Mega Merged: Qantas Long Haul Cabin Crew Eba8 Negotiations
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That's right. Vote no to this and it's probably over very soon. Vote yes, and we at least have 5 good years and I'm pretty sure a lot more after that, too.
If you don't trust the current FAAA negotiating team and you vote No, why would you trust them to try and get a "better" deal? Really think this through.
People like you could jeopardise all of our jobs. Don't post crap unless you really know all the facts.
Go to a meeting. Get the facts. Then come back and play.
If you don't trust the current FAAA negotiating team and you vote No, why would you trust them to try and get a "better" deal? Really think this through.
People like you could jeopardise all of our jobs. Don't post crap unless you really know all the facts.
Go to a meeting. Get the facts. Then come back and play.
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"the fish"
explain to me why the 3k bribe? think from the mind of greed... he(GD
) wants us out numbered for votes on eba9..we vote no and we get MM and sons to go back to the table.its not a lib governnment any longer. i say call the bluff. i also dont trust MM
any longer..he rolls too easily. regarding the union meetings? i've been and MM contradicts himself..
plus gets defiant when asked the wrong question..cant wait to vote him out
) wants us out numbered for votes on eba9..we vote no and we get MM and sons to go back to the table.its not a lib governnment any longer. i say call the bluff. i also dont trust MM any longer..he rolls too easily. regarding the union meetings? i've been and MM contradicts himself.. plus gets defiant when asked the wrong question..cant wait to vote him out
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I spoke to the Domestic FAAA yesterday, and negotiations for the SH EBA is due to commence in Jan. I was told "we will take all the flying we can get", its that attitude which should give some warning to you all.
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I can assure you all that if this eba is defeated then there will certainly be no going back to the table for MM SR or any of the current FAAA officials. As was stated at the meeting the other day if you defeat the EBA which is the culmination of 2 years solid work and planning.
there is no $3000 bribe. It was part of the FAAA Claim as to break the 3% barrier for pay rises has been impossible for any union since 1996 including the most powerful union (AIPA) Pilots.
The pilots have been out of EBA for nearly 12 months and are 2 meal allowance reviews behind cabin crew and we have no qualifications that compare with pilots.
This EBA protects the current crew and creates good full time jobs in Australia for young people.
Leanne Dalton is circulating an email to crew urging them to vote it down because its a 'dire EBA'
Leanne was not at any of the FAAA meetings in the last 3 years as she was not an FAAA member and probably is still not. Such is her committment to the Union and flight attendants.
When it comes to credibility i wouldnt trust someone who professes to care about crew and not even be a union member haviing once held high office
there is no $3000 bribe. It was part of the FAAA Claim as to break the 3% barrier for pay rises has been impossible for any union since 1996 including the most powerful union (AIPA) Pilots.
The pilots have been out of EBA for nearly 12 months and are 2 meal allowance reviews behind cabin crew and we have no qualifications that compare with pilots.
This EBA protects the current crew and creates good full time jobs in Australia for young people.
Leanne Dalton is circulating an email to crew urging them to vote it down because its a 'dire EBA'
Leanne was not at any of the FAAA meetings in the last 3 years as she was not an FAAA member and probably is still not. Such is her committment to the Union and flight attendants.
When it comes to credibility i wouldnt trust someone who professes to care about crew and not even be a union member haviing once held high office
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The 'new hire' Qantas Flight Attendants will not get to vote in EBA 9. They will be hired by a separate company and as such will have their own EBA. They can negotiate whatever they like with the company, and you will have no control whatsoever.
MAM F/A's do not vote in the short haul EBA. They have their own separate EBA.
With regard to the 787. I think that crew should consider the fact that 787's may never become part of the Qantas fleet. If they do, it will most likely be outside the span (5 years) of EBA 8. The first 787's are for Jetstar, and the A330's currently at Jetstar will be transferred back to Qantas. There is no benefit in securing a promise that Longhaul will crew all the 787's in this EBA, if the 787's don't become part of the Qantas fleet until after the EBA has expired.
