Qantas...Post COVID
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Originally Posted by MelbourneFlyer
Wow, P377, if juvenile retorts like that are best you can do, no wonder your actual opinions seem so ill-informed.
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P377, how about trying to debate the issue rather than the personalities? I know that's hard for you when playground-level insults seem to be your forte, but do tell, what is so bad about Qantas' decision to keep so many staff on salary during the past month despite demand and flights being crippled by the lockdowns? Or are you incapable of admitting that Alan Joyce and the QF execs can in fact make business decisions which are not always as evil as you like to portray?
Originally Posted by Paragraph377
But a sensible reply would be wasted on your ridiculous notion that Alan and the Board are doing a wonderfully amazing job at Qantas when it comes to its treatment of its staff.
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Originally Posted by MelbourneFlyer
P377, how about trying to debate the issue rather than the personalities? I know that's hard for you when playground-level insults seem to be your forte, but do tell, what is so bad about Qantas' decision to keep so many staff on salary during the past month despite demand and flights being crippled by the lockdowns? Or are you incapable of admitting that Alan Joyce and the QF execs can in fact make business decisions which are not always as evil as you like to portray?
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Originally Posted by Paragraph377
I don’t need to debate anything as my opinion remains unchanged. I’m sure the 2,500 sacked ground handlers, sacked for the purpose of saving an alleged $100m per annum wouldn’t see things the way you do, Shane.
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Originally Posted by MelbourneFlyer
Well if I was running an airline and could save at least $100m per year by moving to outsourced contract staff, which is a model that works around the world and which has been proven to be more efficient than having your own employees who are notorious as a group for over-crewing and feather-bedding, sleeping open the job, milking the rosters to maximise penalties and overtime etc, then yes, that's exactly what I would do, and any CEO who would not do this doesn't deserve to be CEO in the first place. But it sounds to me like you're just another overly critical 'armchair airline CEO' who can't take an objective view of anything because your established prejudice gets colours your worldview.
I wonder how much money Qantas will save by having their aircraft damaged in outports by cheap contractors with cheap GSE and working under extreme manpower shortages? Oh that’s right, wasn’t it 3 aircraft grounded nationally in one week due to GSE damage? I also wonder how Qantas feel about those pesky load control errors that have occurred exponentially since outsourcing ground operations.
Last edited by Paragraph377; 5th Aug 2021 at 07:02.
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Originally Posted by Paragraph377
Wow Shane, I’m sure that the ground crew that worked hard would love to hear your esteemed analysis of their alleged poor performance.
Originally Posted by MelbourneFlyer
My comments don't apply to all of them of course but there were enough that rode the gravy train for decades and now that ride has come to an end. Same as the goings-on at the wharves until the late 90s when Patricks cleaned things out. Yes, a lot of pain and anger there but guess what, we actually ended up dragging Australia's waterfront operations into the 20th century and making them more efficient by every measure. There's simply no room in the world these days for those sorts of cushy practises of the 1950s and 1960s mindset, and I make no apologies for expecting any business, let alone one the size and important of Qantas, to be running like a business.
There's simply no room in the world these days for those sorts of cushy practises of the 1950s and 1960s mindset
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Totally agree Snoozer.
Yep, to retrench 2500 people to save $100 million is essential to the survival of our business.
To pay the CEO $10.24 million is essential for the survival of our business.
Hypocrisy doesn't even come close.
Melbourne Flyer, I, like most of the other crew I work with, wouldn't the money being saved by these decisions was re-invested in the Mainline Product- but unfortunately, it is be used to line the pockets of the Few.
And if you (as in Management) don't get it- the main issue with stand down is that Crew were FORCED to return, and give up secondary employment on the basis that they were permanently Stood Up ( and so Alliance could operate former 737 services...). Keeping us stood up was "To maintain Operational Flexibility"...DH's words, not mine...not because it was a nice gesture.
And as for Mental Health that has dominated Yammer in the last couple of weeks- the Company could not give a toss.
And yes, if EBITDA is a loss, I will say sorry, I have integrity- and admit to errors.
Yep, to retrench 2500 people to save $100 million is essential to the survival of our business.
To pay the CEO $10.24 million is essential for the survival of our business.
Hypocrisy doesn't even come close.
