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Oh dear oh dear,
Mascarpone you have some serious issues Im not a trick cyclist but I suspect you would present a bagfull of problems. Your rant is wrong on so many counts try spelling(copying) correctly for a start it is Quod not Quad(Latin). It is hard being an FO these days,but like us all they will swop seats in due course, but to afford my comfortable lifestyle I am a captain and have been for some considerable time.The majority of our FOs are excellent I thank my lucky stars you are not one. Unlike you our FOs are PILOTS and this is a PILOTS Rumour site you are a guest and all guests are welcome you however need to take your Prozac and evaluate your anger..You have overstayed and really should be on less demanding site. Sesame street or perhaps some colouring in,dot to dot perhaps? Now Im off to fly big,shiny toys with RR engines and you my son/dear will never be able to comment on an intelligent level with me or any other EK pilot until you too hold a licence and do the job.When you do,most will read and listen then you will earn respect.At present you earn none. Even if not an EK pilot make articulate valid comments dont rant. It is little wonder EK cabin crew morale is in the state it is with the likes of you and I am starting to hoist on board quite what a task"TD" has on his hands now I know who "TD" is. Now,before you respond in your next rant think about the above and if its not intelligent or witty or humourous or valid??? FOXTROT OSCAR.(Thats phonetic,not Latin just in case) QB:cool: :cool: :cool: |
Quod, harsh but fair
Mascarpone, quod erat demonstrandum you have truly demonstrated what you are! Just not sure if its the weakest link or the missing link :hmm: |
Maybe, just maybe, the time has come for Pilots in this airline (EK) to STOP playing Mr. CRM Nice Guy and take a stand against those contemptuous cabin crew who don't know their place!
(Before I create a revolt, if you're pleasant and well mannered or if you didn't notice the word those was underlined, this does not apply to you) :ok: |
Ironic how the wheel turns.
About 2 months ago, I made a post in response to TD's letter to Purser's. I ended my post with the following question Who wants to support indifferent cabin crew with an attitude? Before anyone jumps in the air screaming nonsensical rubbish; 1. There is no implication in my question that the terminology "indifferent" applies to all cabin crew, far from it. 2. If you chose to paraphrase the question to read "Who wants to support indifferent flight deck with an attitude?" Don't bother, but feel free to start another thread. There will always be individual employees in any large organisation that need to be retrained or relegated. TD has been tasked with changing IFS direction and part of that change will involve dealing with (because no one else has) inept crew managers. The word on the street from many crew is that they are pleased to see the changes and fear nothing themselves because they are not indifferent and have the right attitude. I am going to continue to support cabin crew in their role, as undoubtedly many other flight deck will because that's part of our job. Mr Ree is right to a point. You just can't be Mr Nice Guy with everybody but fortunately for us, it's obvious who deserves our support and who doesn't. I don't think we should throw away CRM for a moment, but we are all guilty of only pursuing the most blatant of behaviour. There comes a time where CRM has been exhausted on an individual and they need to be passed to the next level up. Having reliable cabin crew management will be a great asset for all concerned and personally I can't wait for the dust to settle because I believe that we will all be better for it. |
Gentlemen;
I would be interested in your definition of CRM, or for that matter your definition of manners. It is obvious from these posts that none of you have an idea of who or what I am, whether I am crew or not etc... It is in my humble opinion a clear indication that you should remain in the F/D and look after what you are hired to do and that is to fly the plane. How you handle your HR and personal relations is your own problem, but how you treat the crew is incumbent upon your responsability as a captain. Whether you use your CRM skills or not is not entirely upto you but relates to the outcome of the operation that you are paid to carry out for EK. So please do not BS anyone here with your superior jargon full of S**T, because it is not what makes you a better captain or a descent individual, nor will your ATPL buy you the respect of anyone, it is more about treating people the way you would like to be treated. Those of you who think that you can drop CRM will end up like the yougoslave captain who was dobbed at the end by his own crew for obvious low CRM. And note please that no one is looking for Mr. Nice guy, just half decent people with a proper response. Take good care of yourself boys and for latin I reply in another language: Yaghamissou! |
I would be interested in your definition of CRM, or for that matter your definition of manners. One thing you can be very sure of is that CRM is not defined as having manners or being nice. While it can definitely be argued that those are fine attributes for anyone wanting to get the best out of their crew, however, as a leader, keeping discipline is also required. It is in my humble opinion a clear indication that you should remain in the F/D and look after what you are hired to do and that is to fly the plane. |
Humble opinions or not, the arrogance of pilots seems to be what stands out in these posts.