MAM F/A's do not vote in the short haul EBA. They have their own separate EBA.
With regard to the 787. I think that crew should consider the fact that 787's may never become part of the Qantas fleet. If they do, it will most likely be outside the span (5 years) of EBA 8. The first 787's are for Jetstar, and the A330's currently at Jetstar will be transferred back to Qantas. There is no benefit in securing a promise that Longhaul will crew all the 787's in this EBA, if the 787's don't become part of the Qantas fleet until after the EBA has expired.
Last edited by call button; 6th Dec 2007 at 22:14.
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The EBA would get up without the $3K, just as easily.
One question I have asked myself is why would Qantas care about what happens after 5 years when every other decision they make is based on what happens in the next 5 minutes?
With this EBA we live to fight another day with a different management (and live well).
One question I have asked myself is why would Qantas care about what happens after 5 years when every other decision they make is based on what happens in the next 5 minutes?
With this EBA we live to fight another day with a different management (and live well).
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OMG I don't believe it! i actually agree 100% of what twiggs has posted......hmmmm something wrong here!
Twiggs so you have been following Dr's orders and have finally started taking those pills.
The EBA will be voted up! call button you statements are so incorrect, attend and EBA meeting and you will get your answers.
Twiggs so you have been following Dr's orders and have finally started taking those pills.
The EBA will be voted up! call button you statements are so incorrect, attend and EBA meeting and you will get your answers.
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Back To The Future
In 1988 when the Bid System was being introduced the same nonsense that went on then is going on now.
Crew memebers cars were damaged in the carpark,crew were being rung at home and threatened.One poor devil even had his dog poisoned.
We now are so enamoured of our Bid System Crew would scream blue murder if it was taken away.
The same type of moronic behaviour is apparent now.
When the dusts settles you will see that these fools are wrong..just like they were in 1988
There are those that are so dysfunctional that they cannot and will not see the benefits of change in anything.
This is a good deal...its not perfect ...nothing in life is.
Some of the posters on here have suspect credentials ..these issues often excite the lunatic fringe.
You want the truth?.....go to a meeting...get a copy of the EBA and make up your own "adult"mind".
Those that are critical suggest going back to re negotiate..ARE YoU INSANE?
This is the best deal you are going to get.
Those that want to undermine this EBA want to undermne your future.
Those people will not put their names to anything so that they can be questioned.
They are cowards who hide behind anonymity.
The FAAA is open ,upfront and conducting meetings...the critics arent.
Ask yourself ..Where are they? ..Who are these faceless people and why are they doing this?
There are those in this industry who will benefit from this EBA not getting up.
Think about it....
Crew memebers cars were damaged in the carpark,crew were being rung at home and threatened.One poor devil even had his dog poisoned.
We now are so enamoured of our Bid System Crew would scream blue murder if it was taken away.
The same type of moronic behaviour is apparent now.
When the dusts settles you will see that these fools are wrong..just like they were in 1988
There are those that are so dysfunctional that they cannot and will not see the benefits of change in anything.
This is a good deal...its not perfect ...nothing in life is.
Some of the posters on here have suspect credentials ..these issues often excite the lunatic fringe.
You want the truth?.....go to a meeting...get a copy of the EBA and make up your own "adult"mind".
Those that are critical suggest going back to re negotiate..ARE YoU INSANE?
This is the best deal you are going to get.
Those that want to undermine this EBA want to undermne your future.
Those people will not put their names to anything so that they can be questioned.
They are cowards who hide behind anonymity.
The FAAA is open ,upfront and conducting meetings...the critics arent.
Ask yourself ..Where are they? ..Who are these faceless people and why are they doing this?
There are those in this industry who will benefit from this EBA not getting up.
Think about it....
Last edited by DEFCON4; 7th Dec 2007 at 01:57.
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Go to a meeting Call Button
Call Button , I suggest you attend one of the FAAA meetings so you can get the facts .
