Do BA Cabin Crew pull their weight?
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Its the callsign of the Lossie SAR Sea King. Whats my prize?
Time down route? What makes you think we need to socialise with the CC downroute? I've known people go sightseeing, motorcycling, sailing, surfing, skiing, hang gliding, white water rafting, light aircraft flying, hill walking and golfing. I've seen people ditch the crew hotel and go straight to Vegas from the airport. People go to visit friends and relatives, buy things for home, visit museums and galleries. On top of that it's usually pretty sociable anyway with people meeting up for dinner and drinking. The caveat is that it's always the FD who do this because on a crew of 16 if you invite the CC along you'll be lucky to get any interest from more than a couple and they more than likely won't turn up the next day anyway. I'm not sure where you get your idea that its all one big happy family downroute. Its two disparate groups of employees. I can tell you that on longhaul I've had more nights out with the Virgin crew than with our mob. Most FD don't know what cabin crew do for 4 days in their rooms down route ('resting' is the usual answer) and to be honest we really don't care!
In response to your edit, perhaps sarcasm & cyncism don't really come across well on a forum.
I believe my scenario above is rather more commonplace than the roman orgies some people believe occur.
Time down route? What makes you think we need to socialise with the CC downroute? I've known people go sightseeing, motorcycling, sailing, surfing, skiing, hang gliding, white water rafting, light aircraft flying, hill walking and golfing. I've seen people ditch the crew hotel and go straight to Vegas from the airport. People go to visit friends and relatives, buy things for home, visit museums and galleries. On top of that it's usually pretty sociable anyway with people meeting up for dinner and drinking. The caveat is that it's always the FD who do this because on a crew of 16 if you invite the CC along you'll be lucky to get any interest from more than a couple and they more than likely won't turn up the next day anyway. I'm not sure where you get your idea that its all one big happy family downroute. Its two disparate groups of employees. I can tell you that on longhaul I've had more nights out with the Virgin crew than with our mob. Most FD don't know what cabin crew do for 4 days in their rooms down route ('resting' is the usual answer) and to be honest we really don't care!
In response to your edit, perhaps sarcasm & cyncism don't really come across well on a forum.
I believe my scenario above is rather more commonplace than the roman orgies some people believe occur.
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Carnage, you are right. Many crew at BA leave other airlines to come to BA because we are paid more and perhaps work a little less.
I guess the main reason for me wanting to come to BA (I worked at bmi), was because I wanted to work for a professional outfit. For once I had something, written in black-and-white, about what is expected of me and when I can say 'no'.
At bmi, you could get rostered a very rare two sector day, and when you land back from that and getting your things together to go home you are told by the dispatcher you need to do two more sectors as they are short of crew. Can you imagine the sort of service the passengers on those next two sectors received? Can you imagine the loyalty instilled into you for the company, by the company?
On top of that we were spoken to like crap by un-professional, nasty management with no skills what-so-ever.
That is not a way to treat anyone, cabin crew, pilot, cleaner.....
My personal opinion (and again this is my personal opinion) when I was on short-haul I did think I spent too much time hanging around compass/CAT, but I can see the reason for it from the unions point of view.
Anyway, I think it is generally accepted that things will change before the move to T5.
In regards to return catering, it is the cabin crew that do the swapping of trolleys, hots etc not caterers.
There are no 3 x 4 x 3 sector 3 day trips although 3 day trips with 1 sector at either or both ends are fairly rare. Scheduling adjust the trips depending on how over/under crewed EF are.
A few years ago LHR EF was so undercrewed, 1 sector days on trips were practically unheard of.
Now LHR EF are well and truly OVER crewed so more one sector days will probably happen so there is still enough work to go around. Also a couple WW LHR 767 routes are being transferred across to LHR EF as WW are under crewed and EF over crewed.
