Whats going on at CATC
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Whats going on at CATC
Hi,
Just looking for advice, I have recently passed the selection for NATS, and am awaiting a start date for CATC.
I have heard however from a couple of people at CATC that the pass rate has fallen drastically, and that there are loads of people waiting for a training interview. Also that the college has a new policy of trying to get rid of as many trainees as possible as early as possible.
I really want to do this job, and will be giving up a reasonably well paid job to do it, as well as moving down my girlfriend with me. However i am getting a bit nervous about doing this only to be shown the door a few months after i start.
Can anyone clear up exactly whats going on as i may have to reconsider doing this for purely practical reasons.
Cheers in advance
Johnny
Just looking for advice, I have recently passed the selection for NATS, and am awaiting a start date for CATC.
I have heard however from a couple of people at CATC that the pass rate has fallen drastically, and that there are loads of people waiting for a training interview. Also that the college has a new policy of trying to get rid of as many trainees as possible as early as possible.
I really want to do this job, and will be giving up a reasonably well paid job to do it, as well as moving down my girlfriend with me. However i am getting a bit nervous about doing this only to be shown the door a few months after i start.
Can anyone clear up exactly whats going on as i may have to reconsider doing this for purely practical reasons.
Cheers in advance
Johnny
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Johnny5, a career in ATC imho is worth giving up any well paid job. The pass rate at CATC has fallen slightly over recent courses, but if you stick in, do the book work, and don't make a nuisance of yourself then you will be fine.
Throw caution to the wind and do it, you won't regret it.
Not sure this helps any but hey!
Throw caution to the wind and do it, you won't regret it.
Not sure this helps any but hey!
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Thanks for your reply mickrobbo, and i agree with your comments however ive been told its more the practical aspect that people are being failed for and thats a worry, as ive heard the courses are also being made shorter, with less time to get to grips with it all.
My girlfriend is giving up a lot to come down with me, and it would put a lot of strain on our relationship if i were to put her through all this only to be chopped a short time later.
I really am confused as to what to do at the minute. Is there anyone else at the college who can clear up this issue for me, or is there anyone in the same position?
My girlfriend is giving up a lot to come down with me, and it would put a lot of strain on our relationship if i were to put her through all this only to be chopped a short time later.
I really am confused as to what to do at the minute. Is there anyone else at the college who can clear up this issue for me, or is there anyone in the same position?
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Hi Johnny, I have just left NATS as i have had the rug pulled from under me too many times. I passed the old aerodrome courses, radar skills all first time but failed area 1 and was not given a re course. Had few other options but all stopped by someone. HR decide your fate and they have no clue of the job of atc and no interest in your personal sacrifices. The job itself is great but be aware that the failure rate is mega at the college and at area units and you might be one of the unlucky ones who now with the new courses get chopped with nothing. This is the reality and you should be aware of it for your sake and your Girlfriends. As i said the job is superb and i have met people who have become mates for life but lots of pitfalls too. Best of luck for whatever decision you make.
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Johnny5, I covered all bases, or at least attempted to when I joined NATS.
I didnt burn any bridges with my previous employer, my wife and I decided it would be better for me to go down to Bournemouth on my own until I had finished the course (fortunately I did aerodrome, so it was only 7mths). This can be very hard on both you and your partner, but we managed by me travelling home each weekend and my wife visited down in bournemouth.
This way if all went wrong I still had a base back home where I could find another job.
You need to, and obviously are, giving serious thought to this.
I hope it all works out for you.
I didnt burn any bridges with my previous employer, my wife and I decided it would be better for me to go down to Bournemouth on my own until I had finished the course (fortunately I did aerodrome, so it was only 7mths). This can be very hard on both you and your partner, but we managed by me travelling home each weekend and my wife visited down in bournemouth.
This way if all went wrong I still had a base back home where I could find another job.
You need to, and obviously are, giving serious thought to this.
I hope it all works out for you.
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Hi Johnny,
I am currently in the college on the Area course.
All I can say is be prepared to work hard both on theory and the practical. It is achievable! You will have a lot to do in getting through the first course and then the work keeps on coming.
The Area course is changing so I can't comment on the work rate on that. If it is anything like it is now, the learning curve is very steep!
It does feel like you're are putting things on hold whilst working at the college, for me that is not a problem, but I am well aware of the strains it puts on some of my mates on the course. I'm afraid I can't offer any advice on that one; there are plenty people in the college that read here so I am sure you will get some more useful replies. I will point your post out to a couple of people who have brought their girlfriend/wife/children down here to see if they can offer any support.
