EK CCM's Fired
 

Heard today that 8 or 9 Cabin Crew Managers were fired yesterday, so far nobody knows the reason, must be to keep morale at the high level it is.:uhoh:

2 CCM's, 5 CCS's and one CBC manager. Unfortunate as it may seem, something needs to be done about the problems in IFS. These individuals were all part of the problem. Anyone who has worked with these people know how bad they truly were. Moreover there has been tangible backstabbing and undermining of TD from the day he stepped into the job, as he was from outside the organisation.
While it may seem a bit drastic, I think if he is going to turn around IFS into an organisation that performs, TD & KG need to get rid of any dinosaurs and inadequates to move forward.
It would not surprise me if there were a few more to come. The challenge for TD is to move forward, put in good people who know what they are doing and get IFS performing again.

Forgive me for sounding dumb and uneducated, but what do the abbreviations CCM, CCS and CBC all mean?

Ohhhhh please !!!

Oh please what???? Do you know the answer or not?

CBC = Crew Briefing Center
I have just been reliably informed I was using the old titles, it is actually:
2x MCC (Managers Cabin Crew, grade 10 positions)
5x CCM's (Cabin Crew Managers, grade 9 positions)

Interesting, read the thread here or to quote Baglama

Have they actually been totally fired from the company or from their managerial positions only? Anybody care to post the persons' initials? I'm curious!

sccm's
 

I heard TD held an urgent meeting this afternoon calling many people in the office on their days off. One of the sccm was MJ she was great at her job so don't understand why she was fired....should have been her other half!!!:mad:

My understanding of the situation is that they may not be out of a job completely, they will be allowed to apply for other internal positions they may be suitable for.

The problem bubbles is one of perspective, their will be people who say that certain CCM's were great and others who hated them. MJ's support of her husband, against all the reports of harassment etc, are legendary to say the least.

Look out EY incoming applications !

This I think is the first positive sign in EK. Accountability isn't that a new principle here.
A big broom is required here,but not for only the expatriate workforce !

flybystring

you're right, it's just that it has to start a few levels up from CCM's. I'm sure these members are part of the problem. But the real issue starts way above their heads.

Not commenting on the specifics of this thread as I don't know the people or the issues (other than there are real problems in IFS), but accountability is not the problem here. The real problem is that EK routinely expects accountability without giving their people any authority to solve the problems.

The whole place has gone crazy :confused: And for the record MJ was the best ccm they had.....she was a *.....its a sad time for all her crew.

Hmm..
 

Maybe the fact that 1400 crew have resigned since the beginning of the year has something to do with the shuffle in IFS....
I am one of the crew who has indeed resigned, having been with the company only a few years , I was surprised that not only did my CCS happily accept my resignation, with no questions asked but failed to even hand me "feedback" form required as part of the resignation process. ( the form asks you to rate your ccs and various other questions about the company and why you are resigning)
I was an experienced crew member with a good record - yet no sign at all from IFS that perhaps retaining current crew was at all an important part of succeeding as a company....I enjoyed my time at Emirates and hopefully TD will have more luck with a fresh lot of crew managers, it is sad if an airline losses mature, sensible crew with experience who actually enjoy the job because IFS department has the atitude of "we will simply recruit more"....

I am sure this would not have been allowed to happen elsewhere.

Can these ppl appeal?

But would they want to after such a kick in the teeth?

Most of them having been almost 20years in the company!

Personal issues aside guys - this stinks - it could be any of us that this happens to - today, tomorrow, next week....

I believe i speak for a vast majority when i say that i am shocked, disgusted and deeply saddened for those ppl, the rest of us here, and the company as a whole.

Don't forget, it was those ppl leading us when we were no.1

:sad:

It is a disgrace for EK. I have been flying with EK too long to accept something like this. With my CCM gone I will be gone too. If there is to be a shuffle in IFS it should begin with the likes of TW, TD stretching down to MS, JO. Someone up there has got revenge against the good CCMs to hide their own shortcomings. May those heads now begin to roll to pave way for a better system than what is happening now.

TD has interviewed over 300 pursers in the preceding few months.

Apparently his attempts to improve the department were being seriously undermined by the individuals that have been removed.

Now I am as big a critic of our pathetic managment methods as anyone. However if, as a manager, you find that your subordinates are deliberately ignoring or undermining your initiatives, then you have no alternative but to remove them. If you dont, then you cannot possible succeed as a manager. That is assuming that you have brought them in to explain the error of their ways and given them an opportunity to climb on board.

Because you have been in the job "for almost 20 yrs"doesnt mean that your doing a good job.

Whether tha right people went in the right mannner,I dont know but get real with the way this Co operates.

Dont know the individuals,but 1400 crew going is a BIG signal something is not right.
QB

Listen up cheese person,Im not sipping a G and T,nor Im I exhibiting hypocrisy,EK man management is some of the worst Ive seen,as a pilot I cannot comment on IFS,but suspect same.

The fact that your friends got fired,is irrelevant they rightly or wrongly have presided over a sorry mess and done little to arrest it,the same in flt ops.

