BA and Project Columbus III
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The stunning thing is that some of our colleagues still think they are on minimum wage!! On the comments after the Times article yesterday, there were people stating what they get after they have paid National Insurance, Pension/BARP contributions, Crewcard and tax, and trying to get sympathy.
I think that timesonline graphic is fair enough. It does represent the truth.
Lets face it, a 9 day Singapore, £762 for most, £905 for the CSD............and a dinner in the food court costs 4 SIN $. Its a fact. How many crew do you see rush down to the supermarket to stock up for their 48 hours. We cant honestly say that we take 3 meals in the hotel restaurant, can we?
One thing it really highlights is the differential between CSD's allowances and the rest of us. I am now, more than ever, sure that BASSA really does stand for British Airways Senior Stewards (or Stewadresses) Association.
If we cant attract enough people onto the aircraft, and cant entice them to part with enough cash for their seats, we are going to have to alter, and yes, shock horror, probably reduce our remuneration. We will have to make sacrifices, maybe work a bit longer than we had planned, so that we can make ends meet now.
This is our opportunity to control our destiny, if only BASSA will allow us.
Otherwise the future will be dictated to us.
I think that timesonline graphic is fair enough. It does represent the truth.
Lets face it, a 9 day Singapore, £762 for most, £905 for the CSD............and a dinner in the food court costs 4 SIN $. Its a fact. How many crew do you see rush down to the supermarket to stock up for their 48 hours. We cant honestly say that we take 3 meals in the hotel restaurant, can we?
One thing it really highlights is the differential between CSD's allowances and the rest of us. I am now, more than ever, sure that BASSA really does stand for British Airways Senior Stewards (or Stewadresses) Association.
If we cant attract enough people onto the aircraft, and cant entice them to part with enough cash for their seats, we are going to have to alter, and yes, shock horror, probably reduce our remuneration. We will have to make sacrifices, maybe work a bit longer than we had planned, so that we can make ends meet now.
This is our opportunity to control our destiny, if only BASSA will allow us.
Otherwise the future will be dictated to us.
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According to the whispers I'm hearing about the results of the Inland Revenue tax review many of our colleagues in the cabin are going to have to rein in their expenditure a little more soon. Having failed to go out and spend their meal allowances the Revenue are planning a sizeable hike in the taxation.
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Although this has got all the crew laughing their socks off
Quote from JP Europe, times-on line have your say.
Also, what about us commuting cabin crew? I have to spend out of my pay for staff travel to get to London before I even start work! I have to get up 10hrs before I start work, its hard, and then crew don't accept we need first rest. Also, pay converted euros is less now, we need extra to cover it!
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the Revenue are planning a sizeable hike in the taxation
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Andyismyname
What grounds would BASSA have for having a strike?
We cant honestly say that we take 3 meals in the hotel restaurant, can we?
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Incorrect Ham Phisted.
The BACC (BALPAs BA team) has accepted a package of cuts which will be presented to the pilots to vote on by the end of the month.
Nothing has been agreed, but at least BALPA has a package to propose to their members unlike some head in the sand 1970s groups.
I find it amazing ho much incorrect data has been posted by so many people on this thread. Please folk, just post fact not ill informed opinion or speculation.
Its clear from BALPA that the Inland revenue is reducing the pilots tax free percentage of our TAFB payments (time away from base) but nowhere near as painfully as the cabin crews allowance tax free percentage will be reduced by.
The BACC (BALPAs BA team) has accepted a package of cuts which will be presented to the pilots to vote on by the end of the month.
Nothing has been agreed, but at least BALPA has a package to propose to their members unlike some head in the sand 1970s groups.
I find it amazing ho much incorrect data has been posted by so many people on this thread. Please folk, just post fact not ill informed opinion or speculation.
Its clear from BALPA that the Inland revenue is reducing the pilots tax free percentage of our TAFB payments (time away from base) but nowhere near as painfully as the cabin crews allowance tax free percentage will be reduced by.
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There are no details of the BALPA proposals yet, infor will be sent out on Monday. Nor are there any firm details on the tax changes yet, just leaks from inside the review process that our rate is going up and yours is going up further.
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Good one open lies, you say
Then go on to say
So are you posting that as fact or is it indeed speculation cos as far I can tell you either know its a fact because your inside the BACC or it is indeed speculation.