Yes Mam casuals have their own EBA but if you attend one of the meetings you will know that the newly recruited FA's employed by QCCA will be covered by the very same LH EBA 8 that is proposed for us.
At the meeting you will be given a hand out which very clearly states on the first page that the proposed EBA 8 is divided into 3 parts. Part A applies to all LH crew, current and new entrants then Chapter 1 applies to only current LH crew and Chapter 2 applies to all new entrants.
If the EBA 8 is voted yes then all the QCCA employees will be able to vote on EBA 9.
Galley gossip and crew bus b******t doesnt cut it anymore.
Yes Mam casuals have their own EBA but if you attend one of the meetings you will know that the newly recruited FA's employed by QCCA will be covered by the very same LH EBA 8 that is proposed for us.
At the meeting you will be given a hand out which very clearly states on the first page that the proposed EBA 8 is divided into 3 parts. Part A applies to all LH crew, current and new entrants then Chapter 1 applies to only current LH crew and Chapter 2 applies to all new entrants.
If the EBA 8 is voted yes then all the QCCA employees will be able to vote on EBA 9.
Galley gossip and crew bus b******t doesnt cut it anymore.
Last edited by lovelondon; 7th Dec 2007 at 03:06. Reason: Post too long
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Thank You
Flugbegleiter and others for given a more detailed account. more info is required and i am sure will come forward. i also will attend a meeting when i get a chance.
defcon4 the original bidding system was good but as you know 34 or so amendments dont help.
we shall continue to keep with questions, the more we know the more we can dispute "galley rumors".
defcon4 the original bidding system was good but as you know 34 or so amendments dont help.
we shall continue to keep with questions, the more we know the more we can dispute "galley rumors".
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No Names No Credibilty
Whether you like Mijatov, Smedley or Reed, or not, Pegasus is correct.
For those of you who are the authors on TUF why dont you act what you preach. You suggest dont trust whats in this EBA.
Who are you, what are YOUR names, what is your industrial experience, what is your union experience if any, what is your flying experience if any, are you Long or Short Haul?
If what you are saying has any shred of truth to it , it will go largely ignored unless you put your reputations out there with your EBA predictions and viewpoints.
Until you do that i would suggest you change the name of your site from Tuf to scared. Or Tuf to offer an alternative but not my name or expeience.
There are former officials who have insisted in the past that a dob without a name is not to be taken seriously or used against a F/A. Surely the same principle applies here.
Last EBA i was sick of seeing Reeds and Mijatovs name, however, i did read their stuff because they signed it.
One more thing. I guess it will eventually drift out who is behind Tuf. I suggest they make themselves known rather than they become known for being to scared (of what i dont know) to make themselves known.
My advice is read it when its signed then you know whos written it otherwise it could be written by anyone, even non flyers, anybody.
If it aint signed ignore it!
No im not mijatovs stooge , im not anyones stooge, particularly anonymous advice givers.
For those of you who are the authors on TUF why dont you act what you preach. You suggest dont trust whats in this EBA.
Who are you, what are YOUR names, what is your industrial experience, what is your union experience if any, what is your flying experience if any, are you Long or Short Haul?
If what you are saying has any shred of truth to it , it will go largely ignored unless you put your reputations out there with your EBA predictions and viewpoints.
Until you do that i would suggest you change the name of your site from Tuf to scared. Or Tuf to offer an alternative but not my name or expeience.
There are former officials who have insisted in the past that a dob without a name is not to be taken seriously or used against a F/A. Surely the same principle applies here.
Last EBA i was sick of seeing Reeds and Mijatovs name, however, i did read their stuff because they signed it.
One more thing. I guess it will eventually drift out who is behind Tuf. I suggest they make themselves known rather than they become known for being to scared (of what i dont know) to make themselves known.
My advice is read it when its signed then you know whos written it otherwise it could be written by anyone, even non flyers, anybody.
If it aint signed ignore it!
No im not mijatovs stooge , im not anyones stooge, particularly anonymous advice givers.