Within BA this isn't just an issue with cabin crew. I mean look at the bus drivers? Look at the type of conditions they work to?? What a joke! We land from a twelve hour flight onto a remote stand and after working hard to leave a favourable impression with our passengers they are stranded for half an hour because the bus drivers can only come into the central area so many times per day etc etc. At least even if we aren't the most economically efficient crew, we make a significant contribution to the profits. Where do the bus drivers come in?
I guess the main reason for me wanting to come to BA (I worked at bmi), was because I wanted to work for a professional outfit. For once I had something, written in black-and-white, about what is expected of me and when I can say 'no'.
At bmi, you could get rostered a very rare two sector day, and when you land back from that and getting your things together to go home you are told by the dispatcher you need to do two more sectors as they are short of crew. Can you imagine the sort of service the passengers on those next two sectors received? Can you imagine the loyalty instilled into you for the company, by the company?
On top of that we were spoken to like crap by un-professional, nasty management with no skills what-so-ever.
That is not a way to treat anyone, cabin crew, pilot, cleaner.....
My personal opinion (and again this is my personal opinion) when I was on short-haul I did think I spent too much time hanging around compass/CAT, but I can see the reason for it from the unions point of view.
Anyway, I think it is generally accepted that things will change before the move to T5.
In regards to return catering, it is the cabin crew that do the swapping of trolleys, hots etc not caterers.
There are no 3 x 4 x 3 sector 3 day trips although 3 day trips with 1 sector at either or both ends are fairly rare. Scheduling adjust the trips depending on how over/under crewed EF are.
A few years ago LHR EF was so undercrewed, 1 sector days on trips were practically unheard of.
Now LHR EF are well and truly OVER crewed so more one sector days will probably happen so there is still enough work to go around. Also a couple WW LHR 767 routes are being transferred across to LHR EF as WW are under crewed and EF over crewed.
Within BA this isn't just an issue with cabin crew. I mean look at the bus drivers? Look at the type of conditions they work to?? What a joke! We land from a twelve hour flight onto a remote stand and after working hard to leave a favourable impression with our passengers they are stranded for half an hour because the bus drivers can only come into the central area so many times per day etc etc. At least even if we aren't the most economically efficient crew, we make a significant contribution to the profits. Where do the bus drivers come in?
Last edited by keeperboy; 24th Oct 2005 at 13:30.
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keeperboy - U guys are in a union aren't you? well why don't you get the union involved ifd thats the case of them changing ur 2 sector days at short notice. It used to happen nin my company all the time, but we put our foot down and now crewing have to give us 12hrs notice for any change. worked a treat! keep on in there and get the union to sort something out.
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Hey Jettesen, it was at my old airline (bmi) that I was talking about. I was in the union, but they were absolutely useless (Cabin crew 89). Maybe that was down to the fact that only about 30% of the crew bothered being in the union.
When we complained about the disruption we were basically told if we didn't like it we could walk......there were plenty of people working in the local supermarket that would like our jobs.
Luckily, BA is worlds apart. At least you feel valued and we do have an effective union.
When we complained about the disruption we were basically told if we didn't like it we could walk......there were plenty of people working in the local supermarket that would like our jobs.
Luckily, BA is worlds apart. At least you feel valued and we do have an effective union.
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Oh my GOD it must be true if it's in The Sun!!!! 
Blown out of proportion if I even heard it.
We were all sent a crewlink e-mail about a week ago from the safety department to say that they had received a few complaints regarding a minority of our 13000+ crew.
These complaints were made by some passengers as well as other crew and related to crew reading papers, doing puzzles and drinking coffee (!!) during take off and landing.
Said e-mail said blah blah blah blah....don't do it!
The Sun, ever known for its impartial coverage of important world wide news, jumped on this 'story' and put it in it's sad rag. Worse was that it touted the line that we were banned from doing the 'Sun Duko.
Which is rubbish cos it's the Daily Mail we get for free.
Blown out of proportion if I even heard it.
We were all sent a crewlink e-mail about a week ago from the safety department to say that they had received a few complaints regarding a minority of our 13000+ crew.
