Qatar salary reductions and redundancies 😬

[QRAviator]

Hi
So just for my reference, can anyone elaborate on who are eligible according to QR for recall and based on what factors?
Also would help if anyone who has gone the Psychometric test would be willing to connect so (if and ) when the time comes we can prepare.

[Monkey Brains]

latestpilotjobs.com for PSA, not eligible people on final warning letters / shouting at redundancy interview etc..

[777kicker]

Well guys, I believe I’m eligible, 777 Capt, no letters, redundant in August. Still waiting. Either there is an informal black list managed by the usual suspects or a lot of theories in this forum are just “blowing wind “.

[Silver68]

The forum is correct. I understand that appx 200 boeing pilots have returned since April/May. I am one of them.

[Solar350]

How long were you in the company? Less/more than approx 1½ years? Plenty of 103xxx staffnumbers still around so if you were senior to them or especially if you were a lot more senior than them, then don't expect a call anytime soon. At the moment there's former 330/380 guys back in the country about to start a full 777 typerating course.

Yes, there is a black list even if you never were told of any disciplinary actions against you. On the other hand they are getting desperate so you might get a call anyway depending on why you were let go.

But again if you had been in the company for more than 2-3 years you have to ask yourself why you were singled out when so few guys from 777 were let go. It has been the least affected fleet (in terms of redundancy) during this entire pandemic.

[immapostthis]

A post from the 5th of May;

"With the currently lack of crew, and the significant demand, the only option for them is to overwork the current pilots and CC, this will result in the exhaustion of the current workforce they have; resulting the the frustration and 'loss' (leave) of those who they currently have. Making the gap between the 'availability of crew' to 'demand of crew' bigger resulting in more over worked and more leaving increasing the gap even more. ( Negative feedback loop)?

desertdog "Very well said. I couldn't have written it better. Me as FO I can confirm everything you said. I was worried about my job at the beginning of the pandemic. Now? Now I don't care anymore and if I get fired I'll be glad someone made the decision for me. I'm incredibly tired, I'm just surviving on flights from lack of rest. Sometimes I'm so tired I'd rather just do paperwork and have no interest in flying. Constant fluster from poor communication and bad decisions by our management. I do the bare minimum just to make the flight safe and not have to explain anything in the office and the rest I don't really, really care. Now I look at my roster I just want to cry. A roster that is only legal in Qatar, according to EASA or FAA my license should have been suspended a long time ago. No chance to be home, see my folks and do perfectly normal things. I'm just flying, fighting fatigue, locked in a hotel room with no way to get out and eating economy food from plastic boxes."

The downfall of Qatar has started already. Personally I do not know desertdog but I can tell you that; if he is given the opportunity to get another flying job in another region of the world, there is a good chance he/she will take it. Factors he/she may consider if he/she is considering leaving;

Cost of living
Benefits
Possible upgrades (fleet/ctp/sfo)
Salary
Lifestyle
Rostering
Seniority

Now, QA is a company that can boast of some good things; from right to left seat tends to be quick [but not the only airline that is quick e.g. easyjet, skywest, etc] but regional vs international it is quick.

Look at the factors listed above... most places/companies anywhere else would be better than qa on these aspects.... ok their salary will be better, but you've worked here and made the money already...

Does qa think people will not consider these things? Look at the way their staff is treated... it is rubbish! I have some mates on the 777 and they are sooo fatigued and are begging for some rest.. BEGGING! Expect it to only get worse... you guys are in for some serious sheeet....

From what is going around the table and the forums;

boeing is coming back heavily. I believed it was all the boeing pilots back, but apparently not... we got a few on the forum here who are not as fortunate... 777kicker & Huw Jorgan sorry to hear guys.... as you rightly mentioned, some criteria for their stupid 'lists' that no one knows how it is produced. Must be just whose face they like. But guys do keep in contact with each other and hit me a message... I would like to see how this will unfold. Are there any more boeing qa pilots who have not been called back? Reason why i am asking, i personally know of junior guys who are back in doha now... so most people should have been back aswell.

330/380 almost every month or 2 revaluations of bringing back the 380 are in talks... and it starts of as YES YES YES but then dies down to a noo... nooo.. nooooo.... glad to see they have finally decided to call back those guys... i know of some 380 not sooo senior guys who have been called back... and i personally believe that 330 guys should not be thrown away... as mentioned by someone above... they begged people to go on the 330, just to keep the fleet alive until they are able to burn the fleet and transfer them to something else... pandemic came and they took the biggest cut... QUESTION; are all 330 guys back? are all 380 guys back? It seems the narrative now is to transfer them to 777 only [ previously it was 777 and 350] but 350 [personally] i find is a dying fleet. Can people flying 350 tell me how your hours are looking this and next month?

always a big thanks to SandPilot350 for posting the best of the best! I came here today to talk about the transfers to 777 but you handled it already! All this is true... last week thursday airbus pilots had to submit an answer to if they will move to boeing and if not...why... how childish qa... but this is to show the SERIOUS demand on the 777. Cargo still cannot fulfil the contracts made while [as mentioned] the pilots are exhausted! but this will free space on the airbus fleets encouraging the airline to rehire guys on 350 and 320...350 hires FINALLY!

March 21 was the last influx of 320 rehires... the idea of 320 rehires are ONLY form inside doha is incorrect... they brought back people from outside but MAJORITY are from inside. If i am correct it is under 20 guys who rejoined... I would actually believe the number is less... prob 10.. cannot mention the 320 without mentioning the MPL. I have heard both stories that high hour MPL guys were asked to come back, but also heard that no MPLs were called... can you MPL guys clarify this? additionally talks about MPLs within doha have/have not been called... are there MPL cadets still in doha unemployed? I was made to believe every pilot in the airline is either working or have gone home, that NO unemployed pilots (MPL or non MPL) are still in qatar... The last batch of MPLs was fired in Feb/March2021 [ 1st batch i believe was April/July2020]... are any of them still here?

Salaries...

Who here can confirm their salaries? Both talks are being thrown around... most recently I heard that qatari law would not allow difference in salaries for the same job. Someone with S# 123 cannot work for more than someone with S#1234 {ignoring yearly increases, etc.} basically all should have the 23 FO,etc salaires regardless. But now i am seeing that there are guys who are coming back and THEIR CONTRACT IS LESS THAN 23xxxx? WTF?

Keep posting guys, keep asking, keep'em coming!

[QRAviator]

The last batch of MPLs who were fired in Feb/march '21 , before they finished the separation process, some were called back. No one I am aware of from outside Doha were given the call.. at-least yet.
Additionally I know of 1 MPL FO who had just finished his line check in march last year and got culled in June '20 and has since been stuck in Doha (due to home country not allowing anyone cross borders) and has not been asked yet to join back.

[FlyHigher]

I personally know of an A330 Captain who was invited to rejoin. He is just waiting for a joining date and fleet allocation.

[Monkey Brains]

Lots of rumors / news but the only thing that is for sure is that they have 0 idea how to run an airline but the worst part is all the families they destroy while doing this..

[Silver68]

They don't seem to realise it yet, or maybe they do, that the two tier pay structure has done a great deal of damage. Ask anyone (well most) why they come to the ME and they will tell you, money. Take that away or dilute it and it becomes just another job. If you can live at home and earn similar money, why oh why would you put up with this mismanagement. Looking forward to COVID being a thing of the past and the job market to pick up.

[lfbb]

I guess you missed the opportunity to put some pressure on them when you accepted these new conditions, if no one did they would have to reconsider their plan... it is not fair to put it on someone else's shoulders now, live with your decision.

[desert_dog]

Middle East reality check. I am working for QR since 2014 and still don't have a contract. Only the offer letter signed.

[777kicker]

Staff number lower than 30k, 9000 hours in the company on 3 different airplanes with one go-around in 2012 and 0 letters,0 office calls, 0 alternates, 0 safety office visits. Must really look ugly or must really have pissed off some spineless office bitch without the courage to tell me. Informal black lists are SSOO QR style! Enjoy guys, sorry for you all.

[FlyingAce77]

Chief has put Saliya as SVP Operations DIA & Saliya is in charge of Manpower Planning Flight ops.

[desert_dog]

This will have a political background.His brother Ravi Karunanayake is in the Sri Lankan government.

[QRAviator]

Just FYI -
The careers page now has an opening for "Rejoining ex QR cabin crew" to apply. Could expect something similar in future for flight crew.

https://careers.qatarairways.com/global/en/job/21000059/Rejoining-Qatar-Airways-Cabin-Crew-2021

[FlyingAce77]

Rossen email to CC, He is considering Visitor Policy” I think this is just desperation that will be used as a “Marketing” Campaign- by the new VP Babar Rahman”

QR is desperate right now, CC are resigning and leaving, the interesting thing would be , Will it be ok merit or As usual Pick & Choose.
Time shall tell.
I wouldn’t jump the guns right now, knowing how easily qr switches gear.

[desert_dog]

elaborate, I have no idea what does it mean. Who are they? and what does it mean "visitor policy".

