Another fine (DHE) mess........

[canberra]

its not dhes fault!

thats right its not dhes fault. in my opinion the state of quarters is the fault of station commanders! why do they inspect barrack blocks and not quarters, surely the time has come for raf station commanders to start commanding ? people may think im joking but when does the co ever inspect quarters? the swo told me a couple of years ago that the co has the right as landlord to inspect barrack blocks so why not quarters? so if any raf station commander or come to that army or navy co why dont you start inspecting the married patch?

[FOMere2eternity]

Canberra:

I believe technically the CO does have the right to do so, but you can imagine the wives revolt - they have human rights don't you know...

[Talking Radalt]

Listen, my point was simply this:
WHOEVER owns these quarters, by pouring shed loads of cash in to making them fit to sell (including totally re-laid gardens now apparently), they have demonstrated beyond all doubt that the ones our people are expected, nay forced, to live in are crap.

Complete, utter and indesputable crap.

[Talk Reaction]

Quote Talking Radalt "I say "forcing" because to really rub salt in the wound I've just checked the website of the estate agent who is selling said houses and they are priced barely within financial reach of most first-time-buying servicemen based anywhere in the SE.) "

I believe the average cost of a typical house ACROSS THE UK is now over £110 K so assuming that your first time buying serviceman has £3000 or so for solicitiors etc and a 10% deposit (how many of us have £13 000 tucked away?) he still needs to raise a 100K mortgage which means earning at least 28,500 pa (based on a 3.5 times salary mortgage.)

Suddenly it's not just a problem in the SE and with the continued growth of the housing market, which last time i checked was growing faster than MOD pay rises, it's going to get harder for servicemen to get into the market - and all this assumint they dont have young family to look after for example.....

Maybe it's a retention plan - on the principle that we cant afford to leave the services unless we want to live on the streets....

What a rant - you wouldnt guess I dont want to live in anymore!!

[BEagle]

I think that it's now in excess of £130K........

Wasn't the idea behind MQs that they encourage mobility? So that the reluctance to move between stations was less as a uniform standard of housing would be available wherever?

Some years ago we were asked whether the 'live in for the first 12 months' nonsense was fair. I pointed out that, at that time, it represented something like a £5K fine as it would mean being 12 months behind in the housing market.......so our boss at the time was perfectly happy for people to live out as soon as they asked.

In the 70s (when some Plt Offs were on assistance), a Flt Lt with 3 years in the rank used to get about £6K pa (inc FP) - and a 3 bed semi in RAF Lincolnshire cost around £14K. The price of a 3 bed semi near Brize is now around 10 times that; I'm pretty sure that no 3 year Flt Lt earns £60K..... And as for the youngsters in the Other Ranks who make nothing like half that, what hope will they have of buying a house? It follows that MQs are their only option. Mind you, once upon a time early marriage was discouraged by reduced 'marriage allowance' below the age of 25 - but if you were single you were not permitted to live out!

But how do civilians on pay levels less than those of our ORs cope?

[kippermate]

Annington Homes are selling SFQ near York at the moment. I have been led to believe ( only rumour ) that they were purchased for £8K each, ( England and Wales ) and that DHE have to hand them back to Annington in a suitable state or else pay a £2K fee to Annington. DHE have decided that it is cheaper simply to pay the £2k. Therefore, Annington only pay £6k per property.

In order to purchase an Annington Homes property you are invited to camp out for upto 3 weeks prior to the date that the prices are announced. Only slightly degrading I'd suggest. Whlie not actually encouraging people to camp out, they provide a hospitality house, complete with electricty, tea and coffee, and bathroom facilities.

The starting price for the properties was £ 165K. All but 2 campers left as this was outwith their budget, after having lived in a caravan for 2 weeks, with a warden confirming that a member af their family was at the site constantly ( 1 hr away per 24 hr was allowed).

But I believe that the properties have all sold. Don't think may of them went to servicemen though.

Personally I wouldn't have anything to do with them.

Rant over.

[D-IFF_ident]

I recently moved into a renovated quarter at a secret Oxfordshire airbase. I thought renovating 35 year old prefabs designed to last 10 years novel, but remained open-minded. I have found a few minor problems since march-in though. These include:
Cooker unusable as it blows circuit breaker when switched-on. (Lots of BBQs at my house!)
Water dripping through smoke alarm in upstairs hall. (Smoke alarm removed by call-out electrician - not replaced yet, 2 months later). Water still dripping.
Nice Artex on ceiling, nice new cupboards in kitchen. Unfortunately cupboards currently removing artex due to incorrect hanging.
Nice new carpets, unfortunately being eroded by un-planed doors.
Nice new magnolia paint, unfortunately holes appearing in walls pushed-in by door handles due to lack of doorstops.
External door security locks not aligned and removed in order to close doors.
Tap isolated in downstairs toilet to avoid leak - pipes not secured.

