Will Qf Hire From Short List
Join Date: Dec 2003
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You're on a waitlist basically for future vacancies but there is no guarentee of employment.
For those who have eventually missed out, if you're still interested in the QF Group keep an eye on Eastern, Sunstate, Impulse/Jetstar, Airlink, Jetconnect, Australian and the contract companies MAM and Adecco who all recruit for the group fairly regurally.
For those who have eventually missed out, if you're still interested in the QF Group keep an eye on Eastern, Sunstate, Impulse/Jetstar, Airlink, Jetconnect, Australian and the contract companies MAM and Adecco who all recruit for the group fairly regurally.
Join Date: Oct 2001
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In defense of Mr Seatback
With risk of starting an all out squabble with you Easternboy, I must say a few words about Mr Seatback.
Bitter and Twisted are 2 words that are so far from the truth to describe Mr Seatback. For those that do not know Mr Seatback personally, let me tell you that he is professional, motivated, great at his job, and is the first to offer information/ help to friends or fellow Ppruners in regards to any Avaitaion issues that he is acquainted with.
I just can't see how that fits the "B & T image" at all???
I say, LOVE YA WORK Mr seatback!
Bitter and Twisted are 2 words that are so far from the truth to describe Mr Seatback. For those that do not know Mr Seatback personally, let me tell you that he is professional, motivated, great at his job, and is the first to offer information/ help to friends or fellow Ppruners in regards to any Avaitaion issues that he is acquainted with.
I just can't see how that fits the "B & T image" at all???
I say, LOVE YA WORK Mr seatback!
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Definition of "shortlist"
This is my definition of what a shortlist is..
We have processed your application and now have you on hold for a position in a port/base or even company for which you may not have applied, for an indeterminate amount of time. We might call you, we might not. However don't call us. We will only give you updates when your shortlist expires, but then again we might not.
Look guys, being on the shortlist this time round definitely sucked. Be happy and grateful that at least you are there! There are still so many people that missed out, and others still that didn't have the opportunity to apply. Movement in QF is good for everyone, those at S/H, L/H and regionals - everyone wants recruitment to start again.
Good luck!
SG
We have processed your application and now have you on hold for a position in a port/base or even company for which you may not have applied, for an indeterminate amount of time. We might call you, we might not. However don't call us. We will only give you updates when your shortlist expires, but then again we might not.
Look guys, being on the shortlist this time round definitely sucked. Be happy and grateful that at least you are there! There are still so many people that missed out, and others still that didn't have the opportunity to apply. Movement in QF is good for everyone, those at S/H, L/H and regionals - everyone wants recruitment to start again.
Good luck!
SG
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Singalong
*getting out guitar and putting on my poncho*
"...we shall not, we shall not be moved
we shall not, we shall not be moved,
just like a tree, standing by the waterside,
we shall not be moved."
"...we shall not, we shall not be moved
we shall not, we shall not be moved,
just like a tree, standing by the waterside,
we shall not be moved."
Thread Starter
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Hi guys.. I have read some memos today sent to me via email and have seen that QF is planning a new recruitmnet drive to replenish the nearly non-existance of the short list. I think once we have been removed by the end of 28may ( 5 1/2 weeks to go whos counting??)there will be nobody on the short list. I think Q-tee has already mentioned this. Also they did mention that they have increased prductivity in the crewing areas meaning crew are better used. There was no mention that of any new schools soon except that they will not be transfering any short to long crew for a while from the sounds of it. They are wanting a hire number of casuels and the crewing level at this stage is good with some 100 crew to return from june to september that took leave without pay. (sorry if this dosent make to much sense i am rushing to post this.) So as i have spoken to my other friends who are on the short list they all seem positive even though they have found this out. They keep saying that the extension was there for a reason otherwise we all good have got the thanks but no thanks letter.. Only time will tell ... Just reading from the threads I am still not able to work out how many people could be on the short list. Mr Seat back 2 have you got any idea from your neck of the woods.. It would be interesting to know !! Any ideas anybody ??? lets all have a great day!!
