Durham Tees Valley-7

[Heathrow Harry]

And eventually it'll finish up like Dunsfold - 1800 new houses announced this week......

Dunsfold decision greeted with delight | News | Farnham Herald (http://www.farnhamherald.com/article.cfm?id=126411&headline=Dunsfold%20decision%20greeted%20with%20delight&sectionIs=news&searchyear=2018)

[highwideandugly]

Worrying times...no one knows what the future holds,but the reputation.of the airport already tarnished is about to be dragged through the mud.

PEEL with the best will in the world have not been the best landlords...the councils have a lot to answer for too...Beafer for mayor( who incidentally has been pretty quiet)!

[mmeman]

I think it is worrying times.. I am not sure what this is supposed to achieve? What do the the campaigners want to gain from these documents being made public? What is the benefit to the airport - I just cant see what it would be but I thought the Save Teesside Airport campaign was to save the airport - I can't see how that is going to be achieved by this - Is this how they are expecting the Mayor gets the airport - Peel being made to sell it back? How would that happen?

Talking about the Save Teesside Airport group on Facebook - wasn't that set up by someone who had a run in with Peel over the wind turbines at the Riverside?

Do we know for certain that the new flights are not happening for Summer 19? If that is the case and that is due to the Mayor not agreeing to the £500,000, then that is playing politics with the airport - What will happen to the £500,000 where else will it be spent? I won't see any difference in my pocket, but I might have been able to fly from here for my holiday..

[Robert-Ryan]

Well said mmeman! The whole thing is being blown out of all proportion. That's always been my gripe with the STA troublemakers; you don't save something by dragging its name through the dirt. Peel are not the enemy.

[oldart]

Thousands of people want to fly from MME, they don't understand why they can't. Supposedly the recession is over, therefor the flights should have returned. Whose to blame, the councils, the Mayor, Peel or just not enough of the general public making complaints? To me it looks like all of the arguments are just going round in circles and nothing is happening, Leeds/Bradford and Newcastle must be rubbing their hands at what is going on, Surely all concerned must work together to turn things around at the airport.

[SWBKCB]

therefore the flights should have returned

Why should they? Not necessarily anybody to blame, it's a different world now as the airlines look to reduce costs and concentrate on their major bases.

[N707ZS]

therefore the flights should have returned people will still just go to wherever is cheaper.

[AirportPlanner1]

I won't see any difference in my pocket, but I might have been able to fly from here for my holiday..

And therein is the answer. Why should the Mayor pay £500k so you can drive a few miles less to go on your holiday? What economic benefit and how many jobs does you heading to Majorca for a week bring to the Teeside area?

[N707ZS]

Why did Carlisle get millions recently and other local airports have had millions in grants from all over.

[SWBKCB]

Why did Carlisle get millions recently and other local airports have had millions in grants from all over.

Cos they did it properly? Anyway, MME has had it's share (new approach road, etc)

[mmeman]

And therein is the answer. Why should the Mayor pay £500k so you can drive a few miles less to go on your holiday? What economic benefit and how many jobs does you heading to Majorca for a week bring to the Teeside area?

Oh yes I can understand that argument, but why shouldn't Durham Tees Valley just have some holiday flights to serve the local market .. that what was on the table so just using it as an example.

So if the Mayor is to pay millions of pounds to buy the airport do you think he will be able to attract flights to London, Frankfurt, Paris, Bristol.. and loads of other business destinations?
Or will the first flights be leisure flights? If you look on the Save Teesside Airport facebook page as to what the people want - it is to fly from their local airport on their holiday..

Anyway I have a solution - Peel should try and bury the bad news and just pay the £500k themselves and get the new flights announced!:p

[Heathrow Harry]

Anyone in the rest of the UK would suggest NCL IS your local airport - it's only 40 miles away.... look at the distance from E London or Oxford to LHR or N London to LGW for example

[oldart]

Why should they? Not necessarily anybody to blame, it's a different world now as the airlines look to reduce costs and concentrate on their major bases.
But TUI did want to return but Peel slammed the door in their face!

