Greetings all,

it's been said here many times before but I'd like to share my personal experience with you. I'm merely a newly graduated RAAF pilot (graduated on No. 200 pilots' course on 10 December 2004). From my experience the process of becoming a RAAF pilot is a long journey filled with highs and lows of which depending on your ability will either be balanced somewhere around 'equally' or favouring the highs. If it's favouring the lows then maybe your should pick another career because you are probably working too hard (too close to maximum capacity) to get a worthwhile enjoyment out of it. Yes, pilots' course CAN and will be enjoyable! It's what you decide to make of it. If you live in fear of failure then you probably will fail. If you decide to focus your energy on fixing what instructors are telling you to fix instead of 'please don't fail' then you will be more than half way there. There will be times when you say to yourself 'why the f*ck am I doing this to myself?!', and unless you are have an extraordinary (emphasis on EXTRA, as opposed to just ordinary) you are going to be doing it tougher than most of your peers. Military pilots' course will make you sweat, and maybe even shed a few tears. You will never feel like you 'have it in the bag'. Every ride is as important as the next, but you can only focus on one ride at a time. If you get too far ahead of yourself you will trip up. At the end of it though, you will be rewarded with what is considered by many to be the best career in the world. Not a bad rap for 2 years of gritting your teeth. And remember, if it was easy your grandmother would be doing it.

Bzulu,
arm out the window,

thanks for helping clarify all that.

i am just seriously considering changing all the services to first preference. provided, of course, i'm recommended.
(a big decider was seeing a RAAF arm patch half covered by blond locks of the right seat occupier of a Sea Hawk :eek: )

Bzulu, last thing i want is to wait 12 months in vain for an offer from navy whilst i could have been finishing NEOC were i to include Army and RAAF as first pref. (not that likely, but who knows??!)

i know i'll have plenty of time before i can change - what fueled my question though was whether i needed to study up much on RAAF & Army to actually stand a chance being recommended for them,
or whether i'll just be assessed on my officer and pilot potential regardless of lack of knowledge for the other two (didn't seem all that likely).
but i think it's kinda been answered already.


pinny,
i wonder if this holiday's break's been awaited or can't be ending sooner enough?! :)

Olena

If you have a preference then stick to it. However if you really just want in than by all means put down all services as first preference. This also means that you will have some knowledge of all three services, operations, etc.

I am not to certain what you mean by waiting in vain for 12 months when you could have been finishing NEOC if you were to include RAAF and ARA as equal first pref. Making other services equal first pref will not put you into the Navy

Bzulu

Understand that people want information but when you are posting statements that are listed as facts than they should be correct, otherwise far better to say " it is my understanding" etc.
It may be better to be left in the dark about how the system works as opposed to having incorrect info on the system.

Your false assumption two and " at no time while you are in the navy pool, will you even be considered for the other services" I believe is not correct.

It is my understanding that you can still be considered for other services apart from your first preference. The way I believe this works is if you are passed over for your first pref (read others more competetive) but are still rated better than others in your 2nd/3rd pref/or there are no others in those pools you may be offered a considerd for those services.

back to the waiting game
 

A brief report on FSP205-02:
5 out of 7 of us got recommended,
yours truly received a 3 for RAN :D and is still grinning insanely for most of her waking time!!

It was an awesome experience, a huge confirmation to me of being on the right path and i couldn't be any happier. I believe to be very lucky with the amount of advice that i've received, for which i can not thank everyone enough; and especially our FSP group - couldn't find a greater bunch if i tried! it's a great shame that the other 2 missed out, they really deserved it...

so to recap-
THANK YOU!!!

back to the waiting game for me i guess.
oh, and i can now officially be the bearer of advice if required, happy to pass the favour along..

LIFE IS GREAT!!!! :D :D :D

Olena

Congrats and well done

We now look forward to you arriving at BFTS...wah ha ha ha haaa!!:E :E

wow, what a great thread, full of so much info for pilot applicants.

I have my pilot appitude testing booked for the 14th March and i am working towards that date with Maths and instrument reading in mind. The one thing i am worried about is the time/distance/fuel calculation questions, which if the chinese whispers are correct about, have to be answered with exact figures. Can anyone confirm/deny that?

Another aspect i am worried about is the hand/eye co-ord test, no one seems to know that much about it, I have heard stories about the old simulator that was used a few yrs ago, but nothing about what the current test is.