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Why are QF so keen to lock us into an EBA so quickly? All other unions have problems getting their EBA's negotiated years after they expire.
What is the significance of the impending announcement regarding the segmentation of the QF business?
What will happen when future aircraft deliveries are not owned by Qantas Airways Limited anymore? In future they will be owned by another company in turn owned by QF.
Me thinks there is a lot more to unfold from this than people think.
Be careful.
What is the significance of the impending announcement regarding the segmentation of the QF business?
What will happen when future aircraft deliveries are not owned by Qantas Airways Limited anymore? In future they will be owned by another company in turn owned by QF.
Me thinks there is a lot more to unfold from this than people think.
Be careful.
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The fact is this EBA delivers what most of us have been scared of losing for the last 3 years, and giving us back some of what we lost prior to that.
We got what we asked for and still some people are sceptical.
Most of us are confident that Michael and Steve have got all the hidden agenda covered but you can only do so much.
Yes, Qantas will probably have some nasty surprises ahead, but at least we will go into the next 5 years knowing we got a damn good deal and if we are lucky, we will have Reed and Mijatov negotiating again for us at the end of 2012.
We got what we asked for and still some people are sceptical.
Most of us are confident that Michael and Steve have got all the hidden agenda covered but you can only do so much.
Yes, Qantas will probably have some nasty surprises ahead, but at least we will go into the next 5 years knowing we got a damn good deal and if we are lucky, we will have Reed and Mijatov negotiating again for us at the end of 2012.
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for those of you that dont have access to the Crew website!
here is the latest from QF managerment
LONG HAUL CABIN CREW EBA 8 - FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS
1. When do all these initiatives begin?
◣ The new EBA will only come into effect if it is endorsed by a majority of long haul crew
voting in a secret ballot. If endorsed by a majority of crew the Agreement can be lodged
with the Workplace Authority and will come into effect as soon as it is lodged.
2. How do I apply for part time?
◣ We’ll be releasing Expression of Interest forms as soon as the new Agreement comes
into effect. We will also use the existing waitlists.
3. When will part-time start?
◣ As soon as the expressions of interest can be processed, positions will be phased in for
operational reasons. We expect part time positions to start rolling out from BP257. Our
aim is to meet the demand for part time opportunities as quickly as possible.
4. What is happening to A380 flying - it hasn't been clearly communicated?
◣ The A380 will have dedicated Cabin Crew. This will be a combination of Qantas Airlines
crew who apply to operate the A380 and crew employed by QF Cabin Crew Australia.
Cabin Crew for QF CCUK will also operate on UK to Asia A380 routes.
5. If I'm interested in part-time but I'm not ready for that change yet, will I still have
the option of part-time later, for example, in a year's time?
◣ Yes, you will be eligible to put in an Expression of Interest form at any time and your parttime
will be approved as we have the available resources to accommodate your request.
6. If a crew member is currently on maternity leave, can they automatically extend to
two years?
◣ Yes, if EBA 8 is voted up.
7. What will be the work allocation system for crew working for QCCA on the B747,
A330 and B767?
◣ Crew who are employed by QCCA will be allocated after crew employed by Qantas
Airlines. This means that all existing crew will have their roster built using seniority. The
flying that has not been covered by existing crew is then allocated on a fair shared basis
to QCCA crew.
8. Qantas may decide to take all long range flying from existing crew and award this
flying to crew employed by QCCA?
◣ If EBA 8 is voted up, all B747, A330 and B767 flying will be allocated to Qantas Airlines
crew first, using the seniority bidding system. The remaining flying is then allocated to
QCCA crew using fair-share principles. EBA 8 will not allow Qantas to remove all long
range flying from Qantas Airlines crew and allocate this to QCCA crew - this would be a
breach of the new EBA.
9. Even if QCCA only do the unallocated flying, Customer Service Managers and
Customer Service Supervisors will still need to fly with them?
◣ That’s correct and it is no different to our onboard management team currently flying with
crew employed by Adecco, Jetconnect or MAM.
