Saudia
Join Date: Apr 2013
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For those that are interested the 20/10 recently being offered. It's not the only roster/days off pattern being consider by SV Flight Operations management. There are a number of other options being considered as well, including 20/14 but if you all jump in with both feet for the 20/10 you'll not see the 20/14 even proposed. Like any offering situation, it's not always wise to take take the first proposal on offer.
Incidentally, the 20/10 option is supposed to be offered with the choice of two month pairings, so the the 10 days off at the end of one 20 day period butts up with 10 days off at the beginning of the next period. This gives a block of 20 days off in one go. It is supposed to go something like this:
Month One. 20 days on followed by 10 days off.
Month two. 10 days off followed by 20 days on.
So, over a two month period the work/days off pattern should look like this:
20 days on/20 days off/20 days on.
Got it?
Incidentally, the 20/10 option is supposed to be offered with the choice of two month pairings, so the the 10 days off at the end of one 20 day period butts up with 10 days off at the beginning of the next period. This gives a block of 20 days off in one go. It is supposed to go something like this:
Month One. 20 days on followed by 10 days off.
Month two. 10 days off followed by 20 days on.
So, over a two month period the work/days off pattern should look like this:
20 days on/20 days off/20 days on.
Got it?
Join Date: Apr 2013
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As for the "end of contract" bonus NOT being paid. That is certainly true in quite a number of cases. In fact there are number of cases soon to go to the Saudi Labour Court because of non payment.
It seems that good fortune may have been on the side of those who've already received their payments and in all likelyhood they're from the group who were first due to receive it because of when they are started their contracts in 2012/2013. There's no guarantee that the bonuses will be paid to those who joined 2014 and afterwards when their 3 year contracts come up for renewal.
Remember, for those that have the wisdom to see it, the government is running out of money and thus having a lot difficulty with its financing. There are are lot of government funded projects that have been stopped, because of lack of payment. KAIA is just one of them. There are also a lot of Saudi companies that rely upon government contracts that have not been paid. Their expat employees have returned home-many of them unpaid.
Work it out for yourselves. If you joined in 2012/2013 you're at the front of the que and may get your bonus. Not necessarily so if your contract started later. In those cases, I wouldn't say the bonus payment is guaranteed at all.
It seems that good fortune may have been on the side of those who've already received their payments and in all likelyhood they're from the group who were first due to receive it because of when they are started their contracts in 2012/2013. There's no guarantee that the bonuses will be paid to those who joined 2014 and afterwards when their 3 year contracts come up for renewal.
Remember, for those that have the wisdom to see it, the government is running out of money and thus having a lot difficulty with its financing. There are are lot of government funded projects that have been stopped, because of lack of payment. KAIA is just one of them. There are also a lot of Saudi companies that rely upon government contracts that have not been paid. Their expat employees have returned home-many of them unpaid.
Work it out for yourselves. If you joined in 2012/2013 you're at the front of the que and may get your bonus. Not necessarily so if your contract started later. In those cases, I wouldn't say the bonus payment is guaranteed at all.
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The last time I looked, which was admittedly about 10 days ago and I didn't look at the area when on finals either, KAIA certainly looked to me like there was hardly any work or very little progress being made with the airport. As compared, to say just over a year or a year or eighteen months ago, when there were vehicles & construction workers every where.
As for Bin Laden doing the work. Well it must be their "relief crew" because most of their workers were repatriated over the last year by their individual governments due to Bin Laden not paying them and because they had no money to live on. This was well reported in many international news papers.
Furthermore, most of the Spanish expatriates involved in the building of the railway connection to Mecca also left many months ago. There are many more examples as evidence of the country's financial problems if you wish to open your eyes.
As I said earlier, I've not been to the airport in the last ten days or, so maybe it's possible the country's financial problems have all been solved in that short period of time and work has started again at full tilt on the airport but I doubt it.
As for Bin Laden doing the work. Well it must be their "relief crew" because most of their workers were repatriated over the last year by their individual governments due to Bin Laden not paying them and because they had no money to live on. This was well reported in many international news papers.
Furthermore, most of the Spanish expatriates involved in the building of the railway connection to Mecca also left many months ago. There are many more examples as evidence of the country's financial problems if you wish to open your eyes.
