Good luck, not too many hours under your belt, thats good.

ADF Pilot aptitude testing
 

I am about to sit aptitude testing for ADF pilot training. I understand the aptitude testing has changed somewhat in the last few years. If anyone who has done the testing recently could give me some info, it would be much appreciated. I am trying to find out a bit more on the sequence of testing and what level of mathematics knowledge is required.

Cheers,

Dr. Porkchop. :E

I'm sure things have changed in the last twelve years but knowing your 3.5 times tables is a useful thing :)

When I did it a few months ago I thought it was pretty simplie. 100 questions, with 40 minutes time limit. It had various number patterns, as well as symbol patterns. Quite a few word problems, eg. Printing is to book as computer is to: A;B;C;D

ADF Flight Screening Advice
 

G'Day

I'm soon to complete the ADF flight screening program in Tamworth for possible selection for the Australian Army Aviaiton Unit. Just seeking some advice on preparation for the flying program as well as the Officer Selection Board.

Any advice greatly welcomed.

G'day All Torque,

You just missed a similar thread last month.

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=218573

Bzulu posted a link to the mother of all threads that started in 2002 called "RAAF Aptitude Test Results" . I haven't read it all, but looks like there's lots of good gouge in there.

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=39266

Good luck and enjoy..

PLE..

Hi All Torque

What date does your course commence?

The aircrew testing involves spacial awareness and lots of mental maths. You need to be good to get through and you need to be very good to be competitive. There are some books out there that can help but most of it you cant study for.

When I did the testing there were 7 pilot applicants and only 2 passed the test.

Good luck:)

Hi Doc

I pulled this info from elsewhere. I did this one day course and got thru pretty well . The maths was very good - no surprises on the test . Other stuff also right on the mark. PM me if you wish, and I can elaborate further.

Cheers

Merv


Hello All,

We have been providing training to assist people applying for direct entry and also cadet pilot slots at Qantas Airways.
Specifically we have been providing training to assist people pass the psychometric testing component of selection. To date our program has been extremely successful, some of our achievements to date include

• 80 % of direct entry pilots selected by Qantas Mainline during 2005 attended our course
• 70% of Qantas cadets selected at the start of 2005 attended our course (we had only been operating for 5 months before this)
• Substantial numbers of Jetstar and Qantaslink hired in 2005 attended our course

Our performance data is strong and it is something we are proud of – however we are continuously refining our course. The successful Qantas Cadet pilots will be announced during the next week or so – at least 70% and as many as 85% of them will be clients of ours.

The basis of the program is to get clients practicing numerous sample questions. We know exactly what the test questions are, and make our course questions resemble them very closely. We also teach systematic techniques to approach these types of problems, and instruct people on exam techniques as well as many time saving techniques. We know the best systematic methods to solve these types of problems, and your speed as well as accuracy is vastly improved. That is why our clients go to the top of the Qantas hold file – the will dislodge others as their test score is so much higher.
Over the past six weeks we have released two brand new courses. The courses are:

• Aircrew Aptitude Tests ( for RAAF , RAN, ARMY)
• JOES day course

Both of these programs have been the result of an enormous amount of work. These programs are only run in Melbourne on an individual (one on one) basis –the courses are solely for ADF applicants.
We anticipate that our clients applying for the ADF will have the same level of success that our clients applying to Qantas have. We believe our two ADF courses mirror very closely the actual test you will sit on the day. You will see numerous examples of all questions, and shown shortcuts as well as the best techniques for approaching all problems.
Our Aircrew Aptitude Test Course, like the real ADF test contains four components ie:

• Gauge Reading
• Aircraft Maneuvers
• Aircraft Orientation
• Maths(raw data and applied)

We have spent many hours getting this program right, and we believe that we have achieved that. Many ADF candidates fail the gauge reading component. Our “gauge “template is around 95% in exactness to what you will see in the actual test. Once you have a couple of practice runs with us you will be scoring above 40 out of 54 when you sit the actual test (a very strong pass).
With regard to the maths component you will be practicing in our course many times over the exact style, and design of question that you will see in the actual test. It also stands to reason with Aircraft maneuvers, and Aircraft orientation that if you practice this type of question 200 times, and are shown the best methods – that on test day your score will be much higher.
All of our clients who have completed our new course have passed their aircrew aptitude tests. More significantly they all achieved at least a “band two “pass – which is a very strong pass. It is our view that if you have the motivation and are prepared to work hard that our company and our program will get you through the Aircrew Aptitude Test.
Lastly we have also developed a program to assist applicants obtain a high score in the JOES test. As you know ALL applicants to the ADF have to sit the JOES test. The score you obtain in this test will determine whether you can proceed to further specialist testing, such as Aircrew.

