BA and Project Columbus III
Join Date: Apr 2009
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This year has only reinforced what I think we have allowed BASSA, and our alleged reps, to become.
BASSA (British Airways SENIOR Stewards (or Stewardesses) Association)
They are the gold plated Senior staff, looking after their gold plated selves.
I need the airline to survive long term to pay my bills long term.
BASSA (British Airways SENIOR Stewards (or Stewardesses) Association)
They are the gold plated Senior staff, looking after their gold plated selves.
I need the airline to survive long term to pay my bills long term.
Join Date: Sep 2006
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I'mastewardsothere,
I also need the company to survive. I get leaflets through the letterbox several times a week with local people advertising themselves. I chatted to a lovely lady who was posting her leaflets through, and she's been made redundant. She's got a Phd in something I can't pronounce, never mind spell, so very clever. She's been unable to find herself another job, and is now offering her services (no, not that way...), such as house cleaning, dog walking, ironing, painting etc. She'll do anything to keep her house and good on her.
I don't want this scenario to happen to another 44000 people.
Gg
I also need the company to survive. I get leaflets through the letterbox several times a week with local people advertising themselves. I chatted to a lovely lady who was posting her leaflets through, and she's been made redundant. She's got a Phd in something I can't pronounce, never mind spell, so very clever. She's been unable to find herself another job, and is now offering her services (no, not that way...), such as house cleaning, dog walking, ironing, painting etc. She'll do anything to keep her house and good on her.
I don't want this scenario to happen to another 44000 people.
Gg
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: UK
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You're doomed.
You all know it, you sense it you can smell it in the air.
Finally the real world has collided with BA cabin crew and the wreckage will be our terms and conditions which date from another age.
You simply can't have CSD's and Pursars on the rates they are on for the work they do. You simply cannot pay 240% more to cabin crew than Virgin. You simply cannot have people working two trips a month and having a damm good quality of life.
Its over. Its JUST like MPl expenses. The public has no mood for tolerating it. Willie made his reputation on beating cabin crew unions.
He's going to kick your arse and everyone apart from you wants to see it happen.
Princess, dry your eyes..
You all know it, you sense it you can smell it in the air.
Finally the real world has collided with BA cabin crew and the wreckage will be our terms and conditions which date from another age.
You simply can't have CSD's and Pursars on the rates they are on for the work they do. You simply cannot pay 240% more to cabin crew than Virgin. You simply cannot have people working two trips a month and having a damm good quality of life.
Its over. Its JUST like MPl expenses. The public has no mood for tolerating it. Willie made his reputation on beating cabin crew unions.
He's going to kick your arse and everyone apart from you wants to see it happen.
Princess, dry your eyes..
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Why cant the company come and ask us what we think we can personally do to help the company out?
I am personally prepared to operate the 767 on longhaul flights, with eurofleet allowances. that will increase our productivity and also take a bit of pressure of worldwide crew who stuggle to get leave when they want it.
I agree our 500 hours average a year is very low, so im willing to do as much as possible to increase that, but not for less money, harder for more, but not harder for less.
Im also willing to take part time, on a temp basis, but that temp basis will be untill the company returns to profit, at the end of the day it will, at some point return to 900 million plus profit a year, and when it was last year out wages wasnt an issue then, so i dont see why it should be now.
I do also agree we are ment to be a premium carrier, so we should be paid a premium, but there a few bad eggs that have quit in spirit years ago, but still pace the galley floor, its time for those to leave, as its crew like that, that are giving us all a bad name and people thinking we are undeserving of our wages.
Now for those of you who also think are wage is just far to high in comparison to other airlines, i would like to add that as a "new contract" EF crew member, who has previously worked for the UKs largest charter carrier for a number of years, and also a low cost carrier i would like to add my wage is usually on £300 a month more than my previous airlines, and i work similar hours now. so we arnt paid the huge amounts everyone seems to think.
I am personally prepared to operate the 767 on longhaul flights, with eurofleet allowances. that will increase our productivity and also take a bit of pressure of worldwide crew who stuggle to get leave when they want it.
I agree our 500 hours average a year is very low, so im willing to do as much as possible to increase that, but not for less money, harder for more, but not harder for less.
Im also willing to take part time, on a temp basis, but that temp basis will be untill the company returns to profit, at the end of the day it will, at some point return to 900 million plus profit a year, and when it was last year out wages wasnt an issue then, so i dont see why it should be now.
I do also agree we are ment to be a premium carrier, so we should be paid a premium, but there a few bad eggs that have quit in spirit years ago, but still pace the galley floor, its time for those to leave, as its crew like that, that are giving us all a bad name and people thinking we are undeserving of our wages.
Now for those of you who also think are wage is just far to high in comparison to other airlines, i would like to add that as a "new contract" EF crew member, who has previously worked for the UKs largest charter carrier for a number of years, and also a low cost carrier i would like to add my wage is usually on £300 a month more than my previous airlines, and i work similar hours now. so we arnt paid the huge amounts everyone seems to think.