Bottom line, it's worth it, speaking to ATCOs you realise how good the job is and it is worth the hard work to get to the point of obtaining that licence!
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
I am currently in the college on the Area course.
All I can say is be prepared to work hard both on theory and the practical. It is achievable! You will have a lot to do in getting through the first course and then the work keeps on coming.
The Area course is changing so I can't comment on the work rate on that. If it is anything like it is now, the learning curve is very steep!
It does feel like you're are putting things on hold whilst working at the college, for me that is not a problem, but I am well aware of the strains it puts on some of my mates on the course. I'm afraid I can't offer any advice on that one; there are plenty people in the college that read here so I am sure you will get some more useful replies. I will point your post out to a couple of people who have brought their girlfriend/wife/children down here to see if they can offer any support.
Bottom line, it's worth it, speaking to ATCOs you realise how good the job is and it is worth the hard work to get to the point of obtaining that licence!
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
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Hi Johnny,
I am on the Area course with someone else (the id above, not me and another person, things arent that bad).
I brought my wife and kids down with me, and like yourself, my wife left her job, kids changed school, money problems etc etc. I am glad I did, because it is hard work, and I dont think I could have coped travelling weekends, as this is time for me to revise, plus I can spend more time with the family during the week.
It never crossed my mind not to take the risk, because you got to be confident you will pass and not worry about the fact that there is a high failure rate. Believe me, the college is full of highs and lows, and having my family there seems to soften the lows.
Noone is guaranteed to pass these courses, if we could pass on effort alone, there would be no failures, but unfortunately its not like that. Just join with a lot of confidence, dont think about failures rates, and dont let bad times at the college get you down(something I have learnt)
Good luck, if you need any more advise just ask.
abc111
I am on the Area course with someone else (the id above, not me and another person, things arent that bad).
I brought my wife and kids down with me, and like yourself, my wife left her job, kids changed school, money problems etc etc. I am glad I did, because it is hard work, and I dont think I could have coped travelling weekends, as this is time for me to revise, plus I can spend more time with the family during the week.
It never crossed my mind not to take the risk, because you got to be confident you will pass and not worry about the fact that there is a high failure rate. Believe me, the college is full of highs and lows, and having my family there seems to soften the lows.
Noone is guaranteed to pass these courses, if we could pass on effort alone, there would be no failures, but unfortunately its not like that. Just join with a lot of confidence, dont think about failures rates, and dont let bad times at the college get you down(something I have learnt)
Good luck, if you need any more advise just ask.
abc111
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Hi all,
To be honest there isn't really a "failure rate". Some courses go through without a hitch, others go through with the lows. I've stumbled my way through college passing things eventually, (practical wise) and am presently on the knife edge again. As aaabbbccc1111 said, its not about effort that can make you trip up. Sometimes there are many things that contribute to a non successfull outcome. There are many many views as to why this could be, however, i believe we all have to get on with what we have to, to get a chance to do this FANTASTIC job. I most certainly am not going to give up and i am doing everything possible to ensure that i am successfull in the end.
I moved down with my long term girlfriend. I was lucky in the fact that we had both left uni so had no real ties back home. I know a few people who leave family back at home, but if there is any way you can bring them down i would really look into it. Bournemouth is great and the surrounding areas are out of this world. So much so we're almost set on living down here for good if the commute will let me! Have a chat with everyone that the move will have an effect on.
My advice is "just do it!" (Nike: Greek god of victory) you will certainly not regret it, and there is no reason why you should fear becoming one of those bad statistics.
81
To be honest there isn't really a "failure rate". Some courses go through without a hitch, others go through with the lows. I've stumbled my way through college passing things eventually, (practical wise) and am presently on the knife edge again. As aaabbbccc1111 said, its not about effort that can make you trip up. Sometimes there are many things that contribute to a non successfull outcome. There are many many views as to why this could be, however, i believe we all have to get on with what we have to, to get a chance to do this FANTASTIC job. I most certainly am not going to give up and i am doing everything possible to ensure that i am successfull in the end.
I moved down with my long term girlfriend. I was lucky in the fact that we had both left uni so had no real ties back home. I know a few people who leave family back at home, but if there is any way you can bring them down i would really look into it. Bournemouth is great and the surrounding areas are out of this world. So much so we're almost set on living down here for good if the commute will let me! Have a chat with everyone that the move will have an effect on.
My advice is "just do it!" (Nike: Greek god of victory) you will certainly not regret it, and there is no reason why you should fear becoming one of those bad statistics.