[FlyingAce77]

Few Months back CC were barred from inviting guests over to their accommodation- that 10PM thing & Many BFs showing up outside Crew Accommodation- Hence the Visitor Policy is being considered again- Saliya has been removed & Given Charge of SVP DIA, Chief doesn’t like Canadian/Bulgarian Roosen but he’s closed to Sheikha Moza -

New details coming in are that “Redundant crew will be hired with 25% reduced salary” and Warning letters & Caution Letters given prior to March 2020 won’t be hired. Pick & Choose.

Babar Rahman is the New VP Marketing meanwhile Salama Al Shawa the Jordanian is now an “Advisor” to no one!

[desert_dog]

Interesante info. Any info about the new chief ppl officer? That new german guy from Lufthansa?

[Akephalos]

“New details coming in are that “Redundant crew will be hired with 25% reduced salary” and Warning letters & Caution Letters given prior to March 2020 won’t be hired. Pick & Choose.”

I’ve heard before that this is not true, the warnings or caution letters. There’s people flying right now with those ( very serious stuff) so, what’s the difference between those letters given before March 2020 and the ones after?
Maybe because those warning letters or caution letters after march 2020 are the ones of those pilots who were able to stay in the company because they had a friend in the office ..so it doesn’t count?There are people that failed sims that were not made redundant because they knew somebody in the office and are flying right now.

Some pilots were made redundant because they were on a “ blacklist” what the hell is that ?? Some local didn’t like the way they talk to them or some office dude reported them?

Who makes this black list?who decides which names go there, which “criteria” is taken to put somebody on that list ?

it’s also interesting how some nationalities are less affected when it comes to redundancy

[FlyingAce77]

Can anyone confirm How many 350s are grounded? Is it 15 or 19?

[DirtyPorkAgain]

Can anyone confirm if the rejoining cabin crew (not those on SIDL or stuck unpaid) got 25% less on the contract like the flight deck?

[Lucifer786]

FlyingAce77

19 until last week !

[The Lost Goat]

The QR 777 pilots who flew into the teeth of the unknown virus in March, April, May and June 2020, without actually knowing if they were going to survive (I know it sounds silly now, but in those days people in Italy and Spain were dying in their thousands) -

Those same pilots who were made to fly 23hr FDPs to China and back without a by-your-leave;

Those same pilots who carried the entire company by flying ever-changing, insane rosters whilst other pilots from other fleets were staying safe at home or were locked out (no fault to them);

Those same pilots who were doing the above on temporary half pay, then permanent 60% pay (including flight time cuts);

Their leave was cancelled, and leave was assigned to them instead, and then they were forced to work on leave days, under constant threat of random termination;

Those pilots were (and still are) spending layovers locked in hotel rooms, being threatened with termination if they don't use RETI, being thrown little 'healthy' meals instead of proper food. Their rosters continue to be published late, and continue to be unstable.

Those pilots, some of whom flew well over 1300 flight hrs in the year on the employer's perverted hours factoring scheme;

Those pilots have now just been cheated out of their overtime pay.

[gpsprimary01]

Hi,

The 350 pilots are allowed to fly the 330. An email received by management.

[777kicker]

Some of them who flew under those conditions until August were then terminated without a tangible reason except redundancy and have not yet been recalled.

Imagine...

[Klimax]

This sounds like one hell of a :mad: company! Wow. I feel sorry for you guys.

[gpsprimary01]

Oh yeah Klimax, it is. I regret the day I step in this country and this company.

[gpsprimary01]

Hi guys,

Does anyone knows if it is easy to get a licence verification letter from the QCAA?
My CAA is currently requesting that letter to renew my licence. Does anyone of you got that experience recently?

I've been trying to reach them by mail but they never replied back. But I know for that kind of request, the CAA's have a channel of communication so it should be fine I guess.

Thanks

[gpsprimary01]

Thanks a lot spoiler77.

That's the info I needed. Should be smooth if my CAA request it.

[immapostthis]

Expect rehires sometime soon... maybe this week...

[Flyingmexicansaucer]

Which fleets? Any movement fleet wise, waiting to rejoin with my family. Hearing guys moving from 320 to 787, hopefully make room for some of us.

[QRAviator]

immapostthis

any specific fleet/rank? Any particular number of people they will recall?

[FlyHigher]

I know an A330 Captain who got a joining date first week of October.

[airbourne]

I heard the same thing. I wonder if its the same guy! :)

[SHVC]

Is Qatar hiring again? are they flying all destinations freely? over here in Australia we are being locked up like hens over on covid case. Our country thinks they can eradicate C-19.

[Monkey Brains]

taking back redundant guys on a lower salary and not flying freely no.

[airbourne]

SHVC

No

No

Well you only have ScoMo to blame!

[OBNAX]

Question regarding family coming back with rejoiners : does anybody rejoined the company with their family traveling with them on their DOJ ? If yes, what was the visa procedure from the company ?

Thanks in advance.

[QRA350]

Expect rehires sometime soon... maybe this week...

Did this actually happen ? Any latest news ?

[gpsprimary01]

Hi guys,

I don't think we can expect some movements this week, don't forget it's EID holiday and everything run slowly during this period.

Unfortunately we have to be patient.

[Flyingmexicansaucer]

Any updates news on internal transfers? Anyone rejoining 320?

[airbourne]

Plenty of re-hires that were slated for October have been moved up to August for training.

[airbourne]

Just shy of 250 pilots taken back in the last couple of months.

[QRAviator]

Thats some good news. Any idea about fleet or rank wise breakup of these numbers?

[Python27]

​​​​​​... just received here the bond... Around 43k € for 3 years, earning 25% less of base salary.

Utterly UNBELIEVABLE

[lfbb]

You will probably make the same money as before now flying 100 plus hours...

[QRAviator]

Is that bond amount payable monthly which is why there is 25% reduction? Or these are 2 separate points.

[Lucifer786]

So no external recruitments yet eh. For typed, time heavy Boeing widebody skippers ?

[QRA350]

Python27

Be thankful, atleast you have a job, a lot of us would love to be in your position right now

[airbourne]

Sure the bond is a bit high but I also assume that you do not plan to go anywhere and maybe do another 10 years in the sandpit with the company.

As for the 25% reduction, when things started to slow down were you not all given paycuts so its not anything that you are not used to?

Also for the others around the world that are looking for jobs, life in QR can't be that bad when you have company accommodation, schools paid for and those associated benefits.

[Papa_Golf]

QRA350

I will happily stick to my current flight instructor job rather than going back to QR.

[Silver68]

airbourne

Company accommodation? associated benefits? I assume you don't work in Qatar. Company accommodation is accommodation provided by the company at the employees expense, at a rate that is way above any private rental of the same property type. Continually eroding medical insurance cover. No more loss of license cover. Reduced flying pay and increased flying hours to max hours almost every month. Days off limited to minimum. Annual leave restricted or even cancelled for some.

Apart from that, everything is dandy. I just can't think why people keep resigning, especially with no job to go to.

[airbourne]

Good to see that so! :)

[CDRW]

Rejoiners going onto a new fleet are subject to a bond. Question is, is it a paper bond with lots of promises or are the slimeballs actually taking money out of the first year joinining salary less 25%?

If its the former and no cash is removed then great. Sign all the papers they want you to sign. And when you find a new job with your fresh new type rating just walk away. Infact operate the aircraft to a destination that suits you and just dissappear.
Qatar Airways has plunged itself to the bottom of the employment barrel with such haste its unbelievable.
To new or rejoiners - take the job with both hands but use and screw the company before they can do it to you.

[lfbb]

Talking to a friend who rejoined last week felt more like a person who’s trying to fix a broken marriage after a split, there is only sadness and resentment. It’s an extremely hard task to make it work again and will never be the same like the old times. Not only I felt his disappointment for being treated as a new joiner but also the new bond imposed, lower compensation package, worst company accommodation than his previous on, etc… all these things really took a toll on him. Not to mention having to deal with all the hassle when you first move to a country after he just went thru the same hassle 8 months ago to leave this same country. It’s not a situation to the faint of heart. Sometimes I just wonder if rejoining is indeed the best decision.

[pfvspnf]

Python27

you don’t like ? Want to protest ? Too hot right now , maybe wait for winter , humidity will come down

[Silver68]

Genuine question. How many of you plan on still being here in Qatar for the world cup?

[777kicker]

As QRA350 put so clearly, YOU GUYS HAVE A JOB. Just out of respect for the many that are still unemployed, please stop whining. Myself, and many others I’m sure, would be happy to be where you are now. If it’s just too much for you to bear, leave space for the really hungry. Complaints with a full belly definitely sound hollow.

[avgas777]

I would go Back in a heartbeat if they called me, unfortunatelly I wasn't senior enough to keep my Job when they started to let people go last year.

[lfbb]

777kicker

And this is exactly why our profession is hitting rock bottom. I feel sorry for your situation but "will fly for food" is not the solution here.

[WrldWide]

I concur with this statement

[SHVC]

Qatar re hiring that’s good, Australia has again locked down now 18 million people Victoria only just let out of the cage last week now back in. There will be no Airlines left here in 12 months. You guys going back are lucky

[777kicker]

lfbb

Then resign and show them where pilot’s rights stand.
Or admit that in tough times you’ve to plow trough some hard soil, and don’t expect who’s in deeper trouble than you to fight your battles or embrace your sorrows

[777kicker]

Our profession has hit rock bottom with Pay to Fly, with 400 hours junior F/O’s having a seat on a wide body, with 1500 hours captains flying around Europe on a certain type of airlines, with hundreds or maybe thousands of licenses given for a “fee” in certain parts of the world and then converted without a wink by a certain queen’s offices.

