Qantas London base

[west coast girl]

I have been flying longhaul out of perth since the base began 4 yrs ago and before that I flew with ansett & regional so I know a bit about the game.
And the news from perth is not good.
mark hassell has been very cunning with the perth base and has given us all our Airbus flying back for bid period 235.
yes, that is the bid period which covers the FAAA proposed industrial striks period.
I can assure our east coast f/as - THERE WILL BE NO STRIKE ACTION IN PERTH COME DEC 18!
it will be business as usual.
mark hassell has given us back our flying , can the east coast say that? and we are grateful for it.
QF management know we are a junior base and easily manipulated. Likewise our onboard managements have been promoted due to necessity rather than any inate skill and they are all very PRO COMPANY. As such, they will not be partaking of any 'sick outs', strikes etc.
Unfortunately since the base opened we have had little or no union representation or presence here. The flurry of emails from the FAAA these last few days suggest that the SYD based union has just realised their is actually a long haul base on the other side of the island.
In terms of winning the 'hearts & minds ' of PER based crew, it is too little too late.
Most of us see the london base issue as a SYD base concern Loss of SYD allowances, loss of SYD long range penalties, loss of SYD stand down patterns.
The flying out of PER is atrocious but the FAAA has never cared. It has given dispensation after dispensation for the company to do as it likes. We transit our home port and nothing has been done about that. we get no allowances compared to SYD, the SIN/ Per transit tours are ardous with no compensation .
We had Paris for a while but the poor attitude of SYD based crew towards PER crew made you feel like a fixed termer.
Every single flight I'm on someone has just resigned from the union or is about to -its just too expensive for no gain.
PER is a hell hole and we all want to get out , there are over 100 of us on a transfer list.
the flying is crap and the management are not friendly.
If this base closes most of us will be happy to try our luck in SYD.
The FAAA has neglected this bases conditions at its own peril.
Come Dec 18 there will be another 260 strike breakers in the west ready to go.


ps the story about FAAA president Steven Reed verbally abusing a PER based f/a for taking up the London base is doing the rounds and endearing the union leadership to those of us out west. Why would you strike to save this cretin's job sercurity?

[Left2primary]

west coast girl,

so you and your collegues will gladly scab during any industrial dispute as you have no concerns with "Sydney" conditions?

At the same time saying that you and 100 or so cant wait to transfer to SYD????

Its obvious from your post that you are motivated only by self interest so perhaps you and your friends ought to take a little more interest in issues on the other coast.

L2P "S.T.R".

[galley_gossiper]

L2P

You obviously have not been around as long as you claim.If you were you would understand by now that ALL crew are after what is best for them as individuals.If a crew member can see a benefit in striking for themselves, then they will strike.Why would any Per or Mel crew strike over Syd crew losing Lhr patterns?It doesnt affect them in any way. Both Per and Mel have ****ty flying, why do you think the majority of crew going to Lhr are from these bases? The flying is better for them in Lhr than what they have now!the FAAA has done nothing with this campaign except focus on Syd issues.I agree the majority of the members are in Syd, but neglecting those other bases will cost the FAAA dearly,I have heard there is currently a petition against the FAAA leaders happening in Per at the moment.My mate in Per tells me the latest 'Per base' memo from the FAAA has been the final straw for them, they in no way support the FAAA. On top of that the company has said we in Syd will still have access to Lhr patterns, so few Syd crew can see what the big deal is. The approach of the FAAA on this EBA is in no way in line with the membership, no matter what the 'supposed' survey results were The CREW at qf are so over the FAAA.
And like the rest of crew I will be motivated by 'self-interest' when deciding to strike, my commuting days to Syd will soon be over with the opening of the Bne base .... and yes I definately have the seniority to get there So Lhr sectors will in no way affect me. Selfish? maybe, but like most I will not sacrifice myself to try and save flying that wont affect me. I saw what the company has said about their offer as pretty reasonable. It was the FAAA that walked out of negotiations, not the company .Sorry mate. You seem to brand anyone as being too self-interested on here, when it's actually what drives us all - self-interest.