[AirportPlanner1]

Why did Carlisle get millions recently and other local airports have had millions in grants from all over.

Look at the routes being offered from Carlisle. They are not taking locals away to the sunny beaches of the Med. The tourist board is doing a lot of promotion in Essex and London for Lake District holidays and the chambers of commerce etc up in Cumbria are very supportive. Whatever you think of any grants received and the amounts, and regardless of whether the venture will prove to be a success, you can see some tangible benefits for the local economy. That cannot be said for a based 737 going off to Ibiza, Tenerife etc.

[Robert-Ryan]

But TUI did want to return but Peel slammed the door in their face!
Peel most certainly did not! It's clearly TUI who the Mayor blocked for 2019 and hopefully back with more success for 2020

[Heathrow Harry]

"Essex and London for Lake District holidays" = train or car - landing in Carlisle isn't the lake District - you have to hire a car when you arrive - factor time and cost of that in and you might as well drive from Essex TBH

[AirportPlanner1]

"Essex and London for Lake District holidays" = train or car - landing in Carlisle isn't the lake District - you have to hire a car when you arrive - factor time and cost of that in and you might as well drive from Essex TBH

Maybe so but the flights have provided a platform for marketing the area to an extent I’ve not seen before. Whether they arrive by plane or not is immaterial, there are only 70 or so seats each way anyway.

Having taken SEN-MAN a couple of times now I can tell you it does save time from Essex, and I’d suggest the total door to door time of the flight from Carlisle area to central London does make it worthwhile and is probably also competitive on cost if you’re travelling alone.

[SWBKCB]

Peel most certainly did not! It's clearly TUI who the Mayor blocked for 2019 and hopefully back with more success for 2020

I think oldart is talking about the time Peel agreed a contract with Thomson and then cancelled it because they'd got their sums wrong.

And can we take discussions about how long it takes to get to the Lake District to the Carlisle thread?

[Robert-Ryan]

I think oldart is talking about the time Peel agreed a contract with Thomson and then cancelled it because they'd got their sums wrong.
Either way his phraseology is way off

[oldart]

[QUOTE=SWBKCB;10138834]I think oldart is talking about the time Peel agreed a contract with Thomson and then cancelled it because they'd got their sums wrong.

Thank you SWBKCB, that's correct. The facts were there, no matter what phraseology you use.

[Robert-Ryan]

Doesn't mean they "slammed the door in their face", TUI management are no doubt intelligent business people, and will have understood the reasoning

[SWBKCB]

Just like when bmiBaby moved out? DTVA were very understanding about that. :ok:

Breaking a contract is breaking a contract, whatever the reason.

[Robert-Ryan]

Slight quibble with you on that but I won't fight that particular battle now

[N707ZS]

Bmi baby moved out and suffered the consequences! Presume Thomson didn't want to go to court or came to an agreement.

[highwideandugly]

Whatever ...dealing with DTV and PEEL, Seems on the surface to be fraught with controversy and problems.

recap....BMI,Globespan,Thomson,Balkan,Omega,Loganair ,Newmarket,et al...for what ever reason..came and went...is there a common denominator here?

[N707ZS]

No but the list is bigger, Beafer might be able to dig out the reasons back to why the RAF left, all secret back handers of course. Did the RAF sell the airfield off too cheap to the councils in the first place!

[oldart]

No but the list is bigger, Beafer might be able to dig out the reasons back to why the RAF left, all secret back handers of course. Did the RAF sell the airfield off too cheap to the councils in the first place!
Good point, the RAF did have QRA at MSG, maybe the same reason that Leconfield closed, then Binbrook. Some councils did take the opportunity to keep an airfield running, namely at Teesside, maybe we would complain if the local councils payed too much in the first place.

[highwideandugly]

And it’s goodnight from us?

well you PEEL guys look like you may have to club together for a leaving card soon....

[SWBKCB]

And it’s goodnight from us?

well you PEEL guys look like you may have to club together for a leaving card soon....

