MAM & Dom/Reg FAAA
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: 3000
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well you see speedbirdhouse, ;jobs for the boys - to me means will they be tempted by some great job offer at qf that they would sell us out.
From the s/h union we have seen one running mam, one a manger at eastern, one been told to leave and they are still in the office in Mel.
If the two merged, will it be the same as what we are currently experiencing? Or would l/h union straighten out the
ers?
Will s/h heads remain in a joint union?
The casuals know nothing about l/h or at least most of us don't, barely 50% are members of s/h. Which shows how much the mammers trust the faaa.
I personally want to hear about l/h faaa and from them.
From the s/h union we have seen one running mam, one a manger at eastern, one been told to leave and they are still in the office in Mel.
If the two merged, will it be the same as what we are currently experiencing? Or would l/h union straighten out the
ers?Will s/h heads remain in a joint union?
The casuals know nothing about l/h or at least most of us don't, barely 50% are members of s/h. Which shows how much the mammers trust the faaa.
I personally want to hear about l/h faaa and from them.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: 3000
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To highlight the distrust of FAAA. I Just want to know, will the FAAA Intl have a better track record.
I think after reading if you have not already, you might understand the questions I have previously posed.
A case of cabin fever strikes Qantas April 21, 2007
In the new airline workplace, old allegiances seem to count for little, writes Scott Rochfort.
Maurice Alexander has kept a low profile since he quit his job as an airline union official 10 years ago. His office phone number is not listed; neither is it on his company’s website. Many of the hundreds of people he’s employed over the years have no idea what he looks like.
The only contact detail provided is an email address where budding flight attendants – or airlines seeking casual staff – can send Maurice Alexander Management (MAM) a question.
Alexander’s labour hire firm made a $1.57 million pretax profit last financial year from its main activity of supplying lower-paid casual flight attendants to Qantas.
The firm was set up soon after Alexander left the union in 1997 and has an estimated 750 casual flight attendants on its books in Sydney, Brisbane, Perth and Melbourne.
The irony is not lost on some that the biggest workforce of potential strike breakers ever mustered by Qantas was done with the help of a former union boss – and with the consent of his former union.
The former senior industrial officer from the domestic division of the Flight Attendants Association of Australia has also kept in close contact with many of his former union comrades. And not only from the other side of the bargaining table.
The Herald has uncovered an apparent conflict of interest within the domestic union. Aside from the fact that the association and the former union official still rub shoulders by sharing office space in Melbourne, Alexander lists a fellow labour hire firm, Flight Force, as one of his former ‘ ‘clients’’.
Flight Force was set up in January 2000 by senior officials of the union to provide casual labour to the now defunct Ansett. There are concerns the union’s involvement in the labour hire industry is at odds with its main task of representing the rights of flight attendants.
According to records obtained by the Herald, the company’s directors included the former association president Narelle Gill and two union branch secretaries.
The ‘‘non-profit’’ Flight Force posted a $495,495 pretax profit in the financial year before it folded after the collapse of Ansett in 2001. The union’s industrial relations manager and powerbroker, John Playford, was also a director when the company was founded.
Playford did not return the Herald’s calls to answer questions about the labour hire outfit he helped set up. Nor would Playford explain his relationship with Alexander or the activities of the business consultancy he set up with his wife in 1998, Stratagem Consultants.
Coincidently, Playford’s consultancy uses the same Sydney accountant as Flight Force used.
The only domestic union official willing to speak was its assistant secretary, Tom Snowball, who declined to discuss the apparent conflicts of interest between the now defunct Flight Force, Alexander’s company and his union.
‘‘Unfortunately I’ve been involved in the union since 2002 so it’s difficult for me to go there,’’ he says. But he did say that unlike other labour providers Flight Force and Maurice Alexander Management were ‘‘prepared to show they are prepared to negotiate and discuss an EBA in good faith’’.
Snowball declined to say whether the union effectively negotiated with itself when Flight Force was up and running. ‘‘I can’t comment on Flight Force.’’