Do you have an arrogance licence with your CPL boys? Who do you think you are, the thighs of Jupiter! Get off your high horses! Mascarpones' posts show you off in broad day light with an attitude like no other! And you expect to be treated like pilots? Hmm! interesting! |
Oh! Alphatrot, can i be your friend? Oh pelease! You are so great and wonderful, I can't sleep at night you are sooooo Intelligent! Wow!
Can I come and stay with you in Guantanamo in your luxury villa? I would love so much to hang around flight deck...... Yes, yes, yes, say yes!! Oh! Pelease! I just would not know what to do without flight deck around, you guys are so smart and I am always admiring the stripes on your shoulders and the scrambled eggs on your cap.......... Geez, to read your comment one would think that the world would stop if you did not honour us with your bashfull company. Thank God you are not writing company policy mate, otherwise EK would have been in the gutter ages ago with your antiques. You might look smart in the uniform, but anyone eating those discusting sandwiches and green bananas must really be hungry or just a monkey! But mind you monkeys can fly planes too, they even flew rockets in the late sixties, well before many of you were walking! No no one knows anything about CRM we wait for words to drop from your mouth like pearls out of my bum. CRM is not your limited to F/D alone, unless you have forgotten quickly CC are also involved.. "Supporting Mission Accomplishment Through Enhanced Aircrew Performance " But you are still thinking that its incumbent to your sole role/responsability on-board and no-one elses! Wrong! Say you can\'t speak! Is that piece of cheese stuck in your throat? Gag! |
it's obvious that this is not about what one side has or is.
it's about what some on the other side are not. so let them bark miserably, the caravan just passes by. |
Oh yes turtleneck, I have a suggestion, pull your head in, to your shell!
Touchy are we when matters get sensitive? Absolutely the dogs bark while the caravan passes! |
Errr!
Maybe, just maybe, the time has come for Pilots in this airline (EK) to STOP playing Mr. CRM Nice Guy and take a stand against those contemptuous cabin crew who don't know their place! She won't even do it for a turn around! Now what do you prefer the sandwiches or the wife's lunch? I've seen the lot of you rattling the change in your pocket, it's about the only time you have money. The rest of the time you speak about it and let others pay! Feeding you lot on the flight deck is like trying to pry a piece of dead meat from the clasp of a croc! |
The stinginess of EK Flight Deck!
Since we are on the subject let's speak of the stinginess of EK flight deck.
And so they want the crew to honour them with their presence? Who pays the bill? I would think that it can be shared, but in most cases we have guys who escape the bill by putting forward all sorts of excuses..... Have no change, did not order that, can you pay for me now, I will pay you later, etc........ yea right and my grandma was Churchill! |
Rimmer must be crew coz he or she is travelling around Southern and Central America. First Belize, then Easter Island and now off to the Amazon.
Best definition of CRM I have heard was from one of our Captains: "You're the crew, your my resource and I'll manage you!" I await the reply of Mr Rimmer from Red Dwarf. Do a search and you'll know what I mean. :ok: |
Cerberus
You surprise me with your knowledge of sexual practices, I thought most of you were bent like a 9bob note!