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Thanks for your post Qantastic, it all sounds promising ( fingers crossed)
I heard the waitlist had 200 or 300 on it, but that was when we first got notifcation that we had been successful. ( well kinda
)
5 and a half weeks? It's always the final leg that seems to take the longest
I heard the waitlist had 200 or 300 on it, but that was when we first got notifcation that we had been successful. ( well kinda
)5 and a half weeks? It's always the final leg that seems to take the longest
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Well...my info is as follows
1) Any recruitment into Long Haul will NOT be for casuals at this stage. Operationally, QF finds it really difficult to roster/assign work to casuals (apparently)...they're not getting the efficiencies they'd hoped for, in the same way as they do from the MAM Casuals (for obvious reasons, given the vast differences in their flying).
Long Haul only have a small number of casuals. Don't know if there's a limit on them, like the offshore crew. With the Long Haul EBA up at the end of year, who knows what else will change!
That's as of last week. Stay tuned for any changes of heart from Geoff and co!
2) Even with those returning from Leave Without Pay, a few reliable sources tell me that QF are searching for extra aircraft to start services SYD-Shanghai (PVG is the code from memory)-LHR. Although they now have the ability to go via HKG, a lot of work was put in by QF Mgmt to do PVG-LHR before the announcement. Well, for $47m you'd HOPE they'd use the extra LHR slots they bought before they're taken away from QF (because if QF don't use them, they lose em...)!
Which one they go with - either PVG or HKG - remains to be seen!
All the 747's should be back online by this September, or thereabouts, as they finish refurb (give or take a couple going through Skybed refurbishment)...that could of course, like all things, change.
3) I don't think Short Haul will be performing any recruitment for a wee while - except for more MAM casuals perhaps. Think it may all be Long Haul, and that the planned recruitment for mid this year is to top-up the current shortlist. As has been said previously, the numbers would have decreased markedly. Fingers crossed they don't do anymore culling of the list between now and end of May!
Have read in a magazine today that the next A330-300 is now due in November, with the others to follow. That would coincide with a lot of movement around the network, such as SYD-BOM flights, SYD-PVG and who knows what else! As more 767's go into Domestic (and the 1 other 767 into Australian), that means bigger aircraft requiring - dare I say - more crew.
Don't hold me to this info guys - change is in the wind!
Fingers crossed we all see each other in training schools later this year!
PS. Don't forget guys - Jetstar is recruiting like mad and will be for the remainder of the year.
1) Any recruitment into Long Haul will NOT be for casuals at this stage. Operationally, QF finds it really difficult to roster/assign work to casuals (apparently)...they're not getting the efficiencies they'd hoped for, in the same way as they do from the MAM Casuals (for obvious reasons, given the vast differences in their flying).
Long Haul only have a small number of casuals. Don't know if there's a limit on them, like the offshore crew. With the Long Haul EBA up at the end of year, who knows what else will change!
That's as of last week. Stay tuned for any changes of heart from Geoff and co!
2) Even with those returning from Leave Without Pay, a few reliable sources tell me that QF are searching for extra aircraft to start services SYD-Shanghai (PVG is the code from memory)-LHR. Although they now have the ability to go via HKG, a lot of work was put in by QF Mgmt to do PVG-LHR before the announcement. Well, for $47m you'd HOPE they'd use the extra LHR slots they bought before they're taken away from QF (because if QF don't use them, they lose em...)!
Which one they go with - either PVG or HKG - remains to be seen!
All the 747's should be back online by this September, or thereabouts, as they finish refurb (give or take a couple going through Skybed refurbishment)...that could of course, like all things, change.
3) I don't think Short Haul will be performing any recruitment for a wee while - except for more MAM casuals perhaps. Think it may all be Long Haul, and that the planned recruitment for mid this year is to top-up the current shortlist. As has been said previously, the numbers would have decreased markedly. Fingers crossed they don't do anymore culling of the list between now and end of May!
Have read in a magazine today that the next A330-300 is now due in November, with the others to follow. That would coincide with a lot of movement around the network, such as SYD-BOM flights, SYD-PVG and who knows what else! As more 767's go into Domestic (and the 1 other 767 into Australian), that means bigger aircraft requiring - dare I say - more crew.
Don't hold me to this info guys - change is in the wind!
Fingers crossed we all see each other in training schools later this year!
PS. Don't forget guys - Jetstar is recruiting like mad and will be for the remainder of the year.
