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EK : Command Upgrade

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EK : Command Upgrade

Old 15th Jun 2019, 11:46
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EK : Command Upgrade

Good Afternoon,

I have read the past the threads of EK, sadly the current airline I work for doesn't treat their FO well. Sadly, it's become a race to the bottom.

I grew up reading PPRuNe and before i took this flying career. My current airline has a AED 150 k bond.

I meet the minimum requirements of EK FO, probably have more hours too, never failed a lpc, opc, lc written test etc. No letters/verbals/ incident, etc from the company either.

My current company is luring the FO's that the command course is starting at 3000 hours.

Flying with so many dec's and upgraded Fo's, the captains here fly too stressed( New Fo's) , are paid less and do just so many engineering stuff for free. Well that's how low cos work.

I never felt myself wanting to be a narrow body captain or fly single aisle tubes.

I fly one now because i presumed they pay more but sadly they don't. Average FO salary here is 25000 AED or maybe 35000 AED if you have 3000 hours plus, all inclusive. Uniform, loss of license premium, bag, Emirates id, Security tag for Parking etc etc is paid from pocket.

All this ignoring flying with over controlling legendary veterans who Have their own personalized SOPs, micro -manage anything and everything, even the very little brightness knob of the FO SIDE PFD!!!!.

I wouldn't blame them too much either cause we have just too many trainees.

And its always the FO'S fault here.

Then There are those nice guys that i would hats off cause they are the best . That's an odd 10 percent of 250 line Captains here.

And then there are the company negatives .

I Still the pay the loan that my dad took for my training and I'm still in my early twenties.

Looking at Ek command minimum age is 30 and the odds of me being accepted and surviving till the end of my career in EK, is holding me back from submitting my application.

I'm from the sub -continent, made dubai my home ( Not) i have no home in my country either.

Ek looks like paradise to me from here. The 777/ 380s are too shiny. Come on, It HAS to be better than sharjah airlines.

I have spoken to a lot of people about this, my would be wifey is a bit worried too. She would as well bite me if i lose my current job.

I understand this a rumor network, but still, i wish to get advice from EK Pilots.

Should i apply? Would i be accepted? Is the wait to command worth it?. Is it better?.

Thanks for reading and thanks for your time.













Last edited by Aiza; 18th Jun 2019 at 00:29.
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Old 15th Jun 2019, 20:34
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You gotta be kiddin me!
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Old 16th Jun 2019, 07:19
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I never felt myself wanting to be a narrow body captain or fly single aisle tubes.

goodness, what a horrible thought....
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Old 16th Jun 2019, 07:44
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I never felt myself wanting to be a narrow body captain or fly single aisle tubes.

Because everyone knows that flying multiple aisle tubes is so much better!
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Old 16th Jun 2019, 21:23
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Thatís an accident waiting to happen!
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Old 16th Jun 2019, 22:02
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Sandpit is the right place for ya buddy. Enjoy....
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Old 16th Jun 2019, 23:31
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OMG, it can't be real, what a shame.

My dear, if a Captain's asking you to dim the PFD light bothers you and makes you upset, you won't survive 3 weeks with EK, first of all.

Stay in Air Arabia, you don't have maturity and 30 years old for you looks like won't be enough to get there.
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Old 17th Jun 2019, 04:29
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Dude, my honest advice is just apply and go through the whole process, if accepted go. Don't be scared of failing checks or whatever along the route because as you said you never failed once, this shows how seriously you take things. In these majors as long as you open your books and play it safe you won't get into troubles.
​​​Only issue, very big issue I see from you is you like flying with easy going captains only. At this stage of the game you should be able to know that there many Arse hole captains you will always have to fly with. Some would want you to do stuffs their way. What's your problem of doing those stuffs. As long as it is safe to do why not do them. You can't stress yourself up when you use open descent during descent and a captain tells you to use V/s. Or Captain telling you don't do shutdown procedure because the engineer is here and will take care of plane (Airbus). Are you gonna crush if you follow what he tells you? If in your opinion you think safety will be compromised then because you know your books already just tell the captain from this book so and so the Sop wants us to do this n that stuff. Point it out to him.
That is just basic CRM stuffs.
Lastly stop talking about command already. Don't die for it. Just do what's required of you and that's it. If it will come after 8 years then let it be so.
My one cent
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Old 17th Jun 2019, 07:16
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Originally Posted by Guilherme View Post


OMG, it can't be real, what a shame.

My dear, if a Captain's asking you to dim the PFD light bothers you and makes you upset, you won't survive 3 weeks with EK, first of all.

Stay in Air Arabia, you don't have maturity and 30 years old for you looks like won't be enough to get there.

They would want to increase the brightness...... Not dim!.
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Old 17th Jun 2019, 11:01
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Mate, there just might be a valid reason behind the Captainís request/demand! Oblige him or her you might learn something.

For the others: If this is any indication of the entry levels in the ME3 then abandon ship, time to get out, the party is over. itís all downhill from here!
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Old 17th Jun 2019, 19:50
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Originally Posted by Mgggpilot View Post
Dude, my honest advice is just apply and go through the whole process, if accepted go. Don't be scared of failing checks or whatever along the route because as you said you never failed once, this shows how seriously you take things. In these majors as long as you open your books and play it safe you won't get into troubles.
​​​Only issue, very big issue I see from you is you like flying with easy going captains only. At this stage of the game you should be able to know that there many Arse hole captains you will always have to fly with. Some would want you to do stuffs their way. What's your problem of doing those stuffs. As long as it is safe to do why not do them. You can't stress yourself up when you use open descent during descent and a captain tells you to use V/s. Or Captain telling you don't do shutdown procedure because the engineer is here and will take care of plane (Airbus). Are you gonna crush if you follow what he tells you? If in your opinion you think safety will be compromised then because you know your books already just tell the captain from this book so and so the Sop wants us to do this n that stuff. Point it out to him.
That is just basic CRM stuffs.
Lastly stop talking about command already. Don't die for it. Just do what's required of you and that's it. If it will come after 8 years then let it be so.
My one cent

Thanks for your advice.
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Old 17th Jun 2019, 22:50
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Originally Posted by hoss View Post
Mate, there just might be a valid reason behind the Captainís request/demand! Oblige him or her you might learn something.

