Emirates Latest Fleet Newsletter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: The Solar System
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Phew! I enjoyed my 7 consecutive off days and then did a turnaround flight. Guess what? On the return leg during approach I went into "micro sleep", the flight and rosters have become so tiring. So as a conscientious Capt I raised an ASR. Lo & behold thereafter I was invited for tea & biscuits at the office. I ask is this fair?
Are there any other pilots who have experienced the same?
Cheers.
more facts to follow.....
Are there any other pilots who have experienced the same?
Cheers.
more facts to follow.....
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: ME
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
VVV:
The help group you need is the one for Terminally Web Addicted Types like you or 'TWATs'...mind you, there is only so much they can do...
The help group you need is the one for Terminally Web Addicted Types like you or 'TWATs'...mind you, there is only so much they can do...
Last edited by Shake; 17th Mar 2005 at 04:23.
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: uk
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Seaman Staynes
I have been reading pprune in the past months. I am still wondering: What is so wrong with EK? Some of you appreciate the JOB offered, and some of you just find bad in everything. What could be possibly so wrong with the company who employs you, pays your bills and gives you opportunity to forward on your career? I understand that there is NO AIRLINE in this world which is perfect. Emirates is a big company and having ofcourse troubles to manage the expansion. The current status of airline industry is difficult...no doubt about that. The companies do everything to stay in business. But, the bottom line is, if a person is unhappy with the current job, then there is only one thing to do...change the scenery. So, please...answer to me, any of you EK pilots, what is possibly so wrong with EK that makes you "hate" the company? 
Positive feedbacks are also very welcome.
Positive feedbacks are also very welcome.
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: uae
Posts: 2,777
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's not near as bad as some of the neasayers would make you think.
A very small number are the most vocal.
Yes a couple or a few have left and more will, companies(normal) plan on @ 7% attrition at EK that would be @100 per year. Most of them think the grass is greener and hope things work out.
I hate flying with the guys how complain and enjoy flying with those who like it, most like it.
The industry is coming around and if things don't improve more will leave but right now they (the company) can get away with the present conditions because there just is not alot of options, trust me,not alot of options at the present time (read between the lines )
A very small number are the most vocal.
Yes a couple or a few have left and more will, companies(normal) plan on @ 7% attrition at EK that would be @100 per year. Most of them think the grass is greener and hope things work out.
I hate flying with the guys how complain and enjoy flying with those who like it, most like it.
The industry is coming around and if things don't improve more will leave but right now they (the company) can get away with the present conditions because there just is not alot of options, trust me,not alot of options at the present time (read between the lines )
JAROPS,
Do not think anyone hates the company. If they did, they would not be working as hard as they are to keep it working!
What they are not happy with is being lied to, and having their T&Cs changed on a whim, without any consultation! I think if the management even had the courtesy to tell us the truth about things every now and then moral would improve.
Think we are all pretty sick hearing this "hard times for industry stuff". Seems CX, SQ and EK are all about to announce record profits. EK airplanes have always been full, are always full, and I bet in the future will continue to be full. I think quite a few of the pilot group (Fatbus being one of the exceptions of course), are peeved with the company funding some of their record profit from our pockets (see other threads re pilots recent pay cut).
Is it not normal to have some concern as to how far T&Cs will continue to slide before the slide stops?
Its been said before and will be said again. EK is just another job. A whole lot better than some it would seem, and not as good as some of the others.
Don
Do not think anyone hates the company. If they did, they would not be working as hard as they are to keep it working!
What they are not happy with is being lied to, and having their T&Cs changed on a whim, without any consultation! I think if the management even had the courtesy to tell us the truth about things every now and then moral would improve.
Think we are all pretty sick hearing this "hard times for industry stuff". Seems CX, SQ and EK are all about to announce record profits. EK airplanes have always been full, are always full, and I bet in the future will continue to be full. I think quite a few of the pilot group (Fatbus being one of the exceptions of course), are peeved with the company funding some of their record profit from our pockets (see other threads re pilots recent pay cut).