Nor would Snowball discuss the growing dissatisfaction many short-haul flight attendants feel towards the union. This was illustrated when 89 per cent of Virgin Blue cabin crew recently voted against a new five-year enterprise bargaining agreement put to them by the union. The agreement proposed the airline hire more casual cabin crew to ‘‘assist in the efficient operation’’ of Virgin Blue.
Snowball has declined to comment on speculation Alexander’s company or another labour hire firm aligned with the union may try to hire out crews to Virgin Blue. ‘‘I am not in a position to comment on the Virgin EBA at all,’’ he says.
Snowball sees no problem with the current union regime. ‘‘We’re proud of the staff we’ve got,’’ he says.
The union has argued that the conditions and pay of Maurice Alexander Management casual staff are ‘‘in line’’ with Qantas full-time short-haul cabin crew, who are paid considerably less than international flight attendants.
The union failed to mention that full-time crews are paid a guaranteed 140 hours a month, and may be rostered to work 123 hours. Full-timers are paid the extra hours to cover the flight delays that may incur. Casuals are paid for the hours they work. They are not guaranteed a minimum amount of work.
Unlike full-time Qantas crews, casuals are not entitled to a pay rise for each year served. They get a small loading on top of a flat first-year rate to compensate for the holidays and sick leave they are not entitled to.
The union has raised no objections to Maurice Alexander Management recently engaging a new batch of casuals, despite Qantas announcing plans to lay off fulltime cabin crew due to a ‘‘surplus’’ of staff.
The new intake of crew is also putting a strain on longserving casuals. Several Maurice Alexander Management casuals who contacted the Herald say their hours have been dramatically cut in recent weeks, with the newer ‘‘contract C’’ staff taking up more of the work.
Some casuals say their hours have been cut in half to about 60 to 70 hours a month. This equates to less than $500 a week. Some casuals say they are under pressure to find other work despite having to be on call to Qantas most days.
The new contract C staff, who are reportedly taking more work from the other casuals, can request only three days off each month. They have to be on call the rest of the time with no guarantee of work.
They also have no choice over their rosters and are being deployed on international routes. Many of the contract C staff speak Cantonese, Mandarin and Hindi, and are being hired to replace higher-paid international Qantas cabin crew on flights to Shanghai, Hong Kong and Mumbai.
The move has inflamed tensions between the shorthaul union and the international division of the union, which is considered a separate body.
As part of a ‘ ‘divisional flying agreement’’ struck between Qantas and both unions, Qantas has the discretion to choose which crews fly on 45 per cent of its Boeing 767 and Airbus 330 services.
The secretary of the international union, Michael Mijatov, has protested that the increased use of casuals has come at the expense of higher-paying and more secure full-time jobs. The airline has cut its number of full- time long- haul cabin crew by 1200 since 2000.
But the domestic union has raised no objections. ‘ ‘ We don’t feel that it’s being used inappropriately,’’ Snowball says of the flying agreement.
Alexander did not return the Herald’s calls. But in response to a Herald report this week, he issued a memo to his staff arguing that the article ‘‘appears to be an attempt to undermine an arrangement which has provided a positive benefit to both casual flight attendants and Qantas’’.
‘‘I request that MAM flight attendants continue to excel in the provision of outstanding customer service as representatives of an iconic Australian brand and ask that you are not diverted by irresponsible press coverage,’’ the memo said.
I think after reading if you have not already, you might understand the questions I have previously posed.
A case of cabin fever strikes Qantas April 21, 2007
In the new airline workplace, old allegiances seem to count for little, writes Scott Rochfort.
Maurice Alexander has kept a low profile since he quit his job as an airline union official 10 years ago. His office phone number is not listed; neither is it on his company’s website. Many of the hundreds of people he’s employed over the years have no idea what he looks like.
The only contact detail provided is an email address where budding flight attendants – or airlines seeking casual staff – can send Maurice Alexander Management (MAM) a question.
Alexander’s labour hire firm made a $1.57 million pretax profit last financial year from its main activity of supplying lower-paid casual flight attendants to Qantas.
The firm was set up soon after Alexander left the union in 1997 and has an estimated 750 casual flight attendants on its books in Sydney, Brisbane, Perth and Melbourne.