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I also read the Q & A from QF that some are referring to and I couldnt find anything positive for current shortlisters. Sure they talk about recruitment for the shortlist mid year, casuals for short haul and the fact that casuals dont work well within long haul operations, but there is no mention of PERMANENT employment in either division nor anticipated employment in the near future. Dixon has made it clear PERMANENT is a thing of the past, and as there is no provision in the long haul EBA for 3-5 contracts I would expect if I were guys that if you are offered anything it would be fixed term 12 months. This gives QF a lot of flexability in terms of shedding Australian based crew if they get what they want in terms of increasing the overseas based crew in the next EBA.
However, QF require more aircraft, are starting new routes etc therefore you would think they will require more crew but if I were you guys dont expect permanent employment otherwise you will only be disappointed. The only permanent positions if any will go to internals I think. Hope for fixed term and anything better than that is a bonus.
The Q & A was wonderfully written but I didnt find much in that was positive at all, sorry. Maybe I'm just not looking at it from a shortlist point of view.
Easternboy
I cant even think of words to say to you, which is quite a shock for me!!
However, QF require more aircraft, are starting new routes etc therefore you would think they will require more crew but if I were you guys dont expect permanent employment otherwise you will only be disappointed. The only permanent positions if any will go to internals I think. Hope for fixed term and anything better than that is a bonus.
The Q & A was wonderfully written but I didnt find much in that was positive at all, sorry. Maybe I'm just not looking at it from a shortlist point of view.
Easternboy
I cant even think of words to say to you, which is quite a shock for me!!
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At least the ability exists for contractors to be offered permanent employment. But like you said Galleyhag, with the impending EBA and offshore crew matters - not entirely positive. Having said that though, never say never!
QF will be undergoing a great deal of change over the next 2 years with additional aircraft, new routes, etc. Whilst nothing overtly positive is in the Q&A, there isn't anything overtly negative either.
I'm not expecting permanent employment - all in all, I've expected contract work (12 mths) for some time. Anything permanent is a bonus! When was the last time QF recruited full time crew off the street? Was it about 4 years ago??
Keep the faith guys - like cloud nine says, it's the last leg that's always the longest!
QF will be undergoing a great deal of change over the next 2 years with additional aircraft, new routes, etc. Whilst nothing overtly positive is in the Q&A, there isn't anything overtly negative either.
I'm not expecting permanent employment - all in all, I've expected contract work (12 mths) for some time. Anything permanent is a bonus! When was the last time QF recruited full time crew off the street? Was it about 4 years ago??
Keep the faith guys - like cloud nine says, it's the last leg that's always the longest!
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QF took something like 200+ people off the shortlist in early 2002 for permanent positions into short haul. From memory over at long haul people off 12 month fixed term contracts were called and offered permanent around the same time but not sure of numbers but some were without work for around 3 months.
For sure never say never and with everything happening at the very least you would think they would offer a 12 month fixed term contract. However I just wanted to make people aware that are on the shortlist that permanent positions are highly unlikely.
As you say Mr Seatback QF is undergoing major changes to the way we operate, therefore permanent positions for new entrants maybe a thing of the past but that doesnt mean they still may not be offered. I think QF like the try before you buy motto.
For sure never say never and with everything happening at the very least you would think they would offer a 12 month fixed term contract. However I just wanted to make people aware that are on the shortlist that permanent positions are highly unlikely.
As you say Mr Seatback QF is undergoing major changes to the way we operate, therefore permanent positions for new entrants maybe a thing of the past but that doesnt mean they still may not be offered. I think QF like the try before you buy motto.
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With the 200+ people going permanent in Short Haul - are you sure they were all from the Short list? Memory is foggy on my part, but I seem to recall a number of casuals (when QF had their own) and contractors all going permanent around the same time...
Not doubting your info, just don't recall an influx of people from one list.
On everything else, couldn't agree more with everything else you've posted.
Not doubting your info, just don't recall an influx of people from one list.
On everything else, couldn't agree more with everything else you've posted.
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Now that you mention it, I dont think they were all off the short list. There were fixed term crew and mam casuals converted to permanent with the balance off the short list. I would say though that at the very least 100 were off the short list.
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I don't think MAM casuals existed back then. Maybe they did - the old grey matter not what it used to be...I do remember (cause one of my best friends used to be one) that QF had their own casuals. They didn't have hundreds or anything (I think about 30-odd) and they, along with a number of contractors, all of a sudden became permanent.
100 odd from the shortlist sounds about right. I remember because a few of my colleagues were on the shortlist from 2001 - and some were extended, whilst others weren't. Those that were extended were eventually offered positions in either Long Haul or Short Haul.