10. Why will there be Customer Service Manager promotions from all ranks?
◣ With the considerable growth predicted in the Long Haul division, there are going to be
significant new promotional opportunities for both Customer Service Supervisors and
Flight Attendants to move into Customer Service Manager positions.
here is the latest from QF managerment
LONG HAUL CABIN CREW EBA 8 - FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS
1. When do all these initiatives begin?
◣ The new EBA will only come into effect if it is endorsed by a majority of long haul crew
voting in a secret ballot. If endorsed by a majority of crew the Agreement can be lodged
with the Workplace Authority and will come into effect as soon as it is lodged.
2. How do I apply for part time?
◣ We’ll be releasing Expression of Interest forms as soon as the new Agreement comes
into effect. We will also use the existing waitlists.
3. When will part-time start?
◣ As soon as the expressions of interest can be processed, positions will be phased in for
operational reasons. We expect part time positions to start rolling out from BP257. Our
aim is to meet the demand for part time opportunities as quickly as possible.
4. What is happening to A380 flying - it hasn't been clearly communicated?
◣ The A380 will have dedicated Cabin Crew. This will be a combination of Qantas Airlines
crew who apply to operate the A380 and crew employed by QF Cabin Crew Australia.
Cabin Crew for QF CCUK will also operate on UK to Asia A380 routes.
5. If I'm interested in part-time but I'm not ready for that change yet, will I still have
the option of part-time later, for example, in a year's time?
◣ Yes, you will be eligible to put in an Expression of Interest form at any time and your parttime
will be approved as we have the available resources to accommodate your request.
6. If a crew member is currently on maternity leave, can they automatically extend to
two years?
◣ Yes, if EBA 8 is voted up.
7. What will be the work allocation system for crew working for QCCA on the B747,
A330 and B767?
◣ Crew who are employed by QCCA will be allocated after crew employed by Qantas
Airlines. This means that all existing crew will have their roster built using seniority. The
flying that has not been covered by existing crew is then allocated on a fair shared basis
to QCCA crew.
8. Qantas may decide to take all long range flying from existing crew and award this
flying to crew employed by QCCA?
◣ If EBA 8 is voted up, all B747, A330 and B767 flying will be allocated to Qantas Airlines
crew first, using the seniority bidding system. The remaining flying is then allocated to
QCCA crew using fair-share principles. EBA 8 will not allow Qantas to remove all long
range flying from Qantas Airlines crew and allocate this to QCCA crew - this would be a
breach of the new EBA.
9. Even if QCCA only do the unallocated flying, Customer Service Managers and
Customer Service Supervisors will still need to fly with them?
◣ That’s correct and it is no different to our onboard management team currently flying with
crew employed by Adecco, Jetconnect or MAM.
10. Why will there be Customer Service Manager promotions from all ranks?
◣ With the considerable growth predicted in the Long Haul division, there are going to be
significant new promotional opportunities for both Customer Service Supervisors and
Flight Attendants to move into Customer Service Manager positions.
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Call button
Not what Call button but WHO??????
As stated earlier it is just a tad imporant to know who.
Would you ever take advice in life from someone you dont know??????
or someone you do?
Until they reveal themselves they are someone we dont know.
This is an EBA for goodness sake. if they are dealing with the truth then what do they have to hide.
MM and SR certainly didnt remain anonymous when they had objections.
As stated earlier it is just a tad imporant to know who.
Would you ever take advice in life from someone you dont know??????
or someone you do?
Until they reveal themselves they are someone we dont know.
This is an EBA for goodness sake. if they are dealing with the truth then what do they have to hide.
MM and SR certainly didnt remain anonymous when they had objections.
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It's pathetic to discredit Leanne because she does not belong to the Union. The law does not require us to belong to the Union and I believe that people who feel that the Union is not always acting in our interest have a right to be heard. We've heard where the FAAA stands. I'm interested to hear where people like Leanne stand on this EBA and their reasons why.