The irony is not lost on some that the biggest workforce of potential strike breakers ever mustered by Qantas was done with the help of a former union boss – and with the consent of his former union.
The former senior industrial officer from the domestic division of the Flight Attendants Association of Australia has also kept in close contact with many of his former union comrades. And not only from the other side of the bargaining table.
The Herald has uncovered an apparent conflict of interest within the domestic union. Aside from the fact that the association and the former union official still rub shoulders by sharing office space in Melbourne, Alexander lists a fellow labour hire firm, Flight Force, as one of his former ‘ ‘clients’’.
Flight Force was set up in January 2000 by senior officials of the union to provide casual labour to the now defunct Ansett. There are concerns the union’s involvement in the labour hire industry is at odds with its main task of representing the rights of flight attendants.
According to records obtained by the Herald, the company’s directors included the former association president Narelle Gill and two union branch secretaries.
The ‘‘non-profit’’ Flight Force posted a $495,495 pretax profit in the financial year before it folded after the collapse of Ansett in 2001. The union’s industrial relations manager and powerbroker, John Playford, was also a director when the company was founded.
Playford did not return the Herald’s calls to answer questions about the labour hire outfit he helped set up. Nor would Playford explain his relationship with Alexander or the activities of the business consultancy he set up with his wife in 1998, Stratagem Consultants.
Coincidently, Playford’s consultancy uses the same Sydney accountant as Flight Force used.
The only domestic union official willing to speak was its assistant secretary, Tom Snowball, who declined to discuss the apparent conflicts of interest between the now defunct Flight Force, Alexander’s company and his union.
‘‘Unfortunately I’ve been involved in the union since 2002 so it’s difficult for me to go there,’’ he says. But he did say that unlike other labour providers Flight Force and Maurice Alexander Management were ‘‘prepared to show they are prepared to negotiate and discuss an EBA in good faith’’.
Snowball declined to say whether the union effectively negotiated with itself when Flight Force was up and running. ‘‘I can’t comment on Flight Force.’’
Nor would Snowball discuss the growing dissatisfaction many short-haul flight attendants feel towards the union. This was illustrated when 89 per cent of Virgin Blue cabin crew recently voted against a new five-year enterprise bargaining agreement put to them by the union. The agreement proposed the airline hire more casual cabin crew to ‘‘assist in the efficient operation’’ of Virgin Blue.
Snowball has declined to comment on speculation Alexander’s company or another labour hire firm aligned with the union may try to hire out crews to Virgin Blue. ‘‘I am not in a position to comment on the Virgin EBA at all,’’ he says.
Snowball sees no problem with the current union regime. ‘‘We’re proud of the staff we’ve got,’’ he says.
The union has argued that the conditions and pay of Maurice Alexander Management casual staff are ‘‘in line’’ with Qantas full-time short-haul cabin crew, who are paid considerably less than international flight attendants.
The union failed to mention that full-time crews are paid a guaranteed 140 hours a month, and may be rostered to work 123 hours. Full-timers are paid the extra hours to cover the flight delays that may incur. Casuals are paid for the hours they work. They are not guaranteed a minimum amount of work.
Unlike full-time Qantas crews, casuals are not entitled to a pay rise for each year served. They get a small loading on top of a flat first-year rate to compensate for the holidays and sick leave they are not entitled to.
The union has raised no objections to Maurice Alexander Management recently engaging a new batch of casuals, despite Qantas announcing plans to lay off fulltime cabin crew due to a ‘‘surplus’’ of staff.
The new intake of crew is also putting a strain on longserving casuals. Several Maurice Alexander Management casuals who contacted the Herald say their hours have been dramatically cut in recent weeks, with the newer ‘‘contract C’’ staff taking up more of the work.
Some casuals say their hours have been cut in half to about 60 to 70 hours a month. This equates to less than $500 a week. Some casuals say they are under pressure to find other work despite having to be on call to Qantas most days.
The new contract C staff, who are reportedly taking more work from the other casuals, can request only three days off each month. They have to be on call the rest of the time with no guarantee of work.
