REX to transition to ATRs, start domestic jet ops

[AmarokGTI]

Melbourne Airport showing 4 cancelled Qlink flights tonight, Mt Gambier, Launceston, Mildura and Devonport, all Q300's.
Assuming 3 of these are overnighting, not a great start to the week tomorrow for the punters.
Clearly they may not be aircraft related, but it certainly doesn't support Mr Hansfords claims of needing newer aircraft to remain competitive.

Qlink also chartered Rex (well, Pelair) to run a WHA return from ADL on the same day.

[PoppaJo]

So the Chair…

‘We will shut down your bases and your spitting in my face’

Deputy Chair…

‘We are going to rip away all those pesky entitlements those 737 pilots have built up over the years, 10% below Jetstar!’

I can’t say I’ve seen such behaviour from a management team, well ever, from anywhere. I’ve seen some pretty clueless management teams, however this is just utter bull****.

[Captn Rex Havack]

EBA negotiations and alleged threats are an IR concern, not the purvey of the Safety Regulator

[TimmyTee]

Yeah, because a heavily disengaged and distracted flight crew doesn’t have the potential to create a threat to safety…

[SHVC]

Would anyone care to share email?

[Paragraph377]

EBA negotiations and alleged threats are an IR concern, not the purvey of the Safety Regulator
Partly true. Yes, there is a potential I.R issue here, but any management action that places a workforce under duress or unnecesssary stress
is contributing to a potentially unsafe work environment. Obviously CASA doesn’t have the balls to address such an issue, but it’s something that should be noted.

[Paragraph377]

Yeah, because a heavily disengaged and distracted flight crew doesn’t have the potential to create a threat to safety…
10/10. Spot on.

[Ladloy]

Would anyone care to share email?
Sent to your inbox

[Captn Rex Havack]

Yes I agree entirely, but until there are stressed pilots, distracted pilots, or mentally breaking down pilots, and until there are incidents "directly" attributed to Kim Hai's
approach and the stressful effects it has on the pilots, it is not a CASA issue. It's IR until the effects create consequences. But even then, what will CASA do? SFA I suspect.

[Low Pass]

I know many Rex Jet pilots would love to see this for their current negotiations.(If you can call them that.)

May i please?

[Lead Balloon]

EBA negotiations and alleged threats are an IR concern, not the purvey of the Safety RegulatorIs “purvey” a new HR buzzword?

[Icarus2001]

Of course not LB, it’s when you ask a random sample of cats questions on a topic under discussion.

[MickG0105]

Is “purvey” a new HR buzzword?
The correct word would have been the noun purview, not the verb purvey.

[Lead Balloon]

Of course. Like ‘pay purview’ on the internet.

[MickG0105]

Of course. Like ‘pay purview’ on the internet.
That's the one. 😁

[KRUSTY 34]

An old cliche comes to mind.

Something about the self removal of a proboscis?

[turbantime]

With major sporting events in Melbourne (boxing) and Sydney (state of origin) this week, the incumbents have very high loads. Is Rex still flying around with dismal loads? Their fares suggest that they are. If they can’t generate bums on seats now, then when can they?

[43Inches]

Pretty sure the load factors are directly related to no one outside of aviation knowing they exist. I haven't seen/heard a single add on the TV or radio or anything, is there any advertising?

[MickG0105]

Pretty sure the load factors are directly related to no one outside of aviation knowing they exist. I haven't seen/heard a single add on the TV or radio or anything, is there any advertising?
Probably not. After introducing their jet fleet, Rex's expenditure on advertising fell by nearly 25 percent. They may have thought having Sharpie spruiking their flights on The Today Show and the like was all that was needed. Or they thought that the Saab punters and their friends and families would all start lining up to catch Rex jets. A case study in how not to attack a new market segment.

[Captn Rex Havack]

purvey
/pəˈveɪ/

verb
FORMAL

provide or supply (food, drink, or other goods) as one's business.
"shops purveying cooked food"

So, in this case, "provide or supply aviation regulation and oversight as one's business."

[MickG0105]

purvey
/pəˈveɪ/

verb
FORMAL

provide or supply (food, drink, or other goods) as one's business.
"shops purveying cooked food"

So, in this case, "provide or supply aviation regulation and oversight as one's business."
As that definition highlights, purvey is a verb. It is grammatically incorrect to say "not the purvey of the Safety Regulator". Unless you are a graduate of the Marjorie Taylor Greene School of Just Using Words That Sound Similar, the appropriate word to use in that phrase is the noun, purview.

purview
/ˈpɜːvjuː /
▸ n. formal
1. the scope of the influence or concerns of something.
2. a range of experience or thought

eg This case falls outside the purview of the District Court.

[Low Pass]

From the Australian:

Rex’s city foray runs into turbulenceThe regional airline wants to take on Qantas and Virgin in the competitive capital city market. So far, many of its planes are running significantly below capacity.''

Anyone paid enough to share a copy and paste of this paywall article?

[MickG0105]

Rex’s city foray runs into turbulenceThe regional airline wants to take on Qantas and Virgin in the competitive capital city market. So far, many of its planes are running significantly below capacity.

Rex Airlines deputy chairman John Sharp has conceded passenger numbers on its capital city routes – the key to the company’s expansion plans – “aren’t where we want them to be” even as the carrier exits an increasing number of regional destinations.

But Mr Sharp said the company was committed to growing the capital city services, launched in March 2021 with six Boeing 737-800NG aircraft, and was yet to spend half of the $150m of funds invested in the expansion by private equity firm PAG Asia Capital.

Over four days, The Australian monitored passenger levels on 35 of 58 Rex flights between Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane and the Gold Coast. The analysis shows many of those – tracked Monday to Thursday last week – had few passengers. Twelve, with fewer than 44 passengers, were less than one quarter full. One flight, from Sydney to the Gold Coast, appeared to have fewer than 10 passengers. Only three, two between Sydney and Melbourne and another from Melbourne to Brisbane, had more than 100 passengers.

Mr Sharp, who briefly served as transport minister in the Howard government, disputed some of the figures, and said a focus on just four days was “not an accurate reflection of what can happen in a week”. The airline’s busiest days were Friday to Sunday, Mr Sharp said, adding in that period aircraft were regularly full.

Rex declined a request to provide its own passenger data.

“This doesn’t come as a newsflash to us. We’re obviously aware of it and the numbers aren’t where we want them to be in the middle of the week,” Mr Sharp said of the figures compiled by The Australian. “They’re excellent Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday morning. Sometimes it’s difficult to get a flight on the weekends.”

For now, Mr Sharp said, the strong passenger numbers over those days were enough to keep the services – which have a capacity of 176 – flying.

“No one realises just how low cost our operation is yet we offer a full service experience for the passengers with all the things that Qantas offers,” said Mr Sharp.

“The only thing we don’t offer yet is a loyalty program which we will resolve fairly soon.”

“We haven’t touched the second half of the $150m we have available to us from PAG. It’ll take whatever time it takes to build and the domestic market is improving,” he said. “There’s a slow period in the middle of the week and that’s what Qantas and Virgin are also experiencing … reflected in the number of flights they cancel.”

In March, figures compiled by the Bureau of Infrastructure and Transport Research Economics show, the average load factor for all commercial passenger flights between Sydney and Melbourne was 78.4 per cent. It was 72.9 per cent between Brisbane and Sydney and 73.8 per cent between Melbourne and Brisbane.

Rex has high growth aspirations for its capital city network, and has previously said it expected to expand from six 737 aircraft to 14. It intended to fly to all capital cities in 2022, Mr Sharp told an aviation summit late last year.

While the Covid-19 pandemic pushed the aviation sector to the brink of collapse and sent Virgin Australia into administration – Rex has benefited from significant government support. The withdrawal of the Regional Airline Network Support scheme at the end of June, however, has meant Rex will withdraw flights from Sydney to Grafton, Bathurst, Lismore and Ballina – and from Adelaide to Kangaroo Island. The airline has previously announced its intention to stop flying between Melbourne and Albury and Sydney and Canberra.

Rex’s expansion into highly-competitive city routes is being funded by PAG, which has been given two board seats and a 47.6 per cent stake in the airline in return. The six 737 aircraft were previously flown by Virgin Australia, and were secured at a low cost of $60,000 per month at the height of the pandemic. The leasing price will rise to $100,000 in 12 months.

However, many of the scheduled flights monitored last week by The Australian were cancelled. Despite plans to operate nine return flights a day between Sydney and Melbourne – the world’s fifth busiest route – Rex was currently flying just four. The Brisbane to Sydney route is down to return services most days rather than the intended three, and Melbourne to Brisbane is flown just daily midweek, with extra f lights on Monday and Friday.

Peter Harbison, the chairman of market intelligence firm CAPA Centre for Aviation, said the low frequency of Rex flights made it an easy target for the larger airlines.

“Rex is selling seats on price, and the other carriers can easily match them on price at the particular times they fly even though their costs are higher,” he said.

“If you look at Webjet, you’ll see most of (Rex) flights are very carefully matched by Jetstar and Virgin which means they’re not really able to leverage the lower price thing to the extent they need to. As long as they have low frequency that’s a disadvantage.”

Another challenge facing Rex is a lack of brand awareness, Mr Harbison added. With a limited marketing budget, Rex had made little effort to announce its presence in the fiercely competitive domestic market and had no apparent point of difference, he said.

“Rex has got to do something a bit different. They’ve got to get known because very few people know that they fly,” he said. “If you want to get in a nice business class seat, it’s very cheap to fly that way (with Rex) but does anybody know that? You can f ly business class on Rex for a similar price that other airlines charge for economy.”

Mr Sharp said the airline was aware it needed to increase the frequency of flights. “We are bringing in more aircraft as we can get them and getting them is more challenging these days than it was a while ago. It is doable, it just takes longer,” he said. “That’s what we always planned.”

Speaking in February after the airline posted a $36m loss for the six months to December 31 – down from a $10m profit for the same period one year earlier – Mr Sharp said Rex had signed “a number” of large companies and was making inroads into the business market.

According to the figures compiled by The Australian, 12 flights between Sydney and Melbourne were on average only around 39 per cent full. One Tuesday flight from Sydney to Melbourne had fewer than 30 passengers on board. Tickets on those f lights were on sale for $121.

The cost of fuel alone on a one hour Melbourne to Sydney flight is estimated to be around $3800 – assuming Rex has hedged at least a portion of the cost. That does not include airport charges, aircraft lease fees and labour costs.

Tony Webber, a former Qantas chief economist who now lectures at UNSW, said there was a limited time any airline could operate a route with few passengers.

“Their owners won’t let it happen forever,” said Mr Webber. “I would say they probably underestimated the degree of competition in those Golden Triangle sectors. It’s a very aggressive, cutthroat industry, and Qantas especially will be very, very aggressive.”

Rex has repeatedly complained to the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission about Qantas and last week blamed its larger rival’s “predatory action” and “bullying and heartless behaviour” for pulling out of some regional routes. A Qantas spokeswoman said Rex appeared to have no problem investing in major city services, and described the airline’s claims as “far fetched”.

Mr Harbison said competition rules were not designed to protect airlines in the market, but consumers. “You could argue you’ve got Qantas, Jetstar and Virgin … I doubt that you’ll still be seeing $79 fares as often as you are, if Rex went out of the market,” he said.


https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/rexs-city-foray-runs-into-turbulence/news-story/7a045193588c79a162a1ac52b69b5d2b

[Low Pass]

Thanks mate!! Legend

[No Idea Either]

Not sure about JS’s logic. Yes it’s a bit slower through the mid week period but the morning and evening VA flights through that period, aka business traffic, are absolutely chocka’s. As for the cancellations confirming the same slow period, he’s kidding himself. The only reason VA cancel flights is lack of crew, cabin crew in particular, not loads. That’s my ‘at the coal face’ observation anyway.

Can’t speak for JQ or QF….​​​​​….

[MickG0105]

Not sure about JS’s logic.
There's your problem, right there. Assuming that there's any logic at all to anything Sharpie says.

He talks up how busy they are on the weekends yet their own schedules give lie to that. They have fewer flights on Saturdays and Sundays than Thursdays.

He reckons that their flight frequency shortfall is because they don't have enough aircraft. Their utilisation figures give lie to that. Their asset utilisation is a good 25 percent below where it should be. They were operating as many flights back when they only had four aircraft as they are now with six.

He reckons that they are bringing on more aircraft "... as we can get them and getting them is more challenging these days than it was a while ago". Twelve months ago they announced that they "... had signed a Letter of Intent (LOI) with a lessor for the lease of two Boeing 737-800NGs. The two aircraft are expected to arrive in late August, increasing the 737 fleet to eight, and are scheduled to enter service on Rex’s domestic network in September." Those two new jets never materialised.

As usual, he's all over the shop.

[Alfie.floor]

There's your problem, right there. Assuming that there's any logic at all to anything Sharpie says.

