Tail Rota

Guys

heard it from a good source that the 1st 10 A380's will crewed by existing Airbus pilots and FATBUS is probably right ...... senoir 330 guys will be able to transition up no probs. After the initail 10...... its open to senior 777 guys.

how many 777 guys not sure but i reckon you can guess.

TR

scruggs

CCQ should allow an A330 or A340 pilot to fly the A380 with only minimal training.

"CCQ actually allows an A318 pilot to fly an A346 with only a very short conversion course as all modern Airbuses use the same cockpit architecture."

That quote was from Scroggs, a Virgin A340 Captain who I was talking to about whether he flies the A343, the A346, or both. He flies both due to Airbus philosophy/comonality.

As for when the A380 arrives, I'm not sure about EK, but I think Airbus pilots at VS will benefit from mixed-fleet-flying. I.e. they'll be able to fly the A343, A346 and the A38X.

For a 777 pilot, I presume he would have to go through a full type-rating course.

dxbpilot

Thanks for the replys guys, this helpled alot

Cerberus

The jets turn up in early 07 and as I understand it will not be CCQ compatible or MFF compatible with earlier types. That decisions was taken so that the cockpit didn't get tied to the older legacy aircraft and could include all the new goodies.

I believe the 380 will be the starting point for a new CCQ family which will include the 350 onwards.

MR8

Found the following article...
Seems like EK won't get their A380's before END 2007. Any idea how that looks for the upgrades on Airbus? Looks like EK has another good excuse to delay some more people.

MR8


Airbus A380 hit by new programme delay
By Max Kingsley-Jones in Toulouse

The Airbus A380 is facing another serious programme delay, but first delivery to launch operator Singapore Airlines (SIA) is still expected by the end of the year.

Airbus says the delay has been caused by “production ramp-up problems”. It is not expected to impact certification, which is due in the fourth quarter for the handover of the first aircraft to SIA before year end, but will see deliveries of subsequent aircraft slip by “six to seven months”, says Airbus. The programme has already suffered one six month delay, which was announced a year ago and pushed the delivery of the initial Rolls-Royce Trent 900-powered version to SIA back from April to the end of this year.

Other early customers affected by the new delay include Qantas and the lead Engine Alliance-powered A380 operator Emirates, both of whom were due to take their first aircraft early in the second quarter of 2007.

Airbus says the knock-on effect of the slip will be felt on the delivery schedule for production through 2007, 2008 and 2009.

Eldin

Word has it first 5 A380's will go to SQ.
Next 4 will go to EK, followed by first deliveries to QF.


First delivery to EK now 09/07 with official Entry into Service planned 01/08.




Keep discovering......





Cheers,



Eldin

Saltaire

Transition is the only reasonable solution. Offered in other first world airlines with proper training and solid canditates, which EK has. The current policy is absurd.

Another year on top of the already 3.5 years !! What a lottery this place turned out to be.

Tail Rota

Have upgrades been delayed again even further....I hope this time will be used to catch up on the short fall in crew.

TR

411A

More than likely, Tail Rota, by hiring more DEC's.
This policy is called, keep the complainers in the RHS, where they right and properly belong.

Now, you may not like my suggestion, and I truly expect that you might not, but OTOH, I suspect you are not in management, either.

Many line pilots believe THEY could manage flight ops or training properly (to say nothing of recruitment), but past experience with several other carriers has proven this idea to be quite the opposite.
Co-pilots especially believe they 'have seen it all' or, 'know it all' but this also has usually proved to be highly unlikely.

Co-pilots are there to do as they are told...possible safety of flight issues excepted.

EK management apparently has come to know this quite well, so the present policies are unlikely to change in the near term.

As the world turns...

ironbutt57

maybe they wouldnt be complainers if there were some rational reason for the DEC's..but in the case of EK there doesnt seem to be...some of my colleagues are headed there...hope they enjoy themselves...

fatbus

411A ,.
they don't call them co-pilots anymore old buddy
if anything it will give EK some breathing room, the FO's that were delayed have been move up to Jul

Tail Rota

Hi Fatbus...

small post but very big news. ....I hope you are correct. I have been trying to make sense of it all and its great news for the boys if they are back on course.

Personaly I was relaxed about the whole issue as it seems to change weekly around here ....and at the end of the day what can we do about it ....... I dont want cancer


411A.....you are correct mate....I didnt like what you had to say about the other resource in the right hand seat.....but I beg to differ .....as it has been my experience ......and may I add....limited experience in the right hand seat with EK .......that we are there to ensure passenger saftey, and save a very few, from having file ASR's on yourself.