They also have no choice over their rosters and are being deployed on international routes. Many of the contract C staff speak Cantonese, Mandarin and Hindi, and are being hired to replace higher-paid international Qantas cabin crew on flights to Shanghai, Hong Kong and Mumbai.
The move has inflamed tensions between the shorthaul union and the international division of the union, which is considered a separate body.
As part of a ‘ ‘divisional flying agreement’’ struck between Qantas and both unions, Qantas has the discretion to choose which crews fly on 45 per cent of its Boeing 767 and Airbus 330 services.
The secretary of the international union, Michael Mijatov, has protested that the increased use of casuals has come at the expense of higher-paying and more secure full-time jobs. The airline has cut its number of full- time long- haul cabin crew by 1200 since 2000.
But the domestic union has raised no objections. ‘ ‘ We don’t feel that it’s being used inappropriately,’’ Snowball says of the flying agreement.
Alexander did not return the Herald’s calls. But in response to a Herald report this week, he issued a memo to his staff arguing that the article ‘‘appears to be an attempt to undermine an arrangement which has provided a positive benefit to both casual flight attendants and Qantas’’.
‘‘I request that MAM flight attendants continue to excel in the provision of outstanding customer service as representatives of an iconic Australian brand and ask that you are not diverted by irresponsible press coverage,’’ the memo said.
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Sydney
Posts: 824
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Casualvermin,
the elected members of the FAAA are philosophically and ideoligically opposed to the action QF management and it's determination to destroy the career aspirations and conditions of ALL Australian based flight attendants.
By this, I mean that they will not pursue a course of actions that benefits their membership AT THE EXPENSE of other flight attendant groups.
Their approach to industrial relations [as it appears to me] seems to be FAR broader and more strategic than that of the blindingly myopic and shortsighted shorthaul division.
One Union representing ALL QF flight attendants must surely benefit the lot of us [shorthaul and longhaul] in our fight to maintain decent pay and conditions.
QF has made hay using the "divide and conquer" technique to ALL our detriment.
Providing a merger of the two is structured properly I can see no reason why it wouldn't work.
the elected members of the FAAA are philosophically and ideoligically opposed to the action QF management and it's determination to destroy the career aspirations and conditions of ALL Australian based flight attendants.
By this, I mean that they will not pursue a course of actions that benefits their membership AT THE EXPENSE of other flight attendant groups.
Their approach to industrial relations [as it appears to me] seems to be FAR broader and more strategic than that of the blindingly myopic and shortsighted shorthaul division.
One Union representing ALL QF flight attendants must surely benefit the lot of us [shorthaul and longhaul] in our fight to maintain decent pay and conditions.
QF has made hay using the "divide and conquer" technique to ALL our detriment.
Providing a merger of the two is structured properly I can see no reason why it wouldn't work.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: 3000
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thank You Speedbirdhouse.
I think the more informed we are the better.
What kind of structure would be appropriate?
I think they better hurry up before there is a third cabin crew union. That could be months away or years, but I can see it happening. S/H are itching for new representation(at least the ones I have spoken with, with the exception of the band moles and FWA devotees who bid-to-dump)
I think the more informed we are the better.
What kind of structure would be appropriate?
I think they better hurry up before there is a third cabin crew union. That could be months away or years, but I can see it happening. S/H are itching for new representation(at least the ones I have spoken with, with the exception of the band moles and FWA devotees who bid-to-dump)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: syd/aust
Posts: 210
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
it just bizzare that the s/h union is still in business after all this!....are people aware that johnows out fit he helped set up, mam released crew to break the 2002 stop work while the same office is the riggydiggey union you say may merge one day sbh, that just seems wrong! also i think an example of jobs for the boys that cv talks of is like isnt sr from faaa l/h union involved in management with qf on implementation of the a380 .....this is a question only not an attack i know little of it. thanks for any info cheers gigs ps if you scroll down the page you may notice a tread from l1a in 2004 about the faaa s/haul and mam sharing an address, why now 3 years latter is it breaking news?? didnt faaa long haul know what was going down in 2002?