He talks up how busy they are on the weekends yet their own schedules give lie to that. They have fewer flights on Saturdays and Sundays than Thursdays.

He reckons that their flight frequency shortfall is because they don't have enough aircraft. Their utilisation figures give lie to that. Their asset utilisation is a good 25 percent below where it should be. They were operating as many flights back when they only had four aircraft as they are now with six.

He reckons that they are bringing on more aircraft "... as we can get them and getting them is more challenging these days than it was a while ago". Twelve months ago they announced that they "... had signed a Letter of Intent (LOI) with a lessor for the lease of two Boeing 737-800NGs. The two aircraft are expected to arrive in late August, increasing the 737 fleet to eight, and are scheduled to enter service on Rex’s domestic network in September." Those two new jets never materialised.

As usual, he's all over the shop.

I find it amusing how people think that JS has any input into the operation. He is just an old fool with connections to corrupt politicians. Make no mistake ALL communications that go out to the media must get signed off by LKH himself, and all decisions are made from Singapore. He is just a puppet that gets told what to say and when to say it. It used to be NH the one making all the statements to the media, but since the infamous letter to cadets and the failed court case NH has had to lay low.
To all the boys and girls at Rex, hold the line and do not give into the threats made by LKH. He knows the regional arm is the bread winner of the operation, call his bluff and go all in.😉

[Ladloy]

Rex has released a statement to the ASX which is great for a read.

[Paragraph377]

Rex has released a statement to the ASX which is great for a read.
Aagh yes, what an announcement. Yet another mealy mouthed statement that was aimed at sinking the knife into AFAP and the pilot group. And interestingly, they couldn’t help mentioning ‘predatory pricing’ plus they had a shot at the AFAP President for being employed by a ‘competition’ airline. What an absolute lowball assault by REX. Just shows how pathetic the CEO and Mr Sharp are. Get these two clowns a tissue box and tell them to cry elsewhere.

I took a historical look at two things this morning - the REX share price chart for the previous 12 months and then the previous 5 years, as outlined on the ASX. Then I looked at the Brent crude oil prices for the past 12 months and then the previous 5 years. What it shows is that REX overall profits are dependant on the oil prices of the day. Oil goes up, REX profits go down. So that brings me back to the question of how well are they doing with hedging their fuel costs? Not too well by the look of the charts. It would seem that they haven’t factored oil prices into their business model very well at all. That has to be attributed to the CEO, Board, and any other financial decision maker in the company. And at $121 per barrel this morning, that’s not good. I noticed that oil has barely been below $100 per barrel since 14 February 2022. Now if they hedged around 80% of their fuel on 20 December 2021 they would be sitting reasonably well at the moment as the price was $70.51 per barrel. But I’m doubting it. The CEO’s vitriol expressed towards the pilot group is tinted with desperation. The executives are deflecting attention from their own mistakes and trying to blame COVID, Pilot salaries, predatory pricing and anything other than their own incompetencies. What’s next - blame 5G, solar flares and a declining whale population for their financial issues?

[rodney rude]

Alfie nailed it.

[Australopithecus]

Not sure about JS’s logic. Yes it’s a bit slower through the mid week period but the morning and evening VA flights through that period, aka business traffic, are absolutely chocka’s. As for the cancellations confirming the same slow period, he’s kidding himself. The only reason VA cancel flights is lack of crew, cabin crew in particular, not loads. That’s my ‘at the coal face’ observation anyway.

Can’t speak for JQ or QF….​​​​​….

QF recently cancelled several MEL flights due to staff shortages on the ramp. The consolidated load effect was of course full flights,
Rex’s “build it and they will come” marketing strategy is perplexing. Are they relying on lowest fare results in booking apps? Since, as the article mentions, the majors can just offer discounts around Rex’s schedule they then might only get customers from the overflow market. Low fares are one thing but you would think that no name recognition would be a hurdle for many travellers.

[Lead Balloon]

As that definition highlights, purvey is a verb. It is grammatically incorrect to say "not the purvey of the Safety Regulator". Unless you are a graduate of the Marjorie Taylor Greene School of Just Using Words That Sound Similar, the appropriate word to use in that phrase is the noun, purview.Sorry about the continuing drift, but it is hopefully a little amusing in an otherwise serious thread.

I once read a scholarly paper which was very well researched and convincing, but the author at one point said that: “X research was done under the hospices of the Acme Research Institute”. No dictionary would convince the author that he meant “auspices” rather than palliative care homes.

PRuNe is fertile ground for ‘allot’ of ‘mute points’…

/Drift OFF with my apologies.

Fight the good fight, Rex boys and girls.

[PoppaJo]

Are they relying on lowest fare results in booking apps?
That’s the thing, they are not. I go out full and overbooked while they head out next to me with 20.

A low cost carrier with near 20 aircraft exited the lower end of the market yet they are targeting the upper end of the market? Would be like putting a David Jones in Broadmeadows. Targeting a non existent market.

[Bull_Shark]

I find it amusing how people think that JS has any input into the operation. He is just an old fool with connections to corrupt politicians. Make no mistake ALL communications that go out to the media must get signed off by LKH himself, and all decisions are made from Singapore. He is just a puppet that gets told what to say and when to say it.

Spot on there 👍

The ASX statement is just bizarre.

If Rex had concentrated on their core business of regional operations they would be emerging now from the last two years in a stronger position than ever.

Yet with an expensive and dead in the water domestic operation dragging everything else down, Rex do what they know best and start blaming everyone and everything else including the long suffering Saab pilot group for their own incompetent management decisions.

It’ll be interesting to see exactly what the Rex financial position is when results are released in a couple of months.

[Gunner747400]

Latest article in The Australia this afternoon. Good to see going down the road of PIA.

Rex has accused the pilots union of circulating malicious lies to its members after an application was made to take industrial action over the airline’s latest pay offer.

The Australian Federation of Air Pilots has been in negotiations with Rex since 2018, in an effort to secure a new enterprise agreement for Saab 340 pilots.

According to the AFAP, the latest offer from Rex was the “worst yet” and represented a cut in real-term salary of more than 5 per cent since 2018.

“It does not contain back pay and does not cover CPI over the previous four years,” said an AFAP spokeswoman.

“As a result, Rex pilots have been left with little option than to exercise their lawful right to lodge an application for a protected industrial action ballot with the Fair Work Commission.”

In a bizarre statement to the ASX, Rex chairman Lim Kim Hai said the AFAP had circulated “malicious, misleading and deceptive” correspondence to members in the context of ongoing EBA negotiations.

“It is disappointing that AFAP would manipulate information provided to them during the course of negotiations to seek to achieve its aim,” said Mr Lim.

“It is particularly concerning that AFAP whose president (Louise Pole) is a pilot with the competitor (QantasLink) would take this approach given the significant efforts made by Rex during the pandemic to preserve the jobs of pilots when so many other airlines were terminating theirs.”

The AFAP spokeswoman said they stood by their communications with members and would continue to communicate in “an honest, timely and accurate manner”.

Mr Lim went on to defend Rex’s decision to cut a number of regional routes flown by Saab 340s, when government support for those services ended on June 30.

He said a board meeting last month had resolved to channel any resources from those axed routes into other regional routes with strong passenger numbers and growth potential.

“Rex’s current regional flying is about 90 per cent of pre-Covid levels with passenger numbers equally at about 90 per cent of pre-Covid levels,” Mr Lim said.

“Rex believes that it will be reaching over 100 per cent of pre-Covid levels of regional flying activity at the start of the new financial year as a result of the board’s decision.”

Cuts to regional routes had raised concerns the airline was aiming to prop up its expansion to major city routes, using former Virgin Australia Boeing 737s.

As The Australian reported on Monday, passenger loads on the narrow body jets were worryingly low on many weekday services, which were competing with Qantas, Jetstar and Virgin.

Rex deputy chairman John Sharp insisted the airline was in good shape, and would continue its drive into capital city markets with the help of $150m in funding from PAG Asia Capital.

He said Rex was yet to dip into the second half of the funding, which was provided in return for two board seats and a 47.6 per cent stake in the airline.

[gamma69]

Careful boys n girls doing PIA, you will be branded a bully and trouble maker! No promotions onto the C&T team if thats what your looking for. Speaking from first hand experience.

[Bull_Shark]

While the hard working Saab pilots who have weathered stand downs during Covid are once again bullied and threatened by an incompetent management team who have presided over the worst launch of any domestic airline in Australian history, let’s remind everyone what such lack lustre performance gets you as a board member at Rex…

June 2021- John Sharp - 1,600,000 Rex Shares
Ronald Bartsch - 400,000 Rex Shares
Neville Howell - 1,000,000 Rex Shares
James Davis - 400,000 Rex Shares

and the list goes on….

The person/people being spat on in the face certainly isn’t LKH…

[Red69]

Careful boys n girls doing PIA, you will be branded a bully and trouble maker! No promotions onto the C&T team if thats what your looking for. Speaking from first hand experience.

Keep spreading the fear mate. Let Australian pilot’s conditions languish behind the rest of the world and cost of living just so you can climb the greasy pole to show the rest of your colleagues ‘how it should be done’.

Australian pilots need to take a stand and push for better terms and conditions that have been eroded through covid. Just look at America, Asia and the Middle East. They’re all looking for pilots.

[Lead Balloon]

That solves one mystery for me. I wondered where Ron Bartsch ended up, after his 'thankyou' appointment as a member of the AAT expired. He seemed to me to spend an unusual amount of time writing errata to his AAT decisions.

[gamma69]

Keep spreading the fear mate. Let Australian pilot’s conditions languish behind the rest of the world and cost of living just so you can climb the greasy pole to show the rest of your colleagues ‘how it should be done’.

Australian pilots need to take a stand and push for better terms and conditions that have been eroded through covid. Just look at America, Asia and the Middle East. They’re all looking for pilots.

No, quiet the opposite, I fought hard for the previous EBA(PIA), that was my sacrifice not going further. Just a warning that is their tactic. I agree take it too them.

[KRUSTY 34]

Careful boys n girls doing PIA, you will be branded a bully and trouble maker! No promotions onto the C&T team if thats what your looking for. Speaking from first hand experience.

Ha!

Nice wind up Dude.

[Paragraph377]

Ronald Bartsch - 400,000 Rex Shares

But but isn’t Ron ex-Qantas? Surely Kim wouldn’t want Ron on the Board, being an ex Qantas employee? I mean if the AFAP President is a risk, then wouldn’t Ron be a risk as well?

It must be almost time for Sharp to do another tv interview moaning and whining about how poor old REX is hard done by.

[Paragraph377]

That solves one mystery for me. I wondered where Ron Bartsch ended up, after his 'thankyou' appointment as a member of the AAT expired. He seemed to me to spend an unusual amount of time writing errata to his AAT decisions.
Nobody really takes him seriously. He has ridden others coattails and used slippery marketing techniques to promote himself as being the font of all things aviation. His circus tricks dazzle some people, but not all. There are other much smarter and more noteworthy aviation business and safety experts (that excludes GT) that are worth listening to.

.

[Head in the Cloud]

Does anyone know what was offered by the company?

[Ladloy]

Does anyone know what was offered by the company?
5% for the last 4 years, 2.5% from July. No backpay for the 3-4 years of expiry and a 5k bonus upon the group reaching 5 mil profit (includes jet ops)

[SOSIJ]

A salary increase of 5.1% on base salary, effective from 1 July 2022.
A further salary increase of 2.5% up to a maximum of 3% based on CPI, on 1 July 2023.
A one-off payment of $5000 payable when Regional Express Holdings Limited reaches $5 million profit
A further one-off payment of $5000 in 2026 if the company is profitable at that time, payable to those employed pre-COVID (date to be determined).
An offer to discuss how those one-off payments might be distributed.

[Head in the Cloud]

A salary increase of 5.1% on base salary, effective from 1 July 2022.
A further salary increase of 2.5% up to a maximum of 3% based on CPI, on 1 July 2023.
A one-off payment of $5000 payable when Regional Express Holdings Limited reaches $5 million profit
A further one-off payment of $5000 in 2026 if the company is profitable at that time, payable to those employed pre-COVID (date to be determined).
An offer to discuss how those one-off payments might be distributed.


2026?

And no back pay, how can they say it's better than the QLink which was signed during the pandemic?

Be interesting to see if they come to the party.

[puff]

Am I missing something about JSs comment about AFAP agreeing to the Qlink EBA of 2% per year being a worse deal than he's offering.

Wasn't the Rex EBA dead in 2018 - making it 4 years expired when the Q link EBA wasn't expired?
Meaning that to be equal to the QF offer, it would have to have been an 8% rise (they have offered 5.1%), and thats not factoring in the current 5% plus inflation?

So it's at least 3% worse than the Qlink offer, or 2% if they end up with 3% in 2023 vs Qs 2%?

