corrected

The anomaly that existed for many years was that Regular Service (RS) officers in the UK Armed Services had not had their long, voluntary service recognised by the award of a Long Service medal as had almost every other branch in these Services, Voluntary Reserves, Cadet Forces, Fire and Police Services, etc. Then, quite recently, the Government announced that this anomaly would be addressed in that every RS officer who had completed 15 years service, without blemish, would be awarded that Service Arm's Long Service & Good Conduct Medal.

However, any RS officer who had retired before July 2014 would not so qualify, which thereby created a new anomaly whereby those who had served earlier and retired before this date would not have their service recognised in medallic form.

I am one who served between 1959 and 1979, in which more than 15 years were as an RS officer, and I would really like my time in the RAF to be recognised by means of a medal, for this would then be the only medal I would have received from my Country. I was proud to have served, and I would like to be able to display this fact on occasions when medals can be worn, most usually on Remembrance Sunday but on a few other occasions also. Without such a visible token I appear no different from those who have never served in HM Armed Forces, which irks me because I have pride in what I did when in uniform and what I achieved.

In the 1960s and 1970s there were few opportunities for earning medals, generally only those who served overseas on campaigns where risk and rigour existed could qualify, so there was quite a dearth of medals at that time amongst such servicemen and women. At the time of HM's Silver Jubilee word went around that a medal was being stuck to commemorate this event, but the severely restricted number that could be awarded meant that there was huge disappointment as we learnt that most of us would not get one. Fortunately, the qualification rules changed for the subsequent Jubilees and so - remembering that the UK does not have a Defence Medal or anything similar - many who had served for at least five years by and on the appropriate dates actually received a medal, something to wear.

For those of you who read this and already have a medal - campaign or Jubilee - it may not seem quite so important as it does to me, but I do ask how it can be that someone who today holds the same rank as I when I retired and has served for as long as I can deserve a medal whilst I do not. I would be surprised if there are not others who feel as I do and would like this anomaly to be corrected.

A Petition was started to widen the scope to include those of us who served in former years but this has now been brought to a halt due to the dissolution of Parliament. Whether it will start up again I have no way of knowing: we shall see.

Nugget90 - wholeheartedly agree!

Personally, were I to receive it I would just chuck it in the drawer, however if it is to be awarded then all should receive it. Otherwise it is just another piece of grudging parsimony.

YS

I'm with Nugget90, as I expounded on another thread.

1965-1994, so only 29 years of Regular commissioned service. Never went to a 'warry place', despite volunteering on several occasions. No Jubilees either.

I intend, as I said elsewhere, to purchase a replica* to eventually pass on to my son (along with 3 other generations-worth of decorations and campaign medals going back to 1882).

I can understand the Government's parsimony to a small extent, and likewise the administrative burden associated with backdating the award. I shall just bypass that, unofficially, for my son whilst explaining my oersonal rationale for buying an unentitled replica.

* (PS. Cased and displayed at home, along with the others, and NOT worn or on public display.)

I have and LS&GCM received as an officer as I had 12yr airman's service and completed the 15 while an officer. Although I served from 62 to 2000 I was resigned to that being my only medal, but received 2 NATO medals during my last tour at AFSOUTH. The qualification for those was 30 days in theatre or 3 months in the HQ where I was. So, a pretty insignificant collection, but Nugget is quite right about the effect. Whenever I attended the remembrance service at a local village church myself and a retired brigadier where singled out to take the collection.

What a bunch of whingers. You're in one of 2 camps: 'I should have one even those I left 40 years ago' or 'I would chuck it away if they gave it to me'. It's a recognition of service, above and beyond any operational service and it shows that 'you've put the time in' and sacrificed weekends, kids birthdays etc. Just accept that it's now given to all and wear it with pride. You all sound like you're in a doctor's waitiroom trying to 'out symptom' each other.

Quite happy with my single GSM. Six month's service at Khormaksar in 66 - only "wound" a bad case of sunburn after falling asleep on the beach at Tarshine (I believe that was called "self inflicted injury"). Still its nice to have one. When the family medals eventually get framed it will be a bit outshone by my son's group of seven, though!

'What exactly is your beef? Is it against Officers or against people who don't deploy? Or is it a general whinge about the lack of medal for Ops such as Shader?'

Bob,

My point being, and it wasn't put well I admit, it seems ok to give out a medal to people who may or may not have been anywhere, but behaved themselves or didn't get caught...but then claim there is no money for recognition of those that have spent 6 months or longer on OPS doing the job they are supposedly trained for.

Anti-officer? No - vested interest not to be. Been one long enough to know good and bad ones.

G

I think we have been around the bazaars on the subject of the pathetic response of MOD / UK Gov and the LSGC Medal insult to retired service personnel. :yuk: However, it is worth saying here that the generation of a new gong tends to depend strongly on the support of ARMY high rankers. They tend to view RAF involvement in any conflict as superficial and, OPs where the RAF have the primary involvement rarely get support. Additionally, where gongs are declared, the qualifying criteria are based upon the ARMY deployment or rotation dates. The RAF has a history of being short-changed on this basis. :oh:

5port

OAP,

You are absolutely right. However, on the plus side, I've stayed in some nice hotels. ;)

Don't dig in, check in.

Riskman

gijoe.

In the same way that I don't begrudge someone else getting a good deal I don't think it should be one medal or the other. I think an LS medal for officers is long overdue. I also think it is a travesty that there is no Shader medal yet (I am entitled to an LS but no Shader medal).

My other point is my advice is to not be so quick to judge those with no Op medals. I almost hate wearing No 1s nowadays because of the shame of no decent ribbons. It's not my fault that I've never deployed on an Op (believe me I tried) but pouring scorn on all of us does you a disservice.

I admire (and secretly envy) anyone who has done the job for real but everyone's service is valuable. And remember no matter how much of a war hero you are there is always someone with a bigger d1ck!

BV

Bob,

The SHADER situation is plainly poor - and even poorer leadership by seniors to then say there is no cash, but we are giving out the LS to officers...many, many of which will have avoided volunteering or dreamt up some reason of the dicky ticker variety to not go on ops. There are loads of all 3 colours and I am sure serving members will know some.

But, Bob, well done for volunteering and trying to go, and I genuinely mean that.

G

One always had shiny shoes when one was a Regiment officer. One's batman would have got it in the neck if they weren't!

;)

Give it at 30 years and it picks up considerable weight.

Cepaq,

That's what the clasps are for (every further 10 years). The Duke of Edinburgh has six!

I think the scandal of a lack of SHADER medal is starting to become a genuine issue for a lot of people.

It highlights the worst attributes of elements of HM Forces - pigheadedness, reluctance to change and reluctance to think innovatively about how to recognise effort. The problem lies squarely in the military arena to fix.

Reading this thread, I can't get the picture of Mutley out of my head......

Did it not used to be 18 years for the medal then 36 for the clasp?