Merged: Boeing Revises 787 First Flight and Delivery Plans- Again
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: in the classroom of life
Age: 55
Posts: 6,864
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Word at the factory is that it is far from finnished, a publicity stunt, and the delays and resources being poured into this are causing the problems on the 748 line.
No doubt it will get sorted but it has been a big financial and PR disaster so far.
First revenue flight will be the true "day".
No doubt it will get sorted but it has been a big financial and PR disaster so far.
First revenue flight will be the true "day".
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 399
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hong Kong welcomes first commercial Dreamliner flight
Passengers on the inaugural All Nippon Airways Boeing 787 flight are welcomed to Hong Kong.
Boeing's much-anticipated 787 carried its first passengers on a four-hour, eight-minute flight filled with cheers, picture-taking and swapping of aviation stories, yesterday.
The new long-haul jet aims to change the way passengers think about flying with larger windows, improved lighting and air pressure and humidity that more closely resembles that on the ground.
It's not the fastest or the largest jet but the plane, nicknamed The Dreamliner by Boeing, is built of lightweight materials that promise to dramatically improve fuel efficiency.
The first flight, from Tokyo to Hong Kong, was filled with 240 aviation reporters and enthusiasts - some of whom paid thousands of dollars for the privilege.
"It's silly, but it's a little piece of history. New cars come out all the time but how often do new planes come out?" said Stephanie Wood.
She and her husband Dean, of Davie, Florida, won a charity auction, paying nearly US$18,700 (NZ$23,353) for two business-class seats.
Another passenger paid US$32,000.
The most noticeable feature of the plane is its windows, which are 30 per cent larger than those on older jets. Passengers no longer need to hunch forwards to see the ground.
Those in the middle of the plane can even glance out part of the windows. The shades are replaced with a glare-reducing, electrical dimming system that adds tint to the window within 30 seconds.
"The windows are absolutely amazing. You're not confined. You've got the outside inside," Wood said.
The $193.5 million plane's debut was delayed more than three years because of manufacturing problems. But that didn't bother the fans who broke out in applause at every opportunity.
The highlight for many was a rainbow-coloured light show that transformed the sedate white interior into something closer to the Las Vegas strip.
Many of the 106 enthusiasts on board the flight by Japan's All Nippon Airways were carrying memorabilia from past inaugural flights and snapping photos of everything from the overhead bins to the bathroom with a window and bidet.
Thomas Lee, of Los Angeles, handed out his own press release and biography. There was his first inaugural flight - the Boeing 747 as a 17-year-old boy in 1970 - and then the Airbus A380 four years ago.
"I'm not crazy," he said.
"For an aviation enthusiast, this is as high as it gets. It's like going to a movie on opening day."
He and the rest of the coach passengers paid the apt sum of 78,700 yen (NZ$1289), to be part of the inaugural flight.
The 787 has been sold by Boeing as a "game changer," promising to revolutionise air travel just as its 707 did by allowing non-stop trans-Atlantic service and the 747 did by ushering in an age of mass travel.
The 787 is designed to connect cities that might otherwise not have non-stop flights.
Planes like the Boeing 747 and 777 and the Airbus A380 can fly most long-haul routes but finding enough daily passengers to fill the massive jets is a challenge.
The A380 typically has 525 passengers but can hold up to 853.
The 787 only carries 210 to 250 passengers. That means it can fly non-stop routes that larger planes can't profitably support like San Francisco to Manchester, England or Boston to Athens, Greece.
"It's going to be a hub-avoiding machine," said Ernie Arvai, partner with aviation consulting firm AirInsight.
"You'd pay extra not to go to (London's) Heathrow."
Connecting such smaller cities is the "holy grail" of air travel, said Richard Aboulafia, analyst with the Teal Group.
That's why the plane is the fastest-selling new jet in aviation history.
There were 821 orders for the 787 before its first flight, although 24 were recently cancelled by China Eastern Airlines because of delays.
Now, the industry is waiting to see if the plane meets Boeing's 20 per cent fuel-savings claims.
"If it performs as promised, it's the iPod of the aircraft world. If it doesn't, it's just another CD player," Aboulafia said.