I am really looking foward to the process but the time is killing me, I finsihed uni last yr and i work all weekend at large pub in Sydney supervising the busiet bar, but that leaves me with not much to do/think about during the week.

As an "other ethnic" myself, I reckon that the best thing to do is learn to take the p!ss out of yourself before anyone else has the chance. That way it not only takes away ammunition from people but also means that you get used to laughing at such comments when they are meant as slurs - nothing annoys the bigot more than when you laugh at their "finest riposte"!

Edited to add that I've never experienced any serious attempt at racial abuse during my 11 years in.

oz mate,

Crack on and get your qualifications and get in the service.

It's actually fairly cool in, even reading the down-beat posts that the RAF is being sent to s:mad: t by the govt etc. Its still a great life.

As previously alluded to, the only major hassle that I've seen mates from minorities (ethnic, gender etc) have to deal with is the endless stream of PR rollouts that they have to deal with.

If you can put up with being nudged in front of the cameras, you'll be fine!

Remember, virtually everybody in rates folk on ability. They'd be 'kin stupid not to.

Good luck
Turbine

"If you can put up with being nudged in front of the cameras, you'll be fine!"

True. As one black chum once said in an exasperated voice on hearing that a film crew was due: "Oh bloody great! I suppose they'll want the f***ing token n****r again, will they Boss?" And it was similar tokenism which really used to hack off the girls when the press kept clamouring for 'girlie pilot' stories....

You've got no worries, mate.

reacher, check this link out

http://www.cadetnet.gov.au/aafc-apps...&f=39&t=000237

quite recent & relevant


finestkind, thank you this time personally :)

Captain Sand Dune- not for another year dammit!!!! can't imagine what'll be like flying the parrots 2-3 times a week as opposed to twice a day. (or nil now :{ )

where is my letter of offer?!! must be the post's fault!

Hey all. I am due to go through the aptitude tests for another time in June. I came out of the testing last year mentally exhausted and pretty nervous especially in regards to the distance/speed/fuel calculations knowing I wasn't happy with my efforts.

I wrote to Canberra and asked for a copy of my results. It seems I passed on the distance problems and missed out on the first test of the day, an instrument speed and accuracy tests. It was the only non computer based test of the day and we did the EXACT same test again on the computer at the end. According to my results I performed very will on this one. I was offered NAV or ATC but politely declined the offer.

The advice I can give from my experience is practise Maths/Physics problems without the use of a calculator. Get good at estimation and percentages. I am not sure if this book has been recommended previously but I have ordered a copy of "Wings - Becoming an Air Force Pilot". It is quite expensive but have been told it is very useful. I guess I will put that to the test shortly.

Good luck to all the cadets out there I hope I'm not far behind you.

RAAF Assessment Day
 

Evening/Morning!

I have applied for the position of RAAF(pilot) and so far have been through the JOES day and specialist testing.

On notification that i was through the assessment day i was bombarded with doomsday and end of the world type letters (most important stage in recruiting.....you must leave a good impression....ect,ect)

This is a shout out to others who are up to this stage or have been through it already. I would appreciate any hints, tips or techniques to help me prepare for 'the end of the world'.

Also stories from any brave souls who have faced the stony gaze of a DF recruiter would be largly appreciated.


Cheers,

Peachface

Good work, if i read your post right you are waiting for your assesement day?
(can i ask what band u got for spec testing?)

If so they would have already given/told you about the timings and content of the day which is a medical, and 2 interview(i think), one with a pysch and the other with a DF recuriiter. One thing to remember is that the DF member can overrule the head doctor.

To impress the DFR u have to have a indepth knowledge of what position u want and the responibilites including secondary duties, posting locations, training bases and lengths(You should know each step of the way in depth by now, etc.

There's not much to say about the pysch, you have to be yourself and answer the questions truthfully, they will pick out liers straight away.

Have a good knowledge of military lifestyle and try to talk to some ppl already "In", of varying occupations

It also helps to have a basic understanding of the other forces and what they are comprised of to show that if u are offered Army or Navy that u already have some basic knowledge.

I'll PM u with some other hint and tips for flight screening and what not.

Good luck mate.

