Gaining An R.A.F Pilots Brevet In WW II
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aa62 Thank you for the info and book reference.
The Dowdens were senior members of a group of young couples in Nottingham. Money was tight post war but the group had a great community spirit and the remaining members are still in touch. ACD's children, who were a lot older than us, ran what we called the OK Kids Corral.
He died in his late 50s so I don't remember him that well. I do remember Sprog the dog and ACD's favourite sayings: up yer pipe and never mind chaps, press on. Both children died relatively young.
Will send you a pm.
The Dowdens were senior members of a group of young couples in Nottingham. Money was tight post war but the group had a great community spirit and the remaining members are still in touch. ACD's children, who were a lot older than us, ran what we called the OK Kids Corral.
He died in his late 50s so I don't remember him that well. I do remember Sprog the dog and ACD's favourite sayings: up yer pipe and never mind chaps, press on. Both children died relatively young.Will send you a pm.
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Fionn101,
I have no professional competence in these matters, but I would first agree with MPN11 that the Germans put us to shame in this respect. The speed with which they rebuilt their cities (and the care they took to replicate their medieval architecture) were truly impressive. When I first went out there in '54, they were rebuilding night (under arc lamps) and day; when we lived in Cologne in '60, the city had been completely rebuilt, although it had been utterly destroyed by our bombing, only the battered spires of the cathedral left above ground.
At home, in contrast, much commercial property was left derelict for years ("Bombsites"), for the first priority had to be repair of the war-damaged housing stock. Post-war housing was terribly short. Friends of ours in Liverpool, who had been "bombed-out" in the '41 Blitz, did not get their property repaired (at Govt. expense) until '49. All the work was done by civilian contractors, much for Local Authorities and the rest for private householders. The Army certainly didn't do any of the work - in any case they had another war on their hands in '51 (Korea). One attempt to ease the housing shortage was the aluminium "prefabs", little metal bungalows which must have been freezing cold in winter, but better than nothing for newlyweds with nothing else in prospect.
I have not tried, but Google should turn up something on the subject.
Danny.
I have no professional competence in these matters, but I would first agree with MPN11 that the Germans put us to shame in this respect. The speed with which they rebuilt their cities (and the care they took to replicate their medieval architecture) were truly impressive. When I first went out there in '54, they were rebuilding night (under arc lamps) and day; when we lived in Cologne in '60, the city had been completely rebuilt, although it had been utterly destroyed by our bombing, only the battered spires of the cathedral left above ground.
At home, in contrast, much commercial property was left derelict for years ("Bombsites"), for the first priority had to be repair of the war-damaged housing stock. Post-war housing was terribly short. Friends of ours in Liverpool, who had been "bombed-out" in the '41 Blitz, did not get their property repaired (at Govt. expense) until '49. All the work was done by civilian contractors, much for Local Authorities and the rest for private householders. The Army certainly didn't do any of the work - in any case they had another war on their hands in '51 (Korea). One attempt to ease the housing shortage was the aluminium "prefabs", little metal bungalows which must have been freezing cold in winter, but better than nothing for newlyweds with nothing else in prospect.
I have not tried, but Google should turn up something on the subject.
Danny.
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DJFish1,
The document you've copied to us is enough to keep anyone busy for a week ! I can only put in odd comments as follows (and am open to be shot down at any point):
Line 1, he enlists (in the RAFVR) on 5.6.41., after acceptance by a Selection Board at Weston-super-Mare (?) Is sent back home on "Deferred Service" (with a nice little "RAFVR" lapel badge), for 3½ months until recall on 22.9.41. to No.1 Aircrew Reception Centre (wherever that was).
Next move is to 7 ITW on 11.10.41.; does his six weeks there, then kicks his heels at "50 Ground (?) Pool" (some sort of Transit Camp ?) till 18.3.42. Even allowing for these six weeks, and a couple of weeks at Blackpool getting prepared for the voyage, there's about four months idle time. What a waste !