Is it not normal to have some concern as to how far T&Cs will continue to slide before the slide stops?
Its been said before and will be said again. EK is just another job. A whole lot better than some it would seem, and not as good as some of the others.
Don
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Dubai
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fatbus, I hope that you are enjoying your time here but I have yet to fly with someone who is genuinely happy. Many regret the move from their previous carriers, others were just hoping to accelerate their careers a bit. The slow down in commands is one thing, but the continual nibbling away at the contract and terms and conditions vs. the exponential rise in the cost of living here is becoming unbearable for many.
I do believe that the company have taken advantage of the global downturn and held back any chances of a better remuneration package. Our salaries and 'package' are based on a comparison with many carriers worldwide. This is totally flawed because those other carriers may have been deeply affected after the last few years of poor industry performance, yet EK has returned record profits year after year. As someone mentioned earlier in another thread, there's a lot of smoke and mirrors and you yourself say that the compnay can get away with it because of the lack of options. Now consider this, would it not have been great if the company had been honest with us all and shared its great success? Not withstanding the fact that we did get a bonus last year, a realistic salary review is long past due.
I do believe that the company have taken advantage of the global downturn and held back any chances of a better remuneration package. Our salaries and 'package' are based on a comparison with many carriers worldwide. This is totally flawed because those other carriers may have been deeply affected after the last few years of poor industry performance, yet EK has returned record profits year after year. As someone mentioned earlier in another thread, there's a lot of smoke and mirrors and you yourself say that the compnay can get away with it because of the lack of options. Now consider this, would it not have been great if the company had been honest with us all and shared its great success? Not withstanding the fact that we did get a bonus last year, a realistic salary review is long past due.
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: uae
Posts: 2,777
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
read again, I did not say I was enjoying my time here and I am infact peeved with the current T/C's.
I said I enjoyed flying with the non complainers and that EK is getting away with the current T/C's.
I said I enjoyed flying with the non complainers and that EK is getting away with the current T/C's.
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 78
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Jarops,
It would really be nice if EK treated it's pilots, cabin crew, Engineers et al with some respect. The 'perceived' reality is that nobody (Middle management upwards) gives a Monkey's Doo Dah about employees in the Company. Instead they worry about keeping their jobs, saying the right thing and protecting their nice, swollen bonuses come profit share.
With record Flight & CC sickness, the lowest morale I've seen in my time here, coupled with a 5% divorce rate (@ 50 out of 1000 pilots), you can see why people are negative. It 'seems' to be all take and no give. It's not necessarily down to money; try humility & respect for starters.
An example; a recent CC I flew with went sick and she got a note from the Dr. She then received a letter in her file warning her that 'any further transgressions would be seriously dealt with'. For your info; she has NEVER been sick since she's been here. So now I am flying with CC who ARE sick, and are too scared to go to the Dr. Oh, and a CC member who now wants to cut her career short.
Does that sound right to you?
So, it's not all negative Jarops, and of course we moan. But if there is NO way to officially express the frustration we feel without being labelled a trouble maker and getting a letter on our files, it needs to be vented somewhere. PPRUNE & the Flight Deck are the perfect choices I guess.
It's a BASIC human need to be heard. If people are ignored, the proverbial will hit the fan, either at work or in relationships with those we love. Try not listening to your wife or girlfriend! You'll soon end up like the 5% here.....
It would really be nice if EK treated it's pilots, cabin crew, Engineers et al with some respect. The 'perceived' reality is that nobody (Middle management upwards) gives a Monkey's Doo Dah about employees in the Company. Instead they worry about keeping their jobs, saying the right thing and protecting their nice, swollen bonuses come profit share.
