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Arbitrary Dismissal

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Arbitrary Dismissal

Old 5th Jul 2020, 04:56
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Arbitrary Dismissal

A first post for obvious reasons.......

Have any of the newly redundant pilots looked at the UAE Labour Law 122 with regard to Arbitrary Dismissal? As I understand since we are on unlimited contracts, and that the redundancy is NOT due to performance issues we have a claim for up to 3 months wages in the labour courts, this is in addition to the 3 months notice. This has been backed up by a chat to a locals based solicitor.
Please PM if you wish and we can keep this anonymous for obvious reasons
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 10:34
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I have a problem with replying to messages due to being a Ďfirst time posterí I will get back to those of you who reply via PM shortly when I have access to send PMs in return.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 11:17
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Why donít you guys get it. Emirates Airlines is not required to follow UAE labor laws. This is in writing from HR. Sorry to burst your bubble but anyone that tells you any different is just trying to take your money.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 11:32
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Sorry I must have missed that one. Please show me where Emirates says it can ignore the labour laws?
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 12:10
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well I did read the labor law a week back, but I read it differently.... But am obviously not a lawyer...
Could a case like this be handled as class action?
3 months is still 3 months.....and there is no way one of the 600 will ever get a job back...so nothing to loose for many...
But then again they have a legal system only working....in their own favour....
this one is a hard one i guess....

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Old 5th Jul 2020, 12:15
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I hate playing devils advocate here, but EK does everything above board. So what ever is presented to you will be in strict adherence to the law.

Good luck to all of you.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 13:43
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Unfortunately true!
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 13:55
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From someone who's been in the situation before, paying the 3 months notice period is considered complying with that particular section of the law anyway so dreaming of something more will unfortunately only ever be a dream.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 14:17
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Do not waste your money. EK is the government, they can make up rules as they please. If you think you are protected under so called UAE labour laws.. i have a couple of bridges to sell you.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 15:24
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The 3 months notice isnít complying with the law. That was something I checked into and it is a different thing.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 23:01
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Lawyers lie

Lawyers lie everywhere, not just in dictatorships. Especially with 600+ potential clients who will have to leave the country shortly.
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Old 6th Jul 2020, 00:12
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Fired600

Guess you weren’t at EK when they were allocating less than 30 days leave because they couldn’t find enough pilots willing to sell their souls to join the ranks... their response was that they were a semi governmental agency and hence UAE labor law does not apply!
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Old 6th Jul 2020, 05:13
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interessting discussion here

first because the company says that they have to comply with the law is effectively only two things
firsy they want to create fear so you don’t walk into a lawyers office
second just because they say so - they are not correct
the problem hear is that nobody ever really tried it And if so we don’t no the result except via rumors. that’s all because everybody is fearing the consequences
and yes the chances to get a positiv result in Dubai are minimal as you rely on a local judge - Wasta
fighting for the terms of your contract because you want your vacation while also wanting to keep the job is different from being made redundant and ultimate fighting for the live line and future.
i have seen in one of the handed out documents around the eos that ek refers to the Labour law and the correctness of their doing accordingly
EK follows the Labour law widely but the also break it to their wish when They know you can’t do much without risking your job - if you go to court the excuse to dismiss you will be breaking with the confidentiality rules
for eg their is a local lawyer who sent an email that he is not excepting cases against EY even thou it would Be 1000+ clients -guess why
bottom line going into that fight for 3 month salary is not worth the fight - you need to go way bigger than that - these are only supporting arguments but not a reason for a court case
if you want to achieve something you need to proof a gross misconduct and abuse of your contract relation
this is difficult as EK is always on the boarder of the law
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Old 6th Jul 2020, 06:04
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I think the fear factor is a big thing here. But as we have been told there is no Ďfearí. The fear is now that you are taking on Emirates, they are still not above the law and ultimately I would happen that a judge would base his decisions on the law as opposed to Wasta. Ultimately what is there to loose? We are dreaming if we think they will ever take anyone back.

There is no class action in the UAE and case law also doesnít exist. However hundreds of pilots taking cases to court would not be good publicity for the company. The 3 months notice is not the same as the up to 3 months compensation for arbitrary dismissal. 3 months might not seem much but when you have no job prospects and are faced with moving back to your home land and being out of work for possibly years, it makes a difference.
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Old 6th Jul 2020, 10:55
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I think you might need a better lawyer. I'd suggest case law in the UAE has settled that redundancy is a genuine reason for termination and therefore falls under Article 117 and is accordingly NOT arbitrary. Article 122 then does not apply.

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Old 7th Jul 2020, 06:05
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Do you not think the judge hearing the case is easily influenced in the UAE? You have no case. Donít waste your time. Go home, look for a job.
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Old 7th Jul 2020, 09:50
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here_we_go_again

Well you may need to check your details since there is no case law in the UAE. Redundancy may well be a reason but if it is not due to performance issues it is classed as arbitary.
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Old 7th Jul 2020, 17:25
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Directly from the Labor Law.

Article 117
1. Either the employer or the worker may terminate an indefinite term contract for a valid reason at any time following its conclusion, by giving the other party a notice in writing at least 30 days prior to termination.

I am pretty sure that redundancy is a valid reason so Article 117 applies and the termination is therefore not arbitrary.
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Old 7th Jul 2020, 20:05
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Also direct from the Labour Law.

Article 122
A workers service shall be deemed to be arbitrarily terminated by his employer if the reason for termination is irrelevant to the work.

It doesnít matter if it is a valid reason, it is not relative to the work and is thus arbitrary. You canít pick which article you wish to apply.

I am amazed how many of the Ďpilotsí are negative about fighting for their rights. If it is indeed pilots being negative......
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Old 8th Jul 2020, 22:48
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Playing devils advocate here Fired600 but have you considered the situation of successfully pursuing it through legal channels but the company drags its feet in settling any money owed and eventually doesnít pay, knowing your remaining time in the UAE is limited?

I have already seen a post on social media of an employee of a very large property developer in Dubai who went to court to be awarded his contractual entitlements, after being made redundant. He won but has not received a dirham and the clock is ticking until his visa is cancelled and he has to leave the country. I suspect there will be a sizeable legal bill to settle before departure too!
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