And whiners, that’s rock bottom.

You agree with the statement? Then collect your last year’s rosters, collate them with your last year’s logbook and send the file to EASA to reassess QR compliance.

It’s gonna be interesting...

[Silver68]

Feel free to cite any reference that shows airlines upgrading captains at 1500 hours TT.

[avgas777]

You are entitled of an opinion and I respect that. Every case is different tho, In my case , QR gave exactly what they offered me when they interviewed me, I was not mislead and neither forced to anything . They didn't hold a gun to my head to get me to sign a Contract and I was free to go whenever I wanted to.

[lfbb]

777kicker

You might not believe it but I already did, long before the COVID crises, when they started messing up with the T&C and changed the overtime AFTER having flown like crazy on the past year. I realized it was time to prepare a scape plan, saved all the money I could and left. Wished more followed instead of just seating around worrying about fleet transfers.

As I said I really simpatize with your situation, but if we let the company push us down this one more step the new normal will be captains earning less than FOs sharing the same cockpit.

[QRAviator]

Has anyone in last 2 weeks received any rejoining invite mail? Have only heard about a few 320 FOs who did so along with PSA but no dates yet.

[dreamsdocometrue]

What's the outlook in terms of pilot numbers currently based on the schedules?
​​​​​Too many? Too few?

[Silver68]

If you ignore the idiot.

Frantically trying to re-hire pilots who were fired. Not all agreeing to the new contract. Pilots on maximum hours and minimum days off. Steady stream of people leaving too.

[CDRW]

Avgas777 - just a few minor points. No one signs a contract. QR gives an agreement and in general they stuck to it. The agreement is such things as salary, housing, education allowance, transport, telephone etc.
The stuff that really gets up the nostrils of most crew is the arbitury changing of various allowances such as in flight hourly pay and overtime. And it is always for the worse and is always done without prior advice to the crew.

If you are a happy puppy in QR good for you. Most of us are not!

[FlyingOW]

spoiler77

Do you honestly believe there will be upgrades this year? let me have some of that shisha... I hope i am wrong.

QRAviator I know people with DOJs assigned through December, I wouldn't expect anything this year.

777Kicker that's all that most do these days, whine. Many on here b&m about the company and/or country but are eagerly waiting to be called back. Go figure.

It's an employers market right now, China is offering almost half the precovid salary (Triple7 Captain $10.5K). Its only a matter of time when things will swing back our way.. US airlines are facing massive shortages and EK have already opened up careers website for registering for future opportunities.

Until then, carry on!

[Fired600]

Not strictly. They have emailed A380 pilots (not 777) and some cabin crew for an expression of interest for a possible future rehire. The website doesn’t take applications.

[Silver68]

The Emirates website just took my 777 application. Granted it is an expression of interest, but application submitted none the less.

[Fired600]

Interesting, that’s changed from the other day

[Silver68]

If it helps, you have to sign in first, otherwise you will not be able submit application.

[FlyingOW]

I am really surprised that you didn’t even check your website before commenting. It is taking applications.

Rumour network or not, I am not in the habit of spreading fake news.

PS: they are going to need a lot of 350 and 787 pilots in the future, abundant in the region.

[Monkey Brains]

They need now a lot of pilots on 777 & 787 apparently.

[warhammer]

Silver68

I'm sorry but "F" for Emirates ...

[ant1]

Monkey Brains

Then why don't they call redundant "drivers" according to their seniority and reinstate them on everybody else's payscale? Let's not forget that according to the BS they were given during the farewell meeting there was nothing wrong with them, not their fault, it was just the COVID situation. They must have wondered then why on earth the redundancy was not conducted based on seniority. As many have pointed out there must have been undisclosed reasons, let me recap some and add a few:
- They had a letter
- Performance reasons
- They pissed the wrong person by being an arse,
- They pissed the wrong department by trying to defend their rights, asking unwelcome questions or raising unspeakable issues.
- They did not answer the phone on OFF days or refused to fly on such days.

​​​​1, 2 & 3 are in my view the only legit but GG the Great Goat should have been more transparent about its fire&hire policy.
Good luck to all the hunger game players, specially those on the receiving end. I guess the motto is "they give me the dough and I knead it"

[CDRW]

QR will start twice daily services to Kabul with a crew layover! Wouldn't want the aircraft to spend too long there. Crew tho ...pffft - expendable

[007busdriver]

Guys, anyone has any news about rejoiners recently?

[Lucifer786]

Yes. They’re the ones being scheduled for the Kabul layovers with great R n R opportunities 😉

[tundrapilot]

I don't think Kabul is going to be a layover. Also, the people who are in Kabul now in my opinion are friends with the Qr government so it will be fine when they see a QR airplane

[tundrapilot]

its all about the money. ant1 I agree with you but I also know rejoiners with 'a letter' who got back, not a final warning one. So as you said it is all about if you pissed the wrong person before

[sleeve of wizard]

Dear Friend, we are delighted to start the new campaign "WE WILL NEVER FORGET ".

The campaign consists of helping our dearest pilots bringing the light of real facts encountered during the journey of past years to date.

It's an inclusive and real timeline of events that have been affecting our lives, lowering our personal and professional lives.

If you see any lie in this context, please, don't contribute and delete it.

If you believe everything written below is real, consistent, and has diminished your dignity, financial wealth, lifestyle, family relationship, working environment, please we encourage you to add real facts based on dates e-mails crew notices, or reliable common sense facts to our list.

We also suggest you improve awareness of potential new joiners about challenges encountered or even recalling memories of redundant old friends how much pain and disgrace they had suffered from unprepared people in charge for years till their freedom.

" WE WILL NEVER FORGET “

Sincerely your friend,
## 2018 ##

Few days before the new fiscal year, the company changed OVERTIME payment, pilots who flew under overtime conditions didn't get the proper payment.

Introduction of Fake EASA Flight Time Regulation.
- Removal definition of "day off"
- Removal ULR flights, only AKL, so no Days OFF.

Pilot Personal Logbook must be in company desire, correct hours are not logged as per EASA Regulation

## 2019 ##

# June

Downgrade from Allianz to Alkoot including now co-payment 10% or 20% for some hospitals in Qatar/Abroad.

##2020 ##

First Semester

" Fly more, I'm in home office " meanwhile pilots are flying abroad exposing their families ( babies, health problem relatives) without any option or being asked if agree to fly in this condition.

"If you wish, we don't care, face mask are not allowed" until they change the concept.


# March

" In order to maintain business Integrity...company will assign balance annual leave...to pilots from April.
We are confident that you will understand ...this decision.."

No days off after ULR flights, company is using LEAVE balance to give legal rest.

Company started removing days off, from the published roster extending duties out of the home base and home base without pilot agreement.

No payment during rest time while duty ( Bunk Time) although you are working. Doesn't matter if you are suffering exposition to gamma radiation, vibration, noise, dryness, and jetlag.

(Cargo) DH on Belly Cargo is not paid just because it's a Passenger aircraft carrying cargo.

Massive Reduction of the workforce without any indicated and clear criteria.

# August

Obligation to submit the consent forms for the "Solidary Program" of 04th June 2020 till 27th August 2020.

- ONLY EXPATS PILOTS reduction of 25%
- Frozen Salary increments for 5 years
- Pilot allowances reduction of 40%
- Hourly Flying Pay reduction 25%

# September

23rd September 2020

SINGLE ENGINE TAXI "..will result in pilots placed on LOG and called to the fleet office ... if the explanation is found to be without valid reasons, a serious action will be taken AGAINST OFFENDERS INCLUDING DISMISSAL FROM THE COMPANY."

Bid System doesn't work anymore for especially for Boeing Fleet

Pilots from the same nationality will not be rostered together unless company requirements creating more instability for the BID System and Roster.
( Flag Carrier companies are in extreme danger, as they have the same nationality )

# October

New Zealand Captain committed Suicide.

E-MAIL: " Happy World Mental Health Day " a few days after.
It's a clear demonstration of a lack of respect for the individual.

Serving Economy food on Cargo flights including China turn-around.


## 2021 ##

# January

Losing Loss of License, after 6 months sick company has the right to cease your job contract as per HR policy.

# February

Wellbeing Survey, for what?

If you spent money on your TSO proved headset most probably you cannot use it anymore... they are working on it ... LOL.

Total of Redundant Pilots + Resignation

# A 320 = 110 FO/SO / 113 CP
# A 330 = 162 CP / 121 FO
# A 350 = 77 CP / 40 FO
# A 380 = 56 CP / 57 FO
# B 787 = 41 CP/ 59 FO
# B 777 = 107 CP / 40 FO
# B 747 = 5 CP / FO 2


# March

Leave "Enhancements" now you are obligated to use 21 days leave in the next 6 months of the fiscal year.

Fired pilots, few days about to leave the country were invited to perform a physiological test to rejoining the company after the stress of losing the job and relocate the family.
Some of them failed and most probably do you know the reason! Would you be mentally prepared?

# April

777 pilots with balance Leave from the previous fiscal year (2020) were forced to do not take it, no chance to complain.