With record Flight & CC sickness, the lowest morale I've seen in my time here, coupled with a 5% divorce rate (@ 50 out of 1000 pilots), you can see why people are negative. It 'seems' to be all take and no give. It's not necessarily down to money; try humility & respect for starters.
An example; a recent CC I flew with went sick and she got a note from the Dr. She then received a letter in her file warning her that 'any further transgressions would be seriously dealt with'. For your info; she has NEVER been sick since she's been here. So now I am flying with CC who ARE sick, and are too scared to go to the Dr. Oh, and a CC member who now wants to cut her career short.
Does that sound right to you?
So, it's not all negative Jarops, and of course we moan. But if there is NO way to officially express the frustration we feel without being labelled a trouble maker and getting a letter on our files, it needs to be vented somewhere. PPRUNE & the Flight Deck are the perfect choices I guess.
It's a BASIC human need to be heard. If people are ignored, the proverbial will hit the fan, either at work or in relationships with those we love. Try not listening to your wife or girlfriend! You'll soon end up like the 5% here.....
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Global Nomad
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Did you get both sides of the story to ensure a balanced view regarding this CC member, or is this another one sided point of view making its way via chinese whispers?
The world would be a better place if society could achieve a 5% divorce rate, either the % is worse than that claimed or Emirates is not too bad a place for a married couple. Naturally we can also asssume that Emirates is not always the prime instigator of marriage failures.
Emirates management caring about people? I can recall a number of pilots and families that have been well looked after by the company in time of need.
As you express your anger, others must also see a balance.
The world would be a better place if society could achieve a 5% divorce rate, either the % is worse than that claimed or Emirates is not too bad a place for a married couple. Naturally we can also asssume that Emirates is not always the prime instigator of marriage failures.
Emirates management caring about people? I can recall a number of pilots and families that have been well looked after by the company in time of need.
As you express your anger, others must also see a balance.
Global Nomad,
Too right. When tragedy strikes you find no better employer. It is avery long list of those who have been very well taken care of.
It would be nice though, if the same consideration could be shown in the day to day operations as well.
Don
Too right. When tragedy strikes you find no better employer. It is avery long list of those who have been very well taken care of.
It would be nice though, if the same consideration could be shown in the day to day operations as well.
Don
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 78
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
GN: It was a story from a CC I got first hand. No Chinese whispers. As a line pilot, you must have come across many examples. Assuming that is, you are...
It was also meant to be an example of what negatively happens on a daily basis. I was talking about a 'perception' that pervades the Company. Nobody remembers the good stuff, which is a shame. To be balanced: I totally agree that when you have a 'personal' problem, EK management can be excellent at looking after its workers. But then again, these aren't the Managers that affect our work environment or the one's we're talking about. Don summed it up otherwise
As for 5% being a good percentage; that's great news. I'll just go and get married .... again....
It was also meant to be an example of what negatively happens on a daily basis. I was talking about a 'perception' that pervades the Company. Nobody remembers the good stuff, which is a shame. To be balanced: I totally agree that when you have a 'personal' problem, EK management can be excellent at looking after its workers. But then again, these aren't the Managers that affect our work environment or the one's we're talking about. Don summed it up otherwise
As for 5% being a good percentage; that's great news. I'll just go and get married .... again....
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Oz
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Of course it is relevant. With T&C's sharply eroded,goal posts being shifted all the time. The pressure is going to build up somewhere.Even if its putting a budget on the family it all causes problems.The 5% is only the confirmed ones what about all the other cases on the way?
I to have seen cases where management have really gone out of their way to help guys who have had tradgedy strike them and for that they need to be commended. It is now time for them to fix the day to day concerns of the work force, and we can only hope that this in some way improves morale.
I to have seen cases where management have really gone out of their way to help guys who have had tradgedy strike them and for that they need to be commended. It is now time for them to fix the day to day concerns of the work force, and we can only hope that this in some way improves morale.
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: min rest
Posts: 424
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The divorce rate in the late 70's of pilots in Gulf Air and CX was said to have reached 80%.