For the others: If this is any indication of the entry levels in the ME3 then abandon ship, time to get out, the party is over. itís all downhill from here!
Nope, this is a general indication of entry level as well in Europe. No worries, they are everywhere. BUT - I am to tired to ask my FO to fiddle with his light switches after 5 days with 4 sectors each(even that sometimes I really would like to ask WHY the hell his EFB brightness close to midnight is at around 80% and DAY mode and HOW he manages his night vision).

Apart from that - who cares how long the tube behind the cockpit is, how many aisles? At the end free time with the family and money counts. Both are not so good anymore with EK. All what remains are "shiny jets"(wait a few years and we see about that either).

If you think the grass is greener on the other side, you are young, make your own mistakes as so many of us did. If you reach 40 and you are fighting your way through the sky night for night, flying in that beautiful(not) sunrise after a very very long night and you just want to close your eyes, then you will think again. But it will be a widebody. So, well worth the sacrifice, right?
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Old 17th Jun 2019, 23:32
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Will take air Arabia over indigo. Pay your dad back the money. Then decide where you want to go.
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Old 18th Jun 2019, 00:25
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Originally Posted by tomuchwork View Post
If you think the grass is greener on the other side, you are young, make your own mistakes as so many of us did. If you reach 40 and you are fighting your way through the sky night for night, flying in that beautiful(not) sunrise after a very very long night and you just want to close your eyes, then you will think again. But it will be a widebody. So, well worth the sacrifice, right?
thanks for your reply,

I hate those red-eyed flights as well, its on those red-eye flights, I find colleagues asking me to INCREASE the PFD brightness.

do these flights a few times, your body no longer knows when to sleep or wake up. and that's month after month.............

I guess the only difference as you said is widebody and I think more money too






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Old 18th Jun 2019, 00:27
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Originally Posted by donpizmeov View Post
Pay your dad back the money.
thanks for your reply, i thought I could do it faster in EK
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Old 18th Jun 2019, 01:07
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Originally Posted by Aiza View Post
thanks for your reply,

I hate those red-eyed flights as well, its on those red-eye flights, I find colleagues asking me to INCREASE the PFD brightness.

do these flights a few times, your body no longer knows when to sleep or wake up. and that's month after month.............

I guess the only difference as you said is widebody and I think more money too
He was being sarcastic, if you go to EK you will be flying redeyes constantly, is that worth flying a widebody? An airplane is an airplane and it all looks the same in the cockpit!
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Old 18th Jun 2019, 02:20
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I was furloughed twice before I was 30, I didnít touch a Boeing till I was 30, nor a widebody until I was 35. Iíve worked on 3 continents and my career progression has been above average for US passport holders. Thereís a problem. Itís not everyone else...
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Old 22nd Jun 2019, 10:19
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Originally Posted by 4runner View Post
I was furloughed twice before I was 30, I didnít touch a Boeing till I was 30, nor a widebody until I was 35. Iíve worked on 3 continents and my career progression has been above average for US passport holders. Thereís a problem. Itís not everyone else...

At least you had a US passport and Could get a job anywhere without any discrimination.
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Old 25th Jun 2019, 03:27
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Originally Posted by Aiza View Post



At least you had a US passport and Could get a job anywhere without any discrimination.
Dude, you're funny...
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Old 28th Jun 2019, 04:52
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Originally Posted by Mgggpilot View Post
Dude, my honest advice is just apply and go through the whole process, if accepted go. Don't be scared of failing checks or whatever along the route because as you said you never failed once, this shows how seriously you take things. In these majors as long as you open your books and play it safe you won't get into troubles.
​​​Only issue, very big issue I see from you is you like flying with easy going captains only. At this stage of the game you should be able to know that there many Arse hole captains you will always have to fly with. Some would want you to do stuffs their way. What's your problem of doing those stuffs. As long as it is safe to do why not do them. You can't stress yourself up when you use open descent during descent and a captain tells you to use V/s. Or Captain telling you don't do shutdown procedure because the engineer is here and will take care of plane (Airbus). Are you gonna crush if you follow what he tells you? If in your opinion you think safety will be compromised then because you know your books already just tell the captain from this book so and so the Sop wants us to do this n that stuff. Point it out to him.
That is just basic CRM stuffs.
Lastly stop talking about command already. Don't die for it. Just do what's required of you and that's it. If it will come after 8 years then let it be so.
My one cent
Just to play devil's advocate here:

What's wrong with not wanting to fly with jackass captains? If I had my way, all the captains would be easy going.

In terms of doing stuff "their way". I'm assuming you mean technique, and not SOP. If the OP prefers to descend in OP DES, and it's not against SOP, and not unsafe, why should a competent captain insist on another mode just because it's not the way he (the captain) would do it?

At my company, a captain who micromanages to the point of controlling the FO's display brightness would quickly find himself on the no-fly list of all the FO's, and would eventually be having a chat with the professional standards committee, or chief pilot.
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