[MickG0105]

5% for the last 4 years, 2.5% from July. No backpay for the 3-4 years of expiry and a 5k bonus upon the group reaching 5 mil profit (includes jet ops)
A quick clarification please; have there been no pay increases at all for Rex pilots since the last EB 2.5 percent increase back in July 2018?

[Ladloy]

A quick clarification please; have there been no pay increases at all for Rex pilots since the last EB 2.5 percent increase back in July 2018?
that's correct

[assasin]

Am I missing something about JSs comment about AFAP agreeing to the Qlink EBA of 2% per year being a worse deal than he's offering.

Wasn't the Rex EBA dead in 2018 - making it 4 years expired when the Q link EBA wasn't expired?
Meaning that to be equal to the QF offer, it would have to have been an 8% rise (they have offered 5.1%), and thats not factoring in the current 5% plus inflation?

So it's at least 3% worse than the Qlink offer, or 2% if they end up with 3% in 2023 vs Qs 2%?

This accounting by JS is probably exactly how he “mistakenly” claimed entitlements that were fudged in the travel rorts affair 1997.

http://webarchive.loc.gov/all/20090615191148/http%3A//www.anao.gov.au/uploads/documents/1997%2D98_Audit_Report_23.pdf

[Paragraph377]

This accounting by JS is probably exactly how he mistakenly claimed entitlements that were fudged in the travel rorts affair 1997.

http://webarchive.loc.gov/all/20090615191148/http%3A//www.anao.gov.au/uploads/documents/1997%2D98_Audit_Report_23.pdf

And even after getting nailed for his rorting activities the pathetic Australian Government rewarded their ‘mate’ Sharpie with an AM. What a joke.

I wonder how much John’s share portfolio has increased in size and value since 2018?

[MickG0105]

that's correct
Thanks for that.

Just back of the napkin, CPI alone from 1 July 2018 to 1 July 2022 will be over 10 percent. Puts the 5.1 percent on offer in perspective.

The salary forgone number will be substantial - if you were to just apply CPI as the pay escalator that has been foregone because of the stalled EBA, the de facto pay freeze will have generated the equivalent of around 19 percent of your 2018 salary in aggregate foregone wages. The absence of any sort of back pay in the Rex offer needs to be lined up against that.

Notably, for comparison, between June 2018 and June 2021 Sharpie's base pay rose by over 29 percent.

Who was meant to be spitting in whom's eye?

[transition_alt]

Thanks for that.

Just back of the napkin, CPI alone from 1 July 2018 to 1 July 2022 will be over 10 percent. Puts the 5.1 percent on offer in perspective.

The salary forgone number will be substantial - if you were to just apply CPI as the pay escalator that has been foregone because of the stalled EBA, the de facto pay freeze will have generated the equivalent of around 19 percent of your 2018 salary in aggregate foregone wages. The absence of any sort of back pay in the Rex offer needs to be lined up against that.

Notably, for comparison, between June 2018 and June 2021 Sharpie's base pay rose by over 29 percent.

Who was meant to be spitting in whom's eye?

Worth noting with the above that Rex are claiming the “back pay” they are offering will close the missing pay gap. Which it obviously will not as it’s a one off payment if the pilots happen to be employed there in 4 years (ha). Quite a significant real loss of salary for these poor blokes.

I thought we were hard done by in my airlines pay “deal” but this is diabolical.

[Ladloy]

Worth noting with the above that Rex are claiming the “back pay” they are offering will close the missing pay gap. Which it obviously will not as it’s a one off payment if the pilots happen to be employed there in 4 years (ha). Quite a significant real loss of salary for these poor blokes.

I thought we were hard done by in my airlines pay “deal” but this is diabolical.
The backpay clause which is spruiked by the union is a certain percentage of your total income since 2018, paid in yearly instalments for 3 years but if you leave the company it's paid out instantly.

[MickG0105]

Worth noting with the above that Rex are claiming the “back pay” they are offering will close the missing pay gap.
That's complete and utter nonsense. Back-of-the-napkin, a 5yr FO would have foregone between $6,000 - $11,000 in lost salary because of the de facto pay freeze, depending on what you apply as the missing annual escalator (the lower figure assumes CPI, the higher is 2.5 percent per annum). $5,000 at some future date, contingent on profitability (which means no time soon), most assuredly does not close that gap.

Any idea how many pilots (Captains and FOs) Rex has? It would be interesting to see how much money Rex has saved in wages because of the stalled EBA. It would have to run to a few million.

[273Kelvin]

Any idea how many pilots (Captains and FOs) Rex has? It would be interesting to see how much money Rex has saved in wages because of the stalled EBA. It would have to run to a few million.

307 on the latest seniority.

[Pastor of Muppets]

What’s the plan? That prop fleet is looking more and more like a museum flight of Convairs.

[FO NappyBum]

What’s the plan? That prop fleet is looking more and more like a museum flight of Convairs.

Q400’s I’ve heard to operate under the brand name “GypsyLink”

[SHVC]

I’m sure JS will have plenty to blow up about today when he signs on. Article in todays Australian, QF has been cleared of all predatory behavior by ACCC (https://www.accc.gov.au/system/files/Airline%20competition%20in%20Australia%20report%20%28June%20 2022%29.pdf) from complaints by Rex. If you want the Australian article pay for it.

[Servo]

I am all for AFAP going hard for REX to improve their conditions and pay. Any effort to stop the race to the bottom is a good thing. Pity they were mindful that VA Captains and FO's took a 17% paycut.........

[MickG0105]

307 on the latest seniority.
Thanks for that. Back-of-the-napkin, the stalled EBA has saved Rex in aggregate, somewhere between $3.5 - $4.5 million in wage increases since the agreement expired (COVID-related stand downs would have some impact on actual impact). In return they are offering $1.5 million, contingent on profitability. Does that sound like wages theft?

Notably, while the EBA was stalled, management still received fairly substantial hikes to their salaries and total remuneration. The COO's base pay rose over 22 percent between 2018-2021. Management basically never missed out on a pay rise. Even during the pandemic, most of the executive management team received wage increases. In FY 2020, the year that they were crying impending collapse and had their hand out for $54 million in "last resort" funding they still managed to give Sharpie a 6.6 percent pay rise.

[KRUSTY 34]

Thanks for that. Back-of-the-napkin, the stalled EBA has saved Rex in aggregate, somewhere between $3.5 - $4.5 million in wage increases since the agreement expired (COVID-related stand downs would have some impact on actual impact). In return they are offering $1.5 million, contingent on profitability. Does that sound like wages theft?

Notably, while the EBA was stalled, management still received fairly substantial hikes to their salaries and total remuneration. The COO's base pay rose over 22 percent between 2018-2021. Management basically never missed out on a pay rise. Even during the pandemic, most of the executive management team received wage increases. In FY 2020, the year that they were crying impending collapse and had their hand out for $54 million in "last resort" funding they still managed to give Sharpie a 6.6 percent pay rise.

An article in The Border Mail about 12 months ago gives some perspective, although no other mainstream publication, including The Australian, have seemed to run with it?

I’m unable to post the link, but perhaps someone who is a little more tech savvy?

[tossbag]

they still managed to give Sharpie a 6.6 percent pay rise.

Mick, stop calling him Sharpie, the bloke is a ****.

[Paragraph377]

Mick, stop calling him Sharpie, the bloke is a ****.
It should be ‘not so Sharp’…. Or maybe John Shark?

[Arnold E]

…



Well he is the one that is 2 IC in the company, gets a big salary and pay rises, big bonus's and has a lot of "sway" in the company, so I would suggest he is sharper than you

[Icarus2001]

Arnold, thank you for pointing out the often overlooked reality. It's like those who say "Elon Musk is an idiot" as they sit in their track suit in the pub at two o'clock in afternoon.

[Bull_Shark]

Arnold, thank you for pointing out the often overlooked reality. It's like those who say "Elon Musk is an idiot" as they sit in their track suit in the pub at two o'clock in afternoon.

Whats wrong with sitting in your tracksuit in the pub at two o’clock in the afternoon??

[Icarus2001]

Where did I say that there was anything wrong with that activity or location?

[Ladloy]

…





Well he is the one that is 2 IC in the company, gets a big salary and pay rises, big bonus's and has a lot of "sway" in the company, so I would suggest he is sharper than you
corruption pays

[TimmyTee]

Well he is the one that is 2 IC in the company, gets a big salary and pay rises, big bonus's and has a lot of "sway" in the company, so I would suggest he is sharper than you

Sick burn!

[MickG0105]

An article in The Border Mail about 12 months ago gives some perspective, although no other mainstream publication, including The Australian, have seemed to run with it?

I’m unable to post the link, but perhaps someone who is a little more tech savvy?
We kicked that one - about the executive share options - around some time back.
https://www.pprune.org/11144757-post1607.html

[KRUSTY 34]

We kicked that one - about the executive share options - around some time back.
https://www.pprune.org/11144757-post1607.html

Of course!

Thanks Mick.

[Bull_Shark]

Here’s the article in full…Regional Express airline prepares $12 million in executive bonus shares after COVID-19 bailoutRegional Express has set aside company shares worth more than $12 million to pay bonuses to its executives less than a year after the company was rescued with $62 million in taxpayer aid.Former National Party MP and Regional Express (Rex) deputy chairman John Sharp stands to gain the most from the bonus scheme, having been granted the potential to receive 1.6 million shares currently worth more than $1.9 million.

Riverina MP Michael McCormack, who oversaw the federal government's aid to Rex, said allocating shares to executives was a matter for the company.

However, Labor has called on the airline to continue investing in its regional services and workers rather than giving bonuses to already well-paid executives.

REX informed the ASX on June 30 that it would issue 10 million "awards securities" to 11 executives that could be exchanged one-to-one for shares if they met performance criteria such as boosting pre-tax profits.

In response to questions about the bonuses, REX said it was required to establish a "management incentive scheme" as part of a $150 million funding deal with Hong Kong-based investment group PAG (https://www.dailyadvertiser.com.au/story/7106474/rex-secures-150-million-for-jet-service-launch-with-shares-sale/).

"They are performance rights only and shares are not issued unless very high performance targets are reached," REX's statement said.

The airline said any linking of the bonus scheme to the bailout "reveals a poor economic understanding of accounting and finance".

"Shares are non-cash in nature and are funded by shareholders and so has nothing to do with the government assistance," REX's statement said.

While the bonuses could be funded by new or current investors buying shares in REX, the airline's prior statements said (https://www.dailyadvertiser.com.au/story/6683509/rex-airlines-faces-imminent-closure-over-covid-19-threat/) the business would have been "irreversibly destroyed" without government funding. (https://www.dailyadvertiser.com.au/story/6738991/regional-express-to-maintain-flights-after-federal-rescue/)

Mr McCormack said on Wednesday that REX's decision on allocating awards securities was a matter for the company.

REX was operating 35 routes that were not being serviced by any other airlines which received funding, so 35 communities would have been left without support, without a service, without the ability to ship in essential personal protective equipment and other vital supplies," he said.

Labor's shadow transport spokeswoman Catherine King said if REX was in such a strong position, it should continue investing in its business and workers rather than pay bonuses to executives.

"Last year REX received $53 million in untied grants from the Morrison Government. Such significant taxpayer support brings with it a responsibility to use it to support jobs and maintain flight routes," she said.

[SHVC]

JS might not make sign on today, FWA approved PIA last night for Rex pilots.

[Gunner747400]

From the order on the FWC website for the PIA ballot, these are the actions that will be voted on;

1. An unlimited number of indefinite or periodic bans on loading extra fuel prior to flights, where the primary purpose for loading the extra fuel is in order to negate the need to refuel at the destination airport?
2. An unlimited number of indefinite or periodic bans on conducting route or port briefings when not on duty?
3. An unlimited number of indefinite or periodic bans on wearing some or all elements of the prescribed uniform?
4. An unlimited number of occasions where non-uniform items are worn in addition to or instead of some or all elements of the prescribed uniform?
5. An unlimited number of indefinite or periodic bans on signing on at a port other than home base until a minimum of 10 hours free of duty has elapsed since the previous sign-off?
6. An unlimited number of indefinite or periodic bans on signing on at home base until a minimum of twelve (12) hours free of any duty has elapsed since the previous sign-off from duty?
7. An unlimited number of indefinite or periodic bans on operating an aircraft with any deferred defect (including deferrals under Minimum Equipment List (MEL), Configuration Deviation List (CDL) and/or a Not Airworthiness Defect (NAD))?
8. An unlimited number of single or consecutive four (4) hour work stoppages of all work?

[Paragraph377]

…





Well he is the one that is 2 IC in the company, gets a big salary and pay rises, big bonus's and has a lot of "sway" in the company, so I would suggest he is sharper than you

You don’t need to be ‘sharp’ to get rich. And to be a politician you also don’t need to be smart, you need to be untrustworthy, slippery, dishonest, and be a disloyal backstabber.

