Future Carrier (Including Costs)
Joined: Oct 2018
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From: Ferrara
it means long term contracts and commitments - which the Treasury absolutely loathe - as do some politicians - they don't want to be "hemmed-in" so there are restrictions on what THEY want to do when they get to the top of the greasy pole.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Joined: Jul 2000
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From: Peripatetic
"Considers" is a good vague political word.
https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/uk-c...norwegian-gap/
https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/uk-c...norwegian-gap/
UK considers new Clyde frigate order to plug Norwegian gap
The UK will need to place additional Type 26 frigate orders after the government confirmed that build slots currently allocated to the Royal Navy are being transferred to Norway, leaving a gap that has not yet been addressed and which will be a consideration of the forthcoming Defence Investment Plan.
The detail emerged in a parliamentary answer from Minister for Defence Readiness and Industry Luke Pollard on 22 April, in which he set out the number of Royal Navy frigates ordered across four distinct periods, confirming that 24 were ordered between 1980 and 1997, none between 1997 and 2010, 13 between 2010 and 2024 across both Type 26 and Type 31 programmes, and none since the current government took office on 5 July 2024, adding that of those slots “a number have been ceded as part of the Norwegian deal” and that “the delta is yet to be made up through additional orders, and this will be a consideration of the Defence Investment Plan.”
The transfer was first officially confirmed in February, when Pollard told parliament the UK was “working together with our Norwegian partners” and “assessing options for offering Type 26 build slots currently allocated to the Royal Navy to the Royal Norwegian Navy.”
At that point Pollard also confirmed the Royal Navy’s total would not be reduced, stating “the Royal Navy will receive all eight Type 26 ships during the late 2020s and 2030s as planned”, and describing the intended outcome as a combined fleet of “eight British and at least five Norwegian” ships operating jointly in northern Europe where “the only difference between a Royal Navy Type 26 and a Norwegian Type 26 will be the language on the signs.”
The eight-ship commitment has nonetheless come under scrutiny, with Conservative MP Dr Andrew Murrison telling the Commons that “well-placed sources are suggesting that the number of Type 26 hulls on the order book may be reduced or transferred to our Norwegian allies”, and asking Pollard to “confirm that there are no such plans and that we will proceed with a minimum of eight Type 26 frigates, particularly given the increase in Russian submarine activity” discussed earlier that week, to which Pollard replied “I can indeed.”
The commitment was further reaffirmed in a written answer from Al Carns MP in March 2026, who confirmed that “the Type 26 programme will deliver eight anti-submarine warfare frigates for the Royal Navy, which are designed primarily for operations in the North Atlantic and will form a core component of the Atlantic Bastion concept.”
The position as it stands is therefore that the Royal Navy’s eight-ship requirement is confirmed and has been stated repeatedly at ministerial level, that at least one hull already in build is expected to be reallocated to Norway to meet the Norwegian requirement for early delivery, and that the additional orders needed to replace those slots and get the UK back to eight have not yet been placed, with the Defence Investment Plan the stated vehicle for resolving that, a document that was originally expected last autumn and for which no publication date has yet been announced.
The UK will need to place additional Type 26 frigate orders after the government confirmed that build slots currently allocated to the Royal Navy are being transferred to Norway, leaving a gap that has not yet been addressed and which will be a consideration of the forthcoming Defence Investment Plan.
The detail emerged in a parliamentary answer from Minister for Defence Readiness and Industry Luke Pollard on 22 April, in which he set out the number of Royal Navy frigates ordered across four distinct periods, confirming that 24 were ordered between 1980 and 1997, none between 1997 and 2010, 13 between 2010 and 2024 across both Type 26 and Type 31 programmes, and none since the current government took office on 5 July 2024, adding that of those slots “a number have been ceded as part of the Norwegian deal” and that “the delta is yet to be made up through additional orders, and this will be a consideration of the Defence Investment Plan.”
The transfer was first officially confirmed in February, when Pollard told parliament the UK was “working together with our Norwegian partners” and “assessing options for offering Type 26 build slots currently allocated to the Royal Navy to the Royal Norwegian Navy.”
At that point Pollard also confirmed the Royal Navy’s total would not be reduced, stating “the Royal Navy will receive all eight Type 26 ships during the late 2020s and 2030s as planned”, and describing the intended outcome as a combined fleet of “eight British and at least five Norwegian” ships operating jointly in northern Europe where “the only difference between a Royal Navy Type 26 and a Norwegian Type 26 will be the language on the signs.”
The eight-ship commitment has nonetheless come under scrutiny, with Conservative MP Dr Andrew Murrison telling the Commons that “well-placed sources are suggesting that the number of Type 26 hulls on the order book may be reduced or transferred to our Norwegian allies”, and asking Pollard to “confirm that there are no such plans and that we will proceed with a minimum of eight Type 26 frigates, particularly given the increase in Russian submarine activity” discussed earlier that week, to which Pollard replied “I can indeed.”
