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Ryanair interviews and sim assessments - 2

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Ryanair interviews and sim assessments - 2

Old 26th Aug 2021, 17:32
  #141 (permalink)  
 
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Hi ryanair recruitment

I was wondering if you have been put on to unpaid leave this winter as most of your colleagues in uk are about to get this winter? Have you also had a 50% paycut last year? How would you feel if you had and ryanair were hiring more kids to go into the recruitment department to take more work from you?

just asking for a friend (about 5000 pilots…!)

Last edited by UAV689; 26th Aug 2021 at 21:46.
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Old 27th Aug 2021, 09:53
  #142 (permalink)  
 
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RYRCadetRecruitment,

1.) Now we are heading into another Covid winter what are the plans for those Cadets that have been line training this summer? Will they be offered contracts immediately upon conclusion of their training contracts and will said contracts follow suit of other UK based crews, 50% part time and unpaid leave over winter?

2.) What are the terms being offered to Second Officers? What is the base salary and is there a minimum hours guarantee?

3.) For those applying now I assume its for summer 2022 with a view to start TR spring 2022?

4.) Why don’t cadets receive a salary during TR and what additional costs need to be covered by the cadet throughout the process and what does this approximately surmount to?

5.) How are current Ryanair SO’s / FO’s going to survive over winter without taking employment elsewhere?

6.) Are line training Cadets being used ahead of current Ryr FOs over the summer period as a cost saving measure or is everyone flying equally? What guarantee can you give to those who get offered Second Officer contracts that their hours won’t be cut in favour of the next-instafamous-paying-skygod?

7.) Can you put the record straight as to whether this is a legitimate job opportunity with facts to back that up for those who wish to have a long and successful career with Ryanair and that this isn’t a scam to screw over current employees or cadets as those here have discussed.

Hello Everyone,
There seems to be a lot of rumours and incorrect information posted here! If anyone has any questions about the AFA cadet Programme or Ryanair itself, please ask them below so you can hear the correct info!
I feel like these questions would provide valuable information for those considering your cadet program. Paying 30K for a 6 month-16k salary contract with no guarantees on job retention particularly during a pandemic is understandably a huge concern for your future employees many of whom have already spent upwards of 60k for the pleasure to simply apply for your scheme. Sustainability must of course be a concern for yourselves to match the growing demand and expansions you promote. If you’re going to need the crew then isn’t it better to ensure you offer a viable option and security for those to join?

Last edited by Contact Approach; 27th Aug 2021 at 11:29.
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Old 27th Aug 2021, 14:15
  #143 (permalink)  
 
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In answer to point 5, they cant. Even captains now work outside of ryanair. From post men, to amazon drivers to truckers. They cannot survive now on this pay cut.

But don’t worry, everyone must take the hit for MoL to get that 100m bonus.
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Old 4th Sep 2021, 23:29
  #144 (permalink)  
 
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Does anyone know what's in the line training contract terms and conditions? Are the T and C just as bad as the TR contract? The last webinar is kinda dead with very few questions, possibly run out of people with 30k to drop.
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Old 6th Sep 2021, 09:24
  #145 (permalink)  
 
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Hello all,

Short question on the 6-month training contract that Ryanair mentioned during their webinar. What I do not understand is whether the contract starts the day of the TR or the day of the base training + 6 months.

Thank you in advance!
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Old 6th Sep 2021, 12:05
  #146 (permalink)  
 
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After Base training, before Line training
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 01:18
  #147 (permalink)  
 
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After a longer break I had to read the forum again and its kind of the same stuff again people do not understand economics and the basic law of supply and demand. If someone got offered to be submarine/supercruiser captain or fly SU-57, F-22 etc itd. a lot of ppl would pay a lot of money and complete a lot of training to do it and pay in addition to be allowed to do it. While for example being a funeral bureau worker even if it does not take much training and pays highly even in nations like Poland.... well people do not want to.