These complaints were made by some passengers as well as other crew and related to crew reading papers, doing puzzles and drinking coffee (!!) during take off and landing.
Said e-mail said blah blah blah blah....don't do it!
The Sun, ever known for its impartial coverage of important world wide news, jumped on this 'story' and put it in it's sad rag. Worse was that it touted the line that we were banned from doing the 'Sun Duko.
Which is rubbish cos it's the Daily Mail we get for free.
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Positioned back from JFK last week and as usual the fastest bit action that I witnessed was the speed they ran around pulling the blinds down so they could get some rest...the crew that is, not the pax! 5.53 sector time as well. One drink service and then 'nothing'. Loads of pax looking around waiting for service. It was embarrassing. It won't be long before passengers are chloroformed for convienence.
Old and cynical!
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Similar experience I'm afraid on a very recent trip back fom Mexico City. Mexican CC retired to tail section leaving British crew in charge. While I was in the galley requesting water, Mexican passenger came in asking for food in Spanish. English steward says " can you speak in English?" Incidentally, it was the very same steward who had opened the overhead locker above me without any due care as demonstrated in the sfety video! then responded to my comment "carefull the locker is full" with "we are permitted to open the overheads you know!"
Makes me proud to be English sometimes! - not!
Fly the flag!!!!
Makes me proud to be English sometimes! - not!
Fly the flag!!!!
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It is all so variable, at the moment. When good it is very good, but sadly the indifferent seems to be on the increase again at BA. With the continued lack of catering on most s/h, it is interesting to see how different crews react.
The good, sadly in the minority from my experience, will do their best to make up for the lack of catering by talking more to pax (expec in J) and venturing up and down the cabin a couple of times offering more coffee, tea, water or Walkers shortbread (must buy some shares in that Company).
Unfortunately, the majority seem to provide a single paper cup of coffee etc and then retreat behind the curtain for remainder of the flight.
Yesterday, LHR-PRG, I 'dared' to venture behind the curtain to ask for a second cup of coffee. It all seemed just a little too much trouble for the two crew who were having a jolly time there, although after a disapproving look, I did manage to return safely to my seat, with mission accomplished.
Previous estimates were that catering (breakfast and evening meal the most needed) would be back across Europe network by end October. Now few CSDs will comment and some now seem to query whether it will return at all.
My patience is being strectched thin with BA s/h - will catering ever return as we used to know it? I still have J-class seat on most sectors, but there really is no benefit these days. Often just three rows with everyone packed in 2+3, while Y class has more space. And 'compensation' vouchers now seem to have reduced to just GBP5 unless you speak nicely to the ground staff.
Appreciate that the whole Gate Gourmet dispute and the carry on with bus drivers at LHR does little to help morale among people on the front line, especially CC. Just wish some would understand how frustrating it can also be for the SLF - and especially those who pay significantly more for (in theory) a higher standard of cabin service.
If BA revenues are largely derived from J-class seat sales, is it not in the airline's interests to do just a little more to ensure passengers do not vote with their travel budgets and move to other carriers. This has gone on too long.
To prove I am not another BA-knocker, I must finish by saying that my BA l/h experience is usually the opposite from above. Usually good or very good, with just one or two negative experiences. A lot seems to be down to the CSD and how he/she motivates the team. Usually end up chatting to CC in upstairs galley on 74s.
Providing you recognise they actually have a job to do and do not intrude too much, or play bull**** bingo with them, crew seem to be more than happy to chat over a tea or coffee. Not many airlines (VS apart) have crews that would be in the least bit interested.
The good, sadly in the minority from my experience, will do their best to make up for the lack of catering by talking more to pax (expec in J) and venturing up and down the cabin a couple of times offering more coffee, tea, water or Walkers shortbread (must buy some shares in that Company).
Unfortunately, the majority seem to provide a single paper cup of coffee etc and then retreat behind the curtain for remainder of the flight.