Which is after all what the website is about
I find it amazing ho much incorrect data has been posted by so many people on this thread. Please folk, just post fact not ill informed opinion or speculation.
Its clear from BALPA that the Inland revenue is reducing the pilots tax free percentage of our TAFB payments (time away from base) but nowhere near as painfully as the cabin crews allowance tax free percentage will be reduced by.
Which is after all what the website is about
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One thing for sure, UK PLC needs more Tax revenue, the Tax man has some very smart ways of rewarding its staff in getting this money, most normal working people people will be paying more Tax in future, £750/£900 for a trip to Singapore, am sure the Tax man will be having his eyes on some of that.
.
Also need to remember, as normal working people get paid less or new types work for less money, the poor old Tax man will be working even harder, lean times ahead I think.
.
Also need to remember, as normal working people get paid less or new types work for less money, the poor old Tax man will be working even harder, lean times ahead I think.
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I have just read the [Edit]A-Scale NSP Sub Group [Edit ended] missive put around after their Monday meeting! Contains some great lines, and a few shocking ones.
I think this one is excellent and seems to set the tone of the meeting:
Oddly enough, management meetings can be considered part of the working day however meetings for a voluntary participation union group can, honestly, be considered different and outside of the working day.
To those who cannot understand why changes must be permanent. Please, please, please see past the fortress walls of the BASSA rhetoric and look at BA as a whole company. That company desperately needs investors. The major investors provide much of the liquidity that the company needs to continue trading in this current environment. Add to that that investors will want a dividend in the future as a return on their investments and you see the requirement to provide a robust business.
That 'robustness' has been severely tested over the past 15-20 years with every season kicking off with some sort of industrial dispute from one or another department. That is what needs to change. The myriad of rules, clauses, sub clauses and galley FM beliefs need to change. Managers needing to 'clarify' with BASSA if this or that schedule is 'OK'? Gotta go. Get rid of 'industrial' limits and all work to the same scheme.
Until this transparency of working condition is achieved across the board there will be an awful lot of reticence to invest in BA as the company currently stands. Until ALL unionised groups have the ability to engage in meaningful, constructive and adult discussions of disputes then investment will be shortcoming. This is why PERMANENT change is needed. It is not just to spite the workforce but to ensure that the company remains an attractive investment opportunity within the stock market. Lose that and the company will be ruined.
No I am not management, all I want to see is continued employment within the company I enjoy working for.
I think this one is excellent and seems to set the tone of the meeting:
The following Q&A is for the benefit of all those brave women and men of our community who could not be at the meeting. Management refused to release staff in company time but we subsequently heard time was found for management forums.
To those who cannot understand why changes must be permanent. Please, please, please see past the fortress walls of the BASSA rhetoric and look at BA as a whole company. That company desperately needs investors. The major investors provide much of the liquidity that the company needs to continue trading in this current environment. Add to that that investors will want a dividend in the future as a return on their investments and you see the requirement to provide a robust business.
That 'robustness' has been severely tested over the past 15-20 years with every season kicking off with some sort of industrial dispute from one or another department. That is what needs to change. The myriad of rules, clauses, sub clauses and galley FM beliefs need to change. Managers needing to 'clarify' with BASSA if this or that schedule is 'OK'? Gotta go. Get rid of 'industrial' limits and all work to the same scheme.
Until this transparency of working condition is achieved across the board there will be an awful lot of reticence to invest in BA as the company currently stands. Until ALL unionised groups have the ability to engage in meaningful, constructive and adult discussions of disputes then investment will be shortcoming. This is why PERMANENT change is needed. It is not just to spite the workforce but to ensure that the company remains an attractive investment opportunity within the stock market. Lose that and the company will be ruined.
No I am not management, all I want to see is continued employment within the company I enjoy working for.
Last edited by wobble2plank; 11th Jun 2009 at 18:57.
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Cabin Crew are not the only ones who work at BA - there are lots of others too and without all parts of the team, nothing would get off the ground.
The entire workforce of BA is under the gun and having to face changes to their working practices. Although I have sympathy for some of the old practices for crew being dismantled, I really wish they'd see the bigger picture.
If BA has a strike now, there's a very strong possibility the company will fold and thousands of us will be without work. Fine if you're a 25 year old crew member who can get another job.
Try being on the maturer side where work is IMPOSSIBLE to come by.