[TimmyTee]

Anecdotally, option no.7 effectively grounds the entire fleet

[SHVC]

How are the 73 numbers so far this weekend? Surely would have to be full oversold? If they’re not well it will sure to be all over by years end. VA and JQ check inns have been over flowing.

[Stationair8]

The Australian Business Review, reporting Rex are going run Melbourne- Devonport route.

Wonder if that be four return flights day, like Kendell’s did?

[mates rates]

This route supported 2 operators for many years.Originally Ansett and TAA ,then Ansett and East-West Airlines.But you need a schedule that includes an overnight stop.

[Paragraph377]

This route supported 2 operators for many years.Originally Ansett and TAA ,then Ansett and East-West Airlines.But you need a schedule that includes an overnight stop.
3 good airlines mentioned here. The good old days.

[Ollie Onion]

So good they don’t exist anymore.

[Paragraph377]

So good they don’t exist anymore.
Childish comment.

Ansett was brought undone by Ables going on a spending spree in Toulouse. TAA became Australian and was then gobbled up by Qantas and East-West airlines was a great airline gobbled up by Ansett. All provided good services over a long period of time.

[das Uber Soldat]

Childish comment.

Ansett was brought undone by Ables going on a spending spree in Toulouse. TAA became Australian and was then gobbled up by Qantas and East-West airlines was a great airline gobbled up by Ansett. All provided good services over a long period of time.
it's always entertaining watching a blue shirt have a spray about his now utterly defunct airline.

How long till the last of you lot retire? Will be no shortage of parties to attend.

[turbantime]

But didn’t the chairman say the the entire SE operation was unprofitable and likely to be shutdown unless the pilots agree to their ‘offer’?

https://australianaviation.com.au/2022/06/rex-expands-frequency-on-11-regional-services-exits-sydney-cooma/?fbclid=IwAR1fmS6iOjmFoHVLUVYgpxmaczBXdXNX7RNUFFWJstDuwCJnue Ww6PwH5sw&fs=e&s=cl

[Paragraph377]

it's always entertaining watching a blue shirt have a spray about his now utterly defunct airline.

How long till the last of you lot retire? Will be no shortage of parties to attend.

das Uber idiot, you’re not too bright sunshine. Wrong coloured shirt. My heritage is Air New Zealand and I’m long retired after a perfect career that was well remunerated. How’s your superannuation account going, sport?

[morno]

Ohhh some dick measuring hey

[Paragraph377]

Ohhh some dick measuring hey
You can’t be referring to me as I’m happy with the length of my dick and I don’t need to engage in any measuring contest to prove my worth. I will leave that to you and Uber. Cheers

[Cypher]

das Uber idiot, you’re not too bright sunshine. Wrong coloured shirt. My heritage is Air New Zealand and I’m long retired after a perfect career that was well remunerated. How’s your superannuation account going, sport?
So what your saying is that you don't need to be a plonker to be an Air New Zealand pilot.. but it helps...

[Paragraph377]

So what your saying is that you don't need to be a plonker to be an Air New Zealand pilot.. but it helps...
Sorry, I don’t buy into racist comments.

When I was with ANZ we referred to Australian pilots as our ‘brothers across the ditch’. We may have flown for different airlines in different countries, but we always felt bonded as Pilot ‘brothers’. Doesn’t look like that comradeship exists anymore. Real shame. Hell, one of my most favourite memories from flying was being stranded in a location with two KLM pilots whom I had never met before. Two days and 3 nights of unbridled drinking, debauchery (I am trying to keep the story clean for the ‘woke’ fraternity), and then more drinking. Bonded by the epaulette.

[Icarus2001]

Nationality is not race.

[KRUSTY 34]

But didn’t the chairman say the the entire SE operation was unprofitable and likely to be shutdown unless the pilots agree to their ‘offer’?

https://australianaviation.com.au/2022/06/rex-expands-frequency-on-11-regional-services-exits-sydney-cooma/?fbclid=IwAR1fmS6iOjmFoHVLUVYgpxmaczBXdXNX7RNUFFWJstDuwCJnue Ww6PwH5sw&fs=e&s=cl

A possible dilemma in the not too distant future?

[AmarokGTI]

A possible dilemma in the not too distant future?

Although the media release yesterday advised more services than pre covid as they “Return to profitability” and that “We are confident that FY23 will see a great improvement in the financial performance of our regional operations”

Seems misaligned with imminent mass redundancies on the Saab fleet.

[das Uber Soldat]

I don’t need to engage in any measuring contest to prove my worth.

How’s your superannuation account going, sport?

This kids, is why you shouldn't lick the skydrol during the walk around,

Now, you were about to enlighten us all about what race 'New Zealand' is?

[Lookleft]

it's always entertaining watching a blue shirt have a spray about his now utterly defunct airline.

How long till the last of you lot retire? Will be no shortage of parties to attend.

Wow! P77 gives a little bit of history and a completely inaccurate nasty little statement is made. I doubt anyone flying for the crap organisations tarted up as airlines nowadays will ever get to experience the pleasure that used to be had flying for a domestic Australian airline.

[gchriste]

Although the media release yesterday advised more services than pre covid as they “Return to profitability” and that “We are confident that FY23 will see a great improvement in the financial performance of our regional operations”

Seems misaligned with imminent mass redundancies on the Saab fleet.

Sadly no it doesnt. One could draw the conclusion the redundancies is what will help drive the return to profitability.

[Paragraph377]

Wow! P77 gives a little bit of history and a completely inaccurate nasty little statement is made. I doubt anyone flying for the crap organisations tarted up as airlines nowadays will ever get to experience the pleasure that used to be had flying for a domestic Australian airline.
Ditto. I thoroughly agree 👍

[Ladloy]

Sadly no it doesnt. One could draw the conclusion the redundancies is what will help drive the return to profitability.
They're struggling to crew flights as it is. The redundancies are purely a threat to EBA negotiations. Comes around every 4 years.

[SHVC]

Rex signing a deal with multiple travel agency’s. A 10 yr deal with flight centre ensuring Rex will be flight centers partner of choice. Surely this should prop up the 73 loads, Rex seem confident it will anyway. .

“The agreements are expected to result in a more than doubling of Rex’s annual domestic jet revenues in FY2023 compared to its current annualized domestic jet revenues with no increase in fleet size. Revenue on its regional revenue is also expected to be improved”.

[blubak]

Rex signing a deal with multiple travel agency’s. A 10 yr deal with flight centre ensuring Rex will be flight centers partner of choice. Surely this should prop up the 73 loads, Rex seem confident it will anyway. .

“The agreements are expected to result in a more than doubling of Rex’s annual domestic jet revenues in FY2023 compared to its current annualized domestic jet revenues with no increase in fleet size. Revenue on its regional revenue is also expected to be improved”.
This deal along with some decent customer service may just be the turning point. If passengers are treated properly & the network is good the punters may just vote with their feet.

[Colonel_Klink]

“The agreements are expected to result in a more than doubling of Rex’s annual domestic jet revenues in FY2023 compared to its current annualized domestic jet revenues with no increase in fleet size. Revenue on its regional revenue is also expected to be improved”.

Doubling of revenue with no increase in fleet size - to me that would suggest just how much hurt the jet operation was facing over the last 12-18 months.

Does this also seem to suggest that Rex’s 737 fleet is unlikely to grow significantly now?

[Australopithecus]

Finally they are getting their ducks in a row. QF has infuriated enough people to fill every Rex jet. If Rex can deliver an actual premium product they can secure real market share. Earlier in this thread I scoffed at Rex's chances, but I wasn’t expecting such wholesale incompetence from Qantas.

[SHVC]

To right punters could very well be handed to to them on a platter.

[Colonel_Klink]

Does anyone have any idea on the stats of people who would be booking domestic flights with a travel agent? As a percentage of total bookings, it’s hard thinking that the number would be too high.

The other issue with the travel agents using Rex is their quite limited schedule and network.

And whilst QFs current treatment of customers really is missing the mark - it’s unlikely that this will be the case over the medium term. Qantas has significant brand loyalty (ask VA and JB) and frequent flyer program not matched by any of its competitors.

[PoppaJo]

Doubling the revenue? What from 30 to 60 bodies. What about the other 120?

I wouldn’t get too excited.

[SOPS]

Finally they are getting their ducks in a row. QF has infuriated enough people to fill every Rex jet. If Rex can deliver an actual premium product they can secure real market share. Earlier in this thread I scoffed at Rex's chances, but I wasn’t expecting such wholesale incompetence from Qantas.

Joyce has achieved his wet dream.. Qantas is now a ULCC that charges very high fares. If Rex can cash in on this and deliver a good product., they should be on a winner.

[MickG0105]

Does anyone have any idea on the stats of people who would be booking domestic flights with a travel agent? As a percentage of total bookings, it’s hard thinking that the number would be too high.

Pre-pandemic, around 10 percent of domestic bookings went through agents. Apparently that increased during the pandemic but the data underpinning that is scrappy, based on reported intentions rather than actual booking numbers. It wouldn't be a significant percentage.

Rex are not going to double pax bookings off the back of the agency deal - that's pie in sky. Notably the announcement did nothing to their share price.

[Colonel_Klink]

Pre-pandemic, around 10 percent of domestic bookings went through agents. Apparently that increased during the pandemic but the data underpinning that is scrappy, based on reported intentions rather than actual booking numbers. It wouldn't be a significant percentage.

Rex are not going to double pax bookings off the back of the agency deal - that's pie in sky. Notably the announcement did nothing to their share price.

Thanks Mick 👍

[Australopithecus]

Well maybe they will manage to double their bookings. As someone mentioned that will still leave 66% of the plane empty. I thought that Flight Centre did a lot of bookings pre covid. I think people would be more likely to book overseas trips with them and may get sold Rex connections as a result. Still no Rex advertising though.

[SHVC]

They don’t have to advertise, QF is getting enough bad PR and ruining themself that ppl just search other carriers and Rex would pop up.

[PoppaJo]

You know they are a business with no idea, when after 3pm today, all Jets bar one are parked and finished for the day. The one day you can charge whatever the hell you want for a seat and people will buy. Passengers would sell one's soul to get a seat this weekend. Gold Coast and Cairns no seats until mid next week on some routes.

Heck you could make a business this weekend just off picking up cancelled pax from the others!

[SHVC]

What were the loads today Poppa?

[PoppaJo]

All players full today including Rex. I heard some flying via NZ to get to a domestic location this weekend, indicates how tight seats are this school holidays kickoff.

[UnderneathTheRadar]

Well maybe they will manage to double their bookings. As someone mentioned that will still leave 66% of the plane empty. I thought that Flight Centre did a lot of bookings pre covid. I think people would be more likely to book overseas trips with them and may get sold Rex connections as a result. Still no Rex advertising though.

Flight Centre is also Corporate Traveller which does a lot of business booking under contract

[MickG0105]

Flight Centre is also Corporate Traveller which does a lot of business booking under contract
Rex runs just four flights a weekday between Sydney and Melbourne; the first doesn't depart until 7am, the next is at 10am then a seven hour hiatus till the 5pm then the last at 8pm. They're not going to be picking up corporate travellers with a threadbare schedule like that.

[SHVC]

JS in the Australian again having a whinge, wanting NSW to re regulate regional routes. Rex must really be struggling if he spending all this energy hating on QF.

[Ladloy]

Good luck to the Saab drivers tomorrow.

[Deano969]

Just looking through some curfew dispensation reports, noticed a couple of REX flights
27 Feb ZL390 SYD-BNE 156 on board
18 March ZL6437 MEL-SYD 147 on board
18 March ZL6437 Coffs-SYD 27 on board SAAB

These don't reflect the single digit to low double digit loads being touted about on here, yes it's just 2 flights, but from what's being posted regularly you would be under the impression that REX are struggling to get to 1/4 full on every flight

https://www.infrastructure.gov.au/sites/default/files/documents/webreport_3_2022.pdf

[Wizofoz]

Just looking through some curfew dispensation reports, noticed a couple of REX flights
27 Feb ZL390 SYD-BNE 156 on board
18 March ZL6437 MEL-SYD 147 on board
18 March ZL6437 Coffs-SYD 27 on board SAAB

These don't reflect the single digit to low double digit loads being touted about on here, yes it's just 2 flights, but from what's being posted regularly you would be under the impression that REX are struggling to get to 1/4 full on every flight

https://www.infrastructure.gov.au/sites/default/files/documents/webreport_3_2022.pdf
They are doing better- seem to have decent oads Friday-Monday.
Given they have a decent product on proven markets against competitors who are pizzing their customers off, they've got a shot.

[PoppaJo]

The test is next week when all holidays come to a end. Another 8 week run until the next bumper holiday period. Perhaps they should be one of those euro like Holiday airlines. They have the cheap fleet to keep a minimal schedule during the off season.

