UK - NATS Pay negotiations - latest rumours

[Del Prado]

How about just having the correct number of people employed? You pretend your argument is to force an end to AAVA by making it prohibitively expensive, however it's pretty obvious it's just bigger pound signs you're seeing... Stop the AAVAs and stop letting them get away with not staffing correctly.

I agree. NATS are saving millions by not employing the correct number of staff. My sector is 6 down across the unit. 6 x salary, pension and NI contributions must be a saving of nearly a million a year, not to mention the saving in college and training costs.

An increase in the AAVA rate would be another step towards the situation our Spanish colleagues found themselves in.

[Nimmer]

You will never stop people doing AAVA's or overtime. As you said people see the £££££ signs!!!!

Especially those on the bottom ends of the scale, someone has already stated some people in NATS are on £26000 a year. This was the system and pay scales we all voted for. Management know this, and they love the fact that they are getting a service cheaply.

Thus to get full staffing, something I want to achieve also, you need to force managements hand. Make AAVA's/ overtime extremely expensive, very attractive to staff, but will force management to recruit and validate more controllers.

Meanwhile money can be earned, to invest.... and compensate for the end of the final salary pension scheme!!!!, Its coming!!!

[ToweringCu]

Must be a different NATS to the one I work for. The NATS that employs me has area course grads holding all over the place because Swanwick and Prestwick can't fit their training in. The NATS I work for is also continually recruiting ATCOs. Better get an early night I've got an AAVA tomorrow.

[climbwithagoodrate]

There may be lots of trainees holding, but the validation success rate is barely keeping up with the retirement rate...

[Pheasant Plucker]

Can someone please explain why it is in our interests as ATCOs to be fully staffed??

I thought a commodity that was in short supply was more valuable!

[Standard Noise]

It's not.


It is!

[novation]

I hear the latest pay offer made by management on Monday this week was so insulting that our reps walked out of the meeting!

[Roffa]

Giving the upcoming changes to the pensions regime and the extra tax we'll all likely be paying we probably don't want any more pay rises!

[bananablog]

I think that we get paid too much

[rab-k]

Yeah, me too

So long as our shareholders can get their nice big dividend and certain people, both past and present, can get their nice big bonus, then I'm only too happy to earn less in real terms next year for shifting more traffic than I did this.

Hell, I might even stop doing AAVAs next year as I'll be sure to feel so disgustingly rich; a symptom no doubt of my being so grossly overpaid!

Excuse me, but I suddenly feel a bit...

[10W]

Giving the upcoming changes to the pensions regime and the extra tax we'll all likely be paying we probably don't want any more pay rises!

Folks at the larger units might want to also watch they don't go over £100K this tax year if they do AAVAs. You start to lose your Personal Tax Allowance after that figure.

From the tax year 2010-11, if your income is over £100,000, your Personal Allowance is reduced by half of the amount, £1 for every £2 you have over that limit. If your income is large enough, your Personal Allowance will be reduced to nil. This £100,000 limit applies irrespective of your age.

You could then be liable to 40% tax on up to £6475 of your hard earned dosh which you weren't before. And the Revenue folks will also 'assume' that you will be earning over £100K for the next tax year (2011-2012) and require you to submit an annual return.

[AREA52]

You are right that you will effectively be taxed at 60% for the next £12950 after you pass £100000 income. However, the £100000 is after allowable tax free elements (eg pension contributions, childcare vouchers etc) and is therefore still a few years off for those in the negotiated grades.

[10W]

Not that far off, and possibly even achievable by some.

ATCO2 Band 5 LCE @ £87219
Shift Allowance - £5543

Add in some OJTI and Assessor/Verifier payments and then it would then depend how many normal AAVAs and how many 'Golden' AAVAs for iFACTS were carried out

[Mantovani]

Put it like that and I pity the tax Paul Barron our departing CEO had to pay on his Fat Cat bonuses.

Ditto Lawrence Hoskins.

Let's face it; if we can't even get an inflation pay rise this year after the huge profits and obscene bonuses then we might as well give up.

[5milesbaby]

Have heard that yesterday's negotiations lasted less than half an hour before the union walked out again. November's meeting also cancelled.

[250 kts]

FFS playing into managements hands perfectly.

Ready to ballot for industrial action then?

[notatthecollege]

Fed up of being taken for a ride...

so lets get a decision out of management and when we all realise how cr@p it is lets get a ballot underway and walk. We have taken enough over the past few years to not take it anymore...

Time to stand together.

[fisbangwollop]

I remember the ATSA's 6 week strike back in 78...that took balls but to be honest cant see the ATCO's doing the same!!

[250 kts]

I suspect that negotiations will continue for a while yet. It is only 2 weeks till Prospect holds its' annnual conference. No doubt reps will be given a full briefing and asked to consult with their members as to what the feeling is over whatever is on the table at that time.

so lets get a decision out of management and when we all realise how cr@p it is lets get a ballot underway and walk. We have taken enough over the past few years to not take it anymore...

Actually compared with the rest of the aviation industry we have been pretty insulated from things so far and long may that continue. Potentially a far bigger fight over ownership may be just round the corner with the government having now narrowed down which investment bank will deal with any sell off.

[notatthecollege]

But if we didn't stand together and fight over issues such as the pension what chance have we got of standing together over anything else?

Come on Guys and Girls, regeardless of what has happened we need to stand up and stand together. If that is regarding pay then so be it, it will allow us to unite ahead of any other 'bigger' issues that may be coming our way...