" In recognition of your commitment and dedication to support airline.... we will be credit your April salary..." but you don't have chance to see your family outside, keep working... we pay less you work more, great deal!”

NO answer from Company, guys are paying from their own pocket waiting in Qatar to rejoin the company.

If you weren't considered an offender, your RETI fuel was burned for the non-sense flight over Qatar (fully vaccinated people from Doha to Doha), check Instagram..

Pilots are exhausted working more than 100h month, LEAVE from May and June were canceled!!!

Payment:
ENTIRE COMPANY GOT BACK SALARY BUT...WE STILL

No payment during rest time while duty ( Bunk Time)
(Cargo) DH on Belly Cargo are not paid
Pilot allowances reduction of 40%
Hourly Flying Pay reduction 25%

STILL " some redundant pilots " are waiting in Qatar paying expenses from their own pocket to be maybe able to rejoin the company.

777 Pilots although forced to have fiscal year leave in next 6 months, leaves from MAY and JUN has been sacked “ We understand that this maybe disappointing news and that you may have already made personal arrangements”

Company is not publishing the roster as per approved QCAA – PART A.
Great summary,
A few additions :
- Forcing leaves the way they did (1 week every month) is illegal according to Qatar labor regulations. Splitting leaves in more than 2 period is not allowed.
- Paying the leaves is allowed only in case of separation.
- Leaves can be carried forward following a written request by the employee.
- Unused leaves due to operational constraints should be carried forward as per HR Policy.
So the way they force the leaves then refuse to carry forward and pay is a gross and patent violation of Qatar labor law and company HR Policy.
During the pandemic, and still now, the hotels we’re sent to are not adequate according to OM A (Should have at least 24/7 availability of meals), again a violation there.
I will also mention the fatigue survey that can still be found in Aerodoc, where they acknowledge that 93% of the pilots are scared to report fatigue.
Finally I will mention the china turnarounds which are above the maximum ULR FDP and requires special permission from QCAA. Put that next to the fact that many European airlines are still flying to China but are planning a layover in Korea/Japan/Turkmenistan/Kyrgyzstan… to make the flight legal.

Amazing job ! You are the man ! May I please suggest to add the fact that some of our colleagues were desperately begging for unpaid leave only to see their newborn and just got that reply from Flight Crew Screwing Service or Fleet Office : "not allowed, due to operational requirements"

#goingmessestogether
#goingdisgracestogether


Addition:
For pilots made redundant: Not paying back the -25% solidarity payment cut for all the months between starting the solidarity program and terminating the pilot after all, falsely forcing someone to sacrifice both salary and his/her jobs. (Then why did this person participate in a solidarity program?)

add to the list, pilots not able to see their families are not getting destination requested due to the fact they are from the same nationality

[Lateralshaker]

Amen not to forget Goff’s ( golden days are gone) and outstation days off calculated as your day off.. very senior Fo’s with their two stripes dying for upgrade ( even sfo pay scale) will leave for Wizz etc and QA changing rules blue & blue can suddenly fly together the day when Europe & Asia opens will be funny as even SA guys converting their Licence for EASA future is here

[Dumbass863]

And according to the latest ACN regarding the logbook time; there is a new rule coming from the Moon: whenever 3 or 4 crew operation, the B crew (or IRP) must now log the block time divided by 2 and minus 90min! Of course, only this “logged” time will be reflected on the paycheck as well.

So, on a 12hrs flight; crew B will be paid for 6h - 1h30 = 4h30!!! Another great and smart idea to make you legal in any circumstances. So all time spent in the jumpseat is gone, even if you are also responsible and will be blamed for whatever can happen.

I saw 2 rosters of my slave-colleagues with more than 180hrs block in 30 days. 350 fleet. But no problem capt, it’s legal :ok:

[733driver]

That's what I call a five star airline. Will advise everyone I know not to use them.

[CDRW]

Dumbass nailed it. The illustrious management still regards the jump seat pilots as " integral " to the crew. The mad Greek would often say that those pilots should be MORE responsible than the operating crew! He really was a goat!

How QR are going down the rabbit hole of self destruction is sad but not surprising. Non aviators running flight ops wile the actual flight ops mgt guys are tootless pussycats whose only mission is punitive punishment to scared exhausted crew.

[007busdriver]

Any ideas about the latest email from baker?

[Zakary]

….. Of course, only this “logged” time will be reflected on the paycheck as well.

wrong, based on what ?

[Dumbass863]

Go to TOPS then click on the “$” tab. Look what happened after the 1st of August…

doh-xxx block 14h:
6h15 @78.75Qar + 7h45 @39.37Qar = 482.18 + 305.11 = 787.29Qar

Do you call it wrong? I call it robbery. Being paid the same amount of money while you’re technically responsible and blameworthy from the jumpseat than from the bunk is just not right.

Now let’s wait to see if this will come back after the 1st of September (cf. email) but I hardly doubt so. I asked 10 different people; I had 10 different interpretations because as usual; it is everything except clear. For memory, it used to be 104qar x block time. In that exemple; 1456qar so almost 50% drop. Just sayin’.

[casablanca]

Qatar was always famous for really dumb knee jerk reactions… 2 guys from same country get into a fight, let’s prohibit all same nationalities from flying together! My favorite asinine change to procedures was when someone missed a radio call….procedures were changed that said headsets had to be used until top of climb but the intercom must be shut off above fl200. So now 2 pilots talking on noise canceling headsets, monitoring 3 freq, and can’t really communicate well amongst each other. This is better how?

[ThrustAssymComp]

is it legal to use only 1 side of headset and talk normally without int like a human being? Or talking to each other is prohibited in all flight phases? And what are those 3 freq to monitor? Because normally we here use comm 1 for atc, comm 2 121.5, and comm 3 for data. Perhaps I will change my mind to go to ME.

[casablanca]

Atc, guard, and out of Doha normally Iran Air defense.
I think original issue was because with intercom on(hot mic) the speaker volume was lowered. Somebody removed headset with inter phone on and missed a radio call. Instead of memo saying please ensure speaker volume before removing headset, they would implement a ridiculous policy that created more problems than it would ever correct.

[ThrustAssymComp]

Oh I see, but I don’t know if we have to monitor 127.8, I think we only need to contact 127.8 40nm prior to enter iran fir.
And that’s not the right corrective action, are they addicted to drama series or what? Why is everything seems to be so complicated now? Even lcc in my country looks better now thanks to QR.

[WrldWide]

Are you missing the point on purpose?
Point: kneejerk policy changes that are not well thought out.
There you go......

[ThrustAssymComp]

Nope. Just curious, why?

[007busdriver]

In ME the answer to your question is :
-Why?
+Because!
That's how conversations in ME are...

[QRAviator]

Any updates on rehiring/rejoining on any fleet?

[ThrustAssymComp]

https://www.pilotjobsnetwork.com/jobs/Qatar_Executive

[Flapsupbedsdown]

That is not Qatar Airways, it is Qatar Executive

[QRA350]

Any word on the 350 groundings.. seems like the rest of the world brushed this off

[White Knight]

And quite rightly too...... It's a paint issue!

[light and variable]

Time to close this itty :mad: bitty thread me thinks. The redundancies halted months ago and now the August salary is out, salary reductions are therefore history too.
Null and void.

[Lucifer786]

Was there a lesson learnt ?

[FlightDetent]

Referencing the other thread: Do you now get paid for LVP taxi out and deicing at CDG?

(b: is that a turn around flight? )

#askingforafriend

[light and variable]

Middle East in a nutshell. Are you really up to it? := There was far too much complacency amongst our community so the expectation to be treated well when times got tough proves that many simply were NOT

[007busdriver]

The salary is back to normal, it's good. But what about the people still waiting outside without any kind of news?

[WrldWide]

Allowances are still constrained significantly. I would consider that a continued reduction, wouldn't you?

[Fired600]

​​Are re-hires all back on the same salary as they would have been pre-Covid and same seniority ?

[airbus350captain1]

history ? What about the flight crews who got rehired again. starting from the first-year salary. Qatar Airways will never be the same. only people who can't find any other jobs will join this stupid airline. Qatar Airways is better than many other Airlines but for 5-star airlines, it's a Joke. It shows how you can get 5 stars but making your employees the new slaves.

[casablanca]

Salary is back? How about flight pay? And are the relief crew still only paid/ logging only hours in pilot seat? If so this sounds like a pay cut as before this was paid at 100%.

[WrldWide]

No mention of restoring allowance or flight pay. Though when/if the hourly rates return, I would be very surprised if they return the formula to the appropriate pay calculation method.

[desert_dog]

For those who are interested. After the rich announcement of the chief H.E. A.B. about return of the money, it was found that the company does not have the finances in current financial year for it and the return of the money is postponed to March 2022.

The management comedy show continue

[TORDEA]

This just another romour , or something to start a new discussion? I don’t believe anything until I see it.

[oh101]

Would anyone that quit or was made redundant share their experience concerning ID travel?

The situation is after in-service for more than 10 years now. If I decide to quit. Will I still be entitled to some kind of ID travel like North American airlines?

I tried to reach the staff travel office to get some answers. But you know the way they work, I would rather ask other people here if they know and wouldn't mind sharing some info.

Thanks in advance.

[Monkey Brains]

the years above 10 you will get 4 tickets per year based on last booking eligibility. Priority is between current staff and buddy pass.