On 17.5.42. he lands in Canada (Moncto[w]n). Here a bell rings. When I went out to the States in August '41, I had to paint "ATTS TRAIL" on my kitbags for the voyage to Halifax (But I had to go through Moncton on my way home six months later).
Now, it's puzzling. The earliest of several dates for 33 Air Navigation School is 20.2.43. This has to be the date he finished ANS. 6.4.43. to 8.6.43. sees him back in UK at 7 Personnel Reception Centre (more delay). On 22.6.43, he is at 1 (Observers) ? Flying Unit, but he doesn't get to 29 OTU until 24.9.43., so there must have been serious instruction at 1(O)F.U. (whatever that was) to take three months.
From then on, it's fairly straightforward. "1654 Conversion Unit" ("Heavy Conversion Unit" [?] would be when he went onto the Lancs/Halifaxes). An odd thing now is his reference to "Bases" The RAF had Stations, the USAAF had Bases. Perhaps the RCAF had adopted the US term, and he'd picked it up there.
He gets to his first Squadron (44) on 3.2.44., two years and five months after he donned uniform at Reception Centre. I reached 110 on 2.1.43, one year and seven months after I polished my first button. So, although he enlisted only six months after me, he was almost a year later becoming operational. How did the RAF manage to "lose" so much valuable time, when every day counted in Bomber Command ? It beggars belief !
So it was THE End (may the crew RIP).
Danny.
The document you've copied to us is enough to keep anyone busy for a week ! I can only put in odd comments as follows (and am open to be shot down at any point):
Line 1, he enlists (in the RAFVR) on 5.6.41., after acceptance by a Selection Board at Weston-super-Mare (?) Is sent back home on "Deferred Service" (with a nice little "RAFVR" lapel badge), for 3½ months until recall on 22.9.41. to No.1 Aircrew Reception Centre (wherever that was).
Next move is to 7 ITW on 11.10.41.; does his six weeks there, then kicks his heels at "50 Ground (?) Pool" (some sort of Transit Camp ?) till 18.3.42. Even allowing for these six weeks, and a couple of weeks at Blackpool getting prepared for the voyage, there's about four months idle time. What a waste !
On 17.5.42. he lands in Canada (Moncto[w]n). Here a bell rings. When I went out to the States in August '41, I had to paint "ATTS TRAIL" on my kitbags for the voyage to Halifax (But I had to go through Moncton on my way home six months later).
Now, it's puzzling. The earliest of several dates for 33 Air Navigation School is 20.2.43. This has to be the date he finished ANS. 6.4.43. to 8.6.43. sees him back in UK at 7 Personnel Reception Centre (more delay). On 22.6.43, he is at 1 (Observers) ? Flying Unit, but he doesn't get to 29 OTU until 24.9.43., so there must have been serious instruction at 1(O)F.U. (whatever that was) to take three months.
From then on, it's fairly straightforward. "1654 Conversion Unit" ("Heavy Conversion Unit" [?] would be when he went onto the Lancs/Halifaxes). An odd thing now is his reference to "Bases" The RAF had Stations, the USAAF had Bases. Perhaps the RCAF had adopted the US term, and he'd picked it up there.
He gets to his first Squadron (44) on 3.2.44., two years and five months after he donned uniform at Reception Centre. I reached 110 on 2.1.43, one year and seven months after I polished my first button. So, although he enlisted only six months after me, he was almost a year later becoming operational. How did the RAF manage to "lose" so much valuable time, when every day counted in Bomber Command ? It beggars belief !
So it was THE End (may the crew RIP).
Danny.