Just a little tip if I may,

Apart from knowing your stuff about bases and training, lifestyle, and aircraft, there is one more thing that could help. I've been through more than my share of shrinks as I worked through various hold-ups in my recruiting process, and I realised one thing about them. These guys look at nervous, freckle-faced wannabe's all day, and probe them for better or worse. I've talked to a lot of people who have said the psych absolutely grilled them, but my experience with the various psychs has not shown me this side to them. You see, if you are the one person that day to make them smile (you dont HAVE to be a comedian to achieve this, just be polite and smile yourself), they might just think twice before glaring down on you, instead preferring to assume the better of you. They are, after all, human. And the exchange could be far more pleasant, with ice broken and all.

Then again, when it got to the OSB, it got a lot harder to relax...

Bump ...

Good work but maybe suggest as well that a short description of the general content of each thread be included.

Also ... "joining the RAF"? There's a huge thread about RAAF applications that I've found very useful.

Here 'tis:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...threadid=39266

Seeing as I'd typed this out for the other thread, I thought it would be useful to post here as well ...

... in Australian Army Aviation we are promoted from Officer Cadet to 2nd Lt on getting our Wings. :ok:

... [snip] ...

Perhaps it would help to describe the process we go through over here ...

1. Job Options and Evaluation Session (JOES) Day - basic psychometric testing, basic medical, watch a video, bring all your paperwork along and have an interview with a recruiter to talk about your preferred job.

2. Spec Testing (aptitude testing) - all the flight crew related aptitude tests. Find out at the end of the day what jobs you qualify for (pilot, loadie, ATC, Defence Controller, etc), and wait for a date for Assessment Day.

3. Assessment Day - full flight medical, in depth psych interview, in depth Defence interview. This is where it starts to get really interesting, because the responses you give at this stage all go towards a score that determines whether or not you proceed. You have to know everything about the job, the Corps you're going into, promotion structure, equipment to be used, expectations of the military, all sorts of stuff that is relevant to a potential new career. This is all in the letter you get.

At this stage your dossier is sent to the The Australian Defence Force Pilot Selection Agency (ADF PSA), which processes pilot applications for all services, where it is reviewed by the Officer Selection Board and given a score. That score puts you in the queue to be invited to Flight Screening. Every two weeks the top 7 are invited from that list, so you can see that if you're not in the top 7 in week one, you could float up and down in that queue as more applicants enter the process. Some people wait months, some never get invited.

4. The Flight Screening Program is an intensive two weeks of testing to see if you've got what it takes to learn new material quickly and be an officer. There are group activities, individual activities, ground school classes and simulator sessions. An applicant could be scrubbed at any point in that two weeks.

The Officer Selection Board is at the end of the two weeks, and each applicant is given a score from that. Each applicant nominates their preferred Service, and their name then goes into a queue for that Service, again in rank order. When the Service needs pilots, they contact the PSA and say "we need 'n' pilots to start next month". So the top 'n' pilots on that Service's list get called and offered the job.

You have the option of turning down that offer. For instance if your first preference is RAAF but you also said you'd consider Navy, you might be high enough to be offered the Navy job but just below the standard of other RAAF applicants. If you turn down the Navy job, hanging out for the RAAF job, you might never get a job at all.

Anyway, that's just a bit of a brain dump of the process I'm in the middle of. Anyone directly involved in the process should feel welcome to set me straight with any details I'm wrong on.

olena, I know the blonde locks you are talking about, lovely girl!

To whoever is interested in fast jet world:

You wont get a hard and fast answer on the ability to change FEGs, aircraft or service as a pilot because it is highly variable. In the fighter world specifically the acceptance of pilots from other roles and services comes and goes, and depends on many factors such as demand for new Hornet bograts vs willingness of other FEGs to let pilots go, lateral recruits available, the mood of OC 78 wing at the time, and many other factors.

Planning to get foot in door and then come across is a real hit and miss affair, and I wouldn't plan on it as a career move. Retreads dont have a fantastic pass rate when they are suddenly thrown into a fast jet after a few years on autopilot, logging hours whilst in the kip.

I quote senior RAAF flying instructor "Your best ever chance of going to fast jets is straight off pilots course".