ANA is the first airline to fly the plane and expects to have seven of them by the end of the year.
United Continental Holdings Inc. will be the first US carrier to fly the 787, sometime in the second half of 2012. It's planning to use the plane between Houston and Auckland, New Zealand.
There will probably be a short period when United - which ordered 50 of the jets - uses its first 787 on domestic or short trans-Atlantic flights. To make the Auckland route work, it will need a second 787 flying in the other direction.
For passengers, the changes start with boarding. They enter into a wide-open area with sweeping arches. Eyes instinctively move up. There's an impression of more space. Claustrophobia is reduced just a bit, even if seats are as cramped as ever.
Another physiological trick: lights gradually change colour during long flights to reduce jet lag.
But the biggest changes come thanks to the stronger composite shell, which is less susceptible to corrosion than aluminium.
Air won't be as dry, with humidity doubled to 16 per cent. The cabin will be pressurised at the equivalent of 6000 feet - 2000 less than most planes. That should lead to fewer headaches and leave passengers with more energy during long trips.
A number of passengers said yesterday's flight was too short to notice any improvement.
Other changes for passengers include:
* The largest overhead bins ever. They are designed at an angle to make the cabin feel significantly larger. Boeing says there's enough room overhead for every passenger to have one carry-on bag; however, the only way that seemed feasible was with identically rectangle bags, stacked in the optimal order.
* Less noise. New engines with a wave pattern around the exhaust reduce interior and exterior noise, although Boeing won't say by how much. Since the plane is lighter, additional sound and vibration padding can be added. Yesterday's flight appeared quieter, but a hand-held sound meter registered noise levels similar to Boeing's 777.
* Later models will have a turbulence dampening system. Accelerometers in the nose register a sudden drop. A signal is sent in nano seconds via fibre-optic cables to the wings. Adjustments are made and what would have been a nine-foot drop is cut to three feet.
Most passengers don't know the make or model of their plane, unless they read the safety instruction card. The 787's interior is likely to change that. Even those who don't fly it, are likely to notice.
Hundreds of employees at Hong Kong airport stopped working to watch - and take photos - of yesterday's arrival.
"We're celebrities," said passenger Lee Simonetta of Atlanta.
"We ought to just taxi around for an hour."
VideoNew Boeing lands in Hong Kong (1:51)
VideoBoeing delivered to All Nippon Airways (2:42)
Passengers on the inaugural All Nippon Airways Boeing 787 flight are welcomed to Hong Kong.
Boeing's much-anticipated 787 carried its first passengers on a four-hour, eight-minute flight filled with cheers, picture-taking and swapping of aviation stories, yesterday.
The new long-haul jet aims to change the way passengers think about flying with larger windows, improved lighting and air pressure and humidity that more closely resembles that on the ground.
It's not the fastest or the largest jet but the plane, nicknamed The Dreamliner by Boeing, is built of lightweight materials that promise to dramatically improve fuel efficiency.
The first flight, from Tokyo to Hong Kong, was filled with 240 aviation reporters and enthusiasts - some of whom paid thousands of dollars for the privilege.
"It's silly, but it's a little piece of history. New cars come out all the time but how often do new planes come out?" said Stephanie Wood.
She and her husband Dean, of Davie, Florida, won a charity auction, paying nearly US$18,700 (NZ$23,353) for two business-class seats.
Another passenger paid US$32,000.
The most noticeable feature of the plane is its windows, which are 30 per cent larger than those on older jets. Passengers no longer need to hunch forwards to see the ground.
Those in the middle of the plane can even glance out part of the windows. The shades are replaced with a glare-reducing, electrical dimming system that adds tint to the window within 30 seconds.
"The windows are absolutely amazing. You're not confined. You've got the outside inside," Wood said.
The $193.5 million plane's debut was delayed more than three years because of manufacturing problems. But that didn't bother the fans who broke out in applause at every opportunity.
The highlight for many was a rainbow-coloured light show that transformed the sedate white interior into something closer to the Las Vegas strip.