As I said earlier, I've not been to the airport in the last ten days or, so maybe it's possible the country's financial problems have all been solved in that short period of time and work has started again at full tilt on the airport but I doubt it.
Last edited by VAMY; 14th Dec 2016 at 02:33.
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I can only repeat what I have already said. If you only like to see the negative side, then it's another thing.
BTW, the terminal is ready inside. What is remaining - the roads. They will get it done for sure.
And still I have no illusions regarding financial situation in general.
BTW, the terminal is ready inside. What is remaining - the roads. They will get it done for sure.
And still I have no illusions regarding financial situation in general.
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I can only repeat what I have already said. If you only like to see the negative side, then it's another thing.
BTW, the terminal is ready inside. What is remaining - the roads. They will get it done for sure.
And still I have no illusions regarding financial situation in general.
BTW, the terminal is ready inside. What is remaining - the roads. They will get it done for sure.
And still I have no illusions regarding financial situation in general.
Join Date: Apr 2013
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The planned huge hangar construction area to the North of the Royal Hangar remains untouched for more than a year. The same is true for the railway connection to the terminal area, which is an integral part of the airport project, as well as all the necessary road improvements and routes. There's no obvious progress or restart of these construction areas.
Furthermore, the Saudi government have had to go to the IMF for an "economy bailout loan", the first time in about thirty years. Delude yourself if you wish. However, the wider considered evidence suggest a real financial problem with the country.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Vamy - Please clarify or add a link to anything on this IMF "economy bailout loan"?
The Saudis floated an international bond offering a short while back, sovereign bonds are very different than going to the IMF.
The Saudis floated an international bond offering a short while back, sovereign bonds are very different than going to the IMF.
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You may be correct. I've sent you the links and the IMF report via a PM.
Join Date: Jan 2009
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Saudia has now fully stopped recruitment of expat Pilots. I don't know if this is because of the failure to get enough through training. Current success rates probably around 1 in 3 or 1 in 4; or maybe it's because the training center is full. Whatever, I think for the future they're going to have to reassess the selection process.
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Interesting "email" doing the rounds, it states that all new hires will be Riyadh based, AND all contract renewals will also force people to Riyadh.
It might work if the offer the 20/10 option, but that doesn't appear to be written officially yet
It might work if the offer the 20/10 option, but that doesn't appear to be written officially yet
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Deteriorating renumeration on top of it.
I would rather start it anew in some place with beer and other civilization benefits.
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Romasik & Mutt,
Riyadh, as the administrative center and capitol city of the Kingdom, accounts for nearly 40% and growing of Saudia's flight operations. It's an integral and important part of Saudia's operation. Riyadh will become more and more important as time passes. The RUH base is imperative and has to be crewed.
Saudia Flight Operations Management have been presented with a number of recommendations and options to crew a dedicated RUH base. The advised recommendation, in the first instance, was to try and crew the RUH base with as many expat crew as were willing to go and to make this more attractive to expats the recommendation was for an 17/18 days on with 14 days off(17/18 on 14 off) "commuting" rotational roster. This recommendation was given because it was known that RUH base would not be attractive to the majority of Saudi Flight Deck Crew because they're "family base" is Jeddah. However, most expats would consider RUH base if it was a "commutable" base and with sufficient block days off to make it worthwhile.
Obviously, this roster pattern would be very appealing to the greater majority of expats because it wouldn't mean having to live in Riyadh or moving the family to Riyadh. The family would return to the home country and the Flight Deck Crew member would just "commute" in to the Kingdom to work his schedule and either return home to his family for his regular 14 days off or he could choose to sacrifice his days off for extra work/ overtime if he so wished.
The current 20/10 roster pattern, with a permanent "home base" in Riyadh rather than a commuting base, was one of at least four options but it wasn't in the first three recommendations.
The management know the option of 17/18 on 14 off "commuting RUH base" was the recommended option to crew the RUH base and they were provided with the documentation supporting the recommendation.
If the current 20/10 option, with RUH "home base" is unacceptable but the 17-18 on 14 off " commuting base" preferred, then let the management know this. It would be a much better option than either having to move the family and family home to Riyadh or choseing to leave Saudia instead.