So, if history repeats itself, maybe...just maybe...the future could be looking bright!
100 odd from the shortlist sounds about right. I remember because a few of my colleagues were on the shortlist from 2001 - and some were extended, whilst others weren't. Those that were extended were eventually offered positions in either Long Haul or Short Haul.
So, if history repeats itself, maybe...just maybe...the future could be looking bright!
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What a gamble!
Now this is the time where one wishes they had not started their flying career. If I was not permanent Sydney based FA, I would personally be happy with any thing that QF were to offer me. However if fixed term is offered, I would have to do some very heavy thinking in regards to accepting it or not. Not sure if I could just throw caution to the wind and give up my perm flying job, which I do enjoy. I have been to many interviews, even as an experianced FA, and I know how hard it is to get through. Its definatley not something that you want to throw away with out good reason too.
What are others thoughts on this that are also waiting to hear?
What are others thoughts on this that are also waiting to hear?
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Hmm.... its a difficult one....
I have a permanent, well paid and relatively senior position in the public service, so it would be an extremely difficult decision to make...
I'd probably still take it and see what pans out.... The old motto of high risk, high return.... (then again I could flat on my @rse)....
I'd prefer a contract a little longer than 1yr. 2 - 3 years would be much better....
Have to wait and see.....
I have a permanent, well paid and relatively senior position in the public service, so it would be an extremely difficult decision to make...
I'd probably still take it and see what pans out.... The old motto of high risk, high return.... (then again I could flat on my @rse)....
I'd prefer a contract a little longer than 1yr. 2 - 3 years would be much better....
Have to wait and see.....
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What a great question Cloudy! This will get some debate flowing!
Originally, when this whole recruitment thing started about 18 odd months ago, I was not going to accept anything less than full time, permanent employment.
Now, with hindsight, and having the appreciation of an extra year and a bit under my belt, I'd be happy to take a contract position SOLELY for the purpose of doing long haul flying.
Is it a gamble, given that I'm already flying full time for an airline now? Yes - a bloody big one. But it's one I'm prepared to make, given my desire to branch into Long Haul (I much prefer long flights over short hops), and that even with a full time flying job, anything can happen that might stop me flying (eg. illness).
So - for me, I say live life to the full, and enjoy each day as it comes!
And if the contract thing results in no further employment for me - then maybe it's a sign for me to start afresh somewhere else?! Scary? Certainly - but I've been through tougher challenges (as I'm sure we all have). Change can be a good thing if you make it work for you!
Interesting to hear what others might think. As for whether or not the contract periods could be longer than 12 months (given the long haul EBA negotiations later this year), who knows. Between that and offshore labour, bit like being caught between a rock and a hard place.
Originally, when this whole recruitment thing started about 18 odd months ago, I was not going to accept anything less than full time, permanent employment.
Now, with hindsight, and having the appreciation of an extra year and a bit under my belt, I'd be happy to take a contract position SOLELY for the purpose of doing long haul flying.
Is it a gamble, given that I'm already flying full time for an airline now? Yes - a bloody big one. But it's one I'm prepared to make, given my desire to branch into Long Haul (I much prefer long flights over short hops), and that even with a full time flying job, anything can happen that might stop me flying (eg. illness).
So - for me, I say live life to the full, and enjoy each day as it comes!
And if the contract thing results in no further employment for me - then maybe it's a sign for me to start afresh somewhere else?! Scary? Certainly - but I've been through tougher challenges (as I'm sure we all have). Change can be a good thing if you make it work for you!
Interesting to hear what others might think. As for whether or not the contract periods could be longer than 12 months (given the long haul EBA negotiations later this year), who knows. Between that and offshore labour, bit like being caught between a rock and a hard place.
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Coloured beads and mirrors
Ok, so if permanent is not an option, and say they offer fixed term...then I would want QF to disclose what the process is for selecting expiring fixed-termers to be made permanent.
I would not accept casual. I would be most unlikely to accept fixed term. Why?
Would you trust a 'rollover possibility' to an HR department that recruited you for jobs that don't seem to exist and then flicks you off a shortlist as it feels like it?
Glad I've got options.
I would not accept casual. I would be most unlikely to accept fixed term. Why?
Would you trust a 'rollover possibility' to an HR department that recruited you for jobs that don't seem to exist and then flicks you off a shortlist as it feels like it?
Glad I've got options.