81
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When I look at the course I was on at the college, of the 30 who started, approx. 10 got through the college first time, another 10 using a recourse, 10 didn't make it. Of those 10 though probably 5 where offered jobs within NATS.
Pretty much everyone who got through the college went on to validate at a unit. Some units are harder to validate at than others normally if someone gets chopped they will then be sent somewhere less busy and are then normally successful.
Until you are a valid controller I would say don't buy a new car/house and leave your Mrs. where she is!
Pretty much everyone who got through the college went on to validate at a unit. Some units are harder to validate at than others normally if someone gets chopped they will then be sent somewhere less busy and are then normally successful.
Until you are a valid controller I would say don't buy a new car/house and leave your Mrs. where she is!
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Hi Johnny, just to basically back-up everything that has been said I will add my own little piece 
.
Started at the college late '02. Gave up a decent job and moved to Bournemouth from Scotland. Left missus at home (which was hard!) and travelled back as often as I could. To be honest, I feel it was probably better for me to stay there myself as there were no distractions from the bookwork. This is really fundamental stuff and is hard enough without wife/girlfriend etc moaning that your not spending enough time with them.
The courses themselves were quite brainmashing to say the least. I did the old aerodrome courses which I passed first time along with radar skills. Managed to fail Area 1 by a whisker but thankfully passed it on the second attempt. Area 2 was dispatched, again, by the skin of my teeth
. I was absolutely over-the-moon to say the least. Unfortunately many of the friends that I had made during my time at CATC fell by the wayside after being chopped. In my case, during the time at college I bought a house and a new car against my better judgement but the way I saw it at the time was that you just cant put your life on hold!!
At a unit now so things are looking up
. However, THIS is the hard bit. Its what all the time at college was leading up to. College was difficult but I agree with the comment that if you apply yourself then theory stuff will not be too much of a problem. With the practicals, well.......you can either do it or you cant to be honest!.
Did hear that the pass rates for the new courses were less than encouraging but I also hear that they are being 'fine tuned'.
To summarise....Yes its a daunting thought leaving your present job for a 'chance' to become an ATCO; Yes its difficult being apart from loved ones; Yes you need to apply yourself and focus on the courses; yes theres a lot more of the same at the units but I wouldnt trade my job for all the tea in China!!!!
GO FOR IT MATE.......If (hopefully when) you make it then you'll be as happy as a pig in S**t; if you dont then at least you can hold your head up high and say you gave it your best.
Thats all people can ask of you and you of yourself (bit profound but true nontheless)
.Started at the college late '02. Gave up a decent job and moved to Bournemouth from Scotland. Left missus at home (which was hard!) and travelled back as often as I could. To be honest, I feel it was probably better for me to stay there myself as there were no distractions from the bookwork. This is really fundamental stuff and is hard enough without wife/girlfriend etc moaning that your not spending enough time with them.
The courses themselves were quite brainmashing to say the least. I did the old aerodrome courses which I passed first time along with radar skills. Managed to fail Area 1 by a whisker but thankfully passed it on the second attempt. Area 2 was dispatched, again, by the skin of my teeth
. I was absolutely over-the-moon to say the least. Unfortunately many of the friends that I had made during my time at CATC fell by the wayside after being chopped. In my case, during the time at college I bought a house and a new car against my better judgement but the way I saw it at the time was that you just cant put your life on hold!!At a unit now so things are looking up
. However, THIS is the hard bit. Its what all the time at college was leading up to. College was difficult but I agree with the comment that if you apply yourself then theory stuff will not be too much of a problem. With the practicals, well.......you can either do it or you cant to be honest!.Did hear that the pass rates for the new courses were less than encouraging but I also hear that they are being 'fine tuned'.
To summarise....Yes its a daunting thought leaving your present job for a 'chance' to become an ATCO; Yes its difficult being apart from loved ones; Yes you need to apply yourself and focus on the courses; yes theres a lot more of the same at the units but I wouldnt trade my job for all the tea in China!!!!
GO FOR IT MATE.......If (hopefully when) you make it then you'll be as happy as a pig in S**t; if you dont then at least you can hold your head up high and say you gave it your best.
Thats all people can ask of you and you of yourself (bit profound but true nontheless)
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Now Kevan Quinn has been moved to CASPIAN what do the people at CATC think? Has he had to fall on his sword because of bad results or are his particular skills needed at CTC?