The law of supply and demand apply to everything and you cannot expect to do something a lot of people find fun and expect to be paid for your whole effort or have proper return on your investment its because the supply is too high. Personally I even slowed down finishing my FI and doing 200h flying around to get IRI and yes its mostly cause I am satisfied with business income, but also I dont want to take a spot from anyone who can fly better than me just because "some planes and sim are mine so I will do it before anyone else". If I will fly anything as instructor or perform airline transport its when I will know I am good enough compared to others who want to, what it pays its not as important as if its enjoyable. But if people wanna do something they genuinely like to do and know a lot of people enjoy they can really not expect it will give high return on invested time and money. It will not in any kind of job because the supply will always be higher than the demand.
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 07:09
  #148 (permalink)  
 
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Thank you aviator30.

So realistically and depending on the season, after those 6 months we could be looking at 300-500h total time?
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 07:22
  #149 (permalink)  
 
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People need to stop with this idea you shouldn’t be paid to fly because they think it’s fun or it’s their dream, that soon gets old after a week without food. You should be paid to work, that’s exactly how it should be. You cannot invest thousands on licences and then accept not being remunerated in return, you need to live, life is expensive, that’s simple economics. Your rent needs paying, your loans need repaying, your bills need paying, your groceries need buying, your car needs gas, your taxis, trains, buses all need paying. Your cabin crew gets paid, your dispatcher gets paid, your baggage handlers get paid, your engineers get paid, your HR dept gets paid, your bosses get paid, your atc gets paid, your cleaners get paid, your airline gets paid. Why on earth should you not get paid!?

Don’t do it.

Last edited by Contact Approach; 7th Sep 2021 at 07:41.
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 07:46
  #150 (permalink)  
 
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Lovely memos out today to Uk crews saying they will be forced on to part time and UL this winter.

its getting very tedious now. If you are over crewed, stop recruiting, and start redundancies. Stop taking money off your staff to help MoL get his 100m bonus.

ryanair recruitment, how can you justify your jib, with behaviour like that? Is it satisfying to work in an environment like this? To be part of the machinery that rips off your colleagues, because its orders you must follow? Get your moral compass swung asap. Its disgusting how this company views its staff.

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Old 7th Sep 2021, 07:57
  #151 (permalink)  
 
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Is this because of the UK Government's handling of Covid related travel restrictions?
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 08:20
  #152 (permalink)  
 
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UAV689

Where does that leave the Line training cadets that started this year? Have they been offered perm contracts or have they also been forgotten about?
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 09:48
  #153 (permalink)  
 
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The worst part of all the above is people justifying such practices which are against us, all of us. Being a pilot is amazing but still a job. You offer your services and you should be paid accordingly. Paying 30k UPFRONT without knowing what's coming tomorrow is no different than gambling. Ryanair is taking advantage of the tragic situation that aviation is experiencing worldwide to increase its profits. Yes, possibly some of the cadets will continue flying after the line training. But it's highly probable that they won't. Or at least not enough to live decently. Would you apply for Ryanair If you knew that at winter you would be flying once a week or month? I repeat. If NO ONE applied for Ryanair's cadet program with these terms they would have to change it ON OUR BENEFIT. People fail to understand they have the power to change things for the better. Unfortunately this does not affect only them but us all.
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 12:15
  #154 (permalink)  
 
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If this is limited to the UK only, I guess Covid and Brexit could have something to do with it.
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 13:23
  #155 (permalink)  
 
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That's what I thought but I realise it's hard to get an unbiased opinion on this very specific argument.
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 16:01
  #156 (permalink)  
 
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@Contact approach: Of course everything needs to be paid, so maybe the idea is that people think if they have the funds for it before choosing an enjoyable job (that require extremely costly training) that they know lots of others also want to perform. Its the law of supply and demand. Jobs that are unpleasant or like a never ending chore do not have the same supply of people willing to perform them and therefore have to be paid much higher if the employer is to get someone to perform it. Sometimes people even do those jobs so they can spend the money on something they enjoy like flying for example if they do not have other sources of income that can finance their passions.

If people thought about it before going for it then the supply would be much lower and then maybe the salaries would be like people wish, but if people keep following their dream without having the funds for it then the supply will be endless and without the demand going up the salaries will ofc go down. What can you expect if there are people all out of money who "followed the dream" and have only their fATPL in hand or maybe even debt. Those people will always be endless supply for any airline and if demand goes down some will even pay to keep their ratings. All the other non pilot crew can also perform their jobs at other employers than airlines without losing their qualifications so they will always be paid or else they just go.