All flying is good work if you can get it, and my advice to those who had their heart set on getting in as a pilot is if flying is what you want to do then dont restrict yourself to the ADF if all you want to do is fly. I have several mates who failed pilots course and are now Cathay or Qantas pilots, the funny thing is, they are doing what most of us military pilots want to do as soon as we can anyway!!! They just got there five years earlier than the rest of us. (I might get a bit of heat from the career men for that last paragraph)

Well after a long wait I've just received the call to head over to Tamworth for FSP in mid May. Very excited and anxious. I'd love to hear from some of those most recently having been through FSP. Any advice you can give is welcome and appreciated.

Cheers,
Coran

... am waiting for that call ... hopefully it will be around the end of May, that's what I nominated for anyway.

Assessment Day jitters all forgotten, now it gets really interesting!

Does anyone have any thoughts on getting an hour or two logged before going to FSP? Good idea, bad idea? Some I've spoken to say they want to see your ability to learn from dot, but I kind of feel it would be good to at least have a feel for how a light FW aircraft feels in a final approach.

From all the people I've spoken to, including guys who have been through FSP and from guys who work at FSP, getting some flying experience is almost essential, but not entirely. No one will come out and say "You NEED flying experience", because the official stance is you don't. Like in the ad on TV, the guy says he became a Hornet pilot with no more flying experience than counting the times he'd flown in Jumbo's as a kid. Which I'm sure there are lots of pilots who have done it that way, because they show a genuine aptitude and talent for flying and learning to fly.

Getting experience, even if it's only a few hours because you had to scrimp and scrap and work ****ty jobs and long hours to afford it, shows you're motivated to fly. I've spoken to guys who went with no flying experience and were asked "Why do you want to be a pilot?", they respond with something like "It's what I've always wanted to do". The board can only then ask "Well, how do you know? Where's your proof? You've never flown an aircraft, how do you know you want to be a pilot? Go away, get some hours, show us you want to be a pilot, and come back."

So the long and the short.. getting some hours shows you're motivated. And it'll really tell you if you really do want to be a pilot or not. You never know, you mightn’t enjoy it.

Fair call - I've got a few hours on real rotary, and about a hundred in a full size simulator ('cause I design and build them), it's just the FW that I'm not so confident with. I'm not interested in flying fixed wing, so I haven't gone out of my way to get any time in them so far.

See, for me, it just seems right to stop, then land, not the other way around. :O :ok:

Hornet Boy and other RAAF Aspirants

Most interested in you young ones progressing into the RAAF. I joined the RAAF as a trainee pilot as you want to be and then phased out into retirement after a long career which gave me the opportunity for a far wider flying experience than most. Too early for any opportunity for space but this was well compensated for by being actively engaged in the development and testing of high performance aircraft and RAAF aircraft acquisitions.

Part of a fascinating and satisfying career was as a flying instructor and then Central Flying School for the training of flying instructors and the maintenance of flying standards.

Having been on the receiving end of would be RAAF and RAN pilots and having been most dis-satisfied with some of those selected for training by the recruiters I am convinced that the selection process could have done considerably better at the source to reduce the wastage during training and the aggro for those who are found to be inadequate.

Other things being acceptable a would be RAAF pilot must have an acceptable level of manipulative co-ordination. I didn't realise I had my fair share of that attribute until my late teens when I took to doing some motor cycle racing. Fortunately for me I was an engineering under-graduate at the time of enlistment and I was 'snapped up'.

My recruiters had their sights on academics, attitudes and suitable physicals with little or zero attention to co-ordination. Consequently we ended up with a fellow on course who couldn't swing his arms in concert with his legs when walking. He didn't last long when flying training commenced.

More often than not, those having an inherent high level of manipulative co-ordination gravitate to involvement with machinery requiring manipulative skills. An aircraft would appear to have the ultimate requirement.

So, Hornet Boy and others, how do you rate your own relative co-ordination and how did the current recruiters determine your specifics in this area.? Do they know how to do it yet? Be critical of their system - they may be listening and improve their methods..

Meanwhile stay well clear of drugs, body piercing, tatts, smoking and the dole if you want to be the one to be considered most favourably. Nurture your communicative skills and become computer literate.

Milt: thats one thing i was always thinking about, i know to control an aircraft is a highly co-ordinated act, and it's something that is hard to accuratly test. The physcomotor tests DFR do test this ability a bit, but not to much i think.