I have seen a couple of very unusual practices while sitting in the right , minding my own business as you put it.......I have had to speak out more than one time below 1500ft agl, to get the co pilot in the left hand seat to correct his trajectory.

EK apperas to be upgrading at the 3 to 3 1/2 year mark......now this is based on the infomation I have from guys I am flying with, who have recently been upgraded since last year. as well as the guys I have supported in the sim, while completeting the upgrade lofts etc.....

everyone has been 3 to 3 1/2 yrs.........some 777 guys have been checked 3 yrs to day of joining EK.......how do I know this.......they are personal friends of mine and recently checked

I have always said....... the DEC's are a nesessary evil at EK, and will be for the perceived future ....but its not to keep the complainers hidden inthe right hand seat ....its to simply crew planes......I hope you are wrong 411a.........and only time will tell.

In all the caos......fly safe!

The forever doomed Co Pilot TR

EGGW

Well actually 411a, they can't get enough DEC's, no matter what Ed trys to tell us, they are having to promote some whining co-pilots as you put it, onto the 777, as Capts because their policy is totally flawed!
Actually the policy has not been changed, they don't want him at the top to lose face!

This latest move has only pissed off the Airbus guys due to be promoted (seniority whatever that means at EK) even more. its called crisis management, nothing more.

EGGW

Charlie Murdoch

With the announcement that the A380 "Plastic Pig" has been put back even further, what implications for EK?

Some possibilities:

1. EK takes the A340-600 (that was previously looking very doubtful), due to lack of capacity that the plastic piggy was planned to provide (good news for AB F/Os).
2. Temporary CPA remains in position for reasons that are apparent...and not so apparent.
3. Airboos pays through the nose for the delays.
4. An imminent order for B787s to spite Airboos.

Interesting to speculate on what the other carriers who ordered the piggy will do.

Andu

One thing about 411a's posts intrigues me. How many Americans from Arizona call an "airplane" an aeroplane, as he does? Is he a transplanted Brit?

411A

Certainly not many, Andu, but I try to accomodate many of the posters here who would not otherwise understand the use of ah....American terms.

Besides...it fits in with 'aerodrome'

On another subject, it appears to me that what EK desperately needs is an audit from an outside source, as apparently, considering the many posts here that indicate big trouble ahead, the future surely looks to be quite unmanageable in the near term, what with all the 'problems' in the flt ops department.
Will this occur?
Hardly likely, as those in flt ops management are trying desperately to cover their collective behinds...at any cost.
This, as has been proven on MANY occasions at other carriers, is a lost proposition, from the start.
Will those in flt ops management wake up?
Don't hold your breath...!

Gotyou

Fresh from the cave!
For the first time we`ve heard EK saying that is considering cancelling the entire 380`s order if the new delay is to put Ek more than 12 months behind Singapore first acft delivery.
On the other hand, 20 747-800`s freighters are to be announced soon and will be operated with Ek pilots and not Atlas anymore.
Well...seems to be interesting times ahead!!

akerosid

I was about to type "20 747-8Fs - isn't that a bit excessive?", when I thought - hey, this is Emirates! That said, given that they only have a handful of wetleased 744Fs, it does seem quite a jump.

Whatever about the freighters, I'd think an announcement like this would be designed to put the frighteners under Airbus.

If they were to get 747-8Fs, wouldn't they get pax models as well; I don't know what has been proposed about the 747-8 cockpit, but I'd assume that it would have a significant amount of commonality with the 777, which would make conversion between the types relatively easy.

Although EK is apparently waiting for the A370 next month, given its overall annoyance at Airbus, is there any tiny chance that EK would choose the A370over the 787-10? Doubtful, I'd say.

Tail Rota

what drugs are you two on honestly...your shisha pipe must have had a little extra flavouring boys......good try though

Arctaurus

Airbus will be absolutely desperate to try and keep EK inside their front door.

Emirates is well known for screwing the last cent out of every dollar - they have no real interest in the A380 as a "nice" aircraft. It's only there to generate a profit.

Behind the scenes, I would imagine that Airbus is offering A340 600's at COMPLETELY knock down prices (and probably with Airbus wearing all the maintenance) to try and save the situation. This will suit EK down to the ground - they will end up with an interim aircraft that costs them a lot lot less than what the 380's would have done.

EK is laughing all the way to the bank, whichever way it goes.