[Left2primary]

galleygossiper,

posting on a Sunday?

Is that double time or just time and a half?

L2P "S.T.R"

[argusmoon]

WestCoast Grrrl

I never really understood why the westcoast base was established.Other than decentralising flying from Sydney and cutting down on accommodation and allowances there was never going to be enough flying to go around.By establishing bases all over Australia Qantas has created self interest groups,interested in their own piece of turf and not much else.This provides the company with a pool of flight attendants who have an allegiance to nobody and will operate whenever required as they have very little flying.All of this based on parochial nonsense....Westcoast,Eastcoast Melbourne,Brisbane Bangkok,Auckland.....we all do the same job for Godsake!!!
In ten years time someone will realize that the conditons which Crew lost were lost because of myopic self interest.
If you are not happy with the FAAA get stuck into your local representation...Log into the FAAA website and send messages regarding your discontent.Be proactive about your circumstances instead of being an apathetic whinger.
You could of course become a REAL westcoast girl....take up the London Base and live on the Westcoast of the UK

[galley_gossiper]

mate .... I dont have to fly weekends .... I have done me time b ut as usual, you attack the person not the ball, as it seems you have no actual legitimate responses except to attack individuals .... you are a sad little thing arent you?

[Left2primary]

galleygossiper,

thanks for that.................

L2P "S.T.R".

[sima]

L1A

L1A,

Please spend some time to read the previous posts before sledging me.
I am the one who has been labelled a "cubicle sitter" by fellow Flight Attendants.
I myself fly for Qantas. I have been called this because I dont agree with what the FAAA is saying, instead i have somewhat defended the company.
Dont just jump in and start critising people if your not up to speed with earlier things said on here, what ever team you bat for!

sima.

[Left2primary]

sima,

how about telling L1A the full story.

You are a SHORTHAUL FA championing QF's move to recruit hundreds of UK nationals as longhaul FAs on lower wages and conditions than are currently the norm.

The attack on the existing FAs conditions that this represents plus the move to deny Australians hundreds of jobs is being made at the same time as QF enjoys its most profitable position in its 85 odd year history.

Unless of course I have it all wrong????
Please enlighten us.

L2P "S.T.R",

[sima]

l2p

L2P,

ohhhh so now i am a F/A...i thought YOU were the one who labelled me a cubicle sitter!!
I was actually saying that maybe L1A should read the previous posts to understand why i was using the "cubicle sitter" reference in my earlier post.

You need to make your mind up as to whether i fly or sit. Let me know what it is.

And besides, you want all of us to answer your questions with your please explain style of posts.
I am still waiting for your answer to a previous question of mine......
Will you leave Qantas if this EBA goes through since you cant work for this ethically and morally corupt company as you previous said??!!!

Look forward to you answer.

[gigs]

Im a mam casual and of course not involved with long haul or this dispute. I do however read with interest the posts and,would like to offer my imput as not QF LH or SH but a casual. What do you Sima or Left 2 P see is the possability that QF need put on full time for long haul or short haul in the near future or ever with the way things are going?I love my job with a passion but it seems to be gittin harder to be a casual with the reduction in flexabiity. thanx for reading my imput.

[captainrats]

gigs

It will be a long time...several years at least...`til Qantas employs permanent crew again.Dixon is hell bent on reducing wages and casualizing at least 25% of the workforce.It makes it very difficult for those of you who are MAM.My best advice is to use the experience to gain full time employment with another airline,either here or overseas
Best of luck with your endeavour,it is still a great industry to be in.

[galley_gossiper]

L2P ...you are very welcome. I presume the thanks you were offering me were for pointing out to you that you cannot see any other point of you than your own, and allowing you to recognise that there are flying crew who are not willing to strike over a lost cause. Glad your 'thanks' means I have given you a somewhat broader perspective.