The commitment was further reaffirmed in a written answer from Al Carns MP in March 2026, who confirmed that “the Type 26 programme will deliver eight anti-submarine warfare frigates for the Royal Navy, which are designed primarily for operations in the North Atlantic and will form a core component of the Atlantic Bastion concept.”
The position as it stands is therefore that the Royal Navy’s eight-ship requirement is confirmed and has been stated repeatedly at ministerial level, that at least one hull already in build is expected to be reallocated to Norway to meet the Norwegian requirement for early delivery, and that the additional orders needed to replace those slots and get the UK back to eight have not yet been placed, with the Defence Investment Plan the stated vehicle for resolving that, a document that was originally expected last autumn and for which no publication date has yet been announced.
Joined: Apr 2020
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From: Hampshire
I would have thought its more agreeing delivery dates for the two being pushed to the right as the last five were ordered for the RN in 2022, the Norwegian ones being an additional order.
I wonder how Simon Lister's “We’re aiming to build the fourth Type 26 in 66 months. From ship one to ship four we aim to improve the performance of the yard by 30 percent.” , and "The ambition in all of this is to build a warship every year—and to build them well." are progressing?
UKDJ reported last June that, at the same press briefing, Lister confirmed that if Norway selects the Type 26, it would “interleave” with UK builds from Ship 4 onwards. “Because the ships are so similar—or frankly, identical—this brings with it the possibility of taking the efficiency up and the cost down.”
I wonder how Simon Lister's “We’re aiming to build the fourth Type 26 in 66 months. From ship one to ship four we aim to improve the performance of the yard by 30 percent.” , and "The ambition in all of this is to build a warship every year—and to build them well." are progressing?
UKDJ reported last June that, at the same press briefing, Lister confirmed that if Norway selects the Type 26, it would “interleave” with UK builds from Ship 4 onwards. “Because the ships are so similar—or frankly, identical—this brings with it the possibility of taking the efficiency up and the cost down.”
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 807
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From: Portsmouth
I wonder how Simon Lister's “We’re aiming to build the fourth Type 26 in 66 months. From ship one to ship four we aim to improve the performance of the yard by 30 percent.” , and "The ambition in all of this is to build a warship every year—and to build them well." are progressing?
https://thedefensewatch.com/naval-ma...rd-sea-trials/
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Joined: Jul 2000
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From: Peripatetic
https://www.navylookout.com/why-has-...eeks-in-crete/
Why has HMS Dragon spent the last two weeks in Crete?
Why has HMS Dragon spent the last two weeks in Crete?
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 807
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From: Portsmouth
https://www.navylookout.com/why-has-...eeks-in-crete/
Why has HMS Dragon spent the last two weeks in Crete?
Why has HMS Dragon spent the last two weeks in Crete?
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
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From: Peripatetic
RN considering bids for contractor-owned & operated uncrewed ISR systems for Atlantic Net - first phase of Atlantic Bastion concept to increase ASW advantage in the GIUK gap.
5 consortia - led by Anduril, Babcock, Helsing, Ocean Affinity, and TKMS - remain in contention out of 26 compliant industry proposals initially assessed.
5 consortia - led by Anduril, Babcock, Helsing, Ocean Affinity, and TKMS - remain in contention out of 26 compliant industry proposals initially assessed.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Joined: Jul 2000
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From: Peripatetic
HMS Iron Duke has been quietly withdrawn from active service, leaving the Royal Navy with just five operational Type 23 frigates. Full credit to @NavyLookout who first reported this and whose in-depth analysis is well worth reading.
Another warship quietly withdrawn – Royal Navy now down to just 5 frigates
HMS Iron Duke has been stripped of her weapons and sensors and has not been to sea since October 2025, despite no formal decommissioning announcement being made. Her withdrawal from active service, less than three years after a £103M refit, raises uncomfortable questions about the Royal Navy’s ability to sustain even its much-reduced surface fleet.......
HMS Iron Duke has been stripped of her weapons and sensors and has not been to sea since October 2025, despite no formal decommissioning announcement being made. Her withdrawal from active service, less than three years after a £103M refit, raises uncomfortable questions about the Royal Navy’s ability to sustain even its much-reduced surface fleet.......
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 1,978
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From: Hampshire
Thoroughly depressing, from Iron to Lame Duck, only seems yesterday I was posting about the rumour she was going to get Westminster's S2087 fitted (that was almost exactly two years ago). .Let's spoil the Fleet for a ha'porth of tar has been the mantra of successive governments all my life (I was born after Sandys but before the first Wilson government when Healey started the acceleration of rot stemming from Sandys' heavy refocussing on Nuclear Deterrence (although a reduction in conventional forces from mid-1950s levels and the end of conscription were IMO sensible and necessary).
