Not so great news for an 18 year old

[Captainkarl]

Bad news guys, its about time you knew so I can ask many questions! lol

Recently diagnosed with type 1 (Insulin Dependant Diabetes) as you know thats any Professional Career and my PPL course gone :-( (That was the heartbreaking part for me ) I am going for the NPPL so I will have something. However I was wondering are there any countries in the ENTIRE world excluding the CAA & FAA that may possibly issue a person with a medical to fly professionally on the proviso they have all the relevant info/proof that its well managed etc etc?

Thankyou
Guys

[redsnail]

I think you might be out of luck if you're insulin dependant.

Australia's CASA medical has this to say. Look up 2.4.4 for details.

Australia's Medical Branch is pretty reasonable but they do draw the line if you need to inject insulin.

Sorry.

[Old Smokey]

NON MEDICALLY QUALIFIED RESPONSE HERE!!!!!

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the answer is goeing to be a categoric "NO wherever you turn.

I know this from hard fact with my daughter who was grounded with Type 1 diabetes early in her flying training.

Her rejection as cabin crew followed in close pursuit.

You say that you are well controlled Captainkarl, and good for you! Good control does take a lot of personal discipline and a thorough understanding of your condition. My daughter remains well controlled also, but 15 years down the track still has the occasional little "hypo", enough to make flying dangerous.

THAT WAS A NON MEDICALLY QUALIFIED RESPONSE!!!!!

Best regards, and good luck with the next-best alternative

Old Smokey

[RobertS975]

This may be painful to hear, but the rule is a good one. The effects of hypoglycemia can be quite insidious... they can sneak up on a diabetic rapidly, with little or no warning, and rob you of the ability to even comprehend what is wrong with you.

Obviously, the same thing can happen to you while driving a car, but the effects would obviously be more dramatic at the controls of an airplane. Throw in crazy hours, crazy eating patterns, time zone changes etc, and a professional flying career (at least as an airline pilot) is not a great idea for an insulin dependent diabetic.

[Blues&twos]

The Times headline today

"Diabetics cured by stem-cell treatment"

Don't know if this will be of any use, but might be worth looking into.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/lif...cle1637528.ece

If this is true, this is quite an exciting development.

[cotterpot]

Diabetics cured by stem-cell treatment

I noted that it is not as yet a permanent cure - the people treated were only in remission for up to 6 months

[Whirlybird]

Karl,

I only just read this, as I rarely frequent this forum. We've talked sometimes in the past, and you have my heartfelt sympathy.

Now, as to what you're going to do with your life....

As others have said, forget flying professionally....illegal everywhere, and probably unsafe no matter how well managed your diabetes is. I'm not a medical expert, but I think that's the sad truth. I've heard vaguely about this stem cell stuff, and it may well be a real cure in the future; you're young, so you never know. But don't rely on it.

So, get an NPPL, and then you can fly. So all is not lost aviation-wise. As for what you're going to do career-wise, there ARE other things (honest!). You need to look at WHY you want to be a pilot, basically, deep down. Is it an interest primarily in aircraft and aviation? Become an aeronautical engineer. Is it the excitement? There are other exciting careers. Is it the seeing farflung places? Get involved in the travel and tourism industry. Is it the respect and making lots of money? In that case a law degree, as suggested, and many others, will provide that. And the money will enable you to do lots of flying for fun, when and where you want. Some other reason? Well, there are still alternatives.

I used to be an occupational psychologist, and this is how vocational guidance works; you look at people's basic motivations (and abilities, but I get the feeling you're bright enough to do most things if you really want to), and then find out what's likely to satisfy those, and usually there are lots of alternatives. You just haven't seen them, because you were focusing on being a pilot. Tunnel vision, in a way.

If you read PPRuNe, it may be hard to believe, but there is a whole huge wide world out there, with loads of interesting, satisfying things you can do, and it's yours for the taking. And then you can fly in your spare time, doing the sort of flying YOU want. And believe me, once you're doing it for a living, to a certain extent it becomes "just a job"....OK, only to a certain extent. That won't happen for you.

Trust me, it may not feel like it at the moment, but you'll be fine.

[Genghis the Engineer]

Well, there's no need for a medical for most aeronautical engineering jobs - and many of them are absolutely fascinating (I've done more than most).