I think this cryptic post relates to this Northern Echo story:

Deal to bring Durham Tees Valley Airport into public ownership moves step closer (http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/16218412.Deal_to_bring_Durham_Tees_Valley_Airport_into_publi c_ownership_moves_step_closer/)

The Mayor said:
I’m pleased to be able to say negotiations have moved onto a formal and advanced stage and we have signed a formal non-disclosure agreement which allows us to get into the detail of what the proposal might look like on buying the airport, but we will also have to take a hiatus on what we are able to broadcast to people

[SWBKCB]

Update from the Mayor's speech in which he refers to his plans for MME:

I am also pleased to announce that a separate NDA has been signed with a well-established airport operator who is interested in partnering with me.
I really wish I could say more, and I hope to in due course, but what is clear is we’re moving in the right direction.

[No-More-Bullschit]

I like the way he's breaking the NDA by discussing it :}

[highwideandugly]

However,it’s interesting news..he appear so to be putting his mouth where his(your) money is?

A lot of contributors on here doubted his plans and of course only time will tell..unfortunately DTV remains in limbo for the foreseeable future while it’s all sorted.

[N707ZS]

While all this get sorted either way I presume nothing more than care and maintenance will be done, few more years wasted.

Wonder how the Parmo campaign is coming along!

[Robert-Ryan]

Anyone care to place bets on who the operator is? Stobart surely not many other candidates??

[SWBKCB]

Could be anybody. Depends what is involved - is there any ownership stake or is it purely as an operator?

[highwideandugly]

Stobarts..good call..I hear they are looking for a big expanse of land for a NE logistics centre:ugh:

[N707ZS]

Canadians again then buy it back in two years when it doesn't work.

[jetstar.8]

Stobarts..good call..I hear they are looking for a big expanse of land for a NE logistics centre:ugh:
Stobart have a depot at Teesport whith a major supermarket chain

[SWBKCB]

Stobart have a depot at Teesport with a major supermarket chain

The haulage firm are now completely separate from the air and rail company.

[SWBKCB]

Busy day...

£1m Durham Tees Valley Airport deal to bring in new flights (https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/1m-durham-tees-valley-airport-14647506)

Tees Valley mayor Ben Houchen backed the deal. He said: “The facility is designed to support airlines and route operators looking to fly from our airport. This is a necessary step to support airlines in the short term, but it will also be a key part of my longer-term plan if we get hold of the airport.”

Priority would be given to flight operators from European hub airports. Does this include KLM?

[highwideandugly]

Confused ? Firstly is it legal?
secondly...nothing to PEEL. ..but PEEL are the main owners..so
this only works if PEEL are not the main owners...so. Goodbye PEEL. If you want this sweetener.

Sweetner,bribery,pie in the sky...who knows but what a mess..

[SWBKCB]

Confused ? Firstly is it legal?
secondly...nothing to PEEL. ..but PEEL are the main owners..so this only works if PEEL are not the main owners...so. Goodbye PEEL. If you want this sweetener.

Sweetner,bribery,pie in the sky...who knows but what a mess..

The money is for support payments to airlines, not the airport, and Peel have previously committed to match any funds from TVCA (so the Mayor is playing politics with that point).

[Beafer]

Its interesting how things are moving along since the FOI decision by the judge. Remember Robert Hough said a decision into the airports future would be looked at in 2021.

TUI was shown the door by Peel. Its recorded in the press for those who think differently. Thomson flights axed from Durham Tees Valley Airport - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tees-24724265)

Peel and the councillors who agreed on the airport sale now know that the public and press are watching, so they will have to tread very carefully, especially as the "airport closure clause" was included by Peel.

Thats if Peel can show that the airport is not performing financially. Wonder what Whittaker and his cronies think of this venture as it didn't exactly go to plan like Sheffield ;)

Notice the small clause which was added by Peel before Sheffield airport was closed.. :=
https://www.thestar.co.uk/whats-on/out-and-about/sheffield-airport-closure-in-euro-probe-1-306849

Call it a coincidence or planning?