Join Date: Dec 2000
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Hiflyer
It may be too late, as I suspect that BASSA with follow the 'No, now what is the question' dogma and it will result in a company imposed solution.
BASSA will then try to stage another show of resolve with a meeting attended by the die-hards and a vote for a strike/sick out.
WW will then issue a 90 day notice of termination to all crew and those waiting in the wings (ex 11 month etc) and existing crew will be offered jobs on the New Fleet contract (which will be worse than what could have been negotiated).
The rest will find themselves having voted for the dole rather than a strike.
In the above outline, the only chance there may be to change things would be at the BASSA meeting. That will be difficult, I acknowledge, as it will be stage managed, but I fear that if it is not done that it will be a vote for termination and not a strike as WW is dead set on his chosen course of targetted savings.
Whichever way you look at it, there will be many tears and much grief in the next 3 weeks.
Good luck ....
It may be too late, as I suspect that BASSA with follow the 'No, now what is the question' dogma and it will result in a company imposed solution.
BASSA will then try to stage another show of resolve with a meeting attended by the die-hards and a vote for a strike/sick out.
WW will then issue a 90 day notice of termination to all crew and those waiting in the wings (ex 11 month etc) and existing crew will be offered jobs on the New Fleet contract (which will be worse than what could have been negotiated).
The rest will find themselves having voted for the dole rather than a strike.
In the above outline, the only chance there may be to change things would be at the BASSA meeting. That will be difficult, I acknowledge, as it will be stage managed, but I fear that if it is not done that it will be a vote for termination and not a strike as WW is dead set on his chosen course of targetted savings.
Whichever way you look at it, there will be many tears and much grief in the next 3 weeks.
Good luck ....
Join Date: Jan 2004
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I have the feeling BASSA wants to strike and not come to a conclusion in the beginning. This is based on what has been said on previous union meeting and on one occassion they said they would strike but weren't sure of what at the time. Many of the crew also want to strike as this is the jargon amonst the community.
I doubt BASSA would approve EF to operate WW on EF Allowances. In such case operation in terms and conditions of WW Allowances, length of rest and MBT would apply. I don't think this is applicable either now as traffic is going down and crew are being offered part-time and UPL.
Again, I would be surprised if BASSA approved. Especially when you think that the company has to ask them for permission if WW can do a EF trip or vice versa or WW can work one down out of LHR. I remember the snow storm earlier this year and we were one crew short but the entire crew prepared to work down as flight wasn't full. BASSA said no.
I doubt BASSA would approve EF to operate WW on EF Allowances. In such case operation in terms and conditions of WW Allowances, length of rest and MBT would apply. I don't think this is applicable either now as traffic is going down and crew are being offered part-time and UPL.
Again, I would be surprised if BASSA approved. Especially when you think that the company has to ask them for permission if WW can do a EF trip or vice versa or WW can work one down out of LHR. I remember the snow storm earlier this year and we were one crew short but the entire crew prepared to work down as flight wasn't full. BASSA said no.
PPRuNe Person
Join Date: Jun 2001
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I'm not management, I'm a BA pilot who has no wish to see thousands of my crew colleagues thrown on the dole.
If the members of BASSA don't get a grip on their union officers and tell them to start negotiating properly NOW, then I fear for what might happen.
One thing for sure is that BA WILL impose if nothing is settled by the end of June and that will not be pleasant at all. They are determined to keep the business afloat by any means and like a bulldozer they will stop at nothing to get there. Better not to be standing in the way, I reckon.....
If the members of BASSA don't get a grip on their union officers and tell them to start negotiating properly NOW, then I fear for what might happen.
One thing for sure is that BA WILL impose if nothing is settled by the end of June and that will not be pleasant at all. They are determined to keep the business afloat by any means and like a bulldozer they will stop at nothing to get there. Better not to be standing in the way, I reckon.....
Join Date: Jun 2009
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This is really worrying.
Reading the other forums, the BASSA leader (I use the term loosely) is talking about when the ballot comes, (not if). I thought that was illegal??
A couple of years ago, I knew what my options where and was a volunteer to work through the strike. This time I'm not sure we will have that option.
I know that there are MANY crew who feel like the minority who have voiced on here. The problem is that we are overridden by the very vocal lot on the other forums. I am writing a letter to UNITE and hope that others will do the same. In the meantime, we must ensure that as many as possible put an X in the NO box.
I am prepared to stand up for what I believe in, but other than that I don't know what else to do....
Reading the other forums, the BASSA leader (I use the term loosely) is talking about when the ballot comes, (not if). I thought that was illegal??
A couple of years ago, I knew what my options where and was a volunteer to work through the strike. This time I'm not sure we will have that option.
I know that there are MANY crew who feel like the minority who have voiced on here. The problem is that we are overridden by the very vocal lot on the other forums. I am writing a letter to UNITE and hope that others will do the same. In the meantime, we must ensure that as many as possible put an X in the NO box. I am prepared to stand up for what I believe in, but other than that I don't know what else to do....
British Airways pays its cabin crew twice as much as Virgin - Times Online
Someone is briefing the papers!
Someone is briefing the papers!