So if you intend applying to ADFA, or Duntroon, or wish to join the Navy as a Seaman Officer this course is an important one for you. We have developed a program that will greatly boost your score at JOE’s day; this program is full one day individual course which again is run in Melbourne.

The JOES day is a broad spectrum type of IQ test and contains ten distinctly different types of questions. The questions can be broadly separated into verbal, numerical, and diagrammatic, but there are up to four distinctly different styles of questions in these three main categories. Some of these types of questions (letter codes, Greek alphabet codes) are quiet unusual and it is highly unlikely that you will be able to find any example questions.

However in our one day JOE’s course we have a comprehensive database of around 50 example questions in each of the ten categories. All candidates who have completed our course recently have reported getting over 85 questions done (out of 100) when they sat their actual JOES test. Our course will get you a much higher score as we will make sure you thoroughly understand the logic of question type (including all variations), before we do fifty practice questions.

So that is almost enough from me for now. Please feel free to email any questions or post them below. Enquiries regarding bookings and pricing can be obtained by emailing us. You are also more than welcome to call us with any questions you have - don't be shy!
Also if you are interested in our program and would like to be kept on a mailing list, so you can be kept informed about developments please email us.
Best Regards

[email protected]
Ph: 0427 053 715
www.******************

If you guys can't find an (almost identically named) forum on this subject without creating an identical thread, what chance have you of finding a dirt Lz/Dz south of Mataranka in the night????

Wanted to quickly add top notch for JOES test also, I reckon around 40 to 50 questions I saw on course were in the real test.

Thanks guys...shall give it my best!!!

Well Done mate, I am hoping to get a shot this year. I am 26 and have been worried about age. Best of luck.

Merv thanks for your reply mate, I contacted PATS and will seriously consider.

Dr. Porkchop

Dr Porkchop,

Just out of curiosity, how much was the PATS testing?

Thanks Joker.

I will update this thread after my Board Interview at Tamworth.

and what is your cut to place the Ad on Pprune?

Firstly, DTN08 I was quoted $1900 for a two day 'course.' To LJR, I didn't put the add on the site and know nothing more about it!

Digging this thread up again as it seems to have slipped away...
Thought I'd update on my application after waiting the 3 months - had my JOES day, pilot specialization tests and assessment day last month. It was definately an interesting experience and so far recruiting seems quite positive about my chances. Was interesting being a latter aged applicant (I'm 27 now) as the defence interviewer was an Army pilot who couldn't have been 12 months older than I was. And the Psych was the same guy who interviewed me 10 years ago when I first applied! Thankfully he had no hesitation in recommending me through.
Unfortunately I have to get a few medical letters before they send my application off to Tamworth. I need an opthomologist report (I'm slightly shortsighted) and a report from my orthopedic surgeon for a bankhart repair on my right shoulder about 5 years ago. I'm hoping he stands up for the quality of his work :)
For those that have been through the system or are there currently, how many opportunities are there to visit wives/husbands while at IOT at Point Cook? Also how long does it take before you're 'brought back together'? (i.e. after Combat Survival Training?)
Marco

Hi Theedmancometh,

RAAF upper age limit is 43, but they have a stated preferrence for 27.5 years old.

See:
http://www.defencejobs.gov.au/default.asp?p=742#403

So far recruiting have said that my age may have an impact on whether the RAAF accept me, but there are no guarantees either way (obviously!) so it comes down to getting the RAAF to understand why they need me instead of some 17y.o. straight out of school. :E

They've also said that the RAN and the Army won't see my age as a deterrant to entry to those services.

And it was mentioned earlier in this thread IIRC that someone has started IOT at age 30, so it's not impossible. :ok:

Marco

Theedmancometh

Are you an australian citizen or permanant resident?

if your not it is my understanding that if you can only transfer into a similar position and not to re-train as a pilot. You would be put into competition with everyone else.

Also it would mean a 2 year minimum wait which would then make you even older, perhaps the NZAF would be a better option for you. Then once trained you may be able to transfer across.

http://www.defencejobs.gov.au/defaul...=33&IntCatID=3

Well I got the call up for Flight screening and I'm off to Tamworth in a few weeks, Very exicted:), I believe the dream has a chance.

Thanks for the info, its been lots of help.

Cheers

Joker89,

How did you end up going on FSP? Good result I hope? If not, don't give up, sometimes takes more than one bite of the apple.

Congratulations Joker89.

Can I ask how long it took Tamworth to get back to you after your file was sent over? Mine went over about 3 weeks ago and I'm still waiting to see where it sits relative to everyone else.

Please let us know how it goes over there.

Formski

I received a letter three weeks ago saying they had received my file, 18 days later I got a call inviting me to a course. Feel very fortunate as I know some people have their file up there along time before they get a call. However I was in the system for almost a year before my file went up there so I have played the waiting game too.