If you don't have the aptitude to pass an engineering degree (or prefer to work more manually) you can, if you have the aptitude for that, look at working as a licenced engineer.

If you can hold a DVLA/NPPL medical then you can become a microlight instructor professionally - it won't make you rich, but I know a lot of very happy microlight instructors with a lot of flying hours between them.

I suspect (I'm sure that you can look this up) that it's also possible to become a commercial balloon pilot.

Your options have been limited, but not eliminated.

G

[beechgal]

Whirlybird,

Your encouraging and optimistic outlook is refreshing I have been asked the very same question by a close friend who is a pilot... what are the real reasons for wanting to fly?

Captainkarl... i can relate to how you feel I am also keen to get started on my flight training, but the medical is the only damper to my enthusiasm. A few years ago, i started getting heart palpitations which warranted my doctor to send me to a specialist. After a halter ECG and the routine tests, the results were inconclusive other than the fact that i developed tachycardia at irregular times. My faith in the medical profession wavered, and i left it at that, but the palpitations continued, and got worse when i went through a very stressful period. Also have a family history of diabetes but thankfully have not developed the condition as of yet. I am very apprehensive of the initial medical, which i am certain, will pick up this condition, and the idea that:

1. I will be prodded at like a guinea pig waiting to hear the ominous news and
2. the possibility that my flight training may be nothing more than a passionate dream unfulfilled

leaves me very uneasy and disheartened.

I have various qualifications i can fall back on as a last resort, but at this point in my life, i was hoping for a change in direction and pace, and my passion for flying and enthusiasm surrounding aviation made me wonder if maybe this would be a prospective line of work to get involved in. A lot of my friends are contract pilots, and i have seen and heard that the road ahead is very challenging, so you could say i am at a cross-roads regarding the choices i have to make regarding a future career in aviation, as well as if i will even stand a chance with the medical issues i have mentioned.

Any uplifting advice?

[Whirlybird]

beechgal,

I have no idea how old you are or what your circumstances are. However, if you have something to fall back on that will earn you a living, you're not taking that huge a risk in trying for a career as a pilot. But do you really, really want to? Do you really, really want to spend your whole life worrying about the next medical? Especially as you probably have a higher than average chance of some medical condition stopping you from flying at some point, even if you're OK now. Is it really worth it?

I'm not sure, but I get the feeling your enthusiasm is for aviation as a whole rather than flying. OK then. As Genghis suggests, become an aeronautical engineer. Or a microlight instructor - you don't need a Class 1 medical for that. Or run a flying school, or an airfield. Or do something else related to aviation and management. Or become a groundschool instructor. Or an aviation writer. Or an aviation salesman. Or.....an aviation something-or-other that I haven't heard of yet. There are all sorts of aviation-related things you can do, other than sitting in a cramped cockpit flying from A to B all day -or night - long.

I don't know if that's 'uplifting', but hopefully it makes sense.

[Oh that's super!]

Beechgal,

I have to agree with Whirlybird here (except that there IS quite a lot to lose in terms of financial commitment of getting the licence etc). Also if stress makes your condition worse, flying may not be a great thing for you - it does have lots of stressful moments. Maybe it would be worthwhile for you to look at different areas of aviation as Whirlybird suggested?

[beechgal]

Thanks for your comments and viewpoints. They are all valid and have given me something to think about It has also made me re-evaluate the reasons i do want to fly.

I know that it would be heart-breaking and disappointing if i could never do a solo on my own, which brings me to my next point. If you are diagnosed with a condition which will prevent you from flying, can you still do some form of flight training with the condition that you can only fly with an instructor?? Is there such a licence that only allows you to fly with an instructor?

I would appreciate any further advice.

[Whirlybird]

beechgal,

There's no such thing as a licence that only allows you to fly with an instructor, but I've heard of several people who always fly with instructors for one reason or another. An instructor friend of mine has a "student" who is an ex-world war 2 pilot; he's elderly and doesn't feel safe flying alone an/or can't get a licence, but he regularly flies himself to another airfield with my friend sitting there and doing very little, but just making sure he's safe.

However, if you go for an NPPL you only need to be up to the standard for an HGV medical to be able to carry passengers, or the medical standard needed to drive a car so long as you only fly alone. There aren't that many people who can't manage that.

So the bottom line is....YOU CAN FLY!!!!!!!!! It's the details that may differ.