A London divorce lawyer commented...I have never come across such a supposedly educated group of men who insist on digging their financial graves with their pricks.
With the introduction of min rest and max rostering the figures dropped, however true proffesionals managed two and real aces three divorces during their careers.
A London divorce lawyer commented...I have never come across such a supposedly educated group of men who insist on digging their financial graves with their pricks.
With the introduction of min rest and max rostering the figures dropped, however true proffesionals managed two and real aces three divorces during their careers.
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Dubai, U.A.E.
Posts: 222
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Most airlines take care of colleagues in need!! This is not an EK only attribute. That would be the day!If a colleague is in need of assistance and they refuse to assist. So this is not something new to EK management. And I speak from experience, with this airline and my previous one.
So where were we? Aaah yes! They must catch a wake up and start treating all of us with the appropriate work ethics that is expected of a first class airline. Because I am not a second class citizen and neither are my colleagues.
Hey EK management! No need to "keep discovering" we are already here!! So listen up and pay attention to what your colleagues are telling you!
Check Six
So where were we? Aaah yes! They must catch a wake up and start treating all of us with the appropriate work ethics that is expected of a first class airline. Because I am not a second class citizen and neither are my colleagues.
Hey EK management! No need to "keep discovering" we are already here!! So listen up and pay attention to what your colleagues are telling you!
Check Six
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SE ASIA
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
IT'S ALL DUE TO USD FALLING
All this talk about leaving... blah, blah, blah.... is bull****.
It's all due to the USD falling and all you fellows from Ozzieland and Eu-land are not so happy. You guys were mostly bush pilots before and had no or very little experience...especially on widebodies..if not for Emirates...just because you are born with the skin colour and so called better CLASS/BORN PILOTS.
Now you talk big, talk nonsense and most of all ungrateful. You count your fat ass good luck tat you got a good job like now. And don't waste my time making me read your stupid complain..like small kids/brats.
I dare you.. JUST LEAVE, THROW IN YOUR RESIGNATION LETTERS.. IF YOU GOT THE ......balls.
It's all due to the USD falling and all you fellows from Ozzieland and Eu-land are not so happy. You guys were mostly bush pilots before and had no or very little experience...especially on widebodies..if not for Emirates...just because you are born with the skin colour and so called better CLASS/BORN PILOTS.
Now you talk big, talk nonsense and most of all ungrateful. You count your fat ass good luck tat you got a good job like now. And don't waste my time making me read your stupid complain..like small kids/brats.
I dare you.. JUST LEAVE, THROW IN YOUR RESIGNATION LETTERS.. IF YOU GOT THE ......balls.
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: ME
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Crewlounge aka: Albatosser/VVV:
I know I shouldn't but such unadulterated ignorance shouldn't go unanswered:
Pilots are leaving. Pilots aren't turning up for courses.
USD falling: 30% over 3 years, yes it is a major factor.
Ozzies/European bush pilots? Not many bush operators with 737/747/767/330s... (767/747 are widebodies by the way). Oh and the experienced Ozzies & Europeans make up the majority of the work force which also helps keep the insurance premiums down.
Skin colour/class....you have serious issues you sad person if you think this is a racist/status issue.
Take your own advice and don't waste your time reading these posts and we won't waste our time reading yours.
I know I shouldn't but such unadulterated ignorance shouldn't go unanswered:
Pilots are leaving. Pilots aren't turning up for courses.
USD falling: 30% over 3 years, yes it is a major factor.
Ozzies/European bush pilots? Not many bush operators with 737/747/767/330s... (767/747 are widebodies by the way). Oh and the experienced Ozzies & Europeans make up the majority of the work force which also helps keep the insurance premiums down.
Skin colour/class....you have serious issues you sad person if you think this is a racist/status issue.
Take your own advice and don't waste your time reading these posts and we won't waste our time reading yours.