Suppose I should be alright, seeing that i was competitive motor cycle trials rider and can Flair-tend behind a bar. Mow i just ahve to pass Pilot Spec testing next yr. :( :hmm:

G'day Milt,

What was involved in the testing when you went through? It's not my place to make a conclusive judgement, because no matter what it's got to be a difficult job assessing every applicable aspect of every candidate to ensure they have what it takes for every phase of training and further service. For example, someone mentioned to me that while FSP can determine how well you learn basic aircraft manoeuvres, many people get to instrument flying and just can't handle it. But really, what more can you do about that, short of spending another few thousand $$'s and a lot more time getting EVERY candidate into real IF at maximum workload?

...At this point the best they can do is assess your motivation toward overcoming any obstacle put in your path. I'll second what Coran said about flying hours showing motivation. It really is something the OSB is looking for. The guys with minimal to no hours, especially the older ones, said they had a good grilling about it at the Board. But if you have a good reason for it (eg. sick and dying mother to take care of, 3rd world poverty, etc), you may be alright.

Regarding coordination specifically, there was only one coordination test I did at the Recruiting Centre. This is the one we're not allowed to talk about, but I think I can say it wasn't particularly comprehensive. (Although sufficiently confusing!) I've heard they may have introduced more coordination tests now. Anyone care to comment?

Milt, was the Flight Screening Program up and running when you went through? By that stage they're taking a pretty close look at us. I mean if you get through 10 flights and 2 sim rides without the ex-fighter/airline/etc BAe instructors not noticing your lack in coordination....then good job! Also what I appreciated was something called the "round table", where the instructors and Board members would meet to discuss the flying of the candidate. Who knows what sorts of jokes fly around the round table, but it's good to know that there's communication all round, as there can always be a degree of subjectiveness in the scoring of individual instructors.

Unfortunately I don't think I can give my actual results without having to explain how we were scored, and then the ADFPSA may be a tad displeased with me having disclosed that information. But I can say that the instructors were reasonably pleased with my "hands and feet", and bar some hard landings in the past :}, coordination has never been an issue with me.

While I'm not the biggest fan of the initial stages of recruiting, I must say that by the time you reach the FSP/OSB, the ADFPSA are putting a lot of effort into assessing you for the job. They keep mentioning a little something called "reasonable risk to the taxpayer" throughout. So they really seem to have their mind on the goal. And I have heard that the pass/fail rate on Pilots course is improving.

But if I may say one more thing about the process. I think it's quite a pity that a shortlist must be made for FSP/OSB beginning day one of assessment. It's pass/fail for every single test. At FSP/OSB, they make it clear that they are assessing the entire package of the candidate. Meaning if you're not the best flyer (but still not too hopeless), you may make up for it in other areas. And if you're a top gun, you'd have to be - I quote - "bl**dy brainless" not to be recommended by the Board. If you've read my posts from the start, you'll see that I've had to overcome some obstacles in my recruitment process, meaning I've tripped up on the many steps, and been prematurely told I was unsuitable. Fortunately for me there were always 2nd chances and I had the grace of time to re-try as I went through university.

Others haven't had 2nd chances. While the ADFPSA may have assessed their entire package to be a reasonable balance, the initial stages of recruiting haven't looked at them in that way, and scrapped them all too soon. I know it's hard, and expensive, to look at each new candidate as closely as they do in FSP, but I think that if they had that reasonable outlook, we would find more of the right people in FSP, hence saving money at that stage. Not saying the wrong people get to FSP, but I AM saying that a lot of people with great potential, and perhaps greater motivation, get passed up too soon, while sometimes someone who's simply got the ticks in the boxes finds himself in a CT-4.

Fellas.
If you get through the assesment day, and are reconmmended, is it automatic to get to Flight Screening? How long does it take to find out if and when it will happen?
Don

Don, it is not automatic that you'll go to flight screening. If you are successful through assessment day and get recommended then your dossier gets sent to PSA with everyone else who's recommended around the country. PSA give your dossier a score and put it on a pile. When it comes time to select the 7 or so lucky ones for the next FSP they go through the pile and select those that they consider to be most competitive.

My dossier has been down at Tamworth for about 8 months before I got the call to attend. Your dossier will stay for a maximum of 12 months, if you don't receive a call you're deemed uncompetitive and will have to reapply and go through assessment day again. There are some people who have waited out the 12 months before getting a call, there are others that don't have to wait very long.