Take a chill pill,lie down in a dark room.

By the way I have no idea who most of your "initials" are in your rant,and possibly many others have the same problem.

Get real and enjoy your Big Mac.

Off to the pub,QB

Quod Boy - by the sounds of it, you were most probably still in nappies while these ppl were busy getting this company off the ground, so have some respect please.

And if you don't know who we are refering to and you also don't care - then why waste your time typing your silly remarks.

I am shocked by what has happened.

M.J was a fantastic person to work with and will be missed by all her crew.

Yes, too true. MJ did her job fantastically and more beyond that.

The best thing they could do now, would be to beg her and the others to come back.....before its too late and all is lost.

That seems like a lot of crew. I'm not sure how accurate that figure is but I am aware there have been a lot of resignations this year. Many from senior crew who where very happy working under the leadership of the likes of M.J for years. The fact the there have been so many resignations THIS YEAR speaks for itself.

If the people who where sacked are to blame for the crew resignations why is it only now crew are resigning??? Most of the people sacked have been in EK for the best part of 20 years so if they where to blame wouldn't crew have resigned before now???

These people are not to blame for the crew unhappiness or the fact that EK are not winning awards. They where infact there when EK where No 1 and the crew where happy.

I agree with Gee Whizz - these people should be re-instated before things get any worst. The crew moral could not get any lower than what it is at the moment.

Perhaps TD is a double agent.....secretly working still for BA...sent on a mission to screw up EK.........?:confused:

This is not very funny
 

EK are looking for new cabin crew managers advertising twice in the last 3 months.
I got approuched through a head hunting aviation agent 2 months ago in London.

I had a very interesting hour phone conversation followed up by another this week.
His words, there on a quest for the best, they have a hugh amount of planes coming and no structure or crew to handle the growth spert just a year away.

Other airlines have been hearing about some bad internal infighting and problems for about a year.

Maybe I'll stay put

QB, you may not be sipping a G&T at DOSC but by the sounds of it you are speaking from hearsay.

So if you do have nothing to say about the initials because you do not recognise them, have the least amount of decency to let us carry our opinions.

If it were not for the likes of MJ who participated in making this airline what it was in its succesful years, most new pilots would have never made it to EK, the likes of you perhaps.

So stay put in your corner at the pub, but don't speak of things you know nothing or little about. F/D like you we knowand we've seen all you like are groupies and your little porsher got no time for anything sensible apart from enlightening us with your perspective based on your shifting to the LHS, that is of course after EK has finished it's policy of recruitinig DEC's sorry little QBoy.

Mascarpone, with comments like that I only hope that you are the next in line to get fired.

Personal attacks are not the way to assist your argument in support of the group of CCMs that were fired.

I admit to knowing absolutely nothing about what is going on, the only thing that we, the pilots, have heard about this is on this forum. But I have been here a damn sight longer than most and whilst I do sympathise with the way things are going, comments like yours are simply too immature to take seriously.

If you want to really support these people then do so quietly, but with strong resolve and be prepared to give up your own position if needed and go home knowing that you have sacrificed everything yourself because you truly believed that what you was doing was right. So, let me ask you one question; are you prepared to resign over this? Are you prepared to go over TDs head? Or maybe, one day, you'll look back and see that the IFS managemenbt structure badly needed a reshuffle. From where I'm sitting, my perspective is that it did.

Finally, I hope you get that Porsche driving Groupie stereotype out of your head. Surprisingly enough, not many of us FD can afford a Porsche!

Cheese Features

It appears that you hail from the IFS side of things at Emirates. May I gently remind you that although PPrune is in the public domain, it was primarily set up as a pilots web site. YOU are the guest here, not QB. For the record, QB has been around longer than you might care to think.

We would all like to get some feedback on what is happening in IFS, but I doubt anyone is interested in a flight deck/cabin crew slagging war.

Cheese Richard,

Not much support for you here and it's not hard to see why.

Looking for back-up in the pilots' forums and then attacking the respondents is not the smartest tactic I've ever heard of. With that level of awareness you might want to lay low for a while in case your head is the next to roll at EK. I think their idea is to sack morons.

I imagine most if not all of the pilots here have little idea on the identity of most or all of the sets of initials posted.

At the end of the day, whilst most of us would like to see the company do well and whilst most of us apply personal standards of unassailable professionalism out of pride and self-respect and airmanship and a sense of "rightness" about the job, etc etc etc, at the end of the day the success or otherwise of the company is largely out of our hands.

Short of a catastrophe far beyond a single hull-loss/massive loss of life, the airline will never fold and we will still be paid. If management persist in decisions which lessen the effectiveness of the operation, we just have to shake our heads and get on with it, operating as professionally as we can and keeping up with the changes in policy as they appear.

Suggest you do the same. Or else resign in sympathy and in keeping with your principles.

Are you going to resign?



As for 1400 resignations, the upside is, the rest of the Third World has no shortage of applicants for the job, many of whom even speak a little English and will do whatever they're told for as many duty hours as they have to.

It's been a while...

I tip my hat to you, that was the best thing ever said on PPRuNe!