But hey, your right, you could make a business at the moment just servicing Virgin’s cancelled flights alone which is off the charts at the moment

[Low Pass]

How are the saab drivers going with their PIA? Havent heard zilch...

[Hollywood1]

Rex trading halted on the ASX? What's going on here?

[KAPAC]

Rex to buy cobhams FIFO ?

[SHVC]

Article in the review yesterday they were in the top running, PAG was willing to finance trading was halted and an announcement followed. They seem very keen on the FIFO contract. Announcement acknowledged the article but no offer was made, let’s see.

as for their loads, well if they don’t even have half full during holiday periods then they never will SY has been full line ups for coffee are insane and security just as bad. If their loads fall back to 10-50 like before peak then they’re just the airline ppl book when the others are full.

[pinkpanther1]

From the Australian:

Regional Express is set to announce the purchase of Cobham Aviation’s fly-in fly-out airline business as soon as Friday. Rex shares were placed in a trading halt on Wednesday ahead of a likely announcement later this week. The stock last traded at $1.22 and has fallen about 13 per cent this year. Cobham’s FIFO business accounts for just under 20 per cent of the Australian market for transporting miners and gas workers to sites across the nation. The dominant player in the FIFO space is Qantas, combined with Alliance Aviation. Qantas currently owns 20 per cent of Alliance and is seeking regulatory permission to buy the outstanding shares. Together, the two account for about 70 per cent of the market. Virgin Australia accounts for about five per cent of the FIFO market through its VARA unit. For Rex, this purchase gives it a clear scope and direction. During Covid-19, the regional airline declared it would seek a bigger share of domestic city routes but directly taking on incumbents Qantas and Virgin was always going to be a challenge. Rex is not entirely giving up on that dream, but through the purchase of Cobham, it is able to carve out a big chunk of the high-yielding FIFO market, giving it a strong point of difference from some of its competitors. It is believed Cobham’s FIFO business had revenues of between $130-$150m last year, about half of Rex’s normal revenue in a non-pandemic year. The purchase price would likely be under $100m. David Porter, Macquarie Capital’s head of infrastructure, is advising on the sale of Cobham’s FIFO business and its other assets. Rex and Singaporean investor Lim Kim Hai, the airline’s chairman, will each fund half the acquisition, resulting in a joint venture arrangement. The Cobham FIFO unit, trading as National Jet Express, operates out of Perth, where it has its own terminal facilities, along with Adelaide. It also provides freight services in Melbourne, Brisbane, Gold Coast, Sydney and Adelaide. Rex is Australia’s largest regional airline, with six Boeing 737-800s and 60 Saab 340s. Through the acquisition of the Cobham unit, it will also have eight Bombardier Q400s and six Embraer E190s. A Rex spokesman declined to comment. The FIFO market is attractive to domestic airlines because it is often more profitable than metropolitan routes, excluding Sydney to Melbourne. In May, Qantas offered more than $600m in an all-scrip deal for the shares it does not already own in Alliance. The Australian Competition and Consumer Commission is due to hand down its findings on that takeover as early as next month. The ACCC noted at the time of the takeover announcement Qantas and Alliance overlapped in the supply of charter services to corporate clients and also for regular passenger transport. It took the ACCC several years to approve – after the event – Qantas’s purchase of the 19.9 per cent initial stake. It’s expected that Rex and Virgin – which has FIFO contracts with Alliance – will have both made submissions on the takeover.

[hoss58]

Just looking through some curfew dispensation reports, noticed a couple of REX flights
27 Feb ZL390 SYD-BNE 156 on board
18 March ZL6437 MEL-SYD 147 on board
18 March ZL6437 Coffs-SYD 27 on board SAAB

These don't reflect the single digit to low double digit loads being touted about on here, yes it's just 2 flights, but from what's being posted regularly you would be under the impression that REX are struggling to get to 1/4 full on every flight

https://www.infrastructure.gov.au/sites/default/files/documents/webreport_3_2022.pdf



And herein lies the problem.

These three flights averaged 110 punters. Based on a 180 seat aircraft that's a load factor of 61% and I would be surprised if that was anywhere near break even much less making any money although I don't have access to that data.

So even if REX have several flights with good loads it only takes one or two low double digit flights to undo any gains made.
I just don't see the numbers adding up at this stage.

Fly safe and play hard.

Cheers Hoss

[Deano969]

And herein lies the problem.

These three flights averaged 110 punters. Based on a 180 seat aircraft that's a load factor of 61% and I would be surprised if that was anywhere near break even much less making any money although I don't have access to that data.

So even if REX have several flights with good loads it only takes one or two low double digit flights to undo any gains made.
I just don't see the numbers adding up at this stage.

Fly safe and play hard.

Cheers Hoss
Your math is flawed
The average of the 2 x 737 flights listed is 151.5
The third flight was Coffs to SYD (SAAB)

Further
REX's 737s are not 180 seats, try 174
So closer to 88% on the 2 mentioned flights
27 out of 34 for the SAAB 80%

I realize that these are just 3 flights however, I am yet to see any posted figures here or anywhere else, just random guesses here and there

[blubak]

Your math is flawed
The average of the 2 x 737 flights listed is 151.5
The third flight was Coffs to SYD (SAAB)

Further
REX's 737s are not 180 seats, try 174
So closer to 88% on the 2 mentioned flights
27 out of 34 for the SAAB 80%

I realize that these are just 3 flights however, I am yet to see any posted figures here or anywhere else, just random guesses here and there
Spoke to somebody this morning who did the ool-mel flight with Rex yesterday & said was almost if not full.
She commented on the great service & how the crew were so friendly.

[MickG0105]

Your math is flawed


Further
REX's 737s are not 180 seats, try 174

176; 8 J, 168 Y.


I realize that these are just 3 flights however, I am yet to see any posted figures here or anywhere else, just random guesses here and there
PoppaJo has regularly posted reliable data on the load factors for Rex's jets.

The Australian newspaper carried out a fairly detailed review of 35 Rex jet flights between Sydney, Brisbane, Melbourne and the Gold Coast between 29 May - 2 June inclusive. The average load was 56 pax (as few as 7 on one SYD-OOL flight, a high of 113 on a MEL-BNE flight). Average load factor was 32 percent. Notably Rex didn't dispute the numbers when they were put to them.

[PoppaJo]

Everything looks full this week. Holidays, sports, cancelled flights from the others, if you could strap people to the wings you would probably get takers. That’s how tough it is to get a seat at the moment. Some routes are still no seats until mid next week. Reports of some people getting creative travelling via Asia to get to a domestic port for a urgent event.

As I said, come back next week when the all this demand tapers away.

[Ladloy]

Rex has acquired the part of Cobham. To those working in that business fight the good fight. Your wages will be the first thing they go for.

[PoppaJo]

Party funded by PAG, so now gives them an exit option for its 737 adventure. Simply move it out west and sign some new contracts. It’s a no brainer really. Why burn money for eternity on the east coast when one can get guaranteed revenue out west.

[43Inches]

Or you could take it that PAG is happy with current progress and has deep pockets and there is more to come... When it comes to long term strategies, footholds, even loss making are just ledges to settle down and get the product right, some call it launch pads, ie establish, consolidate, assess, and then push hard for market share when the timing and product is right.

[SHVC]

Where does LKH get this! “Crying out” haha please show me a quote from a mining companies for that please! does he realize he will be carting around ppl that dig big big holes and destruct the environment. I don’t think these companies care what jets are operated just as long as they turn up on time.

“I believe that NJE’s modern aircraft fleet and its long-term customer relationships overlayed with Rex’s proven record of safety, reliability and cost efficiencies would propel NJE to be the premier FIFO operator in Australia. NJE will naturally be the partner of choice for resource companies all over Australia who have been crying out for so long for a FIFO provider that is able to address their triple priorities of minimal impact on the environment, comfort and safety of its staff and reliability of service.”

[43Inches]

You'll always get corporate spin of why they are best... That's not surprising, its a speech with marketing firmly in mind.

[Stationair8]

Does this include the BAE-146 freight operations?

The ASX press release mentions freight operations, but no mention of the BAE-146.

The Ansett syndrome at REX group, B737, Saab 340, Dash8 -400, E190, Bae-146, Beech 200, Beech 350, Pilatus PC-24 and various Piper training aircraft.

[MickG0105]

Or you could take it that PAG is happy with current progress and has deep pockets and there is more to come...
PAG haven't put up any more money for this. They have allowed Rex to draw down something like $15 million from the $75 million that remains undrawn from the 2021 $150 million convertible note facility, with Rex contributing around $9 million from 'its own cash resources'. You can possibly read something into the fact that the NJS acquisition is being 50 percent funded by a group of JV partners headed by LKH. Apart from anything else the deal seems to be structured around keeping Rex's balance sheet above water.

[Paragraph377]

Does this include the BAE-146 freight operations?

The ASX press release mentions freight operations, but no mention of the BAE-146.

The Ansett syndrome at REX group, B737, Saab 340, Dash8 -400, E190, Bae-146, Beech 200, Beech 350, Pilatus PC-24 and various Piper training aircraft.

Very astute post and spot on. Has John Sharp been drinking Sir Peter Abele’s Koolaid? Multi aircraft types for an airline as small as REX raises the risks stake. I would assume that there is a strong business case for the purchase. Considering how the 737 startup decision has thus far been a failure, I hope REX used a different risk matrix this time!

[Stationair8]

The freight carried in the BAE-146, is that for Qantas on behalf of Australia post?

So who will REX buy next, AirNorth?

[Bell Man]

Rex has acquired the part of Cobham. To those working in that business fight the good fight. Your wages will be the first thing they go for.

It will be a **** sandwich guaranteed..

Another career change imminent 🤬🤬🤬🤬 Not the first time!

[hillbillybob]

Cobham have been using the Q400 sim in Brisbane.

Rex and Qantas get along so famously...

what next for training?

[Going Nowhere]

Possibly use these guys...

https://www.afap.org.au/pilot-jobs/pilot-job/3919/DHC8%20Q400%20Contract%20Training%20%20Checking%20Captain

[Low Pass]

Havent heard jack from the lads or media how the PIA is going. Anyword or impact? No ties only goes so far......
Got money for a FIFO airline purchase but not a few dollars for the crew.....what a dump

[itchy_feet]

Possibly use these guys...

https://www.afap.org.au/pilot-jobs/pilot-job/3919/DHC8%20Q400%20Contract%20Training%20%20Checking%20Captain

They still use the Brisbane sim!

[itchy_feet]

Cobham have been using the Q400 sim in Brisbane.

Rex and Qantas get along so famously...

what next for training?

With QF soon to own Alliance then what about the E190 Sim?

More than likely back to Sims overseas….

[cloudsurfng]

Don’t forget the only thing that matters to the ‘management’ at qantas is money in their own pockets. If they increase money in their pockets by continuing to sell sim time to Rex, then that’s what they’ll do, regardless of any animosity between the two businesses.

[Going Nowhere]

VA currently use the Rex Sim in BNE

[AmarokGTI]

Havent heard jack from the lads or media how the PIA is going. Anyword or impact? No ties only goes so far......
Got money for a FIFO airline purchase but not a few dollars for the crew.....what a dump

Update was sent to crew today - good process. Union advised crew to cease Tankering Ban immediately.

[Low Pass]

Update was sent to crew today - good process. Union advised crew to cease Tankering Ban immediately.

Thanks for the update! Glad its working

[davidclarke]

The freight carried in the BAE-146, is that for Qantas on behalf of Australia post?

So who will REX buy next, AirNorth?


The cobham 146 Freighters do operate on behalf of Qantas Freight for Aus post. It will be interesting to see if Qantas renew this contract once under Rex ownership. I feel as though QF freight won’t have a choice, given these are the only aircraft allowed a long term exemption for the Sydney curfew.

[Going Nowhere]

The cobham 146 Freighters do operate on behalf of Qantas Freight for Aus post. It will be interesting to see if Qantas renew this contract once under Rex ownership. I feel as though QF freight won’t have a choice, given these are the only aircraft allowed a long term exemption for the Sydney curfew.

Pionair just picked up an extra 3 146’s and already do work for QF Freight so there’s probably already a Plan B in place.

[DanV2]

Airnorth are already flying on behalf of VA on some Qld routes using their E190s (leased from Alliance), such as BNE-TSV.

[aussieflyboy]

Airnorth are already flying on behalf of VA on some Qld routes using their E190s (leased from Alliance), such as BNE-TSV.

So Airnorth crew are flying an Alliance plane with Virgin Passengers?

[Hollywood1]

So Airnorth crew are flying an Alliance plane with Virgin Passengers?

So Airnorth crew are flying an Alliance plane with Virgin Passengers in a thread about Rex ... now I'm really confused!

[pinkpanther1]

So Airnorth crew are flying an Alliance plane with Virgin Passengers in a thread about Rex ... now I'm really confused!