Obviously I've reported these to DHE. They remain on the emergency or urgent list. I've actually had one contractor come around on behalf of DHE. Unfortunately he could do no work as he was paid only to confirm the problem.

I could fix it all myself but I don't think it's legal to 'interfere' with the property?

[Oldandbold]

I added this comment to another post, but it is equally valid on this thread. It is not just housing that servicemen/wowman are being shafted with but all pay and conditions.

I was at Cranditz recently and met an Act Plt Off who had graduated from IOT and was awaiting courses etc.

I was appalled to hear that because of the miniscule pay, and the fact that he had a family, he was on benefit. What are the services coming to when a serviceman (of any rank) has to claim benefit (family credit etc) in order to survive? He did not have a degree and was joining a ground branch so no fast-track promotion and flying pay for him and no chance of this individual getting on the housing ladder.

BEagle says that in the 70s some Plt Offs were on assistance, well it is beginning to happen again. History beginning to repeat itself again.

[Talk Reaction]

I'm sure that more than just APOs are on income support or whatever with families. And as an aside to this subject wasn't part of the Bett shambles the renaming of MQs to FQs so that those in a stable long term relationship could occupy them?? Well where I am (singly mind) married couples have to wait for quarters that are far from satisfactory, let alone have spare for "modern families"...

It is ridiculous, we dont pay, house or in anyway look after the people that are expected to spend all the year away from their families anyhow!!!

Retention - I cant see the problem

[6nandneutral]

I thought that the whole idea of selling off a load of quarters as a job lot was to get a large amount of cash quickly to raise sufficient funds to improve the remaining quarters to a high standard. As far as I hear this has not happened, so either someone has got their sums wrong or it raises the question.......where has the cash from the sale gone?

[Vortex_Generator]

Perhaps those of us who currently live out should all apply for service accommodation at the same time, then sit back and watch the fun!

[Grimweasel]

This whole MQ issue has become a farce! Which Government was responsible for this debacle in the first place?
Its time that we stopped being shafted by the Government and started to get a little recognition for the cr*p we have to put up with. I wish to buy a house as I do not want to buy one when we get snowballed into the Euro. Watch house prices rocket then, mark my words!
Annington should give servicemen the house at a profit of say 10-25% of what they paid for them instead of the 500% and more they are making now.
See the latest scam that we have to endure? Nurses in London moving into Army Barracks due to the rising cost of living in the South. I suppose that I will be getting a posting to whever they go and expected to live out. There will be no MQ (all sold off) and no Single accomadation as its chocker with nurses!!
Its so bloody infuriating....what with the NAAFI robbing you blind down the Falklands to me having to wear trops in the desert because there is no Desert Cam. One wonders if its worth staying in??

[Talking Radalt]

"Many Victorians struggled to understand and explain poverty. Was this because of circumstances beyond the individual's control or the direct result of their indolence? To discourage dependency, workhouse conditions were worse than the lowest standard of the independent labourer."

And that was a hundred or so years ago, oh how we've progressed!

The above was found at:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/society_culture/welfare/bsurface_01.shtml

Some "interesting" reading to be found.

PS. It gets even nearer to the mark on page two!
Get this:
"At the beginning of the 19th century poverty was regarded as the natural condition of the labouring poor - those who worked with their hands. The fluctuations of harvests, the disruptions of war and the fine line between subsistence and penury were seen as inevitable and difficult to change."

[Talking Radalt]

Oh the irony of it all.......
If it wasn't so sad it'd be funny.
Latest rumours around the leafy lanes of Death Banana HQ suggest that out of over 20 houses up for sale Annington sold a staggering............one. Oh how we laughed.

But what's this?!!! Fat cat property company buys up entire site and then offers them for a huge monthly rent to hungry mice tenants.

So in summary:

There were a number of quarters occupied by servicemen and women, married and single, who appreciated renting a quarter at what was admittedly a very attractive rate, since the Services simply don't pay them enough to buy a property anywhere south of Carlisle.
DHE then evict these people (some are rehoused, some are not) so that Annington can renovate said properties and in doing so demonstrate just how bad they really were (and the remainder still are).
Annington make a nice wad by then selling them to a private property company who itself then makes a nice wad by offering them for tenancy at a rate over five times higher than that paid by previous Service occupants.
So despite claiming to take care of "our" welfare, MOD has allowed DHE and especially Annington (and in this case an estate agent) to target those least in a position to answer back in order to make a nice wad for themselves and to continue making a nice wad for themselves all the time people who CAN afford it are renting these pads, at prices beyond the reach of those previously evicted.
And before anyone says they were "surplus", I did some digging and there is now a waiting list for quarters at said site.