Yesterday, LHR-PRG, I 'dared' to venture behind the curtain to ask for a second cup of coffee. It all seemed just a little too much trouble for the two crew who were having a jolly time there, although after a disapproving look, I did manage to return safely to my seat, with mission accomplished.
Previous estimates were that catering (breakfast and evening meal the most needed) would be back across Europe network by end October. Now few CSDs will comment and some now seem to query whether it will return at all.
My patience is being strectched thin with BA s/h - will catering ever return as we used to know it? I still have J-class seat on most sectors, but there really is no benefit these days. Often just three rows with everyone packed in 2+3, while Y class has more space. And 'compensation' vouchers now seem to have reduced to just GBP5 unless you speak nicely to the ground staff.
Appreciate that the whole Gate Gourmet dispute and the carry on with bus drivers at LHR does little to help morale among people on the front line, especially CC. Just wish some would understand how frustrating it can also be for the SLF - and especially those who pay significantly more for (in theory) a higher standard of cabin service.
If BA revenues are largely derived from J-class seat sales, is it not in the airline's interests to do just a little more to ensure passengers do not vote with their travel budgets and move to other carriers. This has gone on too long.
To prove I am not another BA-knocker, I must finish by saying that my BA l/h experience is usually the opposite from above. Usually good or very good, with just one or two negative experiences. A lot seems to be down to the CSD and how he/she motivates the team. Usually end up chatting to CC in upstairs galley on 74s.
Providing you recognise they actually have a job to do and do not intrude too much, or play bull**** bingo with them, crew seem to be more than happy to chat over a tea or coffee. Not many airlines (VS apart) have crews that would be in the least bit interested.
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Is BA just LHR!!!!!!!!
I don't think so!!!
BTW to all EF LGW crews......they are doing it!! Read the latest Cabin Crew News..........how many flights are now "trialling" with only 3 cabin crew??? Same level of service??? They can only dream about it.
Why do they do this in November?????? They should have trialled it in JULY/AUGUST!!!!!!!!
We are sick and tired of working our socks off and yet being labelled the same as those few (I hope) black sheep.
All this thread is useless. People, you don't like flying with BA? Then, by all means, DON'T.
PS: on BA news there was an article "how will you spend the extra hour this sunday". People said "in bed" "quality time with family".
Guess what, no response from CC, of course.
Of 5 people on my crew yesterday, 4 of us had been rostered minimum rest (12 hours) and yet we finished after 1am. On paper it looks like 11 hours, but thank god for the time change we still have 12 hours!! Yahoo!!
I am off to work.
I don't think so!!!
BTW to all EF LGW crews......they are doing it!! Read the latest Cabin Crew News..........how many
flights are now "trialling" with only 3 cabin crew??? Same level of service??? They can only dream about it.Why do they do this in November?????? They should have trialled it in JULY/AUGUST!!!!!!!!
We are sick and tired of working our socks off and yet being labelled the same as those few (I hope) black sheep.
All this thread is useless. People, you don't like flying with BA? Then, by all means, DON'T.
PS: on BA news there was an article "how will you spend the extra hour this sunday". People said "in bed" "quality time with family".
Guess what, no response from CC, of course.
Of 5 people on my crew yesterday, 4 of us had been rostered minimum rest (12 hours) and yet we finished after 1am. On paper it looks like 11 hours, but thank god for the time change we still have 12 hours!! Yahoo!!
I am off to work.
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I know CC89 and BASSA don't give a about LGW (short haul, of course. For long haul it's slightly different).
Sad but painfully true.
The problem, you see, is that at the end of the day we all fly for the same company. WE ARE the same company.
I expect that behaviour from BASSA or CC89 (which I am NOT supporting) but I don't like to then be involved with all this "BA are lazy" attitude.
We don't swim in gold here at LGW and work our off. No catering problems,thank god, summer overbooked all the way through and minimum crew. Lots and lots of "rest day working available" crewlink messages. Minimum rest and multi-sector days with fixed links becoming a constant feature even for doubles = longer sectors and no rest in between.