I work for BA and want to keep the job I enjoy. I'm on a measley salary but I'd rather have that than nothing at all.
Time for crew (and anyone else who thinks a strike is the answer) to stop being so selfish. If you continue that way I hope you won't be complaining when you're earning £5 an hour filling shelves at the local supermarket - you don't get allowances for that.
The entire workforce of BA is under the gun and having to face changes to their working practices. Although I have sympathy for some of the old practices for crew being dismantled, I really wish they'd see the bigger picture.
If BA has a strike now, there's a very strong possibility the company will fold and thousands of us will be without work. Fine if you're a 25 year old crew member who can get another job.
Try being on the maturer side where work is IMPOSSIBLE to come by.
I work for BA and want to keep the job I enjoy. I'm on a measley salary but I'd rather have that than nothing at all.
Time for crew (and anyone else who thinks a strike is the answer) to stop being so selfish. If you continue that way I hope you won't be complaining when you're earning £5 an hour filling shelves at the local supermarket - you don't get allowances for that.
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Industrial action : Directgov - Employment
useful info on this government website about the implications for people who chose to go on strike
useful info on this government website about the implications for people who chose to go on strike
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Actually the going rate for a supermarket worker where I live is more like £6. At least you'd be in your own bed every night. Mmm the idea of being a night shift shelf stacker, not having to interact with any of the general public does appeal to me!
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In that case Virginia you are clearly in the wrong job and should leave any customer service job immediately and enjoy your new salary of £6 (before tax) an hour unencumbered with the rest of the human race, especially those who pay your wages. Bon Voyage!
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ps You could be in your own bed if BASSA would let you do 4 sectors a day instead of whiling away unnecessary hours at Heathrow.
Last edited by Skylion; 11th Jun 2009 at 22:36. Reason: Spelling
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nuigini,
(I do apologise, I've learnt once how to quote, but forgotten-why don't we have a quote button here..!!)
I did say I thought any crew who fly for BA should be on the same salary and T&Cs. But other companies have brought in lower starting salaries, not just BA.
Re the destination payments. They're not always on the the same trips, 1 MIA might get one, the other may not, 'cos there are only so many to go round and they sometimes change with the schedule. To which trips they are attributed, is not set in stone.
On Mid-fleet, we too only got 2 days off after a US trip(1 day off was trialled for a few weeks
), I didn't mind that, we had bidding also and more control over our lives; when we worked, what time we finished and started etc.
Like I say, if you want a full answer to the destination payment question, why not ask on other 'in-house' forums.
GS-Alpha, thankyou for your reply.
(I do apologise, I've learnt once how to quote, but forgotten-why don't we have a quote button here..!!)
I did say I thought any crew who fly for BA should be on the same salary and T&Cs. But other companies have brought in lower starting salaries, not just BA.
Re the destination payments. They're not always on the the same trips, 1 MIA might get one, the other may not, 'cos there are only so many to go round and they sometimes change with the schedule. To which trips they are attributed, is not set in stone.
On Mid-fleet, we too only got 2 days off after a US trip(1 day off was trialled for a few weeks
), I didn't mind that, we had bidding also and more control over our lives; when we worked, what time we finished and started etc.Like I say, if you want a full answer to the destination payment question, why not ask on other 'in-house' forums.
GS-Alpha, thankyou for your reply.
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FloridaCandle,
I have done 20 years in BA, cabin crew is my third job in the company, and I agree with everything you say.
I personally think if more crew had worked elsewhere within the company, things would be different.
Yes, to most pax we are the face of BA, they spend longer with us than other depts within the company. But we need to remember that most other depts have already been downsized as far as they can go, so most people still at BA are very much needed to keep the company going.
We're all cogs in a very big wheel.
I have done 20 years in BA, cabin crew is my third job in the company, and I agree with everything you say.
I personally think if more crew had worked elsewhere within the company, things would be different.
Yes, to most pax we are the face of BA, they spend longer with us than other depts within the company. But we need to remember that most other depts have already been downsized as far as they can go, so most people still at BA are very much needed to keep the company going.
We're all cogs in a very big wheel.
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Hmmm why was the destination payment brought in?................it was because people used to go sick and avoid the trip. Even after the sickness policy revamp, the destination payment continues.
No wonder we are slowly going broke. Doh
No wonder we are slowly going broke. Doh