Join Date: Apr 2009
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....and it is not a recent conspiracy.....the data has been loaded by the CAA annually since, I believe, 1995.
We need to change. Whether we do it as a broken BASSA or not, time will tell.
We need to change. Whether we do it as a broken BASSA or not, time will tell.
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Dosnt matter if BASSA want a strike or not, its not their choice... its ours! we vote if we wanna walk out
Personally I will give a lot back to the company, ANYTHING... with the exception of new fleet. as ive said before, when the company was raking in 900 million a year our wage wasnt an issue then, now it is.
So why should i slash my wage to almost half of what is it now, to see the company in 5years time raking it in again, except this time i can bearly survive, who will be in a "fight for survival" then? when BA is creaming it in, willie has long gone to rip his next airline to shreds, collected his bonus and we as crew are almost on the breadline.
BA wanted to attract some of the best crew in the insutry (and before we start a debate here, we do have high levels of customer service, but there are of course a few bad apples that spoil it for the rest of us)
so they need to offer a decent wage, same goes for pilots! otherwise what
is the attraction, if they pay virgin wages, i would have choose to go to virgin in the first place!! (no offence to anyone at virgin... )
Its also good to see flight crew on here who do actually support crew, ive never worked for an airline that has such a big crew/flight crew devide.
I like many others am very junior at BA, and im now worried that no matter what i do, i could be jobless anyway.... i have put my name down for unpaid leave and part time to help the company out, but i fear this may not be enough, even if i signed up for new fleet i think i could be gone by xmas! so in my eyes, if im halfway out the door, i might as well go on strike anyway.... what have i to loose now?
Personally I will give a lot back to the company, ANYTHING... with the exception of new fleet. as ive said before, when the company was raking in 900 million a year our wage wasnt an issue then, now it is.
So why should i slash my wage to almost half of what is it now, to see the company in 5years time raking it in again, except this time i can bearly survive, who will be in a "fight for survival" then? when BA is creaming it in, willie has long gone to rip his next airline to shreds, collected his bonus and we as crew are almost on the breadline.
BA wanted to attract some of the best crew in the insutry (and before we start a debate here, we do have high levels of customer service, but there are of course a few bad apples that spoil it for the rest of us)
so they need to offer a decent wage, same goes for pilots! otherwise what
is the attraction, if they pay virgin wages, i would have choose to go to virgin in the first place!! (no offence to anyone at virgin... )
Its also good to see flight crew on here who do actually support crew, ive never worked for an airline that has such a big crew/flight crew devide.
I like many others am very junior at BA, and im now worried that no matter what i do, i could be jobless anyway.... i have put my name down for unpaid leave and part time to help the company out, but i fear this may not be enough, even if i signed up for new fleet i think i could be gone by xmas! so in my eyes, if im halfway out the door, i might as well go on strike anyway.... what have i to loose now?
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so in my eyes, if im halfway out the door, i might as well go on strike anyway.... what have i to loose now?
Join Date: Jun 2009
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Channex101, why have put yourself down for unpaid leave, and part-time, but are worrying about your wage being slashed by half..........surely you have just done it to yourself?
If you bother to look at the airline employee cost data, which the CAA have published annually since at least 1995, you would see that we have been earning well above average pay for at least 15 years. The problem has always been there, but now, in the worst downturn ever, the problem is more acute.
Then you say that you may as well strike? Hello? What about a negotiated pay cut, and changes to working practices? Surely a 4% or 8% cut and staying in a job is better than a 100% cut when we get sacked after a failed strike.
If you bother to look at the airline employee cost data, which the CAA have published annually since at least 1995, you would see that we have been earning well above average pay for at least 15 years. The problem has always been there, but now, in the worst downturn ever, the problem is more acute.
Then you say that you may as well strike? Hello? What about a negotiated pay cut, and changes to working practices? Surely a 4% or 8% cut and staying in a job is better than a 100% cut when we get sacked after a failed strike.
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The stark choice is either you wish to retain your job or join the ranks of the unemployed. Even for those that find employment, for the majority it will be at vastly reduced T and C's in jobs that we will be far from that you enjoy now. I acknowledge that a few will do much better than their present CC roles. CC will still be a reasonable career for some and what you cannot deny is that at Cranebank we still get over a 1000 e mail job enquiries a week.
Crew management have spent sometime looking at how many days can be taken of the NECC course and be in no doubt that we could recruit and train 100 a week in about 14 days or less if required to do so. There is an army of trainers doing very little at this time, they and many ex CC trainers could start in a matter of days. It is as if at Cranebannk there is an expectation of a lot of new work.
Whatever happens you are still much better seeking employment while you are in employment and if the market improves in 5 years, then you can move on.
Crew management have spent sometime looking at how many days can be taken of the NECC course and be in no doubt that we could recruit and train 100 a week in about 14 days or less if required to do so. There is an army of trainers doing very little at this time, they and many ex CC trainers could start in a matter of days. It is as if at Cranebannk there is an expectation of a lot of new work.
Whatever happens you are still much better seeking employment while you are in employment and if the market improves in 5 years, then you can move on.