But not to worry as long as the red Dwarf has got big hairy balls, everything will be A OK! Off to the Haufbrauhaus (it's the Oktoberfest in case you've forgotten!) to catch a real mass of beer, bring everyone along and don't forget to bring your money to pay the bill! For once! Timmmmmmmmmmmmberrrrrrr!!!!!! :O :} :\ :E :8 :ok: := |
Mr Rimmer,
I have been with EK a while now and I go out for dinner just about every time I go on a layover. I reckon on about 25% of occasions CC bail on the bill particularly if they are male and from the eastern end of the med. On another 25%, despite the fact that the flight deck have picked up the wine tab I hear a debate about who had the prawn cocktail. I am prepared to bet my massive pilot's pension, porsche, ferrari, club membership, hot air baloon and private jet that the flight deck subsidise the crew's layovers and not the other way around. |
Hi red Dwarf;
With hairy balls, I think you pre-empted the question, I was not asking F/D to answer, let the CC come back on this one! Then you get your chance to speak. Everyone their turn please. But thanks for letting us know of your ferrari, pension etc... until your post I was under the impression that all F/D were poor. but while you are there, can you walk back to the end of the queue so others get a chance? Thanks |
You do not surprise me with your lack of knowledge of anything to do with current affairs, pop culture, sexual practices, terrestial bodies or airlines.
So you think Rimmer has something to do with a red dwarf satisfying you desire to be a total arse? Only a very sick, very sad person could come to that conclusion. Better go to the pub before I get sucked into your vortex my obscurantism suffering friend. Enjoy the tapping and insults, watch out you don't get RSI.:ok: |
If you wanted the cabin crew to answer, why didn't you post on the new PCrune website? Can you define irony by the way coz you obviously can't spot it!
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Yea! thanks for the advice I'll keep a look out for both RSI's and FBI's too!
As long as I am on TCAS, and my ILS is calibrated, Don't see how I can miss the runway, but like they say: You never know! Prost! |
Didn't think Irony came into play in an aluminium tube, but you do have a point!
However, anything with a battery is considered dangerous! And if you started answering this thread, it is only because you feel concerned and if you do it also means you are guilty! |
Mascara-prone-prick,
Must be hard being down the back pushing a trolley handing out meals when you know the "monkeys" are flying the plane. You must have a lot of trust in monkeys to put your life int their hands. By the way, here's a dare, why don't you push your luck and ask for the L1 position on my next flight. Then try not "feeding" us for 21 mins. I'll kick your arse so hard you won't have sex for 6 months! Oh! Pelease! I just would not know what to do without flight deck around, you guys are so smart and I am always admiring the stripes on your shoulders and the scrambled eggs on your cap.......... Geez, to read your comment one would think that the world would stop if you did not honour us with your bashfull company. (Once again, this rant is aimed directly at mascaraqueen, to most other EK cabin crew, being decent, these comments don't apply) :ok: |
Can I have head!
on my beer please! What were you saying red dwarf? Ah! I hear you better now, you are the new EK mascot for F/D, good on you it was about time ID was replaced! |
Mascaraqueen
You said you were going to the Oktoberfest 30 mins ago, so go!
By now EVERYONE knows you're a total waste of space. 4-holes, evict this chop! Please! |
I am there already mate, modern technology does wonders I can follow the threads form my little PDA and reply, maybe you should get yourself one of these, they are quite handy, if you know how to use them of course! I can't see any F/D where are you boys?oops!
Just farted but I guess that's a fax! Can you send one of your F/O's to clean up please someone spilt a beer on the floor, it must be one of those captains you know they can't handle drink! You can't take these guys out I tell you! |
no, no fart, you just lost your brain, for what little size it had.
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This thread brings a tear to my eye. It used to be that it needed an outsider to wind up the EK guys into a frenzy, now you are fighting amongst yourselves, and showing inclusive CRM traits by encouraging the cabin crew to join in. Now thats progress.
KEEP DISCOVERING |
In my opinion, the occasional conflict or lack of understanding boils down to certain individuals who hail from the eastern med.. They poison, taint and obscure all with which they come in contact. It starts from day one of CC training with the not so subtle jabs at aircrew and continues on a daily basis throughout each flight and layover.