So Airnorth crew are flying an Alliance plane, 20% Owned by Qantas operated by Bravo Airlines with Virgin Passengers in a thread about Rex ... now I'm really REALLY confused!

[SHVC]

I didn’t see too many get off in OOL yesterday, are they returning to pre holiday loads already on the 73?

[Ladloy]

I didn’t see too many get off in OOL yesterday, are they returning to pre holiday loads already on the 73?
The OOL flights are supposed to be the heavier of all the loads too.

[PoppaJo]

Numbers have not fallen away. Yet.

However they are not really flying many flights at the moment, ie into Gold Coast only two flights a day. Between the same two cities Virgin has 20. Even Tiger was about 8 a day.

[hoss58]

Your math is flawed
The average of the 2 x 737 flights listed is 151.5
The third flight was Coffs to SYD (SAAB)

Further
REX's 737s are not 180 seats, try 174
So closer to 88% on the 2 mentioned flights
27 out of 34 for the SAAB 80%

I realize that these are just 3 flights however, I am yet to see any posted figures here or anywhere else, just random guesses here and there

Hi Deano.

Actually my math is pretty good however i need to make my self read things properly.

So point taken re the third flight being a SAAB.

But I still stand by my comment and that is when an airline like REX operate relatively few flights per day it only takes a couple of low loads to bring down
the averages for the rest of the fights to below break even and you can't make money like that. It appears their loads over the holiday period have been ok
however Poppajo's data seem to show that overall the loads aren't great.

Fly safe and play hard.

Cheers Hoss

[Deano969]

Hi Deano.

Actually my math is pretty good however i need to make my self read things properly.

So point taken re the third flight being a SAAB.

But I still stand by my comment and that is when an airline like REX operate relatively few flights per day it only takes a couple of low loads to bring down
the averages for the rest of the fights to below break even and you can't make money like that. It appears their loads over the holiday period have been ok
however Poppajo's data seem to show that overall the loads aren't great.

Fly safe and play hard.

Cheers Hoss

What data from Poppajo ?
Seems he has only posted a few estimates but no actual numbers....
Estimating heads on or off a random flight here and there is not data

[PoppaJo]

The software that I and it seems the media also use in that article, are exact. Sure I do park alongside them at times and we play count the passengers. Not exact as you say, give for take 5 bodies perhaps.

The data doesn't lie. The numbers March to June, May especially was beyond a disaster, the media in the above article already skimmed the numbers. Bit hard to judge at the moment they are not exactly flying a heavy schedule.

The flights are full at the moment. Now they need to try and convert that to a 10-12 aircraft operation. And go on from there. They will never get to 30, Tiger started to implode on many fronts at about 18 and then went backwards. Rex will face the same operational headwinds as the operation is capital city based.

The threat for Rex, is if Bonza pulls out Plan B when the Plan A fantasy falls apart, which would be operate what Tiger did. Bonza and Rex overlapping would spell the end for RexJet.

[Wizofoz]

The software that I and it seems the media also use in that article, are exact. Sure I do park alongside them at times and we play count the passengers. Not exact as you say, give for take 5 bodies perhaps.

The data doesn't lie. The numbers March to June, May especially was beyond a disaster, the media in the above article already skimmed the numbers. Bit hard to judge at the moment they are not exactly flying a heavy schedule.

The flights are full at the moment. Now they need to try and convert that to a 10-12 aircraft operation. And go on from there. They will never get to 30, Tiger started to implode on many fronts at about 18 and then went backwards. Rex will face the same operational headwinds as the operation is capital city based.

The threat for Rex, is if Bonza pulls out Plan B when the Plan A fantasy falls apart, which would be operate what Tiger did. Bonza and Rex overlapping would spell the end for RexJet.
Tiger went backward when Virgin saddled them with a two-type fleet and horrendous expenses converting to 737s that then didn't materialise. I don't think over capacity was a problem.

[Deano969]

The software that I and it seems the media also use in that article, are exact. Sure I do park alongside them at times and we play count the passengers. Not exact as you say, give for take 5 bodies perhaps.

The data doesn't lie. The numbers March to June, May especially was beyond a disaster, the media in the above article already skimmed the numbers. Bit hard to judge at the moment they are not exactly flying a heavy schedule.

The flights are full at the moment. Now they need to try and convert that to a 10-12 aircraft operation. And go on from there. They will never get to 30, Tiger started to implode on many fronts at about 18 and then went backwards. Rex will face the same operational headwinds as the operation is capital city based.

The threat for Rex, is if Bonza pulls out Plan B when the Plan A fantasy falls apart, which would be operate what Tiger did. Bonza and Rex overlapping would spell the end for RexJet.

Jo, if you have data, why not post it....
Most on here lay the boot into REX and I have a suspicion that many are looking at a few quiet flights and hitting the multiplier button for their full schedule

Pax are having good to great experiences on REX
On time is the highest of all airlines, by a long way
They are still adding the odd SAAB to their fleet
They have taken over Cobham
They are adapting to the war with QF by getting out of low earning regional destinations and replacing them with the likes of Port Maq, Coffs and Devonport and getting good loads
They are gradually increasing bums on seats with their jets
Wouldn't worry about Bonza hurting REX as they will look at places like Avalon and SWA and likely cram 189 into their MAX's for $60-$80 legs +++++
They only lack FFPs and decent lounges
FFPs could be a quick fix with 7-11 and IGA

[SHVC]

Pax are having good to great experiences on REX
On time is the highest of all airlines, by a long way


You can not compare their 73 OTP to QF, JQ and VA. Managing 4 flights a day to 4 ports is a piece of pi$$, he’ll I could manage it from an iPhone.

[Icarus2001]

They have taken over Cobham Wow that is a big call. I think you mean they bought FROM Cobham ONE of their business units called NJE.

https://www.cobham.com.au/

They are gradually increasing bums on seats with their jets

Ummmm, Tiger Australia were doing that also.

They only lack FFPs and decent lounges

What about checked bagged through to a destination? Multiple flights a day to effect a service recovery?

[Jack D. Ripper]

Loving the pedanticism.

I think the point is clear, REX are not in the toilet.

Whilst not a fan of their antics or Chairman, it would seem they are hanging in there and responding as needed. Despite the wishes of some, it would seem they are not going anywhere, at least for now.

Of more interest to me is where we are going to end up:

QF buys Alliance, completes Mainline, Regional and Charter piece.
REX now Mainline, Regional and Charter.
VA, Mainline and Charter only.

Given VA have some 33% of the market, there is a question here on their regional strategy?

Partner with REX?
Greenfields?
Partner with smaller players (Skytrans, Airline, AirNorth etc.)

[tossbag]

It is what it is. I've travelled with them and it was one of the better travel experiences. Their management are complete wankas, but hang on, qantas management are bigger wankas and virgin management are psychopaths. So what are you gunna do?

[Deano969]

You can not compare their 73 OTP to QF, JQ and VA. Managing 4 flights a day to 4 ports is a piece of pi$$, he’ll I could manage it from an iPhone.
Numbers were across the the whole REX group, a tad more than 4 flights a day

Of the regional airlines, Rex recorded 80% for on time arrivals, followed by QantasLink at 59.6% and Virgin Australia Regional Airlines at 51.3%.

[SHVC]

Numbers were across the the whole REX group, a tad more than 4 flights a day

Of the regional airlines, Rex recorded 80% for on time arrivals, followed by QantasLink at 59.6% and Virgin Australia Regional Airlines at 51.3%.
like I wrote, OTP for the 737 op as mentioned earlier.

[Trevor the lover]

I actually pity someone like P Joe who's hobby or interest in life is gathering data, or counting passengers, on opposition airlines. Geez mate, go to work, fly your tub then go home. Let Rex worry about their loads. Not sure why you gather joy out of your weird hobby.

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

Wow that is a big call. I think you mean they bought FROM Cobham ONE of their business units called NJE.
To be fair, it was headlined a lot as Rex buys Cobham.

[Servo]

I actually pity someone like P Joe who's hobby or interest in life is gathering data, or counting passengers, on opposition airlines. Geez mate, go to work, fly your tub then go home. Let Rex worry about their loads. Not sure why you gather joy out of your weird hobby.

If it is his hobby, then so be it. Nothing wrong with that. As pilots we are far to quick to judge others in this profession. No wonder we are divided and easy to manipulate with management.

I have a mate, 737 Captain, that comes home from work and then jumps on Microsoft Flight Simulator and does more flying. Not my cup of tea, but he enjoys it and that is all that matters. How people spend their free time should not be anyone else's business and certainly not worthy of your comment.

[PoppaJo]

I reckon I spend 2 mins a month checking Rex loads via an App available in the industry. And because people ask on here, but mainly to put to bed claims from John Sharp that everything is rainbows and lollipops over in Rex 737 land. He throws mud at us and tells us how good it is over there, I wasted 60 seconds of my time fact checking these claims.

Have you not played count the Rex 737 pax whilst parked next to them? I have scored a few free coffees from my FO with this gem. Closest to number wins and the loser shouts a free coffee. Generally aim below 10 and more than 0, possibly including zero.

[Deano969]

So long as they are getting better loads that Q Link has been on Melbourne to Mount Gambia and Wagga :E

[cloudsurfng]

I reckon I spend 2 mins a month checking Rex loads via an App available in the industry. And because people ask on here, but mainly to put to bed claims from John Sharp that everything is rainbows and lollipops over in Rex 737 land. He throws mud at us and tells us how good it is over there, I wasted 60 seconds of my time fact checking these claims.

Have you not played count the Rex 737 pax whilst parked next to them? I have scored a few free coffees from my FO with this gem. Closest to number wins and the loser shouts a free coffee. Generally aim below 10 and more than 0, possibly including zero.

cheap bast*&d…poor FO’s have been stood down for 2 years and you’re skimming coffees. :p

[PoppaJo]

Haha. My FO guessed 10..I being a tad more realistic guessed 5. It was actually 3 so I won. Gotta aim low folks. I guess if you include crew he won.

[SHVC]

So long as they are getting better loads that Q Link has been on Melbourne to Mount Gambia and Wagga :E

They don’t have to worry about those loads anymore, they’re pulling out of both 1st August.

[1A_Please]

Given VA have some 33% of the market, there is a question here on their regional strategy?

Partner with REX?
Greenfields?
Partner with smaller players (Skytrans, Airline, AirNorth etc.)
Jack D. Ripper is online now
I think VA's regional strategy is no regional strategy. Apart from FIFO which is a very Australian opportunity, VA is operating very much from the disciplined Southwest playbook with a single fleet operating trunk routes.

FFPs could be a quick fix with 7-11 and IGA
You do realise 7-11 is already in a well publicised alliance with Virgin??

[DanV2]

I think VA's regional strategy is no regional strategy. Apart from FIFO which is a very Australian opportunity, VA is operating very much from the disciplined Southwest playbook with a single fleet operating trunk routes.

Regional seems to be an add-on (an afterthought) for VA 2.0. Apart from Link (regional NSW) and AirNorth (regional Qld) operating some regional routes for VA 2.0, most of the regional work is on VA mainline's 738s.

There are also some residue Alliance contract work leftover such as BNE-GLT, BNE-Moranbah, BNE-NTL and BNE-ROK. It'll be interesting to see what VA will replace those with, should the ACCC clear the QF takeover of Alliance.

VARA's A320s also does some intra-WA RPT work, as well as some PER-ADL and PER-DRW rotations

[markis10]

I wouldn’t be surprised if Link pickup more QLD routes and look at bringing in some cheap SAAB 2000s

[Deano969]

Need 3 airlines in this country
QL, Link, JQ (budget arm of QF nothing more)
VA, VAR / Link / Alliance (regionals)
REX mainline and regional, they ain't going away..... Just had a couple of wins over Link in Wagga and Mt Gambier

[Ladloy]

Need 3 airlines in this country
QL, Link, JQ (budget arm of QF nothing more)
VA, VAR / Link / Alliance (regionals)
REX mainline and regional, they ain't going away..... Just had a couple of wins over Link in Wagga and Mt Gambier
Rex and Qlink won't have any crew soon enough.

[dijical]

REX announces (https://rex.com.au/BlobViewer/BlobViewer.aspx?attachtype=MR&filename=68496F3871736C36414A457749396E674A4C2F6234396165377 870345A4E48526178375564577538326A527043572B54626D3155425A497 05451597958324776) Sydney - Adelaide flights.

The new Adelaide-Sydney route is made possible by the imminent arrival of two additional aircraft which will increase Rex’s domestic fleet to nine Boeing 737-800NGs

[DanV2]

The two incoming 737 aircraft for REX are leased directly from Singapore Airlines.
9V-MGA and MGB were originally delivered to SilkAir before being painted into SQ colours (after SilkAir was merged into SQ mainline).