I am remember feeling old over twenty years ago watching a batch 2 T22 being towed out for use as a target.(probably Boxer which commissioned sometime after I joined) - the T22s had a planned service life of 18 years.life, ironically nearly 24 years after the last batch 2 decommissioned from the RN, a batch 1 and three Batch 2s are AFAIK stil serving with the Brazilian, Chilean, and Romanian Navies. They do not, however, face the conditions of the North Atlantic.
I am remember feeling old over twenty years ago watching a batch 2 T22 being towed out for use as a target.(probably Boxer which commissioned sometime after I joined) - the T22s had a planned service life of 18 years.life, ironically nearly 24 years after the last batch 2 decommissioned from the RN, a batch 1 and three Batch 2s are AFAIK stil serving with the Brazilian, Chilean, and Romanian Navies. They do not, however, face the conditions of the North Atlantic.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
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From: Peripatetic
ROFL......
Video
Video
3 members of the Royal Navy Parachute Display Team landed on HMS Queen Elizabeth this morning.
The team, also know as the Raiders typically jump with 5 members. However, one was in dry dock in Long term maintenance and another is being retired and sold to the Bangladesh Navy.....
The team, also know as the Raiders typically jump with 5 members. However, one was in dry dock in Long term maintenance and another is being retired and sold to the Bangladesh Navy.....
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
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From: Peripatetic
https://x.com/TomCotterillX/status/2...559143033?s=20
New Zealand is considering purchasing this British-built Type 31 frigate as the future work horse of its navy.
They are looking at the vessel, which will also be used by the Royal Navy as a general purpose warship, alongside the Japanese Mogami-class frigate selected by Australia.
The New Zealand government is currently in talks with both the Royal Navy and Australian navy about this, says Chris Penk, New Zealand’s defence minister.
New Zealand is considering purchasing this British-built Type 31 frigate as the future work horse of its navy.
They are looking at the vessel, which will also be used by the Royal Navy as a general purpose warship, alongside the Japanese Mogami-class frigate selected by Australia.
The New Zealand government is currently in talks with both the Royal Navy and Australian navy about this, says Chris Penk, New Zealand’s defence minister.
Frigate project progress key for maritime security
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 1,978
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From: Hampshire
RN shipbuilding woes, or How *Not* to build a frigate T31 vs ???
Various news media outlets reporting, that due to issues with the Type 31 builds, Babcock have reported a £140 million charge as it "admitted it built the first two in the wrong sequence. " - mostly affecting Venturer, somewhat affecting Active, and minimally affecting Formidable and Bulldog. Better be more careful with their Virginia Block VI work...
PA Media via STV
Defence giant Babcock has revealed it took a £140 million hit for late-stage reworks to its newest Royal Navy warships.
The London-listed company, which is a major contractor for the Ministry of Defence, told investors that its annual financial results had been impacted by the charge on its Type 31 contract.
Under the contract, Babcock is set to deliver five frigates that are being built at its manufacturing site in Rosyth in Fife.
The first and second ships took to the water for the first time during the past year after four years of construction.
But Babcock said on Wednesday it had experienced “higher than expected levels of rework as a result of changes to the design” and that the work “is being performed in the later stages of completion, and therefore is more complex and more costly”.
The London-listed company, which is a major contractor for the Ministry of Defence, told investors that its annual financial results had been impacted by the charge on its Type 31 contract.
Under the contract, Babcock is set to deliver five frigates that are being built at its manufacturing site in Rosyth in Fife.
The first and second ships took to the water for the first time during the past year after four years of construction.
But Babcock said on Wednesday it had experienced “higher than expected levels of rework as a result of changes to the design” and that the work “is being performed in the later stages of completion, and therefore is more complex and more costly”.
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 807
Likes: 425
From: Portsmouth
Various news media outlets reporting, that due to issues with the Type 31 builds, Babcock have reported a £140 million charge as it "admitted it built the first two in the wrong sequence. " - mostly affecting Venturer, somewhat affecting Active, and minimally affecting Formidable and Bulldog. Better be more careful with their Virginia Block VI work...
PA Media via STV
PA Media via STV
There is no amount of "rework" on Gods green earth that would incur that amount of cost. It'll be an excuse to cover the fact they're learning how to build ships.
Joined: May 2009
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From: Here
Prettyu much. It's really just an accounting exercise to say 'we spent more on this than we thought we would, so we are reducing our profits on those (and reducing our tax liability at the same time)'
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: The Roman Empire
Nobody seems to have mentioned that any possible future buy of Type 31s by New Zealand will no doubt be used by the UK government as an excuse to prioritise overseas sales and further delay delivery of RN hulls - conveniently saving the UK having to spend money on defence.
Or is it a case of pprune readers being astute enough to realise this without the need for it having to actually be said?
Or is it a case of pprune readers being astute enough to realise this without the need for it having to actually be said?