[Robert-Ryan]

TUI was shown the door by Peel. Its recorded in the press for those who think differently. Thomson flights axed from Durham Tees Valley Airport - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tees-24724265)
I read it in a newspaper so it must be true...:rolleyes:

For the third time; the door is not closed to TUI or anyone else

[GrahamK]

So what happens when no airlines show any interest in serving MME? Or they find flights unviable, like bmibaby found out?

[tigertanaka]

So what happens when no airlines show any interest in serving MME? Or they find flights unviable, like bmibaby found out?

i thought bmi was more about them selling the LHR slot pairs rather than the route not being viable?

[SWBKCB]

i thought bmi was more about them selling the LHR slot pairs rather than the route not being viable?

You're confusing the LHR service operated by bmi mainline and the LCC flights op by bmiBaby.

[onion]

I read it in a newspaper so it must be true...:rolleyes:

For the third time; the door is not closed to TUI or anyone else

It may not be now as Peel have done a massive UK turn on the viability of servicing aircraft over the 120 pax size. Previously though the door had been closed.

[Robert-Ryan]

It was always open subject to the circumstances being right, if it ever was closed then it was for reasons of good business practice (i.e. minimising loss)

[SWBKCB]

£1m sweetener to attract airlines to Durham Tees Valley approved (http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/business/16224279.__1m_sweetener_to_attract_airlines_to_Durham_Tees_V alley_approved/)

After the meeting, Darlington Council leader Cllr Bill Dixon was pleased the idea had come to fruition. He said: “Whatever the outcome of discussions of ownership of the airport, we will be able to draw down on the fund with KLM all being well. This will give us a facility, and I think it probably will do, to appoint someone on a fixed term contract to do some route development for us. There will be a budget there to do whatever is needed to bring flights in. Be they tourist or domestic flights, there is a need for them. It’s a piece of business which needs to be done wherever we land.”

[Robert-Ryan]

Is it just me, or is that incredibly hypocritical??

[SWBKCB]

Is it just me, or is that incredibly hypocritical??

The quote seems odd - the bit about KLM makes no sense, not clear who is employing the route development person (surely this should be Peel? and the papers published say it's to cover airline start up loses?), and tourist flights (presumably outbound?) add nothing to "regional connectivity", which is the stated aim.

[onion]

Why is it hypocritical?

The way I read it, it is for airlines to apply for, not for Peel to get their hands on!
I wouldn't listen to a word Dixon says!

[Robert-Ryan]

Like I said it might just be me. The 500k was ultimately going to the airlines though that's why I'm struggling to see a difference?

[N707ZS]

However, the mayor’s office has said this new £1m deal will not be open to Peel and was separate to the ongoing discussions on any potential handover. So if the mayor gets the airport, he gets the money. But if he doesn't he won't part with the 500k which was going to be matched by Peel to make £1m and we would possibly have had flights summer 2019!

[SWBKCB]

So if the mayor gets the airport, he gets the money. But if he doesn't he won't part with the 500k which was going to be matched by Peel to make £1m and we would possibly have had flights summer 2019!

The money is for airlines to apply for, the money will be available whoever owns the airport. The £500K applied for by Peel wasn't just for routes, but also to fund retail developments.

[Robert-Ryan]

The two are still more than close enough to be considered alike!!

[SWBKCB]

Is anybody saying they aren't?

[Robert-Ryan]

No I guess I was just expecting those opposed to the 500k being in support of the 1 mil

[Beafer]

Re the losses which Peel show as over £2.5m a year in the last accounts. I noted that they show their tangible assets (land and buildings) are worth over £26.6 million. Not bad for only paying £500k for the 835 acres.

If Peel do decide to sell it back to the Mayor, will they be looking for £26m which is their estimate shown in their companies house filing for last year (PDF Jan 2018)
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/02020423/filing-history

[No-More-Bullschit]

I'm sure I read somewhere that they stated total losses since they took over amount to 48 million, they'd want that back I would have thought so 74 million is probably nearer the mark.