Coran

Thanks for that Coran

Great post HB!

The last few paragraphs totally explains how i feel after just failing spec testing. The drive and detmermination that i feel inside of me can easily make up the very small shortfall that was found in insturment reading (of all things to fail on :\ )

While understanding the need to cut the wannabes from the real stuff early on in the application process, having the spec testing as the 2nd step doesn't really assess the drive and motivation of the applicant. Maybe it would be more applicable to pay attention to such indicators earlier on rather than concentrate on pass/fail critera to wean the wannabes out. Perhaps hve the assessment day before the spec testing?

Random thoughts flying about in my head in the spare months that i have. None of this matters so it's hurry up and wait (to kill the testing next time)

Hornetboy and reacher

I feel I have opened up a can of worms when it comes to pondering how to determine levels of human dexterity and co-ordination of brain function with muscular control as related to pilot aspirants.

Having had experience with a deficient RAAF assessment system 40 odd years ago I had hoped that reasonably effective methods would have long since been developed if not by the RAAF then by other air forces, all of which will be continuing to seek the optimum quality of their aircrews.

My own recruitment in 1948 was very superficial with emphasis on medical, academics and some elementary aptitude testing leaving pilot potential to be investigated during the first 10 hours of elementary flight training. That 10 hours produced a very rough assessment of those who may make an acceptable pilot with the remainder diverted to be trained as other aircrew. Subsequent wastage became increasingly significant and costly.

Incidently it took me several early flying hours to become somewat familiar with the control of an aircraft rudder as they all operate in the reverse human instictive sense. Blame this on the Wright Bros who didn't want to cross over their rudder control cables.

Recruiters of aircrew are apparently not yet equipped with a satisfactory means for assessment of the relative intrinsic manipulative skill of us humans with any high level of confidence; and this is after I have spent half a lifetime in trying to ensure that many of the aircraft you may handle can be flown safely by the least capable in the system.

Experience indicates that the more intense the resolve of a would be pilot becomes then it is a fair bet that that person is being driven by an innate recognition of his/her own capabilities in expertly and precisely co-ordinating multiple muscular activities.

Must go and discuss with the RAAF Recruiters.

Reacher,

Cheers mate. What I was thinking was perhaps letting everyone complete the initial testing/interviews before getting someone(s) to consider the balance and make the judgement of whether they are suited to continue. Or even sending everyone's results to the *possibly enlarged* ADFPSA for that judgement.

Even medically, if someone's eyesight is slightly below criteria, if it can be corrected to 6/6 and that person shows great potential, why not give him a go? (I know, I'm a dreamer, but within reasonable grounds of course.) It seems to be just that Manpower has had to play a bit of elimination in a numbers game to get us down to size for the more expensive testing.

ANYWAY, back on topic...

Milt,

What you're saying is that it's possible that the more motivated a person is towards flying, the more capable/coordinated he/she is likely to be for the role? Kind of like our natural attraction to certain members of the opposite sex is possibly due to subconscious recognition of their reproductive abilities? (too many big words)

What changes would you propose to RAAF Recruiting?

Hornetboy and reacher

Just had a review of this thread from my perspective of one who did it all in the RAAF including some selection boards.

Some time ago there were some references on this thread to a rapidly diminishing level of literacy and how this may be viewed by the recruiters.
Believe me it will have some significance. If the present rate of decline is accepted by the recruiters communication on the flight decks will eventually have to be by a series of grunts. Whenever I see "i" used for "I" I know that person is too lazy to use the shift key and I wouldn't want that person on my flight crew or even in my Squadron. And when I see Australia typed with a small a I think I don't want to know you. It does matter. These are little windows into your literacy and your potential. Some of you expressing yourselves in this slovenly manner are not fit for acceptance by Australia's military elite even though generally you are innocent victims of school teachers who seem to have mostly gone feral.

All aspirants consider - you are trying to be the cream of the crop - not the dumbest.

Hornetboy - your decode of my attempt to define aptitude is spot on. One can sense it in children and wise parents are able to influence them into occupations which appear to be most suitable.

Too early yet for me to propose any changes to the RAAF recruiting assessment system. I don't know enough of the methods being used but intend to soon correct that situation.

For aptitude testing, ADF Recruiting uses a version of the WOMBAT system from Aero Innovations - http://www.aero.ca/e_main.html - which provides a very accurate measure of the applicant's aptitude in certain tasks.