A I
A I
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Johnny5, my advice to you would be to go for it with this in mind. If the worst happens and you end up failing once maybe twice and ending up in one maybe two Training Reviews, the following are sure fire ways of ensuring continued employment at the College:
1. Try to fail more than one course.
2. If your sim runs aren't going that well, run out mid-excercise crying.
3. Blame your instructor for number 2.
4. Try and turn your whole course against said instructor especially if he is a popular and well respected individual and do so in such a way as to guarantee you get a warning out of this.
5. If 3 and 4 don't work, blame the ATSA input and complain about them.
6. Try and turn your coursemates against each other and yourself. A good way to achieve this is to control in such a way as to directly affect your partner's sim run and then interupt their debrief to tell them what they are doing wrong.
7. Ask your instructors for an honest opinion of how you are progressing. Put in a complaint about them if they dare to suggest anything other than you are the greatest ATCO to grace the world ever.
8. The more thick-skinned and insenitive you can be towards others the better - especialy if they are struggling.
I hope this helps you. I can assure you they are all guaranteed to work.
Best of luck.
1. Try to fail more than one course.
2. If your sim runs aren't going that well, run out mid-excercise crying.
3. Blame your instructor for number 2.
4. Try and turn your whole course against said instructor especially if he is a popular and well respected individual and do so in such a way as to guarantee you get a warning out of this.
5. If 3 and 4 don't work, blame the ATSA input and complain about them.
6. Try and turn your coursemates against each other and yourself. A good way to achieve this is to control in such a way as to directly affect your partner's sim run and then interupt their debrief to tell them what they are doing wrong.
7. Ask your instructors for an honest opinion of how you are progressing. Put in a complaint about them if they dare to suggest anything other than you are the greatest ATCO to grace the world ever.
8. The more thick-skinned and insenitive you can be towards others the better - especialy if they are struggling.
I hope this helps you. I can assure you they are all guaranteed to work.
Best of luck.
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Bern Oulli When did that happen? (Being a retired and out-of-touch instructor.)
Who is in charge now?
Edited to add a bit.
Who is in charge now?
Edited to add a bit.
(edited to put the correct surname in)
Last edited by Someone_Else; 10th Oct 2005 at 11:49.
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sr562/anyone
I don't want to put anyone off, but I've been hearing some stories recently about the pass rate at CATC since the change in the structure of training. Are things particularly bad at the moment?
I don't want to put anyone off, but I've been hearing some stories recently about the pass rate at CATC since the change in the structure of training. Are things particularly bad at the moment?
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First some get outs...
I'm not at the College, I work in the Black hole where the nightly smell of burnt out cars still prevails.
I've also not been in work for two days.
However, just before I finished my last shift (so three days ago) I read an announcement by Ian Hall that Kevan Quinn was leaving the college to go and work on a bit of Caspian. (to answer Bern Oulli's question)
Now I don't know exactly what reasons are behind this. I'm also not totally au fait with courses at the moment, but I know that the last couple of lots haven't done too well numbers wise. Whether this is a failing at the college, or a failing of the new courses, or merely due to the quality of the student intakes I couldn't say. But perhaps they are trying to do something about it. I sure hope so, because some of the folk I am being asked to mentor these days (and incidentally I love training people, it's a part of my job that I value most) lack some of the most basic of knowledge that I had when I left the college.
I understand the pressures of getting people through asap to get them live asap because there simply aren't enough of us. However, that isn't going to work if we have to train them for much longer at units because of the knowledge and experience they lack (not necessarily their fault!)
I'm waiting to hear about Kevan's replacement, will post when I know unless someone beats me to it.
Cheers,
N
"Keep smiling, it makes people wonder what you're up to..."
I've also not been in work for two days.
However, just before I finished my last shift (so three days ago) I read an announcement by Ian Hall that Kevan Quinn was leaving the college to go and work on a bit of Caspian. (to answer Bern Oulli's question)
Now I don't know exactly what reasons are behind this. I'm also not totally au fait with courses at the moment, but I know that the last couple of lots haven't done too well numbers wise. Whether this is a failing at the college, or a failing of the new courses, or merely due to the quality of the student intakes I couldn't say. But perhaps they are trying to do something about it. I sure hope so, because some of the folk I am being asked to mentor these days (and incidentally I love training people, it's a part of my job that I value most) lack some of the most basic of knowledge that I had when I left the college.
I understand the pressures of getting people through asap to get them live asap because there simply aren't enough of us. However, that isn't going to work if we have to train them for much longer at units because of the knowledge and experience they lack (not necessarily their fault!)
I'm waiting to hear about Kevan's replacement, will post when I know unless someone beats me to it.
Cheers,
N
"Keep smiling, it makes people wonder what you're up to..."