So 10 years in service will be 10, 14 years will be 14 years tickets

[jacekgfly]

Only on QR

[mmorel]

I think they change it to minimum 15 years .
so if you work only 10 years you will not be entitled

[Monkey Brains]

When did that happen?

[mmorel]

Please look at the staff travel documents under GEMS Maybe they have updated it .

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/501x78/screen_shot_2021_09_04_at_9_49_55_am_1b7452e733fad17ba9d8760 382a4cefde386b76c.png

[oh101]

Thank you, guys.

[oh101]

Thank you to the person that PM me with the instructions how to find the information from the Aerodoc.
Appreciate your instruction. I found it.

For some reason, I couldn't reply to your PM.

Thanks again.

[007busdriver]

No one is talking about re-joiners, is that stopped or what?

[tundrapilot]

it is stopped for the time being. They called some people in August. Maybe next month again

[Monkey Brains]

people have joining dates up to in December..

[007busdriver]

tundrapilot

Do you know their fleet?

[FlyHigher]

As far as I know, quite a few joining on Boeing fleet.

[teroken]

Guys any news about new joiner's contracts after 09/2021? I mean do they still ask to sign 25% less contract but pay full salary? Or again how it used to be?

[007busdriver]

As far as I heard new joiners are still to sign deducted salary. And it will be the same until the spring.

[APU_inop]

No more 25% paycut on the basic

[tundrapilot]

320, 787, 777 pilots fly like horses but not many pilots get invitations to rejoin. This company will never manage to have a roster of 70 hours a month for pilots. a roster with 11 days off per month and 70 hours of flying sounds unmanageable for QR.
especially 320 sucks now, 7 days off average

[007busdriver]

Has anyone been called so far this month?

[The Rage]

Yes, people are being called back on short notice.

[FlyHigher]

Very short notice. In some cases 2 or 3 days!

[Flyboy_SG]

Just wondering/out of curiosity, how much time do you guys fly on long haul a month on the new FDTL? I believe rest time is not counted towards paid/FTL block?

[Xaxa]

I’ve seen 160hrs roster of a 777 captain. :mad:

[jacekgfly]

CP A350 +160 h block. +180 h duty

[Travelbiz]

I’ve heard that the British Airways 777 pilots declined the invitation to work in qr, good to know.
I think nobody will ever trust this company again after all they did to their pilots.
I think they’ll go back to what they were, the last choice in the ME.

[Flyboy_SG]

Holy COW ! That's like 6 ULRs a month :rolleyes: killing !

[Flyboy_SG]

tundrapilott

Paying overtime is cheaper than to have more pilots. Probably why they do it.

[Dumbass863]

Flyboy_SG

i’ve seen few 350 rosters with 180hrs BLOCK in 30 days. I believe the same happened on the 777. And with a LPC/OPC between.

But no worry gaptain, you’re legal! :ok: Btw, you have a new LMS about human trafficking. Your professionalism is appreciated.

[FlightDetent]

Flyboy_SG

Apparently, only until you discover the opportunity of not paying for overtime.

[Flyboy_SG]

180 ?
Personally 100 hrs of ULR/LR itself is killing, but that 10 BDO was a breather. I can't imagine living on 160-180 with no BDO !
Nevertheless they'll get 20-30k applications when they open up.

[Whitemonk Returns]

Dumbass863

My first 12 months with a UK LCC several years ago I flew 220 block hours....

That's 5 weeks at QRs current rate 🤔 needless to say, they will be recruiting soon as nobody is going to put up with that for too much longer

[fatbus]

How are block hours vs flight hour vs logbook hours vs paid hours . 1000 hours /year max ?

[737a]

Interestingly QR is looking for a recruitment specialist to hire flight deck crew, and that seems like a sign of external hirings soon. Good luck everyone who needs to go back to the sandpit and newbies who thinks is all rainbows and butterflies. Just be sure you are getting yourself into true turmoil when you join these ME companies.

[tundrapilot]

I don't think external recruitment will happen soon. They have over a thousand pilots on the list to call back. let's assume 10 % of them had final warning letters.
another 900 remaining. Let's say out of 900 another 200 will say NO.
still 700 hundred remaining. and all those pilots have already a Qatari pilot's license and a type rating on it at company's fleet. This number can cover company's demand for at least another 2 years. From what I have heard they are going to give priority to Ex crews. In addition to that the do fleet transfers from Airbus to Boeing on re-hiring pilots so they do not care much about external recruitment. They can do whatever they want with the ones that got redundant

[Flyboy_SG]

From what I heard from top management official in QR, they are going to open up to externals within the next 3 months. You guys will have to wait until that happens.
Even if this guys info is wrong, 700 isn't a big number and definitely won't cover the next two year demand of QR.

[Flyboy_SG]

737a

I second this, Quicksand pit indeed.

[Fadecwithnos]

737a

As tundrapilot mentioned there are still several pilots to be brought back, and logistically speaking it's way better for the airline since they're holders of RP's and QCAA licenses.... But we must never forget the qsense factor...

Regarding the flight crew recruiter, maybe this opportunity is to add some manpower to the "3 stooges dept" formed by only 3 people, highly underpaid and underqualified as most of the management departments in this airline. These 3 are doing an utterly pathetic job bringing back people, sometimes giving less than 36 hours to pack the things....

As always, the company is running behind the clock not by hours, but by months...

[tundrapilot]

Fadecwithnos, I agree. All the rejoining pilots who got redundant are being handled by recruiters so that's why probably they want to hire another recruiter. Maybe someone quitted too. So nothing abnormal with that

[Flaperon777]

A lot depends on how much of the total fleet is flying presently with the current pilot force.
Anyone has that approximate number ?
Based on that number it will be very easy to project future demand and availability requirements.
Which are the main fleets flying.
350’s and 787’s ?

[tundrapilot]

Emirates has officially started hiring external pilots while the have over 1000 of their redundant crews on list.
Do you think QR is going to do the same ? I think this move shows zero respect for the crews who used to work here. At least for those who had good files

[Flyboy_SG]

Respect & Loyalty - these words doesn't exist in the Middle East dictionary.

[jacekgfly]

Is QR still recalling redundant crew? If so what fleet?

[flyfast123]

tundrapilot

Absolute rubbish. There is no external recruitment at EK. All the applications are going into a hold pool for when it does start. And that little gem is straight from the camels mouth.

But hey don’t let facts destroy your story!

Im in no way defending how the process was managed but they will be bringing back those they want before externals.

[tundrapilot]

Flyfast123... that's good.. I wish EK does not hire externals before taking into consideration their redundant pilots. That would be a shame for EK and for QR as well. Only reason I would say is acceptable for not calling a redundant crew is final warning letter and multiple simulator or line check failures. (let's say more than one failure).
As far as the numbers ... There were 4100 pilots at QR before covid. maybe 4150 if I remember correctly. Nothing less than 4050 for sure and I can dig and find it at the company's old magazine issues. When the reduction started about 1500-1600 got redundant ... that's my number and sorry if I disagree with Winged Lion.
So let's say the number was 2600 in the first quarter of 2021. In May they started rehiring by calling a few people. There is no way according to the numbers described at the previous post above that QR has hired and retrained 800 people from June until now. It is only 5 months. Actually Wing Lions says that QR rehired 800 pilots in 4 months. That's not even possible from the recruitment department to handle such a huge number. Come on let's be realistic... Many of them got from the Airbus a Boeing type rating which mean lengthy process. All of them need at least one and a half month of training regardless fleet change or not. The ones with a fleet change need several months. QR is not capable to train so many pilots from June until end of October ... In five months.. 800 people. It is not possible... Even half of it it is not possible.
Wing Lion if you disagree let's discuss it. I might be wrong. It is a discussion here and not an argument. Thanks

[Silver68]

Much of the training for type conversions has been outsourced.

[Silver68]

Don't forget attrition levels are apparently still high amongst the 777 fleet.

[itwillbefuntheysaid]

Hey guys, Just wanted to know for QR, if someone has a warning letter, what are the chances of being called back? Thanks

[tundrapilot]

People with warning letters have been called back already. If it was a final warning then it is different, but you never know....

[Python27]

qrteria in qr ain't something logical, nor fair

The so called qsense. You should know that!

[CDRW]

Ahh the Qsense - that a good one. No rhyme of reason - just complete knee jerk reaction to events.

[light and variable]

That wasn't some chap, that was just some :mad:. Probably of the same ilk who find it amusing to meaow on guard radio at 3AM.

[jacekgfly]

Do they still recall redundant pilot? Heard that they will maybe start with external recruitment after the new year.

[LandCruiserFTW]

Yes, redundant pilots are still rejoining. It’s gonna take some time yet. Meanwhile, company will prepare to start external hiring, first focusing on type rated experienced pilots.

[tundrapilot]

I cannot understand how QR will start external hiring especially in 2022. That sounds like a joke ... They have more than 800 redundant pilots on the list to call back. Also the new covid variant from Africa brought new problems..
If they do it , it will be something like what EK did. Express of interest but no actual hiring

[tundrapilot]

https://www.reuters.com/article/health-coronavirus-qatarairways-safrica/qatar-airways-bans-travellers-from-s-africa-zimbabwe-mozambique-over-omicron-variant-idINC6N2R5024

[Count von Altibar]

They probably don't want all the 600 back I reckon, it's the middle east after all they like to pick and choose and the smallest misdemeanor in their eyes (like being in a naughty Whatsapp group) and you're permanently banished. Qsense as someone said above.