And, what's most important, no matter how tired we are, we DO take care of our passengers. And very much so.
about LGW (short haul, of course. For long haul it's slightly different).Sad but painfully true.
The problem, you see, is that at the end of the day we all fly for the same company. WE ARE the same company.
I expect that behaviour from BASSA or CC89 (which I am NOT supporting) but I don't like to then be involved with all this "BA are lazy" attitude.
We don't swim in gold here at LGW and work our
off. No catering problems,thank god, summer overbooked all the way through and minimum crew. Lots and lots of "rest day working available" crewlink messages. Minimum rest and multi-sector days with fixed links becoming a constant feature even for doubles = longer sectors and no rest in between.And, what's most important, no matter how tired we are, we DO take care of our passengers. And very much so.
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Flybywire makes a good point and my apologies to her and her colleagues at LGW. Comments in my previous posting were not LGW-oriented.
Fell into the trap, as many seem to do, of generalising across all BA - instead of restricting my comments to LHR and its ongoing problems.
Need to change my routings and fly the Gatwick experience more often methinks! Especially after reading some of FBW's previous postings about new(ish) cc uniform and entertaining the SLF!
Fell into the trap, as many seem to do, of generalising across all BA - instead of restricting my comments to LHR and its ongoing problems.
Need to change my routings and fly the Gatwick experience more often methinks! Especially after reading some of FBW's previous postings about new(ish) cc uniform and entertaining the SLF!
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First post on this board
As a PAX, BA is my airline of choice. There is only one reason, the quality of cabin crew and the service.
Back to the Clarkson article, in general in my experience he is talking out of his a**e.
There are a few exceptions, the other day I saw a PAX in club carrying a truly monster bag which would not go into the (full) lockers. He approached a cabin crew who told him it was oversize and walked off. Not Good.
It needs few of these sort of stories to harm the rep. of the airline.
I am sure that these are the few, but what to do about them?
It also upsets me to see posts on investors bulletin boards from disaffected cabin crew saying how the union is engineering industrial problems and how they are poorly paid.
As a PAX, BA is my airline of choice. There is only one reason, the quality of cabin crew and the service.
Back to the Clarkson article, in general in my experience he is talking out of his a**e.
There are a few exceptions, the other day I saw a PAX in club carrying a truly monster bag which would not go into the (full) lockers. He approached a cabin crew who told him it was oversize and walked off. Not Good.
It needs few of these sort of stories to harm the rep. of the airline.
I am sure that these are the few, but what to do about them?
It also upsets me to see posts on investors bulletin boards from disaffected cabin crew saying how the union is engineering industrial problems and how they are poorly paid.
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I think for many at BA the main goal is getting away with as much as possible with the aim of doing the mimimum. This applies from my viewpoint to staff at all levels not just CC if indeed this is the case. Surely BA staff are no different from those at many other airlines. CC are entitled at present to be demotivated with such a long period of catering shortages. At BA, I feel ashamed at this continuing farce which once again is some way short of being resolved. Thank you to all our loyal customers and the many of the commited BA staff.
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HZ123 need to get out of Cranebank a bit more mate
CC demotivated
What the catering service means is more rest, now I know its back on long haul, but when it was'nt I have never seen the crew so happy.
Now, on short haul it means that "hello" and "ok" can be read cover to cover before you get to the hotel room, now I guess for some that is demotivating, I mean what else are the darlings going to do in their hotel room for the next 20 hours??????
CC demotivated
What the catering service means is more rest, now I know its back on long haul, but when it was'nt I have never seen the crew so happy.
Now, on short haul it means that "hello" and "ok" can be read cover to cover before you get to the hotel room, now I guess for some that is demotivating, I mean what else are the darlings going to do in their hotel room for the next 20 hours??????
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Seems to be another BA crew bashing thread, most of it fuelled by a silly billy Nigel who spends most of his life sitting on his grammer school educated backside, having never done a real job in the grown up world, and has the nerve to criticise grown ups who work for a lving.