I have recently made it a point to never partake of extracuricular activities if one of these low-lifes is present. Shockingly......... NOT......... the layovers have now become a joy and good time. My latest was a fantastic pairing where we were visited frequently by the crew, had great layovers and generally respected each other. Its amazing how nice, friendly, funny and intelligent CC can be when not being coerced and harassed by these individuals. Coincidentally not one of these smarmy bastards was on the crew (amazing but true) Someone mentioned earlier the fear of being labelled a cockpit floozy. What a ridiculous and absurd concept, promoted and embellished by these same slimey, loud mouth, obnoxious men. When will EK learn that a 5% demographic of these idiots .... is 5% too high. And they stay here forever!!!. Harassing and abusing each new course of CC, as is their 'right' as seniors and pursers. Never met a more despicable nationality of human beings in my entire life. And this is not a generalization, it is 98% valid. Don't go crying racist to me, it took me far too long to accept the reality of these people, as i tend towards not generalizing. Smiling assasins, nice to your face, slag you behind your back at the first opportunity. The best thing EK could ever do with respect to crew harmony, service and general moral of this company, is to fire each and every one of them tomorrow. |
i've gone right off you lot.
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Helmreich said -
"While effective teamwork is clearly important, it is not the primary goal of CRM training. The following is a more accurate representation of current, effective CRM programmes: CRM consists of the effective utilisation of all available human, informational, and equipment resources toward the goal of safe and efficient flight. More specifically, it is the active process employed by crewmembers to identify existing and potential threats and to develop, communicate, and implement plans and actions to avoid or mitigate perceived threats. CRM also supports the avoidance, management, and mitigation of human errors. The secondary benefits of effective CRM programmes are improved morale and enhanced efficiency of operations." My dua sen worth.... |
M-boy has got it right. I'm stuck down the back at the bouncy end and always try make it up to the flight deck, but sometimes it is difficult to get past the pit bulls at the front.
Anyways - heard anything about the CCM's. I ain't got one. |
For one thank you Marcellus for giving us your worthy note on CRM, at least one who is pragmatic and efficient in analysing these threads.
And rightly said that it does not take much to wind up EK F/D, you think that the world stops in the nebula of the ops retinue and should feel obliged to you for treating us with a slight bit of consideration. I have you cheap lot around for dinner and seen the ones who drop their trousers collapsing on sofas etc..... And you want respect, I would suggest you first behave like a captain treat your crew with respect and you will get the same in return with perhaps no one spitting in your coffee 1+1 in your special starbucks mug! But I could have not said it better: In my opinion, the occasional conflict or lack of understanding boils down to certain individuals who hail from the eastern med.. If your comment did not sound an alarm anywhere alse it tells me of your lack of confidence in confronting and dealing with "Eastern med" types. Now that also tells me how good your CRM is and how reliable you are as a leader in manageing your ressource to maintain safe and efficient flights. By saying so you've already identified a threat where it does not exist. Boy you should be sent back to school to do a bit of history for you to realise how close you are to infringing social and political etiquete with such comments, that is if you haven't done so already. Worse though is that you live in the middle East and expect everyone to behave according to your norms......Well well! But then to add: Its amazing how nice, friendly, funny and intelligent CC can be when not being coerced and harassed by these individuals If anything a blatant lack of culture, manners and education! But then again what would you expect from an OZ farmer who's been dustcropping all his life b4 he came to DXB. Eat your sandwich eat! And choke on it as far as I care. You will onlny get what you deserve from the Midlle Easterners and I am sure that they are giving you your change back. And by the way I waited for some of you to appear and celebrate with me the Oktoberfest but no one pitched up, probably short on cash hey? |
Either the sandwiches are indeed very tasty, or lambasting flight deck is chocking on the same.
Eat eat! You want some Hommos? ............................................................ ................ No Comment! |
EK according to Quod Boy
Captain Quod Boy awaiting his pick up in the Springs (AKA Guantanamo) Should be arriving in 5.
http://www.humorbug.com/fpics/f_humorbug_ad27c03563.jpg Oh Captain yes, yes, show us how much power you have..... An according to Men is a boy http://poster-posters.com/pics/ww2/german/frauent.jpg Some of you boys even got fired over crew sandwiches! Cheap cheap cheap! |
I guess nobody pitched up because you are a ****.