[jacekgfly]

Who knows the logic? There is none. I know people with active warning letters that are already back.

[fatbus]

Referring to 600? What is that? There was the first 600 at EK , are you saying that QR did the same or only 600 total at QR ?

[Skyfl410]

[(like being in a naughty Whatsapp group) and you're permanently banished.

Yea.... managers really worked hard to look into WhatsApp groups...Trust me, in most groups, it was only an exchange of everyday life in Doha, Not much about the company, Only when the pandemic began people started to question what decision would the company take. But hey it's better to call a 63-year-old captain and bond him for 3 years ( age limit is 65) or a pilot with warning letters.
Makes us understand how bad they handled everything.

[Skyfl410]

I just think that they want to understand how much demand is out there. How many people are willing to go to the ME. Ek opened for external pilots during the summer... wouldn't be surprised QR copied them. Monkey see, monkey do

[tundrapilot]

Correct...

[mmorel]

Maybe they are going through the rehiring process by seniority. so your opinion is 63 years old pilot with over 12 years of experience in Qatar Airways should be called back?

Anyone who is over 55 years old has less chance to get a job in other companies so their hope is to get back to Qatar Airways.

[Skyfl410]

Hello Mmorel, Qr is not rehiring by seniority. 2 Cpts I know had only 6 months on the A330 before the Pandemic started. They are back in Qr doing a 777 full type rating. Don't you think it's a bit silly? Bond them for 3 years at an age of 63?

[mmorel]

Hi,

yes, in that case, you are right. The mentality of this company will never change.

[CDRW]

Just to be clear. The witch hunt on wattsapp groups was led by a lanky peice of Italian crap who rose up from the **** pipes of another airline and sucked his way up to the highest flight ops position.
The wattsapp groups were easy pickings for him.

How the Italian community let him still walk is a mystery.

[chobo97]

Looks like qatar start hiring external pilot who type rated in B777/787, does it means that they already finish recalling redundant pilot?

https://careers.qatarairways.com/global/en/job/210000E5/-B777-B787-Type-Rated-First-Officer

[jacekgfly]

Maybe all rated FOs on 777/787 that were made redundant have been called back.

[jacekgfly]

To my last post, they are looking for pilot for all fleets and grades. So the ones that got redundant and did not receive a email until now..... yea then its goodbye....

Apparently the BOSS did not keep his promise.

[jadrolinija]

I wonder how many applications will they get from recent 777 and 787 crew... Recency might be the biggest issue now...

[Akrep]

Plenty from Turkish Airlines that will apply

[mmorel]

It's awful how they treat pilots. I know some pilots who works more than 10 years without any sick days and they have not called them back.

[LandCruiserFTW]

I cannot understand how QR will start external hiring especially in 2022. That sounds like a joke ... They have more than 800 redundant pilots on the list to call back. Also the new covid variant from Africa brought new problems..
If they do it , it will be something like what EK did. Express of interest but no actual hiring

You see? Exactly as I told you. Looking for type rated lads on 777/787, NTR will start later next year.
Wonder, how many SFO will stay in the company, if they are waiting 8+ years for the upgrade and company is still prioritizing Direct Entry Captains, who will require basically the same amount of training.
Also, many ex-Cathay Pacific and ex-Etihad 777s are coming.

[LandCruiserFTW]

It's awful how they treat pilots. I know some pilots who works more than 10 years without any sick days and they have not called them back.

Everybody, who was not called back, yet, had some other (maybe) unknown issue in his folder. It wasn’t a random pick.

[737a]

And what happened to the NTR pals? No ad for them!

[777JockeyIN]

Yep, recency is a big issue. Who has 12 months currency?!

[LandCruiserFTW]

Any info if there is (still) an embargo for EK past/present employees to apply?
no embargo if you fulfil the requirements

[karnc]

They are just trying to get a pool of available pilots. No real new hiring yet. 12months current requirement is a joke. Maybe they put their hiring ads because EK just did so.

[777JockeyIN]

They are just trying to get a pool of available pilots. No real new hiring yet. 12months current requirement is a joke. Maybe they put their hiring ads because EK just did so.
I don't think so. From what I heard people will be called for interview asap, ie by the end of december.

EK advertised "Expression of interest" for future requirements. QR posted a job vacancy. Both are two different adverts.

[WrldWide]

What to expect in online assessments? Any info or guess ?
wrong thread

https://www.pprune.org/middle-east/643473-joining-qatar-airways-master-thread-2-a.html#post11152726

[Flyboy_SG]

if they are waiting 8+ years for the upgrade and company is still prioritizing Direct Entry Captains, who will require basically the same amount of training.
Also, many ex-Cathay Pacific and ex-Etihad 777s are coming.


That really is a sad thing, Besides many of these guys have 1000s of 320/737 PIC time, and or unfortunately joined at wrong time.

[3cy3D]

Anyone got email for online assessment?

[777JockeyIN]

Nope not yet, do you have 12 month flight currency ?

[3cy3D]

Nope not yet, do you have 12 month flight currency ?

Yes mate, I’m current on A320, I hope they will start ASAP for guys who are don’t have a job. 🙏🏻

[Flaperon777]

Yes mate, I’m current on A320, I hope they will start ASAP for guys who are don’t have a job. 🙏🏻

I thought QR was only looking for Boeing pilots. Or is is Boeing and Airbus ?

[3cy3D]

On sunday in the morning they advert first Boeing then in the afternoon they advert Airbus as well with all FO and DEC options. For Boeing they only looking for 777 and 787 rated, for Airbus 320/30/50/80.

[777JockeyIN]

777/787 rated for 77/78 fleet and 320/30/40/50/80 rated pilots for A350 or 380 I presume ?

[WrldWide]

https://www.pprune.org/middle-east/643473-joining-qatar-airways-master-thread-2-a.html#post11152726

[jacekgfly]

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/708x970/img_20211208_wa0004_5b2ca2722b4563e9503c1a92615c85fdf5fe2adc .jpg

[jacekgfly]

Go Akbar Al Baker....

[Skyfl410]

In a way you should be happy not going back with them... This email clearly makes you think about what kind of people they are. Things are Slowly moving and most importantly they are not going back. You will find a job faster than you think... just hold tight and study for interviews.

[Skyfl410]

https://avherald.com/h?article=4f161e30&opt=0

[Flyboy_SG]

https://avherald.com/h?article=4f161e30&opt=0


Someone took chance it seems. God save these poor four men.

[Flyboy_SG]

In a way you should be happy not going back with them... This email clearly makes you think about what kind of people they are. Things are Slowly moving and most importantly they are not going back. You will find a job faster than you think... just hold tight and study for interviews.


They were always like these.No surprise. Practical and straight forward. Because planes and pilots can be replaced with a newer better versions.

[Skyfl410]

They were always like these.No surprise. Practical and straight forward. Because planes and pilots can be replaced with a newer better versions.

Other than Practical I would say MESSY....

[SOPS]

Someone took chance it seems. God save these poor four men.


I feel sorry for that crew.

[tundrapilot]

Go Akbar Al Baker....


Very reliable personality... people will remember

[fatbus]

Pilots have short memories! This is another reminder that the ME has zero job security.

[mmorel]

They are going have pilots from
other airlines in middle east or Asia where they treat pilot worse than Qatar Airways.

the golden time to have pilot from Flag carriers from Europe and north america is gone .

Hope Easa and Faa soon ban qatar airways or at least ask them to rectify the issue with flight duties .

[Newcomer2]

Hope Easa and Faa soon ban qatar airways or at least ask them to rectify the issue with flight duties .

Not gonna happen. Boeing and Airbus orders at stake. Money talks...

[fatbus]

Do you think EASA, FAA or any other country are daft and don't know what QR is doing? Of course they do , it's they that approve the appropriate authorities to operate within there boundaries. This is not new . Unfortunately you're wasting energy . If you want to do something, then support the 4 guys that are deep in it at the moment .

[felixthecat]

Entered in error

[tundrapilot]

Do you think EASA, FAA or any other country are daft and don't know what QR is doing? Of course they do , it's they that approve the appropriate authorities to operate within there boundaries. This is not new . Unfortunately you're wasting energy . If you want to do something, then support the 4 guys that are deep in it at the moment .


Regarding those 4 fellow pilots. The captain will get fired for sure if not already. The first officer will also get fired or get a final warning letter for not taking over the controls from the captain. Probably fired. They will blame him for assertiveness and all those qr things they know to play with during investigations. The guys at the back will get warning letters for not prompting for a go around.
INVESTIGATION DONE !!! no need to discuss more. We all know how the office works .......... it will be all the pilot's fault according to the office but no fatigue will be taken into consideration. Go Qatar !!!!!!!

[fatbus]

Mate.Spot on!! ..

[Dropp the Pilot]

I enjoy a good Qatar or EK bash as much as the next retiree but speaking of Qatar in Brisbane, it IS all the pilot's fault.

Perhaps things have changed but I remember it being a job for big boys who know how to accept responsibility.