[QDMQDMQDM]

Captainkarl... i can relate to how you feel I am also keen to get started on my flight training, but the medical is the only damper to my enthusiasm. A few years ago, i started getting heart palpitations which warranted my doctor to send me to a specialist. After a halter ECG and the routine tests, the results were inconclusive other than the fact that i developed tachycardia at irregular times. My faith in the medical profession wavered, and i left it at that, but the palpitations continued, and got worse when i went through a very stressful period. Also have a family history of diabetes but thankfully have not developed the condition as of yet. I am very apprehensive of the initial medical, which i am certain, will pick up this condition, and the idea that:
1. I will be prodded at like a guinea pig waiting to hear the ominous news and
2. the possibility that my flight training may be nothing more than a passionate dream unfulfilled

beechgal,
You're being a touch histrionic here. There is nothing in what you have said which will definitely prevent you getting a Class 1 medical. I don't think you have reason to be particularly apprehensive of your initial medical, based on what you have said. It is highly unlikely to pick up diabetes simply because you have a family history of it. The palpitations need looking into, but may turn out to be nothing serious.

(Only Type 2 diabetes, which comes on in middle to old age, runs in families. Type 1 diabetes, which affects younger people, does not.)

If you seriously want to become a commercial pilot, go and try for the Class 1 medical. On the other hand, if you are getting in such a state about the medical, perhaps you do need to ask yourself if you are temperamentally suited to being a professional pilot. (Whirlybird will tell me off for saying this, but I think it is worth mentioning.)

QDM

[Whirlybird]

If you seriously want to become a commercial pilot, go and try for the Class 1 medical. On the other hand, if you are getting in such a state about the medical, perhaps you do need to ask yourself if you are temperamentally suited to being a professional pilot. (Whirlybird will tell me off for saying this, but I think it is worth mentioning.)

Well, for the record, I get in a state about every medical, but I cope quite happily with students trying to kill me. Make of that what you will.

[beechgal]

QDM,

My mum unfortunately did develop Type2 diabetes later in life, which is why i am concerned. However, i am seriously considering starting out with my PPL and seeing where that takes me, since the commercial route is financially demanding as well as medically, and i want to be sure it is what i really want to do Who knows, i may be just happy to fly as a hobby At this stage, i am keeping all possibilities open and closing no doors!

Thanks for your advice again

PS Whirlybird, i get into a state everytime i have to go to the doctor which is why i haven't gone back for such a long time!

[Captainkarl]

About time I made a post.

Hello all, thankyou for your messages. I am doing very well thank you, no major dangerous hypos, only had 1, where the very early stages of getting a perculiar feeling occurred and I treated this correctly.

Just been fleeced out of £86 for NPPL medical, for my GP to put he doesnt want me to fly solo for 12 months and that I must fly with a qualified pilot.... so I need to do a little more solo flying to gain my NPPL but cant....mad any who my CFI has been digging around and contacting the nessesary people, now my Diabetic Nurse and Dr/consultant :-) have got to contact the AOPA's chief medical man so he can find more and sooo on.

Any who, If anyone has questions about diabetes ask me, I am an expert now!lol I have learnt so much about the condition just a lot of reading really.

Bye for now

Karl

[PPL152]

Type 1 diabetes is one of the many types of diseases caused by some kind of disorder of the immune system. It is in fact thought to be an autoimmune disease where the body attacks the alpha cells of the pancreas (those which produce insulin).

Unfortunately, unless scientists find an alternative cure (other than taking in insulin), it can't be cured.

However, I consider you are lucky on one side because all of us here have been bitten by the aviation bug and all the wannabes struggle their way through (financially... mostly... then emotionally, physically, mentally) etc etc to get their licences etc etc!

At least, you got rid of that and can move on to a different career, which may at the end offer you what you have been really looking for! Good luck!!

[gingernut]

PS Whirlybird, i get into a state everytime i have to go to the doctor

so do I mate, and I work there

In all seriousness beechgal, I'd say QDM has hit the nail on the head. No-ones gonna prod you around and use you as a guinea pig, I know nothing of the aviation medical process, other than having to pay my dosh every few years for my renewal, but from my years of trawling this board, it's pretty obvious that their not out to get you

If you really want it,go for it, what have you got to lose?

[world]

Try www.leftseat.com (Pilot medical solution).
They helped a lot of pilots with medical problems

Good luck - i wish those stupid rules change