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Originally Posted by Danny42C
An odd thing now is his reference to "Bases" The RAF had Stations, the USAAF had Bases. Perhaps the RCAF had adopted the US term, and he'd picked it up there.
http://www.raf-lincolnshire.info/bom.../bombercmd.htm
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Service Record
DJFish1
Just to add to Danny's post on the service record:
1 ACRC (Aircrew Reception Centre) was the one based at RAF Regent's Park (London) [see recent posts on this matter]
50 "Ground Pool" should read "Group Pool"
1 (O) AFU was the advanced flying unit where he would have been "acclimatised" to UK flying conditions (weather, terrain, blackouts, barrage balloons) after learning his trade overseas
The term "Base" was used for a cluster of airfields where Heavy Conversion Training was carried out. I am away at the moment so I do not have access to my reference books to enable me to advise you on which airfields were designated as 51 and 57 Base
Regards
Pete
Just to add to Danny's post on the service record:
1 ACRC (Aircrew Reception Centre) was the one based at RAF Regent's Park (London) [see recent posts on this matter]
50 "Ground Pool" should read "Group Pool"
1 (O) AFU was the advanced flying unit where he would have been "acclimatised" to UK flying conditions (weather, terrain, blackouts, barrage balloons) after learning his trade overseas
The term "Base" was used for a cluster of airfields where Heavy Conversion Training was carried out. I am away at the moment so I do not have access to my reference books to enable me to advise you on which airfields were designated as 51 and 57 Base
Regards
Pete
The Bomber Bases are listed here:-
Bomber Bases_P
They were indeed commanded by AOC Air Commodores. I seem to remember that the famous film made by the Station Commander of RAF Hemswell required the approval of his Base Commander. 51 base became No.75 when 7 Group took over all those bases that housed HCUs on 3.11.44.
Bomber Bases_P
They were indeed commanded by AOC Air Commodores. I seem to remember that the famous film made by the Station Commander of RAF Hemswell required the approval of his Base Commander. 51 base became No.75 when 7 Group took over all those bases that housed HCUs on 3.11.44.
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A better "Bases" link than mine, Chugalug2 
... my excuse is that breakfast was being served!!
... my excuse is that breakfast was being served!!
On the contrary MPN11, the two are complementary to one another. Yours for instance emphasises that the two figure identifier for a Base signified both the Group and the ID of the Base (hence the need to change 51 Base to 75 Base when moved to 7 Group from 5 Group). It also tells us that originally the Bases were identified by the name of their principal Station together with function, ie Swinderby Training Base before the numbering system made it 51 Base.
As we find repeatedly in this thread, the devil lies in the detail and the value of the "by the way..." snippets that Danny often treats us to.
As we find repeatedly in this thread, the devil lies in the detail and the value of the "by the way..." snippets that Danny often treats us to.
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My 'criticism' was the large gaps relating to other Groups, I suppose, but the explanatory text in indeed good. Whereas yours has a more comprehensive/detailed listing.
As you say, complementary documentation.
As you say, complementary documentation.
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You are obviously forgiven, Danny42C ... you were not in BC, and were also abroad at the time! 
Danny, I've learned far more about the Indonesian Confrontation against Malaysia in Borneo, Malaya, and Singapore, than I ever did by being there in the mid 60's, simply by trawling the internet and by belonging to the RAF Historical Society.
Which allows me a shameless plug for the Society. The subscription (presently £18 pa) gets you three bound books per year of the Society's various presentations, plus the opportunity to attend a symposium at RAFM Hendon, and the Society AGM at the RAF Club, which includes a presentation by a guest speaker.
I'm off to Hendon on the 21st October to learn all about "Aspects of RAF Maritime Air Since WWII" a bargain at £20 all in, including coffee, a buffet lunch, and a glass of wine:-
RAF - RAF Historical Societyrafhistoricalsociety
Don't tell anyone though, it's supposed to be a secret...
Which allows me a shameless plug for the Society. The subscription (presently £18 pa) gets you three bound books per year of the Society's various presentations, plus the opportunity to attend a symposium at RAFM Hendon, and the Society AGM at the RAF Club, which includes a presentation by a guest speaker.