[Deano969]

Next route ?
ADL PER
ADL BNE
More Triangle

[Ladloy]

Next route ?
ADL PER
ADL BNE
More Triangle
which routes will they cut due to insufficient staff?

[smiling monkey]

Next route ?
ADL PER
ADL BNE
More Triangle
ADL - SYD announced today.

[Ken Borough]

I saw in another forum a very interesting question about Rex. The poster asked if Rex actually grows markets or simply cannibalises existing markets in relation to Rex introducing their jet services on Capital City routes.

[SHVC]

Their heart is not really on the country is it. Cutting regional routes to bolster city pairings.

[Wizofoz]

I saw in another forum a very interesting question about Rex. The poster asked if Rex actually grows markets or simply cannibalises existing markets in relation to Rex introducing their jet services on Capital City routes.

Demand grows markets, supply adjusts to meet demand. Domestic demand has skyrocketed over the last decades and continues to grow- is there a reason only two operators are allowed to benefit from that growth? Do they have an inalienable right to the business they have, or is competition a thing?

[PoppaJo]

Domestic demand has been fairly flat for the last decade. 58-61m passengers domestically each year, and it hasn’t really moved since 2013.

2008-2013 the market had large gains with the introduction of Tiger Airways and Jetstar growing its local fleet, alongside the Virgin/Qantas capacity war.

Rex has likely picked up some of the Tiger share. Otherwise everyone is just talking traffic of each other. Remains to be seen where the numbers sit today and the coming years, obviously a whole heap of demand at the moment, will be interesting to see how far north of 60m passengers we currently sit at.

[43Inches]

I saw in another forum a very interesting question about Rex. The poster asked if Rex actually grows markets or simply cannibalises existing markets in relation to Rex introducing their jet services on Capital City routes.

Cannibalism was used in regard to Jetstar, QLink and such eating away at it's own company market share from the mother company on a lower cost base as an industrial device/wedge. Not sure how Rex is eating into it's own market share when it only has itself and no subsidiaries in each of it's markets. I think the correct term would be that Rex is relying on taking over existing market share rather than generating it's own, which is correct to a point for every airline that enters into competition rather than creating new routes. They would definitely be taking back some on carriage of regional passengers that connect from the country and possibly getting new custom from others that wanted connections but only had other options.

Sounds more like somebody trying to flip the QF issues onto Rex.

As opposed to Bonza who is taking a gamble on the smaller markets to try and generate new markets, Rex is competing in what is a competitive but established market that is subject to customers who are willing to try other products.

[PoppaJo]

What’s the go with this pic doing the rounds re someone parking a van next to a then starting prop?

[Captn Rex Havack]

SHVC - how does Rex cancel regional routes to bolster city pairings? Do the SAAB guys on the regional routes just trot over into a 737 seat?

[KRUSTY 34]

SHVC - how does Rex cancel regional routes to bolster city pairings? Do the SAAB guys on the regional routes just trot over into a 737 seat?

Slots Maybe?

[SHVC]

SHVC - how does Rex cancel regional routes to bolster city pairings? Do the SAAB guys on the regional routes just trot over into a 737 seat?

I don’t know!

But, my comment was related to Rex cutting back regional routes on the SAAB but increasing the 737 operation. Not using the 73 on SAAB routes. Hence my comment their heart is not in the country anymore.

[Ken Borough]

Slots Maybe?

Slots used by regional services are supposed to be ring-fenced at Sydney.

[Deano969]

Regional slots have to maintain their regional status
Eg a SAAB CFS slot can be transferred to a 737 to CFS but not to a 737 to BNE
Interestingly if REX wanted to run a SAAB to BNE instead of CFS, they would not be permitted to transfer the slot

If REX wanted to get creative
They could run
SYD-CFS-BNE on a 737 using a regional slot

[juliusg]

ADL - SYD announced today.
If Rex adds Perth, even thru Adelaide, we will fly it. Because then business class will be competitive.

[tossbag]

The REX 737 op is quite good, you'd take it over QF or VB any day.

[Ladloy]

Some interesting stats I've heard.

Over 90 Saab pilots have resigned this FY, about a third of the workforce.
Over 20 jet pilots have resigned also
Not confirmed figures but theres up to 20 saabs parked on the east coast with no available engines or props.

Positive news ( if you consider the conditions positive). The jet pilots are getting a 5%ish increase in pay due to fairwork and the award. There's also a good chance the minimum wage increase will eclipse the first year FO pay on the saab. What a great place to work!

[dijical]

MEDIA RELEASE
HOBART, HERE WE COME!
The airline today announced daily flights between Melbourne and Hobart will begin on 17 August.

Hobart is the second new destination Rex has announced in recent days, as it added two more Boeing 737s to its fleet. Last week the airline said it would begin direct Adelaide-Sydney flights on 29 June.

The flight schedule will be perfect for holiday-makers with the flights from Melbourne departing at 12.15 pm and arriving in Hobart at 1.30 pm. The return Hobart-Melbourne service will take off at 2.15 pm and touch down in Melbourne 75 minutes later. This schedule will provide good connections for flights to and from Sydney, Adelaide and Brisbane.

[Icarus2001]

The jet pilots are getting a 5%ish increase in pay due to fairwork and the award. There's also a good chance the minimum wage increase will eclipse the first year FO pay on the saab.

Another way to view that news is that the wages are so low that they increase due to safety net low wage increases in MINIMUM wages such as the Air Pilots Award,
Very sad in a time of huge demand for experienced pilots.

[Deano969]

MEDIA RELEASE
HOBART, HERE WE COME!
The airline today announced daily flights between Melbourne and Hobart will begin on 17 August.

Hobart is the second new destination Rex has announced in recent days, as it added two more Boeing 737s to its fleet. Last week the airline said it would begin direct Adelaide-Sydney flights on 29 June.

The flight schedule will be perfect for holiday-makers with the flights from Melbourne departing at 12.15 pm and arriving in Hobart at 1.30 pm. The return Hobart-Melbourne service will take off at 2.15 pm and touch down in Melbourne 75 minutes later. This schedule will provide good connections for flights to and from Sydney, Adelaide and Brisbane.

Did not see that coming

[Colonel_Klink]

Another way to view that news is that the wages are so low that they increase due to safety net low wage increases in MINIMUM wages such as the Air Pilots Award,
Very sad in a time of huge demand for experienced pilots.

What is even sadder is under the proposed Rex 737 EA, the Company are trying to tie a pilots rate of productivity pay above the overtime threshold to the Load Factor of the jet operation.

So if you did 10 hours overtime last month, you need to wait until the load factors are released to figure out how much you are paid, and for Captains that can vary up to $100 an hour.

A new low in the way pilots are paid in this country?

[smiling monkey]

What is even sadder is under the proposed Rex 737 EA, the Company are trying to tie a pilots rate of productivity pay above the overtime threshold to the Load Factor of the jet operation.

So if you did 10 hours overtime last month, you need to wait until the load factors are released to figure out how much you are paid, and for Captains that can vary up to $100 an hour.

A new low in the way pilots are paid in this country?

Absolutely considering pilots have little control over the load factors. That's a marketing KPI; not flight operations!

[Icarus2001]

Brilliant strategy. Tie the productivity allowance to something you have no control over.

[SIUYA]

I wonder if this 'decision' was also part of the REX marketing KPIs?

Rex Airlines skips scheduled Monkey Mia stop mid-flight, leaving passengers stranded - ABC News (https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-06-08/rex-airline-flight-fails-to-make-scheduled-monkey-mia-stop/102450024)

According to the article, a Rex Airlines spokesperson '...did not respond to detailed questions, including why the decision was made not to stop at Monkey Mia or what support was offered to passengers at the time.'REX issued this statement:

With regards to individual incidents, Rex is not in a position to comment on the regulated routes of which Monkey Mia/Carnarvon is one. Such matters are regularly discussed at the community consultative group held by the Department of Transport and we believe that is the right forum to be raising these questions.

The mind boggles.

[PoppaJo]

What is even sadder is under the proposed Rex 737 EA, the Company are trying to tie a pilots rate of productivity pay above the overtime threshold to the Load Factor of the jet operation.

So if you did 10 hours overtime last month, you need to wait until the load factors are released to figure out how much you are paid, and for Captains that can vary up to $100 an hour.

A new low in the way pilots are paid in this country?
The way it works in that place, is every dollar paid to a Jet Pilot over the award is a dollar too much.

[SOPS]

The WA government has been questioning the reliability of REX on certain routes in the state, recently.

[SHVC]

I think it seems obvious Rex will be exiting most regional markets only maintaining QLD due contract obligations. The departure of crews and the aging SAAB fleet is forcing their hand. I’d put $10 on it they will only be focusing on the jet operation moving forward.

[Icarus2001]

The great unknown is how they will use NJE.

[Saintly]

I wonder what will happen if Rex no longer shows interest in regards to the Monkey Mia and Carnarvon routes once their agreement/contract expires.

Who would take over? Skippers???Well Skippers already had a go at it from I think 2011 to 2015 (or 2016) from memory.

Would Skippers be interested again and if not, then who?

Ahh the days of Skywest, at least we had constant and consistent stability and reliability.

[Deano969]

I wonder what will happen if Rex no longer shows interest in regards to the Monkey Mia and Carnarvon routes once their agreement/contract expires.

Who would take over? Skippers???Well Skippers already had a go at it from I think 2011 to 2015 (or 2016) from memory.

Would Skippers be interested again and if not, then who?

Ahh the days of Skywest, at least we had constant and consistent stability and reliability.

Nexus...

[Saintly]

Nexus...

Can a Dash 8-400 land at MJK and CVQ, I'm not so sure?? Also due to the size of aircraft, they'll need to have securty screening for pax too etc.

[PoppaJo]

I was wondering what happened to those unaudited profits they had been releasing to the market each month…seems like no longer making money.

Rex has called a halt to trading on the ASX pending an announcement by the airline, which currently has a third of its regional fleet parked. 19 of Rex’s 58 Saab 340s are out of action, which deputy chairman John Sharp attributed to logistics and supply issues.
The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/rex-calls-asx-trading-halt-as-concerns-grow-over-regional-fleet/news-story/ea3a798a98a92774aed8726b399ca596?amp&nk=1ce83c9c5f2448c4abca694f84262b4d-1687165945)

[Badengo]

Can a Dash 8-400 land at MJK and CVQ, I'm not so sure?? Also due to the size of aircraft, they'll need to have securty screening for pax too etc.

Pavement concession would be needed, but easily obtained from the shire.
No screening needed for the -400.

[NaFenn]

Pavement concession would be needed, but easily obtained from the shire.
No screening needed for the -400.
Screening is needed for the Q400 if it is an open charter or RPT. Any aircraft with more than 40 seats engaged in RPT or an Open Charter (where the general public can buy tickets) must be screened. Its not required for closed charters (Like mining charters with NJE)

Based on the size of the apron at Monkey Mia I highly doubt a Q400 would fit, but I have been proven wrong before.

[Badengo]

Screening is needed for the Q400 if it is an open charter or RPT. Any aircraft with more than 40 seats engaged in RPT or an Open Charter (where the general public can buy tickets) must be screened. Its not required for closed charters (Like mining charters with NJE)

Based on the size of the apron at Monkey Mia I highly doubt a Q400 would fit, but I have been proven wrong before.

More than 40 people?? Nope, other WA operators that do RPT do not screen on 50 seat aircraft, the 400 also does not require.

The apron is big enough, but maybe the WA tax payer can pay for upgrades just like they did when REX arrived with low wing aircraft and needed modifications at each airport….

[Going Nowhere]

There are now 4 categories of airports as far as security goes. The change happened a few years ago.

AVIATION TRANSPORT SECURITY REGULATIONS 2005 - REG 3.01B Categories of security controlled airports (http://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/legis/cth/consol_reg/atsr2005457/s3.01b.html)

Can't find where they are defined but I believe it has something do with annual passenger numbers.

QLink in QLD routinely operate their Q400's into ports which are deemed 'unscreened' and the passengers are bussed to a specific gate in BNE where they exit the terminal directly to a landside location.

[Lead Balloon]

4.02 Meaning of screened air service

(2) An operation of an aircraft is a screened air service if:

(a) all of the following apply in relation to the operation:

(i) the operation is a regular public transport operation or an open charter operation;

(ii) the aircraft has a seating capacity of 40 or more persons;

(iii) the operation operates from a designated airport or a tier 1 or tier 2 security controlled airport; or

(b) all of the following apply in relation to the operation:

(i) the operation operates from a designated airport;

(ii) the aircraft departs from the same apron as an aircraft (the other aircraft) that is operating a screened air service to which paragraph (a) applies;

(iii) the aircraft is scheduled to depart within the operational period of the other aircraft.

(3) For subregulation (2):

apron, for an airport, means an apron described in the document accompanying the TSP of an operator of a security controlled airport in accordance with subregulation 2.13(1B).