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: melbourne
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Is this the new Virgin EBA?
$82 800 USD P.A
One Month on, One Month Off!
See the World!
Do you enjoy working as a flight attendant, but crave more freedom? Do you love to travel and experience different cultures? Do you have a passion for customer service? Do you have a creative flair but are finding that your current job just isn’t giving you a chance to express it? If you answered yes, then this may be for you!
My client is one of Asia’s leading investment firms and is currently looking for a highly motivated and organised flight attendant to work in a team of 4 including two pilots and an engineer on their private Boeing 737 jet. Working on a rotating roster of 28 days on, 28 days off, you will be flown to where-ever the jet is at the time to and act as the sole Flight Attendant on board. With your exceptional customer service and communication skills, your duties will include:
Conducting a safety check upon boarding the aircraft.
Meeting and greeting passengers.
Maintaining aircraft safety and security.
Providing In flight service (serving of beverages, food and assisting with the running of the aircraft).
Preparing the aircraft for landing and passenger dis-embarkation.
Cleaning the inside of the aircraft.
Co-ordinating with chefs, catering companies and suppliers for all meals served on board.
Creating and regularly changing in flight menus.
General administrative duties as required.
For your hard work and dedication, you will be handsomely rewarded with an annual salary of $66 000 USD. You will also be paid with $100 USD per day whilst on assignment to cover your meals. All hotels, transfers to and from the airport in the country where the jet is and working expenses included. Furthermore, while you are on duty, you will also be provided with a mobile phone and laptop!
To be successful in this role, you will have the following:
Previous experience as a flight attendant (International Experience is highly valued)
Exceptional grooming and presentation.
Highly honed communication skills.
Be fluent in at least one Asian language.
Strong understanding of Asian culture and customs.
Exceptional organisation skills.
The ability to work independently and under pressure.
If upon reading this it sounds like it’s for you, then act now! Send your application to [email protected]
$82 800 USD P.A
One Month on, One Month Off!
See the World!
Do you enjoy working as a flight attendant, but crave more freedom? Do you love to travel and experience different cultures? Do you have a passion for customer service? Do you have a creative flair but are finding that your current job just isn’t giving you a chance to express it? If you answered yes, then this may be for you!
My client is one of Asia’s leading investment firms and is currently looking for a highly motivated and organised flight attendant to work in a team of 4 including two pilots and an engineer on their private Boeing 737 jet. Working on a rotating roster of 28 days on, 28 days off, you will be flown to where-ever the jet is at the time to and act as the sole Flight Attendant on board. With your exceptional customer service and communication skills, your duties will include:
Conducting a safety check upon boarding the aircraft.
Meeting and greeting passengers.
Maintaining aircraft safety and security.
Providing In flight service (serving of beverages, food and assisting with the running of the aircraft).
Preparing the aircraft for landing and passenger dis-embarkation.
Cleaning the inside of the aircraft.
Co-ordinating with chefs, catering companies and suppliers for all meals served on board.
Creating and regularly changing in flight menus.
General administrative duties as required.
For your hard work and dedication, you will be handsomely rewarded with an annual salary of $66 000 USD. You will also be paid with $100 USD per day whilst on assignment to cover your meals. All hotels, transfers to and from the airport in the country where the jet is and working expenses included. Furthermore, while you are on duty, you will also be provided with a mobile phone and laptop!
To be successful in this role, you will have the following:
Previous experience as a flight attendant (International Experience is highly valued)
Exceptional grooming and presentation.
Highly honed communication skills.
Be fluent in at least one Asian language.
Strong understanding of Asian culture and customs.
Exceptional organisation skills.
The ability to work independently and under pressure.
If upon reading this it sounds like it’s for you, then act now! Send your application to [email protected]
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: 3000
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well the s/h union have sent out a bit of spin regarding mam progression. Crew voice was on today, very interesting....... It is a good start. MAM have their own crew voice on a sunday, guess they are hoping for minimal input as will be a church praying........