(I tried phoning Annington to discuss this but someone called Terry answered the phone and said Arfur wasn't at the lock-up this afternoon but might be found down the Winchester showing Dave the barman his new Jag and discussing his latest "deal" but not to tell 'er indoors )

So Tony, how was the bloody chateau in the bloody South of sodding France?

[kippermate]

My missus works for Airwaves, and has just been told one of the reasons that DHE are in the sh!t financially. Annington Homes, who own the properties, in England and Wales, have recently increased the rent, by 40%! Contractors cost have also increased, by 12%, and to cover these costs DHE have been given a 2% rise from DCDS(Pers). Now whithout knowing all the numbers involved it is difficult to see whether the problem is DHE or DCDS, but it doesn't look right to me!

The result of this is that maintainance, which one would expect of a landlord, is not being done, until the problem is classed as an emergency repair. Recently, up here in Yorkshire, we were being told that having raw sewage backing into your bath was not an emergency as you could always use the other toilet. You don't want to hear the response of Mrs Kippermate!!!

Still, its a laugh, isn't it?...................Isn't it?

[SirToppamHat]

The latest from my helpful admin friend (I am not being sarcastic, he is genuinely helpful) is that Binnsworth's latest cracker is that when moving, you will have to provide receipts for expenditure relating to the purchase of children's uniforms before you can claim the £105 per child of school age that is currently part of the Disturbance Allowance as a whole.

The argument goes that not all schools require uniforms, that some elements are not changed from school to school and that the total expenditure is usually less than the allowance. I believe it is also acceptable to produce a letter from the school stating that a uniform is required, but am not sure what level of information it will need to contain. No doubt some of the schools will charge for such a letter? I wonder why this has not been trumpeted as a step forward? I wonder how anyone hasn't come up with such a fine idea in the past? I wonder how long it will be before some to**er thinks it will be a great idea to apply the same rules to the rest of the DA?

Despite having been qualified in my Branch for more than 10 years (ie I am not in the trg system), I have moved house 5 times in the last 6 years; three of these moves required changes of school, and they all cost a bl**dy sight more than £105 in uniform and other special items each school expected parents to provide. Under current plans, I will be moving a further 3 times in the next 3 yrs. Can anyone beat this? How I look forward to the incompetence of the removals system damaging my furniture and creating more work than it saves!

I accept that there is a requirement to move around from place to place; I have taken up the offer of Boarding School Allowance (will still cost me £1000 per term though). However, I am getting increasingly pi**ed off with the continual tinkering with allowances that pass for improvements whilst they are actually attempts at reducing the amount by which we are compensated.

By the way, anyone any thoughts on the nonsense 1771 mileage rates? Understand some units now require pers to produce petrol receipt to justify this payment!



'Nuff Whinging.

[Scud-U-Like]

Interesting piece in today's Guardian:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/military/s...781534,00.html

[EESDL]

Due to unsuitability of quarters at new post have recentlt bought a house in the area. 2 kids, 2 dogs only one wife. Inconvenience of move overhauled the 'disturbance' allowance a long time ago.

During one of my visits it was quite obvious that the available quarters were not going to be suitable.....so refused the kind offer. Now if I was to March-in to that property, my expenses would have been covered. As I did not 'march-in' but still had to view the property, I've been told that my expenses should come out of the Dist Allowance!!!

Anyone know how to claim back renting expenses whilst house is being readied for occupation?

Now where's that tin of magnolia.............

If I receive another glossy welfare brochure that purports to indicate that the RAF 'cares'....I will shove it up the nearest OC Accts' ****. Anything outside of the 'norm' then you might aswell not exist. eg, Removal companies that actually do the move when you need it, cost more than the quote for MOD moves,,,same company but out of contract.

Wangers, the lot of them.

[Hydraulic Palm Tree]

I have recently moved into a quarter at a well known helicopter base, however, as usual, the state of the property on march in was terrible. The garden had been left untended for over a year and it was slashed immediately prior to occupation during a hot spell. This has meant that the grass is either dead or weeds. I have written (6 Aug) and told DHE that if the garden is not brought upto standard by the end of next week, then I will be employing a gardener to make the garden fit for its intended purpose. I will also be advising them that I will be doing the same for the other internal faults if they are not fixed within the 30 days which are promised.

Wil keep you posted on DHE's response.

HPT

[Talking Radalt]

"I will be employing a gardener to make the garden fit for its intended purpose"

Thing is Tree, you're overlooking the fact that your purpose of a garden and DHE's will differ largely.
To you a garden is an area, usually to the rear of a house, used for recreational gardening activities, exercise, socialising and grazing of pets, thus generally enhancing the character of your, admiteddly rented, property.

To DHE it's the patch of land between one ****hole and the next.

Would be very interested to see what they say about emplying yourown contractors. Dripping hot tap in bathroom has been "repaired" by locally employed DHE multi-skilled "handyman" a total of four times now.
An actual plumber with even an average degree of competance would nice.