Just a hunch!!:E |
babyblu - nope, not heard a sausage about the ccms.
I haven't got one either. I was perfectly happy with the one i had b4 so don't want a new one. think EK must have realised that the people fired were too good for this company. anyway, thought this airline was supposed to be multi-cultural - how come the office/management is now mostly british??? huh? and you wait....the new ones will be british too. bet ya. |
how come the office/management is now mostly british Last count the remaining CCM nationality make up 1 Lebanese 1 Sri Lankan 1 Indian 1 French 2 UAE nationals 2 English 2 Irish Unless my map of the world is wrong, there is only 2 there that fall under the category of British! If you want to hand in your resignation Gee Whiz, why don't you pass it to TD directly and discuss your concerns & how upset you are... or would you rather hide behind text messaging and bleating anonymously. I can understand why you would not want another CCM .... could it be you are afraid that they will actually address your "issues" with you? Just get on with it or leave, it is your choice. But the bleating has become very tiresome :( |
This is how I picture the cabin crew:
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a1...ooters-air.jpg marscarpone: now listen carefully son, I'm sure you do a fantastic job as a sandwich dispenser. Stick to what you know and let the big people get on with their jobs! :ok: Run along now and go play in the Shk Z Rd traffic! |
Hey Mr. Camelot "Son";
Will you please hold my hand I am shaking!!!!! Brrrr! you scare me with your tone! I feel so threatened! Been there done that on shk Z road even got the Tea Shirt (blop) Pleased to see that you at least have some taste. She is not chinese is she? I suggest you do one thing, point your index up in the air and stick it in your left eye all the way to the elbow. Now look at the photo again, that should give you an outlook on our crew! And to reply: 2 UAE nationals 1Sri Lankan 1 Indian 1 French 2 English 2 Irish An English MCC who was previously managing baggage handlers. And the Irish who was sick the whole time she was on the line and never flew and taken directly as CCM. And you forgot the palestinian pimp. What a dynamic team. How would you like as pilots to be managed by a catering officer and a cabin cleaner? Don't bother to answer its on the cards next, you had a bus driver before so why not? What you are showing here as pilots is your inabillity to manage people without resorting to threats! Keep discovering! |
Would someone PLEASE put Mascarpone out of his/her misery............this bickering is driving me nuts!
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Gee wiz can you enable your pm service pls
To the others, dry as a bone! The truth hurts....... Whether I am mid eastern or not is not the issue, I would like to see you master the idioms of any other language other than yours like mid easterners manage yours, the truth is you are so ignorant most of you limit yourselves to the vulgar and derogatory terms that are taught you by a pick up of the street. The truth is was it not for EK you lot would be still somwhere in the boonies of OZ or somwhere in the realm of the Magna carta, but you got your only break here to a "form" of civilisation. Anywhere else without the facilities at hand here and you would not last longer than a day. And you still moan about Dubai! It is very much a paradox that somhow society did not start in the UK or in OZ but actually in the mid east, perhaps the day you realise that, you will understand why your little minds cannot cope with the with of mideasterners and their ways. The proof: How many of you are doing mid eastern girls? None! How many lebos doing WASPies? All! It is also likely that before you befriended her, your wife or girlfriend was probably doing an MMD trip with a BHW. Now tell me the proof is not in the pudding! While you were still living in caves history was being made here and still is. Like it or not mid east is not your choice, it's a fact and like it or not it's here to stay with its people. Because along the way, they will always show you the way the only one you know: The stick! Now quod and all the boys, go watch jerry Springer tonight, I think batman maybe on, your IQ won't allow you to understand anything beyond that, forget the politics and GW, because you probably think that is the language that should prevail and you would all probably join him on a crusade if you could. Why not ask Mr. Hilton to join in his rubber shoes? Or put yourself out of your misery and for once put that fan in your spare room to good use: Hang urselves to these words. and make sure you put a plastic liner so we dont have to clean your feceas after you. |
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