Riyadh, as the administrative center and capitol city of the Kingdom, accounts for nearly 40% and growing of Saudia's flight operations. It's an integral and important part of Saudia's operation. Riyadh will become more and more important as time passes. The RUH base is imperative and has to be crewed.
Saudia Flight Operations Management have been presented with a number of recommendations and options to crew a dedicated RUH base. The advised recommendation, in the first instance, was to try and crew the RUH base with as many expat crew as were willing to go and to make this more attractive to expats the recommendation was for an 17/18 days on with 14 days off(17/18 on 14 off) "commuting" rotational roster. This recommendation was given because it was known that RUH base would not be attractive to the majority of Saudi Flight Deck Crew because they're "family base" is Jeddah. However, most expats would consider RUH base if it was a "commutable" base and with sufficient block days off to make it worthwhile.
Obviously, this roster pattern would be very appealing to the greater majority of expats because it wouldn't mean having to live in Riyadh or moving the family to Riyadh. The family would return to the home country and the Flight Deck Crew member would just "commute" in to the Kingdom to work his schedule and either return home to his family for his regular 14 days off or he could choose to sacrifice his days off for extra work/ overtime if he so wished.
The current 20/10 roster pattern, with a permanent "home base" in Riyadh rather than a commuting base, was one of at least four options but it wasn't in the first three recommendations.
The management know the option of 17/18 on 14 off "commuting RUH base" was the recommended option to crew the RUH base and they were provided with the documentation supporting the recommendation.
If the current 20/10 option, with RUH "home base" is unacceptable but the 17-18 on 14 off " commuting base" preferred, then let the management know this. It would be a much better option than either having to move the family and family home to Riyadh or choseing to leave Saudia instead.
Last edited by VAMY; 29th Dec 2016 at 16:54.
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Well, I don't know (nobody knows at the moment, even the management) what and when we will end up with. The only thing I know for sure is that if they force me to move to RUH after 19 years in JED, I would rather leave the company
.
I'm not interesting in commuting. Just my 5 cents to complement the picture.
Good luck for those who are looking for commuting options.
.I'm not interesting in commuting. Just my 5 cents to complement the picture.
Good luck for those who are looking for commuting options.
Join Date: Jun 2009
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Training itself is a big joke. Those who fail are not real failures. People are often put down because they failed to satisfy the trainers ego. someone was told to do a walk around with his flight bag for forgetting the 360 scan. Who apparently resigned on the flight. There is no professionalism of any kind, especially in line training.
Btw did you guys get the salary yet ?
Btw did you guys get the salary yet ?
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Romasik, I appreciate and understand your position.
Personally speaking, I would also prefer to remain in JED, if given the option, but if not, then something like an 18/14 "commuting" option would be much more preferable than having to move the whole family to RUH. I'd much rather just move them home if RUH "home" base was the only option on offer.
Personally speaking, I would also prefer to remain in JED, if given the option, but if not, then something like an 18/14 "commuting" option would be much more preferable than having to move the whole family to RUH. I'd much rather just move them home if RUH "home" base was the only option on offer.
Even 10 days look unrealistic...
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Expats to RUH
So much for a choice... all expat crew will only be offered a RUH base and all expat renewal conctacts will be RUH based. You have no 'choice' in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia.
Enjoy the six days off a month in your new home.
Saudia City is going to start looking pretty 'local' very soon.
Enjoy the six days off a month in your new home.
Saudia City is going to start looking pretty 'local' very soon.
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VAMY - Your third paragraph is bang on / correct!
Contract renewal letters are now not being seen as acceptable if you specify a Base & Type. It must be "open-ended" and at the behest of Saudia where, when and what type you are moved to.
Maybe in your home country that may be acceptable but as an expat well away from home in some other Foreign country, not acceptable (for many reasons).
I can see a lot of people using The Exit door coming up, if SV are not careful.
Contract renewal letters are now not being seen as acceptable if you specify a Base & Type. It must be "open-ended" and at the behest of Saudia where, when and what type you are moved to.
Maybe in your home country that may be acceptable but as an expat well away from home in some other Foreign country, not acceptable (for many reasons).
I can see a lot of people using The Exit door coming up, if SV are not careful.
Last edited by Chocks Away; 4th Jan 2017 at 17:54.