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: cancun
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wow Aussie 78 what a proposal. But how lonely being on your own, you would oviously need to be single to do 28on28off? Unless you didn't mind doing the two boys up front, who usually go for the ladyboys. Sorry everyone can't help myself, the thought of doing 28days by my self brings on those night terrors......
CASUALS: I agree, I don't trust 'em.
FAAA International: How do you propose the merger goes??????
Divide and concur must stop, it has worked for some but ain't done squat for moi. This is the perfect place to express yourself(ta Madge), why aren't the orifice posting or FAAA, good time to sell it folks.
I would like to see current officials perhaps moved to CWA, and new blood take the reign. Can't comment on international, but I am happy to go along with them sofar. An earlier point made was good, why not one FAAA be it for QF/MAM and the other for the rest, problem solved
No merge, no question, we all do International and Domestos, can't one FAAA division be for AO/QF & MAM?
Now the long serving casies are beened, I am begining to see, they are not scabs. Having said that there is a load of 'em. Lord help us if they get a union live casualkangaroo said....
FAAA say something. Before a third union is in place
CASUALS: I agree, I don't trust 'em.
FAAA International: How do you propose the merger goes??????
Divide and concur must stop, it has worked for some but ain't done squat for moi. This is the perfect place to express yourself(ta Madge), why aren't the orifice posting or FAAA, good time to sell it folks.
I would like to see current officials perhaps moved to CWA, and new blood take the reign. Can't comment on international, but I am happy to go along with them sofar. An earlier point made was good, why not one FAAA be it for QF/MAM and the other for the rest, problem solved
No merge, no question, we all do International and Domestos, can't one FAAA division be for AO/QF & MAM?Now the long serving casies are been
ed, I am begining to see, they are not scabs. Having said that there is a load of 'em. Lord help us if they get a union live casualkangaroo said....FAAA say something. Before a third union is in place
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Sydney
Posts: 824
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
gigs,
I'm not privy to the details of any FAAA involvment in the introduction of the A380 but if what you say is true I'm pleased to hear so, on a couple of levels.
Having the Longhaul FAAA actively involved in the introduction of an aircraft who's FA manning levels could theoretically double cabin crew numbers speaks well for our career aspirations and job security.
It also bodes well from a FA operational perspective given that ALL FAAA elected officials are also cabin crew with years of "hands on/real world" experience.
The same can't be said for the office dwelling management types who will be making the FINAL decisions on who, how, where, when things happen on board..........
There will also a myriad OH&S issues involved that require input from the FAAA.
You seem to imply that SR is doing or is going to do a shayne neelon.
May I respectfully suggest that you and your office mates are DREAMING
I'm not privy to the details of any FAAA involvment in the introduction of the A380 but if what you say is true I'm pleased to hear so, on a couple of levels.
Having the Longhaul FAAA actively involved in the introduction of an aircraft who's FA manning levels could theoretically double cabin crew numbers speaks well for our career aspirations and job security.
It also bodes well from a FA operational perspective given that ALL FAAA elected officials are also cabin crew with years of "hands on/real world" experience.
The same can't be said for the office dwelling management types who will be making the FINAL decisions on who, how, where, when things happen on board..........
There will also a myriad OH&S issues involved that require input from the FAAA.
You seem to imply that SR is doing or is going to do a shayne neelon.
May I respectfully suggest that you and your office mates are DREAMING
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: syd/aust
Posts: 210
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
sbh i agree with what you have said........i only asked a question of sr and i dont know who shayne is? their is no me and my office mates there is just little ole me,maybe you think my motive or who i am is someone else.......i am just a hostie who wants some longevity................if s/haul could join the faaa long haul i think that would be a great thing.................if faaa s/haul merge with l/haul faaa well what do you guys think about this given all data? thanks sbh for posting cheers gigs
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: syd/aust
Posts: 210
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
this was the only mam thread i could find. i would like to ask if anyone has any idea of the tooling costs of a mam casual ie. cost of out fitting n trianing and period of time in employment until this is payed off???? thanks to any informed f/a (flight attendants) or management who reply.......pls no diabribe from ilinformed w/be long haul bs folk! or s/haul union reps this is an honest question for factual purpose. thanks gigs