Oh and L2P

the only ways you manage to debate on this post are:
1) to proclaim that anyone who has a differing opinion to you 'are management' or a 'cubicle sitter' (whatever that means);
2) make a personal attack on that person who posts a position that doesnt agree with yours;
3) give some vague comment that has no relation to the stated arguements
You cant make any sensible argument for your case, you just state your opinion andf bag those who choose to take a legitimate debate line against your claims.
Mate, I hope you aint part of the union negotiating team, cos if you cant sustain a logical debate on here, where you have time to consider a response ....then you are of no use to any crew relying on the FAAA to continue to maintain conditions with QF Longhaul.
Screw The Roo? Go Ahead, but you will be Screwing your job mate, less profits = less crew onboard .... nasty fact, but a fact nontheless.
Are you sure you arent a CSM who wears a really bad rug?

[Left2primary]

sima,

You are mistaken if you think that I have labeled you a cubicle sitter. Your earlier posts indicate to me that you are a SHORTHAUL FA.

Am I mistaken?

In answer to your question.
Yes.
I will continue to work for the current pack of decieptful, lying hypocrites running this company because at the end of the day, my mortgage needs to be paid.

It may be news to you to know that the employee/employer relationship is really quite simple.

I fulfill my obligations to QF, to their satisfaction and in return, they pay me a wage.
End of story.

Now its your turn.

Given that you are a SHORTHAUL FA.

Do you support the attacks being made on your longhaul collegues conditions and do you support QF's move to deny hundreds of young Australians jobs by exporting them overseas to boost its already record bottom line??????


gigs,

"the villiage idiot" before he left for Cairns, had info from HR to suggest that QF didnt plan to offer fulltime longhaul positions for at least 5 years.

Leaked QF documents that made the papers earlier in the year indicate that QF plan to move 25% of the FA positions offshore.

Your guess is as good as mine as to how this will all play out but the VAST majority of us at longhaul will resist QFs attacks on our conditions and the loss of Australian jobs to the bitter end.

Those who post to this list suggesting FAs are only driven by self interest paint a shallow, bleak and inaccurate picture of how we feel.
In effect they are confusing the values of FAs with those of the management types they represent.

The only definite that can be concluded from the current situation is that those being trained from midnight to 7am and only issued with "King Gee" pants and a polo top for a uniform are being very cynically and cruelly used.

L2P "S.T.R".

[lame1]

Notice to all international FAs
The LAMEs are behind you,my suggestion to you all is to FILL the CABIN LOG and TECH LOG with every defect you can find.Leave the rest to US.The bottom line is -UNSERVICEABLE A/C DONT FLY.

[TightSlot]

Despite previous warnings, personal attacks have returned.

Once again, nobody is entitled to bully or abuse someone for holding an alternate view.

Left2primary threadbanned for 2 days - i.e. can read but not post on this thread for 48 hrs. Next offence will mean permanent threadban, leading to a forum ban on third occasion.

[Wirraway]

Mon "Melbourne Age"

Qantas training 'strike breakers'
By Scott Rochfort
October 18, 2004

Qantas has quietly hired 350 flight attendants on three-month fixed contracts in an apparent move to thwart a threatened Christmas strike by its 4000 long-haul cabin crew over plans to base more jobs overseas.

Outfitted with black pants and red polo tops, instead of the usual flight attendant uniform, the new intake of Qantas attendants are being trained in how to operate a 747 aircraft.

In what is shaping up to be one of the most high-profile industrial disputes since the 1998 waterfront strike, there are claims the fixed-termers are being asked to use code-word destinations (such as "Bronte") when picked up by unmarked Qantas buses for their training sessions at the airline's Sydney base at Mascot.

The Flight Attendants Association is already calling the trainees "strike-breakers" - and is taking Qantas to the Federal Industrial Relations Commission this morning over the matter.

"What has Qantas got to hide and what are they ashamed of that they have to go to these extraordinary lengths to mask what they are doing?" the international head of the FAAA, Michael Mijatov, said yesterday.

But Qantas denies there is any secrecy, saying it has told the FAAA how many people it is training and given union officials free access to talk to fixed-term staff, some of whom have joined the union.

"How can there be any secrecy when we've told the union about the training?" Qantas spokesman Michael Sharp asked.