Looks to me like the only way in which an RPT or open charter operation in an aircraft with a seating capacity of 40 or more persons can escape being a 'screened air service' is if it operates from an airport that is neither a designated nor Tier 1 nor Tier 2 nor Tier 3 security controlled airport. (But, as with most of aviation in Australia, there are probably exemptions buried somewhere.)

[markis10]

There are now 4 categories of airports as far as security goes. The change happened a few years ago.

AVIATION TRANSPORT SECURITY REGULATIONS 2005 - REG 3.01B Categories of security controlled airports (http://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/legis/cth/consol_reg/atsr2005457/s3.01b.html)

Can't find where they are defined but I believe it has something do with annual passenger numbers.

QLink in QLD routinely operate their Q400's into ports which are deemed 'unscreened' and the passengers are bussed to a specific gate in BNE where they exit the terminal directly to a landside location.

Home Affairs changed the requirements for aircraft over 20000mtow, basically it’s over 40 seats at airports with 30000 departing passengers a year.

[dejapoo]

Oh gawwd this security crap has been discussed for years. It's beyond irritating. Leave it to the boffins in the office. It's as annoying as being felched and having my pen dismantled at the screening point.

[romeocharlie]

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/rex-calls-asx-trading-halt-as-concerns-grow-over-regional-fleet/news-story/ea3a798a98a92774aed8726b399ca596?amp

Rex has called a halt to trading on the ASX pending an announcement by the airline, which currently has a third of its regional fleet parked.19 of Rex’s 58 Saab 340s are out of action, which deputy chairman John Sharp attributed to logistics and supply issues.

The number of aircraft on the ground has steadily increased since Rex announced a reduction in regional services (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/pilot-shortage-behind-rex-cuts-to-regional-flights-australiawide/news-story/3805fcbe852c93d0d0e0fb7a5cf5e896) in late April.

At the time, a chronic pilot shortage and supply chain disruption were blamed for the cuts, affecting routes in remote parts of Queensland, NSW, Victoria and South Australia.

Services were expected to be reinstated in late June, but no further update has been forthcoming.

Mr Sharp confirmed the airline was continuing to face challenges (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/rex-remains-in-the-red-for-first-half-but-hopeful-of-profit-by-june/news-story/57ed494807ed700d07d9c3e102c59ba0), that were keeping a significant number of Saab 340s parked.

The airline’s fleet of seven Boeing 737s remained operational, with one currently undergoing routine maintenance.

Two more 737s were due to be added (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/rex-to-add-more-planes-by-midyear-amid-shameless-price-gouging-by-qantas/news-story/e4dde5238d9c05ff4f2b0a0666dd7049) to the fleet in June and July, increasing operational resilience and allowing new daily flights between Adelaide and Sydney to begin at month’s end.

At Rex’s half year results, the airline said regional operations had been a “drag” on the group’s financial performance but were expected to return to profit by the end of March.

No further guidance has been provided since then.

Rex shares last traded at $1.21, down from a high of $2.06 in late 2020 when the airline unveiled plans to expand onto major city routes with the backing of investment firm PAG.

Under the deal, PAG was to provide Rex with up to $150m to support the jet operations.

Once the full amount was drawn down by Rex, PAG would hold a 48 per cent stake in the carrier, which entitled the firm to two board seats.

[Ladloy]

Yeah... Pilot shortage. Shortage of people wanting to take a pineapple. This company is deserving of everything it gets.

Last I heard the terms of the cadet course had changed to 9 years and total cost close to 200k!!

[Icarus2001]

A trading halt. Hilarious. What happens one minute after the market opens on Wednesday? The market reacts to the announcement which caused the trading halt. No way to avoid a market reaction. You can tell lies to the media all day long but the share market finds its own reality.

Good luck.

[red_dirt]

A trading halt. Hilarious. What happens one minute after the market opens on Wednesday? The market reacts to the announcement which caused the trading halt. No way to avoid a market reaction. You can tell lies to the media all day long but the share market finds its own reality.

Good luck.

buy the rumour, sell the news

[markis10]

A trading halt. Hilarious. What happens one minute after the market opens on Wednesday? The market reacts to the announcement which caused the trading halt. No way to avoid a market reaction. You can tell lies to the media all day long but the share market finds its own reality.

Good luck.

They are required to call a halt under the exchange rules when there is a material change to the companies finances be it results or promulgated outlook. Interestingly most halts for companies I have been watching tend to see an announcement the morning after the halt, most be struggling on the content and how to spin it, maybe something along the lines that they expect another loss now but in good news they sold four SAABs to Air Chathams???

[TimmyTee]

So their "guidance" wasn't quite accurate, and now forecasting a $35mill loss (and given only the SAABs got a mention as being pre-tax profitable, who knows how poorly the 737 operations are going).
Also, wouldn't the loss be half their entire revenue?

Also much love for their media department contact being a regular mobile number haha

https://cdn-api.markitdigital.com/apiman-gateway/ASX/asx-research/1.0/file/2924-02677866-2A1455743?access_token=83ff96335c2d45a094df02a206a39ff4

[43Inches]

So their "guidance" wasn't quite accurate, and now forecasting a $35mill loss (and given only the SAABs got a mention as being pre-tax profitable, who knows how poorly the 737 operations are going).
Also, wouldn't the loss be half their entire revenue?

Also much love for their media department contact being a regular mobile number haha

https://cdn-api.markitdigital.com/apiman-gateway/ASX/asx-research/1.0/file/2924-02677866-2A1455743?access_token=83ff96335c2d45a094df02a206a39ff4

At least try to have a clue by googling the half yearly result... half year revenue was $340mil, so assuming slightly less for second half a guess at total revenue would be around $550-$650mil for the year.

[PoppaJo]

Between September to January they had been giving the market monthly (pre tax/unaudited) jet profit numbers, that has since stopped, so one could assume the profit has also since dried up. Operating a small fleet of 737s is extremely vulnerable to cost blowouts at anytime of the year, be it engineering, weather, spare parts, staffing, training and so forth.

Rex need to start making some big decisions about who they want to be, and where they want to go in the long run. Amateur hour is now over, the current regime running it appears not fit for where they are going.

[Icarus2001]

No, no, no, it’s all because of a world wide shortage of pilots and engineers.

Except Qantas made a multi billion dollar profit, so there is that.

[43Inches]

To be fair QF made $2 billion because it had that much paid by customers for flights before covid that were not used, and now in the last year they charged them again using the excuse flights were full and they had to pay more for the same flights. Goes to show how lame our consumer protections are in this country, that and the dismal protection for disrupted/cancelled travel.

[Icarus2001]

Okay 43, Virgin appears to be in profit, Alliance is in profit, how many more excuses do you want to make for REX?

[MickG0105]

To be fair QF made $2 billion because it had that much paid by customers for flights before covid that were not used, and now in the last year they charged them again ...
To be fair, that is complete and utter nonsense. Revenue received in advance sits on the Balance Sheet, not the P&L. Qantas is on track to make around $2 billion in profit because revenue is up by around 4.5 percent over the corresponding period pre-COVID, and their expenses are down by around 3.9 percent.

If Rex can't turn a profit under the current conditions, then there is something fundamentally wrong with their business model. They reckon that their regional revenue is better than in FY2019, and for month after month they spruiked announcements headlined Rex's Record Domestic Performance (September 2022) and Rex Announces Increased Profitability (January 2023). They should end the FY with about $640 million in revenue and still end up losing $35 million. The fact that they're trying to fob off a drop in business travel over May - June on "corporate travel budgets being exhausted following exponential increases of international fares" tells you pretty much everything you need to know about their grasp of the market and their business culture.

[chimbu warrior]

Except Qantas made a multi billion dollar profit, so there is that.

............because they "stole" all the Rex pilots and engineers.

[SHVC]

............because they "stole" all the Rex pilots and engineers.
Stole?? They applied and left for better pastures.

[Icarus2001]

This is a fine example of a press release being published as if it were news…

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-06-21/rex-airline-forecasts-millions-in-losses/102503130

[Australopithecus]

There is always some business owner lamenting a labour shortage when in fact they are really complaining about the abolishment of slavery and the free market for labour.

[Colonel_Klink]

There is always some business owner lamenting a labour shortage when in fact they are really complaining about the abolishment of slavery and the free market for labour.

Exactly - I recall Sharp rejoicing at the fact that he’d be able to start up an airline during COVID and have extremely cheap labour because of Virgin going into administration. Oh how the free market has delivered the ultimate slap of karma to his face.

[Colonel_Klink]

If Rex can't turn a profit under the current conditions, then there is something fundamentally wrong with their business model.

And ultimately this is the nuts and bolts of it all. I struggle to think of a more profitable time for airlines than right now. If Rex is still posting losses - something has to change.

Was this a case of Corporate Shiny Jet Syndrome where the eye of the Execs was firmly taken off the ball - where the core business wasn’t focussed on?

Or is there something fundamentally wrong with the core (Regional) business and the company will have to consolidate further and move to focussing even more on the jet / fifo market? Time will tell….

[43Inches]

Okay 43, Virgin appears to be in profit, Alliance is in profit, how many more excuses do you want to make for REX?

Not making excuses for Rex just saying the QF super profit is because half their flights were pre paid, and then paid for again, after the company received subsidies to be cost neutral during covid. The double loading of old booking plus new bookings and aggressive cancellation policy inflated the price of seats so that new and existing customers were effectively paying double. Theres a reason the spotlight is on QFs behavioure since the pandemic. Rex was quick to re emburse passengers, where QF offered credits only.

The smart/devious part to QFs plan was that they manged to turn a liability into a capacity constraint and resell already sold seats, that is credits used on the exact same flight had to pay extra for the same service. Plus use that pre booked capcity to charge higher prices for new passengers.

VA is possibly profitable because they had all their debt wiped and started from scratch with pre existing customers, established network and a workforce on effectively 20% less.

Alliance is a Fifo operator that basically cant loose money.

Rex is expanding a new fleet and dealing with its management sins of the past, both dragging on the company.

PS in regard to how weak Australian consumer law is, our travel plans in the US when disrupted were offered 3 different options, full refund, re booking on like for like service no cost at a future date at the companies direction or credits to the value of 125% of paid for future use. QF group and VA had one choice of credits to only the value paid, Rex offered full refunds for Covid disrupted flights and so on.

As a result there are numerous calls out there to change the consumer laws, and QF group is in the news every second day with disaffected passengers who have lost credits, been charged double for flights, cancellations that have incurred change of flight charges etc etc.... Fine if you have choice, but when one company runs 60%+ of the market there's not much choice out there.

Alan might be a dick, but he knows how to generate profit from a stone, and still by the law, even if it does lack morality and compassion.

[B772]

Shares in REX changed hands at $1 earlier today. Back to where they were 3 years ago.

[43Inches]

A SAAB 2000 is a licence to lose lots of money.

It's lucky Rex operate only SAAB 340s then...

[KRUSTY 34]

[QUOTE=MickG0105;

[i]"If Rex can't turn a profit under the current conditions, then there is something fundamentally wrong with their business model."

The REX business model, as per their original submission to ASIC, cited the upcoming demise of VA as an opportunity to get into a domestic Jet Operation.

Draw your own conclusions on that!

[Icarus2001]

Alliance is a Fifo operator that basically cant loose money.

Did you mean lose? You forgot about the thirty Ejets operating “RPT” for QantasLink.

Rex is expanding a new fleet and dealing with its management sins of the past

Again, Alliance has ADDED thirty Ejets in the last two years. Purchased not leased as REX has done. Who looks like a more savvy operator?

Totally agree with you 43inches about consumer law in Australia. We are poorly served by both flavours of government in this regard. Just look at the EU rules on delayed flights etc. We need much better in Australia. Our government cannot even keep the lights on.

[43Inches]

Did you mean lose? You forgot about the thirty Ejets operating “RPT” for QantasLink.

Same same really, ones chartering to a mining company the other is chartering to an airline, unless they have rocks in their heads they would price the runs to QF at a profit. Question is what happens if QF pulls the pin and they have all those jets and no work, answer is similar to what happened to Strategic. Hopefully the savvy operator has big penalties for contract withdrawal. Alliance at least is trying to stay away from what Skywest did, and that is move heavily into RPT rather than stick to its FiFo base.

[1A_Please]

REX are bigger grifters than Donald Trump; it is only a matter of time before they cry poor and say to governments, both state and federal, that regional services will be cut unless assistance is provided. They do not have the balance sheet to finance a replacement of the SAAB fleet any other way.

[Icarus2001]

Alliance is at least staying away from what Skywest did, and that is move heavily into RPT rather than stick to its FiFo base. My recollection back to the Jetstream and Fokker 50 days was that RPT was the BASE for Skywest, not FIFO. That came later. There was only ONE jet charter operator at Perth airport and that was NJS. Alliance started with one F100 to Mt Keith. Skywest were late to the FIFO party.