Melbourne Flyer, I, like most of the other crew I work with, wouldn't the money being saved by these decisions was re-invested in the Mainline Product- but unfortunately, it is be used to line the pockets of the Few.
And if you (as in Management) don't get it- the main issue with stand down is that Crew were FORCED to return, and give up secondary employment on the basis that they were permanently Stood Up ( and so Alliance could operate former 737 services...). Keeping us stood up was "To maintain Operational Flexibility"...DH's words, not mine...not because it was a nice gesture.
And as for Mental Health that has dominated Yammer in the last couple of weeks- the Company could not give a toss.
And yes, if EBITDA is a loss, I will say sorry, I have integrity- and admit to errors.
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Street Garbage, don't misunderstand me, I am certainly not suggesting that the job of Qantas Group CEO is worth $10m per year. I think $7.5m is more appropriate, with maybe $5m for the CEOs of QF domestic and QF international. But much less than that would be hard to see working, I mean, if the CEO of Qantas Group is $5m then the CEO of each operational arm of the airline would be paid quite a bit less, eg $3m, and that's just not going to fly in today's business world.
And I also agree there needs to be more investment in the airline, be it fleet or product or lounges. But right now that $100m per year is really just going to help bring the books back into balance, not a lot in the scheme of things but it all adds up.
And I also agree there needs to be more investment in the airline, be it fleet or product or lounges. But right now that $100m per year is really just going to help bring the books back into balance, not a lot in the scheme of things but it all adds up.
Last edited by MelbourneFlyer; 5th Aug 2021 at 08:46.
Well, we are in a much much worse position than this time last yr. Hiw much of that runway that AJ always talks about is left? Outside of SY base you might be lucky to fly again this yr, NSW is out until next yr at the earliest.
Originally Posted by SHVC
Well, we are in a much much worse position than this time last yr…..
…….Outside of SY base you might be lucky to fly again this yr, NSW is out until next yr at the earliest.
…….Outside of SY base you might be lucky to fly again this yr, NSW is out until next yr at the earliest.
Talk about a glass half empty kind of person. You must be a hoot to hang around! :-)
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Originally Posted by MelbourneFlyer
I am certainly not suggesting that the job of Qantas Group CEO is worth $10m per year. I think $7.5m is more appropriate, with maybe $5m for the CEOs of QF domestic and QF international. But much less than that would be hard to see working, I mean, if the CEO of Qantas Group is $5m then the CEO of each operational arm of the airline would be paid quite a bit less, eg $3m, and that's just not going to fly in today's business world.
Originally Posted by ScepticalOptomist
With all due respect, how can you possibly assert that? Everyone is so full of their own BS here on PPRuNe!
Talk about a glass half empty kind of person. You must be a hoot to hang around! :-)
Talk about a glass half empty kind of person. You must be a hoot to hang around! :-)
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Originally Posted by MelbourneFlyer
Well if I was running an airline and could save at least $100m per year by moving to outsourced contract staff, which is a model that works around the world and which has been proven to be more efficient than having your own employees who are notorious as a group for over-crewing and feather-bedding, sleeping open the job, milking the rosters to maximise penalties and overtime etc, then yes, that's exactly what I would do, and any CEO who would not do this doesn't deserve to be CEO in the first place. But it sounds to me like you're just another overly critical 'armchair airline CEO' who can't take an objective view of anything because your established prejudice gets colours your worldview.
When were the cash reserves supposed to be able to last until?
Was it the end of 2021?
At this rate we will be lucky if there is anything left to go back to.
MCD
Was it the end of 2021?
At this rate we will be lucky if there is anything left to go back to.
MCD
I think the last few months extended it, JQ was making a profit he last dial in we were told. But I agree we will be lucky to have a company to return to if this keeps up past 2021! NSW is out of the game for rest of the yr ppl need to realize regardless of the vaccination Gladys wants as other states will not let NSW travel there. Dan is locking Vic down weekly this is not sustainable.
Mid 2022 will see a very different country in what is left, seems Bain are tipping in more cash keeping their pilots and cabin crew paid even tho they’re not flying.
Mid 2022 will see a very different country in what is left, seems Bain are tipping in more cash keeping their pilots and cabin crew paid even tho they’re not flying.
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Originally Posted by SHVC
...seems Bain are tipping in more cash keeping their pilots and cabin crew paid even tho they’re not flying.