I'm off to Hendon on the 21st October to learn all about "Aspects of RAF Maritime Air Since WWII" a bargain at £20 all in, including coffee, a buffet lunch, and a glass of wine:-
RAF - RAF Historical Societyrafhistoricalsociety
Don't tell anyone though, it's supposed to be a secret...
A stab in the dark gentlemen, my late father in law served for some time as Groundcrew on 71(NZ) squadron at RAF Mepal in Cambridgeshire. My wife is trying to expand her family tree on her dads war service. Can anyone shed any light on that particular station or squadron ?
Smudge
Smudge
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Mepal
A slight correction 75(NZ) squadron, Mepal was home to "75 (NZ) from its opening in June '43 until the end of hostilities in Europe in '45.
https://75nzsquadron.wordpress.com gives a good coverage of the operational side of "75".
There is a Friends of 75 (NZ) SQUADRON RAF ASSOCIATION UNITED KINGDOM and also a fairly active facebook page https://www.facebook.com/75nzsquadroncom and also at https://www.facebook.com/groups/2132...65096/?fref=ts
https://75nzsquadron.wordpress.com gives a good coverage of the operational side of "75".
There is a Friends of 75 (NZ) SQUADRON RAF ASSOCIATION UNITED KINGDOM and also a fairly active facebook page https://www.facebook.com/75nzsquadroncom and also at https://www.facebook.com/groups/2132...65096/?fref=ts
Some information about Mepal itself, the units based there (75 Sqn seems to have been the main one), links to a Google Earth image (not much left now!), and to the image of the Watch Office (since demolished) here:-
Stations-M
We used to use Mepal as a joining fix for Oakington (5FTS) in 1962/3, given its location near the end of the "Twin Canals".
Chug
Stations-M
We used to use Mepal as a joining fix for Oakington (5FTS) in 1962/3, given its location near the end of the "Twin Canals".
Chug
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Ref the posts 7475 and 7479 regarding Service record.
The unidentified hospital refers to No 4 RAF Hospital Rauceby near Sleaford.
There is a brief but interesting Wiki link under 'Rauceby Hospital' which mentions that it was a 'crash and burns unit'.
Guy Gibson's 'lady friend' was Corporal Maggie North, a WAAF nurse, stationed at Rauceby who was among the staff who attended Group Captain Gus Walker at Syerston when he was involved in an explosion which caused him to lose an arm.
The unidentified hospital refers to No 4 RAF Hospital Rauceby near Sleaford.
There is a brief but interesting Wiki link under 'Rauceby Hospital' which mentions that it was a 'crash and burns unit'.
Guy Gibson's 'lady friend' was Corporal Maggie North, a WAAF nurse, stationed at Rauceby who was among the staff who attended Group Captain Gus Walker at Syerston when he was involved in an explosion which caused him to lose an arm.
Pompax #7496,
Thanks so much for those links in your post, I feel sure that we might glean some more information on my wife's fathers time at Mepal, and maybe even find someone who remembers him. I'm off for an explore anyway.
Chug,
Thanks for the reference, looks like somewhere we can go and still see where her dad spent his war years.
Smudge
Thanks so much for those links in your post, I feel sure that we might glean some more information on my wife's fathers time at Mepal, and maybe even find someone who remembers him. I'm off for an explore anyway.
Chug,
Thanks for the reference, looks like somewhere we can go and still see where her dad spent his war years.
Smudge
Last edited by smujsmith; 9th Oct 2015 at 21:44.
Smudge, just in case you haven't navigated around the Royal Air Force Organisational History site, here is its entry for 75 (New Zealand) Squadron:-
Sqn Histories 71-75_P
The site itself is a treasure trove of people, places, and organisations, obtainable in full only to members but a great deal is open to all via the quick menu:-
Site Map_P
Sqn Histories 71-75_P
The site itself is a treasure trove of people, places, and organisations, obtainable in full only to members but a great deal is open to all via the quick menu:-
Site Map_P