Many of the 106 enthusiasts on board the flight by Japan's All Nippon Airways were carrying memorabilia from past inaugural flights and snapping photos of everything from the overhead bins to the bathroom with a window and bidet.
Thomas Lee, of Los Angeles, handed out his own press release and biography. There was his first inaugural flight - the Boeing 747 as a 17-year-old boy in 1970 - and then the Airbus A380 four years ago.
"I'm not crazy," he said.
"For an aviation enthusiast, this is as high as it gets. It's like going to a movie on opening day."
He and the rest of the coach passengers paid the apt sum of 78,700 yen (NZ$1289), to be part of the inaugural flight.
The 787 has been sold by Boeing as a "game changer," promising to revolutionise air travel just as its 707 did by allowing non-stop trans-Atlantic service and the 747 did by ushering in an age of mass travel.
The 787 is designed to connect cities that might otherwise not have non-stop flights.
Planes like the Boeing 747 and 777 and the Airbus A380 can fly most long-haul routes but finding enough daily passengers to fill the massive jets is a challenge.
The A380 typically has 525 passengers but can hold up to 853.
The 787 only carries 210 to 250 passengers. That means it can fly non-stop routes that larger planes can't profitably support like San Francisco to Manchester, England or Boston to Athens, Greece.
"It's going to be a hub-avoiding machine," said Ernie Arvai, partner with aviation consulting firm AirInsight.
"You'd pay extra not to go to (London's) Heathrow."
Connecting such smaller cities is the "holy grail" of air travel, said Richard Aboulafia, analyst with the Teal Group.
That's why the plane is the fastest-selling new jet in aviation history.
There were 821 orders for the 787 before its first flight, although 24 were recently cancelled by China Eastern Airlines because of delays.
Now, the industry is waiting to see if the plane meets Boeing's 20 per cent fuel-savings claims.
"If it performs as promised, it's the iPod of the aircraft world. If it doesn't, it's just another CD player," Aboulafia said.
ANA is the first airline to fly the plane and expects to have seven of them by the end of the year.
United Continental Holdings Inc. will be the first US carrier to fly the 787, sometime in the second half of 2012. It's planning to use the plane between Houston and Auckland, New Zealand.
There will probably be a short period when United - which ordered 50 of the jets - uses its first 787 on domestic or short trans-Atlantic flights. To make the Auckland route work, it will need a second 787 flying in the other direction.
For passengers, the changes start with boarding. They enter into a wide-open area with sweeping arches. Eyes instinctively move up. There's an impression of more space. Claustrophobia is reduced just a bit, even if seats are as cramped as ever.
Another physiological trick: lights gradually change colour during long flights to reduce jet lag.
But the biggest changes come thanks to the stronger composite shell, which is less susceptible to corrosion than aluminium.
Air won't be as dry, with humidity doubled to 16 per cent. The cabin will be pressurised at the equivalent of 6000 feet - 2000 less than most planes. That should lead to fewer headaches and leave passengers with more energy during long trips.
A number of passengers said yesterday's flight was too short to notice any improvement.
Other changes for passengers include:
* The largest overhead bins ever. They are designed at an angle to make the cabin feel significantly larger. Boeing says there's enough room overhead for every passenger to have one carry-on bag; however, the only way that seemed feasible was with identically rectangle bags, stacked in the optimal order.
* Less noise. New engines with a wave pattern around the exhaust reduce interior and exterior noise, although Boeing won't say by how much. Since the plane is lighter, additional sound and vibration padding can be added. Yesterday's flight appeared quieter, but a hand-held sound meter registered noise levels similar to Boeing's 777.
* Later models will have a turbulence dampening system. Accelerometers in the nose register a sudden drop. A signal is sent in nano seconds via fibre-optic cables to the wings. Adjustments are made and what would have been a nine-foot drop is cut to three feet.
Most passengers don't know the make or model of their plane, unless they read the safety instruction card. The 787's interior is likely to change that. Even those who don't fly it, are likely to notice.
Hundreds of employees at Hong Kong airport stopped working to watch - and take photos - of yesterday's arrival.
"We're celebrities," said passenger Lee Simonetta of Atlanta.
"We ought to just taxi around for an hour."