[Flapsupbedsdown]

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/708x970/img_20211208_wa0004_5b2ca2722b4563e9503c1a92615c85fdf5fe2adc .jpg
Regrettably also in europe they act the same way.

[fatbus]

If the captain was PF and he took out some lights , who's fault is it ? I agree to wait for the facts but !

[mmorel]

they Might be a 5-star airline for customers but it is 1-star for employees. we should really ask all these websites that promote Qatar Airways, look into employee lifestyle and treatment as well. We can't change their mentalities but if it is all over the news we can force them to change. The only way you can change Arab mind is by Media

[Whitemonk Returns]

Well how do you know he was at fault, if you don't know what happened

If you're the Captain of the aircraft you are always at fault, even when it's not your fault

[tundrapilot]

they Might be a 5-star airline for customers but it is 1-star for employees. we should really ask all these websites that promote Qatar Airways, look into employee lifestyle and treatment as well. We can't change their mentalities but if it is all over the news we can force them to change. The only way you can change Arab mind is by Media

Correct.. !!! This is what I always say when people who have no idea what an airline is would admire me for working at a 5 star bus-line. I say 5 star for the passengers but 1 star for the employees.. I really want to see what will happen when the recruitment opens wide in Asia and Europe.. We all need to buy a lot of pop corn.. colas and beers... Sit and relax on our couches ... and see the attrition happening at qr LIKE NEVER BEFORE..... It reminds me now of the tower 2... with the big photo spreading on the windows ... "experience the world like never before...." ...

when the jobs open again.. they will stick... 'RESIGNATIONS LIKE NEVER BEFORE" on the one side.. and on the other side they can stick.. "ATTRITION LIKE NEVER BEFORE" in different colors , maybe on the one side they can use pink color, Lol..... the baker has no idea what is going to happen... hundreds of pilots are waiting desperately to get out.... this is the result of a management who never respected human values, families, fatigue, and so it goes....

[Bjornolf]

An unhappy person doesn't work for a year, let alone 15 years, in the gulf.

Many of those, who have written negative comments on social media, are not recalled by the company.

Human Resources' e-mail about not being recalled is shared on many sites, including Avherald.

What does the news of an unfortunate incident have to do with the human resources e-mail?

Things like family atmosphere in the company are emotional concepts. We are in a professional business environment.

Qatar is already a company that does not tolerate much error.

In return, Qatar Airways provides many opportunities (42 days of annual leave, high salary, opportunity to fly B777/B787, relatively early captaincy in wide body)

We are talking about a company that gives direct B777 opportunity to a Boeing 737 pilot working in Europe.

Desert is always desert.

I don't find the people, who talk negatively about the company, sincere. Because after 15-20 years of working in the gulf, they were dismissed and not called back due to pandemic.

[Whitemonk Returns]

Not sure I agree, we're always responsible. But I wouldn't say at fault, fault implies you did something wrong. Plenty of bent aeroplanes where the crew did a fantastic job.

If you've taken out a row of runway lights you have done something wrong, why didn't they go around? I don't personally believe you should lose your job over something like that but if your that far to the side of a runway then the aircraft is not under control and you will have to answer those questions.

[tundrapilot]

An unhappy person doesn't work for a year, let alone 15 years, in the gulf.

Many of those, who have written negative comments on social media, are not recalled by the company.

Human Resources' e-mail about not being recalled is shared on many sites, including Avherald.

What does the news of an unfortunate incident have to do with the human resources e-mail?

Things like family atmosphere in the company are emotional concepts. We are in a professional business environment.

Qatar is already a company that does not tolerate much error.

In return, Qatar Airways provides many opportunities (42 days of annual leave, high salary, opportunity to fly B777/B787, relatively early captaincy in wide body)

We are talking about a company that gives direct B777 opportunity to a Boeing 737 pilot working in Europe.

Desert is always desert.

I don't find the people, who talk negatively about the company, sincere. Because after 15-20 years of working in the gulf, they were dismissed and not called back due to pandemic.


THE 42 DAYS LEAVE A YEAR IS A BIG SCAM !!!!!!!!!! they average 8 days off a month while an American air carrier gives an average of 14 days off.

At QR when you bid for let's say 7 days leave every 2 months ... Total 42 a year.

during the 7 days of your assigned leave for the month they WILL REMOVE SOME OF YOUR NORMAL DAYS OFF OUT OF THE AVERAGE OF 8

so you consume 7 days from your leave...... you come back to Doha to fly.... and then for the remaining of the month you HAVE 4 DAYS OFF.... IT IS A SCAM

SO THE 7 DAYS THAT YOU HAVE CONSUMED FROM YOUR ANNUAL REMAINING LEAVE ARE FOR REAL ONLY 3 DAYS LEAVE !!!! BECAUSE WHEN YOU COME BACK TO FLY INSTEAD OF AN AVERAGE OF 8 DAYS OFF YOU NOW HAVE ONLY 4 .....!!!! SO THE MONTHLY ROSTER WITH 8 DAYS OFF NOW IT IS CONVERTED TO A TOTAL OF 11 DAYS OFF BUT 7 OF THEM ARE DEDUCTED FROM YOUR ANNUAL LEAVE BALANCE !!!!! A BIG QR SCAM...... but probably our fellow pilot above is not even a pilot to know this well or he just wants to advertise them because he is a part of them...


PLEASE DO NOT FOOL PEOPLE..... IF YOU ARE PART OF THE MANAGEMENT TEAM STOP FOOLING PEOPLE..... !!!!!!!!

people with excellent files were not called ... while others with warning letters were called... there is no fair environment in the office... it's all a scam...
people who din't even have a social media account and excellent files were not called back

People will realize ... what is going on... let's wait next year when the pilot jobs will open... resignations will skyrocket !!!... the bread maker will not even believe it !

STOP FOOLING PEOPLE.. DO NOT POST LIES if you are a part of them just show some respect to our community !

and who cares to fly a 777/787 after a 737 ? when you get fired for no serious reason you cannot find a job because you have no recency on the 737..

and what are you trying to say ? people who served the airline with dedication for 15 years were not called back due to the pandemic while others who were here for one year were called...? WOW !!!!!!!! what a disgrace to dedicated long term employees !!!.. What a shame ! what a zero respect for the senior people ! THIS IS HOW A PROPER ORGANIZATION WORKS... with zero respect ! are you even a pilot ? and many of the low seniority guys who were called back are already planning to leave with the first opportunity while the senior ones would stay

QR is not an airline.. it is just a place of disgrace for aviation... and for employees...

[mmorel]

totally agree with you.

THE 42 DAYS LEAVE A YEAR IS A BIG SCAM !!!!!!!!!! they average 8 days off a month while an American air carrier gives an average of 14 days off.

At QR when you bid for let's say 7 days leave every 2 months ... Total 42 a year.

during the 7 days of your assigned leave for the month they WILL REMOVE SOME OF YOUR NORMAL DAYS OFF OUT OF THE AVERAGE OF 8

so you consume 7 days from your leave...... you come back to Doha to fly.... and then for the remaining of the month you HAVE 4 DAYS OFF.... IT IS A SCAM

SO THE 7 DAYS THAT YOU HAVE CONSUMED FROM YOUR ANNUAL REMAINING LEAVE ARE FOR REAL ONLY 3 DAYS LEAVE !!!! BECAUSE WHEN YOU COME BACK TO FLY INSTEAD OF AN AVERAGE OF 8 DAYS OFF YOU NOW HAVE ONLY 4 .....!!!! SO THE MONTHLY ROSTER WITH 8 DAYS OFF NOW IT IS CONVERTED TO A TOTAL OF 11 DAYS OFF BUT 7 OF THEM ARE DEDUCTED FROM YOUR ANNUAL LEAVE BALANCE !!!!! A BIG QR SCAM...... but probably our fellow pilot above is not even a pilot to know this well or he just wants to advertise them because he is a part of them...


PLEASE DO NOT FOOL PEOPLE..... IF YOU ARE PART OF THE MANAGEMENT TEAM STOP FOOLING PEOPLE..... !!!!!!!!

people with excellent files were not called ... while others with warning letters were called... there is no fair environment in the office... it's all a scam...
people who din't even have a social media account and excellent files were not called back

People will realize ... what is going on... let's wait next year when the pilot jobs will open... resignations will skyrocket !!!... the bread maker will not even believe it !

STOP FOOLING PEOPLE.. DO NOT POST LIES if you are a part of them just show some respect to our community !

and who cares to fly a 777/787 after a 737 ? when you get fired for no serious reason you cannot find a job because you have no recency on the 737..

and what are you trying to say ? people who served the airline with dedication for 15 years were not called back due to the pandemic while others who were here for one year were called...? WOW !!!!!!!! what a disgrace to dedicated long term employees !!!.. What a shame ! what a zero respect for the senior people ! THIS IS HOW A PROPER ORGANIZATION WORKS... with zero respect ! are you even a pilot ? and many of the low seniority guys who were called back are already planning to leave with the first opportunity while the senior ones would stay

QR is not an airline.. it is just a place of disgrace for aviation... and for employees...

[Bjornolf]

Each airline has its pros and cons.

Qatar Airways repeatedly has been named airline of the year.

It is an airline that does not deserve such negative sentences.

1) Did you criticize the company about these subjects when you worked for Qatar Airways?