Milt, you mention "pondering how to determine levels of human dexterity and co-ordination of brain function with muscular control as related to pilot aspirants" - ponder no more, this test does it all. That and the other batteries of tests given pilot applicants on the "Spec Testing" day give recruiters a very solid picture of the overall suitability of the applicant to perform the job.

Years of using these tests have given them the confidence to apply certain cutoff points with the scores.

These days, I believe much less emphasis is placed on academic achievement, however the testing will quickly determine if the applicant lacks basic mathematics skills essential in the cockpit.

This testing does not necessarily mean the applicant wouldn't be suited to a civilian flying career. The Defence Force is looking for a higher level of capacity for training, for learning and applying new material quickly, etc. I am told by those who have been through the system how easy it is to be scrubbed by failing one flight test. Tough, yes, but they aren't interested in babysitting people who might get it right with lots of practise - they're interested in the ones who will get it right quickly.

And they have the luxury to be choosy. There are still thousands of initial applicants who dream of being pilots. No shortage there. The hard part is holding on to the good ones. This is why if you are in the Defence Force as an aviator for longer than 10 years, you get almost an extra $30,000 per year just because you CAN fly. This is how a Major can be earning over $100,000 pa before he gets out of bed. If a helicopter pilot leaves the Defence Force he'd be lucky to be on 80% of that if he found a job at all.

See the bottom of page 8 of this thread for a bit more of a description of the overall process.

wishtobflying

Thanks a bunch for the reference to page 8. I had missed it in my review of the thread.

Now I have renewed confidence in the recruiters' assessment methods which in my day as a trainee and later as a flying instructor were almost non existent.

Having had a very active flying career covering 90 + types from Tiger Moths to F-111s, a fair share of being shot at and being able to shoot back, more than a fair share of flight testing on all types and now retired, I am unable to turn off my continuing concern for the upholding of aircrew and aircraft quality in Australia's military.

PSA, Tamworth, what really happens?
 

I am attending flight screening in Tamworth in a couple of weeks.

I am interested in what actually happens in the two week stay.

The people i've talked to have been fairly tight lipped and don't like to disclose what the testing guidlines are and what determines a pass. I've even had trouble decerning the nature of the assesments, why keep me for two weeks when you only perform 10 hours flying?

Any enlightenment would be greatly appreciated. Any comments on what to wear would also be welcome (formal, semi-formal, casual ect).

Cheers, Peach

Be yourself (but slightly better behaved).

It's better to overdress than it is to underdress.

Listen lots, don't brag about your supposed experience.

Be willing to learn, take time to study whatever notes they provide, show improvement daily.

If you don't understand something, just ask. If they don't tell you, give it a go.

Have fun !!

Peachface,
Flight screening does involve a lot of study. The best way to fail is to treat it like a holiday. Your comment of "why keep me for two weeks when you only perform 10 hours flying?" has me a tad concerned.

The flying you do is not teaching you to fly, it is assessing your aptitude and learning rate for military flying. To enable you to pass there is a lot of info that they expect you to know, which they provide you with on day 1. If you don't know it, you won't pass. Simple.

Trust me, the two weeks will go very quickly when you study, fly, study, fly, study, etc. Oh and eat and sleep.

Even if you are already an aerobatic wizz, they will show you plenty of things you have never seen before. Add to that the fact that you fly two aircraft in those two weeks and i am sure you will not have that much spare time on your hands.

Cheers.

I've talked to a few people concerning the testing at Tamworth and they told me to study up on the UN, Australia's relations and policies with other countries and to practise counting backwards from 100 by 3s. Does anyone have any other suggested topics to study, and how throughly must i be versed in the above areas?

Thanks mate, very well done, you've just succeeded in getting the OSB at Tamworth to change every question on their sheet! :ok:

I believe the saying is ... "All bets are off". :hmm: :* :rolleyes:

There is no secret, just be yourself. If you try to 'be' what you think the RAAF is looking for you will disappoint and be disappointed. (or not appointed to be more correct) However the ability to count backwards from 100 by 7 could come in handy.

What to wear? Take an educated guess, its hard to be overdressed, v. bad to be underdressed. Finally, its best to remain clothed at all times, even after 67 pints of lager.