With the FAAA warning it could take industrial action over Qantas' plans to base hundreds of cabin crew overseas, Qantas is believed to be training more of its non-flying and management staff on how to work aboard long-haul aircraft.

Qantas says the extra staff will help it get through the peak Christmas period, but the FAAA says the airline plans to use the fixed-termers as strike breakers. (A recent union survey found that 96 per cent of its Qantas members were willing to strike.)

The FAAA says Qantas has offered many of the contract positions to people who previously had their applications to become flight attendants rejected.

Meanwhile, hundreds of Qantas customers have unknowingly had their summer travel bookings altered after the airline revised its flight schedule.

Despite accepting payment for the advertised flight bookings, the airline cancelled and rescheduled a host of summer flights late last week, in changes that are believed to affect a high proportion of passengers over the peak summer period.

Most changes will be minor delays. However, some flights have been cancelled.

The cancellations mean passengers have been redirected onto other flights, with discrepancies of more than an hour from the original bookings in some cases.

Qantas yesterday maintained that there had been no deliberate or significant overhaul of the summer schedule.

=============================================

[str]

I wasn't going to post here again but I can't sit back and watch hard working individuals being attacked:

Tightslot - How come you didn't ban west coast girl? She has personally named and attacked Steven Reid (FAAA rep). L2P who is obviouslly rightfully very emotional about this subject, is the only person balancing out this thread.

west coast girl - you attack Steven Reid (FAAA) for having a go at a PER based flight attendant. I cannot believe Steven would be disrespectful or rude to anyone. Has anyone actually called him to check out the story? The PER base is so small rumours spread like wildfire. YOU need to check whether this is true or not.

PER based crew continually bleat about the poor flying etc. out of the base. Well do something about it, the FAAA can't do anything unless crew unite and start asking question, complaining, making suggestions. This is were SYD crew are different to PER, they won't lay down and be walked all over by managers.

PER has a FAAA rep called Grant Ormarod (sorry if I've spelt is name incorrectly) lovely person and very eager to get better flying/conditions for PER crew. Speak to him, get your collegues to speak to him, make some noise and that dreadful woman who runs the base there will have to listen.

Lets just get back to basics and think what happening here:

1-QF are making massive amounts of money. This is due to hard work from crew, engineers, ground staff etc. who have all pulled together over the past 3 years and worked harder than ever before.

2-We accepted wage freezes company wide.

3-We accepted reduction in crew onboard.

This was done to ensure the future of the company, no one at QF wants another Ansett.

In return the company have given us:

1-A mediocre product which is embarassing to hand out.

2-Courses on how to communicate better with customers. READ : How to say sorry in 15 languages

3-Transfering of 330 flying to short haul crew. west coast girl
Mark Hassell only gave you 330 flying back to keep PER base happy over the stike period. If he was serious about this he would ensure it was written into the new EBA.

4-Transferring of up to 25% of crew (1250'ish) jobs to London.

5-Continous lies and propaganda from managers on a bonus based salary system.

6-Managers have requested a SIXTY SIX PERCENT pay rise.

I think any reasonable person who works for Qantas would be very annoyed about the treatment from management.

Management seems to have forgotten that we are an airline. Transporting people is our job, not sucking up to shareholders in order to get a few more $$$ in bonuses.

[Butterfield8]

Smiling Assassin Silent

Intersting to note that Hassell has fallen silent over the past couple of weeks......not one communique.The Black Widow (Grant)
appears to have been given control of the bullhorn.Could this be due to BA no longer having representation on the Board.Or,as has been rumoured he is preparing to return to the UK to manage the LHR base?Anyway it appears that the Air New Zealand diaspora has triumphed over the BA mob......both as incompetent as each other and equally untrustworthy.
Disappointing to note L2P has been banned.....admire his passion

[miss L4]

I'm not sure how Qantas's paid shock jocks, Jones and Laws are reporting it, but ABC radio have been giving Qantas management a pasting all afternoon.

Michatov has done a great job in helping to expose Qantas Management as the lying, decietful scum that they are.

Well done FAAA.
We are behind you ALL the way boys.

Miss L4