2) Or did you just start criticizing these subjects when the airline did not recall you?

3) Is it right to ruthlessly criticize and vilify the company for other subjects because you didn't get recalled?

4) What does the human resources email shared on Avherald have to do with an unfortunate incident?

5) If, as you claim, annual leave is more in the United States, why didn't you apply to Delta or United airlines? Delta and United Airlines open new training classes every month.

6) You claim that B777 or B787 doesn't matter for you. Many airlines in Europe, including Wizzair and Ryanair, are recruiting B737/A320 pilots. Why didn't you apply? Don't you love to fly four legs anymore?

[Fired600]

Each airline has its pros and cons.

Qatar Airways repeatedly has been named airline of the year.

It is an airline that does not deserve such negative sentences.

1) Did you criticize the company about these subjects when you worked for Qatar Airways?

2) Or did you just start criticizing these subjects when the airline did not recall you?

3) Is it right to ruthlessly criticize and vilify the company for other subjects because you didn't get recalled?

4) What does the human resources email shared on Avherald have to do with an unfortunate incident?

5) If, as you claim, annual leave is more in the United States, why didn't you apply to Delta or United airlines? Delta and United Airlines open new training classes every month.

6) You claim that B777 or B787 doesn't matter for you. Many airlines in Europe, including Wizzair and Ryanair, are recruiting B737/A320 pilots. Why didn't you apply? Don't you love to fly four legs anymore?

The vote for airline of the year has nothing to do with how staff are treated unfortunately.

I have a suspicion that you haven’t worked for the airline and as such criticism of pilots points of view who have seems a little uninformed, and if so how would you know if it deserves such response or not.

[mmorel]

Bjornolf, Qatar needed a pilot before covid so they treat them well. Just look at how they treat FA, They can't even go out after 10:30 pm, Maybe they should put some restrictions on pilots too and I'm sure you will still like to be there. Who wants to work for an airline that does not treat its employees? Maybe you are from a low-cost career or an airline in Iraq, Iran, Asia so obviously, Qatar is heaven for you. It all depends on the pilot's culture. you are probably a low-class pilot who will fly for free if you can keep your jobs.


Each airline has its pros and cons.

Qatar Airways repeatedly has been named airline of the year.

It is an airline that does not deserve such negative sentences.

1) Did you criticize the company about these subjects when you worked for Qatar Airways?

2) Or did you just start criticizing these subjects when the airline did not recall you?

3) Is it right to ruthlessly criticize and vilify the company for other subjects because you didn't get recalled?

4) What does the human resources email shared on Avherald have to do with an unfortunate incident?

5) If, as you claim, annual leave is more in the United States, why didn't you apply to Delta or United airlines? Delta and United Airlines open new training classes every month.

6) You claim that B777 or B787 doesn't matter for you. Many airlines in Europe, including Wizzair and Ryanair, are recruiting B737/A320 pilots. Why didn't you apply? Don't you love to fly four legs anymore?

[SOPS]

Each airline has its pros and cons.

Qatar Airways repeatedly has been named airline of the year.

It is an airline that does not deserve such negative sentences.

1) Did you criticize the company about these subjects when you worked for Qatar Airways?

2) Or did you just start criticizing these subjects when the airline did not recall you?

3) Is it right to ruthlessly criticize and vilify the company for other subjects because you didn't get recalled?

4) What does the human resources email shared on Avherald have to do with an unfortunate incident?

5) If, as you claim, annual leave is more in the United States, why didn't you apply to Delta or United airlines? Delta and United Airlines open new training classes every month.

6) You claim that B777 or B787 doesn't matter for you. Many airlines in Europe, including Wizzair and Ryanair, are recruiting B737/A320 pilots. Why didn't you apply? Don't you love to fly four legs anymore?

Have you ever worked for them? Or anywhere in the ME?

[tundrapilot]

each airline has its pros and cons.

Qatar airways repeatedly has been named airline of the year. For sure because they buy their reviews.. Everybody knows what is going on with skytrax.. With unlimited money supply everyone can make the airline of the year, even a monkey or even someone who used to ride camels during the 90sss ...

It is an airline that does not deserve such negative sentences.

1) did you criticize the company about these subjects when you worked for qatar airways? 50 % of the pilots complain to each other about the airline when the meet at the qroc before go flying...
The rest of 50% complain in the airplane during flight

2) or did you just start criticizing these subjects when the airline did not recall you? I am still here check my old posts,

3) is it right to ruthlessly criticize and vilify the company for other subjects because you didn't get recalled?

4) what does the human resources email shared on avherald have to do with an unfortunate incident? You have never worked at qr

5) if, as you claim, annual leave is more in the united states, why didn't you apply to delta or united airlines? Delta and united airlines open new training classes every month. There is no single pilot in the world that has left a major us airline to go to qatar . Only a lunatic would do that or someone who got terminated

6) you claim that b777 or b787 doesn't matter for you. Many airlines in europe, including wizzair and ryanair, are recruiting b737/a320 pilots. Why didn't you apply? Don't you love to fly four legs anymore? this is what I am planning to do soon... Along with hundred of pilots who are here and plan to do the same
you are not even a pilot. Probably you want to become a pilot in the future.. Probably you are a young kid who lives in qatar and wants to become a pilot one day

[tundrapilot]

Have you ever worked for them? Or anywhere in the ME?
it is obvious he has not from what he writes ..

[tundrapilot]

Bjornolf, Qatar needed a pilot before covid so they treat them well. Just look at how they treat FA, They can't even go out after 10:30 pm, Maybe they should put some restrictions on pilots too and I'm sure you will still like to be there. Who wants to work for an airline that does not treat its employees? Maybe you are from a low-cost career or an airline in Iraq, Iran, Asia so obviously, Qatar is heaven for you. It all depends on the pilot's culture. you are probably a low-class pilot who will fly for free if you can keep your jobs.

mmorel.. probably he is someone who wants to do his commercial pilot's license in the future... agree on what you wrote above

[Flaperon777]

Thread drift alert …

[ant1]

Hi Bjorn. I will try to answer you quiz

Q1) Did you criticize the company about these subjects when you worked for Qatar Airways?

A1)

Better not, did you read what happened to many loyal pilots for simply being members of WhatsApp groups?

Q2) Or did you just start criticizing these subjects when the airline did not recall you?
​
A2)

I guess they did not feel threatened anymore

Q3) Is it right to ruthlessly criticize and vilify the company for other subjects because you didn't get recalled?

A3)

See A2. I can also imagine that they feel some bitterness in relation to the way they were treated, first on their way out, the lack of transparency in the "selection" process, for instance and the way things are unfolding during this rejoining process. Let me tell you that the deal was to be recalled before any external hiring or as QR said, to be given priority during a three year period.


Q4) What does the human resources email shared on Avherald have to do with an unfortunate incident?


A4
In case you don't know, fear is not a good flight deck companion. Fear of going around, of loading more fuel, you name it. Most of the emails were lately contributing to that 5* pervasive fear culture

Q5) If, as you claim, annual leave is more in the United States, why didn't you apply to Delta or United airlines? Delta and United Airlines open new training classes every month.

A5)

I'll give a go to this one, too. They may not have the right to work in the US

Q6) You claim that B777 or B787 doesn't matter for you. Many airlines in Europe, including Wizzair and Ryanair, are recruiting B737/A320 pilots. Why didn't you apply? Don't you love to fly four legs anymore?[/QUOTE]
​​​​​​
A6)

Maybe the lesson here is that there's a limit to what money can buy and it's perhaps better to do some crappy domestic hopping than to be treated like ****e as a reward for your loyalty and the life expectancy that you traded for money
I hope to have contributed to your understanding of life itself
Keep the blue side up and Merry Christmas

[Skyfl410]

Qatar salary reductions and redundancies should always be visible......

[TruckR]

Reuters just published an article on Qatar Airways fatigue and doctored hours.
You should google it and read it before joining.

[FlyingAce77]

Reuters published 2 Articles back to back ...

Here is the link to other article.

https://news.trust.org/item/20220127235650-vhrt4/

[TruckR]

Looks like there some attempt at damage control going on in QR.
Posts/article are being removed as soon as being published.
Happening on Pprune/Simpleflying/paddleyourownkanoo/news.trust/economictimes ......
How does that Reuter's article about attempt to muzzle people sounds like now ?

[Senior Pilot]

Looks like there some attempt at damage control going on in QR.
Posts/article are being removed as soon as being published.
Happening on Pprune/Simpleflying/paddleyourownkanoo/news.trust/economictimes ......
How does that Reuter's article about attempt to muzzle people sounds like now ?

Not here; but a lengthy and interesting thread was deleted by the Thread starter here in the past 24 hours.

Generally this forum is moderated with a very light touch and with absolutely no influence by airlines unless legal action is involved, such as 10 years ago👍

[fatbus]

Typical spineless pilots , caving to the pressure . Same as EY and now EK stuffing pprune and other social media. It's been said numerous times , be very aware what you are getting into when you go to a ME carrier. If you can't deal with there gag orders , for your( and family) own benefit stay away .


ps ; the articals in question are easily found .

[Skyfl410]

Nice to see the link is back up....


https://www.reuters.com/article/qatar-airlines-surveillance-idUKL8N2U40W9