Learn to read a flying schedule, and show up for briefing 45 minutes before ramp out!!:mad:

Congratulations. I got my call while I was overseas on other ADF business and had to ask PSA if I could do it later in the year. They were very understanding (thank god).

ADF pilot selection: PATS, what do we think of it?
 

Hi all,

I would like to be made aware of the general opinions and experiences concerning PATS throughout pprune as this has been a very valuable source of accurate and reliable information that I've found to be invaluable.

PATS being the Pilot Aptitude Training Systems, a company which prepares ADF Aircrew applicants for assesment day, in particular the various aircrew specific tests.

Has anyone actually attended the program? Was it what you expected? Was the price justified? How accurate was the preparation to actual pilot testing you underwent. Did it give you the necessary edge to make it through to FSP.

Is it a good idea?

Thankyou

Don't know what they teach you really. I heard a current RAAF pilot saying that the best money he spent was $20 at the video game arcade before the co-ordination test.

Wanabee RAAF Pilot
 

G'day Guys,

My name is William Foot and I am in my last year of high school. Im interested in becoming a raaf pilot and I was wondering if anyone had any experiences or advice as to entrance streams/previous flight experience/ anything else relevant? I was thinking of going through ADFA but I've missed the application date (although apparently I can still apply). If I can't apply to ADFA I would still be willing to try though the DEO scheme. I do not currently have any flight experience and was wondering if this would be a hinderance for my possiblities for selection? I've read that it is not a problem but if anyone has any knowledge to the contrary I would love to hear it. Lastly if anyone knows of any good websites regarding raaf pilots it would be greatly appreciated. Cheers,

Will

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=39266

That should keep you busy for a while ... :ok:

Hello Mate

I have just finished flight screening. I lived for 26 years thinking that it was next to impossible to get a start but I tried and it is possible. Nothing can prepare you for the final stages but working on mental maths and showing you have the desire to fly helps. Leadership potential is a major factor too.

On my FSP course there was everyone from 20 yr old Aero Eng students to F111 Nav's to an old banker like me. You probably won't guess who scored highest.

Medical is a big barrier for most. At your age it will be easier to try for ADFA than DEO.

Regards

Can I guess you old fart? Being humble never really suited you ;)

I echo most of Jokers thoughts, I used to hate hearing people say there's nothing you can do to prepare for the final stages... but guess what? It's true! You can prepare for the whole experience by knowing as much as possible about everything military and military aviation specifically. But in the end, when the pressure is on, you are who you are.

Start buying every aviation and military mag available.Start spending a lot of time on the defence home page learning where everyone in the ADF is at the moment, what their role is and how they do it. Start spending to much time on pprune. Hell, even subject yourself to reading Dale Brown books. Sometimes that won’t be enough, or just enough as might be the case for someone I know.

Best advice, get down to DFR ASAP and get into the selection process for ADFA.
Unless you are an aviation god who can do inverted circuits in a glider then DEO probably isn’t for you.

Ok, that last bit was a bit of an in joke, but if you went DEO, you would most probably get hammered on maturity, motivation to fly (seeing as you have no time) and leadership potential as you just don’t have the life skills to call on that others in the course would.

On the other hand, if you went ADFA the OSB knows that you won’t be showing all those skills mentioned above. They will be looking for the POTENTAIL to develop those skills via 3-4 yrs in a military environment. Besides, what do you have to lose doing the ADFA selection this year?


Signing off, and back to waiting.

As reacher mentioned, an ability to wait is crucial to the recuiting process. I never knew the meaing of the word till I applied.:ugh:

Oh and to break the suspense, it was Mr Joker who topped the course and with style as well. Sorry, but someone had to.

Thank you all for your replys.

My plan is to go to ADFA but I think I have missed the application date. The website says all applications must be in by the end of August but I sent an email DFR and they said applications for next year are accepted up until UNSW applications close. If anyone has anyfurther info regarding this that would be very helpful. If I have missed it I thought I may as well apply for DEO and see how far I go, otherwise I will just wait until the next application round. Thanks again for all the replies, keep 'em coming

Cheers,
Will

Dude, you missed the date? Motivation is everything.

Kick ADFA dreams into touch and go direct. You will be on front line flying your Hornet, B737, P3 etc, BEFORE your ADFA mates finish their degree in underwater basket weaving. Also you will not have the PRIMADONNA stamp on your forehead for the early part of your career.



btw Good luck with whatever you do..

Wannabe pilot
 

William, check this site out: www.stealthtraining.com.au
Not sure if it is what you need but its a start.

As a new immigrant is intereseting to see ADF pilot careers being advertised, I even saw one in the cinema the other day. Does this mean that fewer people are applying, or fewer 'quality' people applying? I guess the real question at the back of my mind is will selection be 'easier' due to this big recruiting push? Common sense says NO! However I live in hope.