VideoNew Boeing lands in Hong Kong (1:51)
VideoBoeing delivered to All Nippon Airways (2:42)
380 is quieter.
Airbus have had turbulence dampers for years.
So you get some flashy lights and some big windows.
Yep a real game changer.
Airbus have had turbulence dampers for years.
So you get some flashy lights and some big windows.
Yep a real game changer.
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: under a rock
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Missy,
The 787 is reported to be in Australia on the 15 and 16 of November. However, nothing has been published by Boeing or qantas regarding any promo.
Boeing has confirmed the 787 to be in NZ on the 13 and 14.
The 787 is reported to be in Australia on the 15 and 16 of November. However, nothing has been published by Boeing or qantas regarding any promo.
Boeing has confirmed the 787 to be in NZ on the 13 and 14.
Nunc est bibendum
i was lucky enough to be one of the QF staff who scored tickets to see it on Wednesday at Sydney. Can't wait.
Probably the only chance I get to see it with Qantas.
Probably the only chance I get to see it with Qantas.
JQ Asia
Jestar have A320s, A330s, and soon 787s. What ever happened to it being a low cost style airline?
Would have made more sense to replace the 767 with the 787s and that would have allowed for further international expansion as well as the retirement of an expensive fleet, and just sent the new A330s to Jetstar. Qpilots would be happier, they get a new toy, and the training costs for Jetstar are less.
Would have made more sense to replace the 767 with the 787s and that would have allowed for further international expansion as well as the retirement of an expensive fleet, and just sent the new A330s to Jetstar. Qpilots would be happier, they get a new toy, and the training costs for Jetstar are less.
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wouldn't a LCC benefit more than a premium carrier from having the most fuel efficient aircraft as fuel makes up a higher proportion of cost? A332 will be returned to QF to replace B767.
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: under a rock
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just throwing this question out there in hopes that a Sydney ATC do petrol these forums. The B787 will be arriving in Sydney on Tuesday the 15th.
What do you think of the landing runway would be if we are looking to see it coming and take a few happy snaps? The 34L/16R or 34R/16L?
cheers
Bubbles.
What do you think of the landing runway would be if we are looking to see it coming and take a few happy snaps? The 34L/16R or 34R/16L?
cheers
Bubbles.
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Stuck in the middle...
Posts: 1,638
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
OK BP2197,
Until all their A330s are replaced by B787s and returned to QF,
On the usual LCC logic of reducing the number of types in your fleet, it would have made far better logic for QF to get the B787 first and send A330s to Jetstar 1:1 after the B767s were all replaced. At least that way, a lot of the intro costs would've been borne by mainline.
So the Dugong had QF decals on its first visit. What will the 787 have... ??
Until all their A330s are replaced by B787s and returned to QF,
Jestar have A320s, A330s, and soon 787s. What ever happened to it being a low cost style airline?
So the Dugong had QF decals on its first visit. What will the 787 have... ??
Last edited by Taildragger67; 15th Nov 2011 at 05:09.
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Warm & Sunny
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
bubble.head _
Southerly through SYD tonight and should still be there middle of the day tomorrow; I would guess 16R.
Yes, you have to give the prize to Q "management" - complain about their costs being 20% above competitors, then hand off the newest , most fuel efficient a/c on the market to Jet* whilst the premium market continue with the old/tired types.
Guess who will be footing the bill for the refurbishment of the A330's when they are returned to their owner; that loss making Mainline International no doubt.
Southerly through SYD tonight and should still be there middle of the day tomorrow; I would guess 16R.
Yes, you have to give the prize to Q "management" - complain about their costs being 20% above competitors, then hand off the newest , most fuel efficient a/c on the market to Jet* whilst the premium market continue with the old/tired types.
Guess who will be footing the bill for the refurbishment of the A330's when they are returned to their owner; that loss making Mainline International no doubt.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: sydney
Posts: 136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wouldn't a LCC benefit more than a premium carrier from having the most fuel efficient aircraft as fuel makes up a higher proportion of cost? A332 will be returned to QF to replace B767.
Might or might not be the LCC subsidiary.