I have had dealings with more than a few of the MCC's and CCM's including quite a few of the ones named here. I have also had several professional dealings with TD.
One thing that became very evident is that most of the MCC's and CCM's were grossly under skilled, devious, inconsistent and downright dishonest in their behavior.
TD on the other hand is singularly one of the more intelligent, responsible managers I have met in aviation. This was evident at the pilots meeting were he fended some pretty tough questions with a degree of honesty and integrity that is sadly missing in our management. I believe he really cares about his organization and if you listened to what he has to say, you might figure that out as well.
IFS was on a downward slide BEFORE TD took over, this was because the organization was chock full of small minded, small airline managers, who had been promoted way beyond their ability. Furthermore the IFS "we are wonderful" mentality led to a degree of complacency and arrogance that is endemic today. In an organization as big as we are becoming you cannot have that, you need structure and solid individuals in management positions.
As much as I hate the way management do stuff around here, I personally think this is a positive step, we really did need to get rid of this lot and hopefully the truly inept PG & MH as well.

SandIgger sorry for the Daley.

Well I am pleased that you can at least differentiate between a dessert cheese and an after dinner one.

Perhaps the day it is not such a well kept secret by the management, the crew would perform.

And change is inevitable yes is that anything new? Or should we drink your words for their wisdom, we've heard of change for the last 20 years, it came in the form of management who could not cope and manage beyond their four fingers ahead of their nose.

Get a life, no one is communicating to the crew beyond performance performance performance; go on suit yourelf to the third world and get as many as you like we will see how the chiinese and koreans who crowd your aircraft will fare in the face of the customers, open the way for a new qatar airways!

And perhaps as well if you selected your trainers on the basis of their proficency rather than who they are married to or sleep with we would start a new track.

You say I should: "Resign with my principles", you mean to say that because I have principles I should resign and stick to them and let the likes of you override them.

Seriously where do you come from? The last time I heard a comment like this was on a 2nd world war footage speaking on the third Reich.

Do people just lay down and let you just flatten them, obviously your principles are as far removed from those of the developped world as one could ever imagine and you want to bring EK to the new age......

But hey! It takes a bit of everything to make up the world.

What you fail to read is that I agree with the principle of removing the deadwood, no one considers MJ deadwood all the others, yes!

Does that make you happy?

Good post sandIgger

I suppose like any company they have to source the reason as to why the amount of cabin crew are resigning as they are. Like any company they will look downwards.

I do not know MJ but having read much input in this topic it seems that everybody liked and respected her. However in this company that is not always the reason for being in that position. It is very sad to see people with 20 years service being terminated.

Someone already stated that these people were causing problems for TD. Whether that is true I do not know. All I do know is that we only see things from one perspective. There is usually more to this if we could scratch beneath the surface a little more.

Only time will tell as to whether this was the right choice. If it was then there could be improvement. We all know that there are cliques, mafias and small empires here. If this was not the right decision, then the big bosses will not look so far down the list of people to terminate.

TD has alot at stake here, ultimately he is responsible for rectifying the problem of cabin crew resignations and IFS. This was therefore the first step to cure this. He has had orders from high up to make thigs right. If he doesnt succeed then guess who will be lent on next.

I think that this is just the start. There is alot of dead wood here which needs to be burnt. There are people in positions in this company that have been here a long time but all of us could not really say what they do. The company needs streamlining.

I wish the people who were terminated much luck for the future.

Anybody can be replaced - the world is full of people - but what a shame to lose the experience.




Have you worked with ppl like that? what a shambles. And would you like to be in an emergency situation with them?

I think not.

Yes, I think we all have.Yep.No but what choice will we have on the day?

You may have missed the subtle ironic edge I was trying to inject into that statement you quoted.

Miss CheeseStick, all I can say is:

would you like some whine with that cheese???

SandIgger sorry for the Daley;

Obviously been getting used to F/C food mate, we need to put you on a crew meal regimen you might otherwise grow out of the zebra stripes on your shoulders. Thinking perhaps just for the likes of you we should add piping to the uniform and whistle when you board to announce the arrival of the archetypal captain and his retinue?

I apologise I did not know this was the DOSC forum.

Where should we go Mr. little stick if we need to continue our whine?

Thanks for all the help.

Me little crew lost and no idea where to go maybe you can help with your wizlittledom!

Global Nomad;

panthers change place but never change spots! Thanks for the warning I willl heed it! But was it a masked threat?

No problems, cheese, apology accepted. And there's no shame in being corrected either.

I see you've deleted some of your previous posts after receiving a kicking. Having a re-think, hey? Good to see.

Whatever your personal history and problem is with pilots, this is not the place to go slagging off if you're hoping for back-up although it does provide sport for some of the fellas in a battle of "wits". I just hate to see someone going into a fight un-armed!!

Woooof, dont ya just love it !!!!!!

Dessert Cheese,

Why did you delete the other thread that you began, couldn't take the heat? It took me forever to come up with a cogent arguement and you deleted it with a key stroke. Mind you, the Tiramisu tasted good!

Cerberus:8