As for people who are extremely good at flying its their passion they are the best of the best but do not have funds for it in case the market is bad, well they can always check how much the best they are at the military instead of taking loans for civilian training there in most countries the best of the best always get to fly and get paid (yes nepotism is also present in militaries but its another topic and does not take up all spots). Its like with sport (just worse because safe operation do not require someone to be the best in the world or top 100) the talented people get paid training, the rest would be crazy to follow the dream without funds hoping to become a pro. If someone do not have the necessary talent to pass military check before flight training for free, maybe they should think about it if they have the funds to follow their hobby because if they do not well it is where the supply chain starts and how it ends with what it is. And it will not change unless 1 of 2 things happen, medicore people without funds stop starting their I want to be a professional pilot career by bank loans (imagine someone starting their I want to be professional F1 driver with bankloan) or the demand for flights become so high all over the world that there actually are spots for ALL (if someone good enough is left outside there will always be that someone willing to do the job cheaper to get someone elses spot) good enough medicore pilots in the cockpit. In contrast to sport it is not a competition so professional medicore pilot who can guarantee 100 % safe operation will always be preferred for half price by the business owners, they wont pay double for "skygod" if its not required for safe operation and they will not wish to make the selection so hard that only "skygods" can pass it since the airline owners interest is to keep supply high.
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 19:38
  #157 (permalink)  
 
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It has nothing to do with brexit or uk gov handling. In fact it could be argued that uk gov furlough scheme has made it cheaper for ryr to furlough staff and get the new cadets to fly for less.

Dont forget new cadets pay twice the market rate for a rating, and in their first year, earn about 15k. So they are effectively paying their own wages...I thought pilots were supposed to be good at maths…

It is purely down to greed. Some wierd types in hq that are dazzled by MoL and sit in front of a spreadsheet trying to save him a few quid so he can make that 100m bonus. I can think of a few of the names, they are on the bottom of the latest memos…they are so removed from reality, its down to a couple of options.

Either they are too narrowminded to realise the hardship crews have endured, or they literally do not care, and see the numbers on their spreadsheets not as people, fathers, wives, trying to support their families, but as “cost saving levers” to be pulled at will to get their beloved Molly his bonus. To short sighted to realise that he would bin them in a heartbeat as well if it were to suit him. But hey, its just orders isnt it…

They are so short sighted, not to realise that they to are getting shafted by him just as much, hq is full of kids and interns and ex cabin crew that don’t realise how underpaid they are.

One ex cc and now ops lad in stn has spent 10 years in the company, and he is off to earn 12k a year as a window cleaner. Christ on a bike, what were ryr paying him after 10 years if thats his progression…

Speaking of cabin crew, a recent course of over 30 crew, after 3 days on the line 27 quit when they found out they would earn about £400 a month.

Its an utterly disgusting corporate culture, and notice the so called ryr recruiter has not commented on any of this, I would hope that they might be looking at their conscience, but it’s unlikely, after all “its orders” or “if I dont do it someone else will”…I think both those defences were throw out of courts long ago….

its a shame that mankind is so weak now. That we as a workforce allow our own colleagues to treat each other like this, and that the colleagues that do this to us, are to scared themselves to question it, or say “hang on lads, enough is enough, we are killing them here”, but they are all too scared themselves to speak up. Cowards on both sides of Mollys puppet strings.

If ryr pilots were in the RAF during WW2 then europe would be a different continent right now!

Last edited by UAV689; 7th Sep 2021 at 20:04.
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 19:58
  #158 (permalink)  
 
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they will never get perm contracts. Self employed gig is back in full swing at ryr. They wont get a contract for years, if ever.
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Old 7th Sep 2021, 21:24
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Sorry, it makes no sense at all.

Is Ryan hiring for UK bases too?
There are other countries where the furlough scheme is totally up to the State, why isn't Ryan doing the same there?
Is this memo a UK only thing?
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Old 8th Sep 2021, 05:23
  #160 (permalink)  
 
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it makes perfect sense. Every winter we are quieter, but you still got paid. Now they will wiggle out of paying us.

they will do the same everywhere.

dont forget half the company is buzz now, all contractor airlines, so they dont even need to tell them, they are all zero hour contracts anyway…
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