Surprised no-one has brought the below up; suspect Eastern are to credit!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-44190066

[P330]

No it doesn't. It shows, after depreciation a book value of £5m. And if you look at the full balance sheet, the liabilities are greater than the assets. Not a healthy balance sheet at all. You need to read the full accounts Beafer....

[VentureGo]

KLM 1533 from AMS this morning diverted to Newcastle, and returning from NCL to AMS as KL1534 departed at 13:25 just ahead of Newcastle's own service KL960 - Passengers being ferried by coach to/from MME

[SWBKCB]

KLM 1533 from AMS this morning diverted to Newcastle, and returning from NCL to AMS as KL1534 departed at 13:25 just ahead of Newcastle's own service KL960 - Passengers being ferried by coach to/from MME

DTV Movements reporting a fire cover issue.

[Plane.Silly]

KLM 1533 from AMS this morning diverted to Newcastle, and returning from NCL to AMS as KL1534 departed at 13:25 just ahead of Newcastle's own service KL960 - Passengers being ferried by coach to/from MME

Well that certainly won't do their punctuality figures any good :p

[oldart]

DTV Movements reporting a fire cover issue.
Did the fire service ever help with off loading/loading baggage at MME?

[SWBKCB]

No 'secret deal' behind airport controversy - councilor (http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/16251447.No___39_secret_deal__39__behind_airport_controversy/)

And Cllr David Walsh, the Labour leader of the authority at the time, believed the airport does have a future but wanted to dismiss the rumours surrounding the sale of the airport. He said: “There is no secret hidden at the bottom of this, it was a very simple issue faced by the local authorities at that time that would not alter one iota, if it was happening now we would have to take the same decision. There’s no Da Vinci code in the middle of it, there is no hidden horde of gold, there is no strange Masonic handshakes between Peel and the local authorities – people want to believe that sort of thing and that is what motivates quite a lot of this."

[N707ZS]

Amazed Beafer hasn't posted this, must be walking the dog.


https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/stockton-council-leader-agrees-make-14762997

[highwideandugly]

What ever..i have never seen the airport so quiet at almost the hight of a summer season....sorry guys things have to change...

[No-More-Bullschit]

Pie in the sky but worth a post. Easyjet want a Heathrow base with us as a destination...

easyJet reveals routes for potential Heathrow base at anna.aero-RABA HubLab conference; 18 domestic destinations identified (http://www.anna.aero/2018/06/14/easyjet-reveals-routes-for-potential-heathrow-base-at-anna-aero-raba-hublab-conference-18-domestic-destinations-identified/)

[Robert-Ryan]

The antagonists over at STA have finally gotten their hands on the original 2003 sale agreement, I haven't read their full post but the jist seems to be that it doesn't teach them anything they didn't already know and true to their style they're exaggerating the negativity of it

[SWBKCB]

The antagonists over at STA have finally gotten their hands on the original 2003 sale agreement, I haven't read their full post but the jist seems to be that it doesn't teach them anything they didn't already know and true to their style they're exaggerating the negativity of it

I agree - not much we didn't know. I've always been a bit baffled about the "valuable land" argument. Much of it will be contaminated and it will have a cost to turn into something useful, and before you do that you need to get change of use and planning permission.

[highwideandugly]

Good précis though and refresher?

place your bets...mayor or peel or or?

still desperately quiet..as bad as last 15 years..something has to change?

[SWBKCB]

Good précis though and refresher?

But where's the smoking gun that was being looked for?

[Robert-Ryan]

There isn't one, and once again it should be stressed that any barren spell is not down to the actions of Peel.

Looks like today might be the start of housing...diggers moved in and even the bomb squad are on site "just checking".

[OMGitsDAVE]

Pie in the sky but worth a post. Easyjet want a Heathrow base with us as a destination...

easyJet reveals routes for potential Heathrow base at anna.aero-RABA HubLab conference; 18 domestic destinations identified (http://www.anna.aero/2018/06/14/easyjet-reveals-routes-for-potential-heathrow-base-at-anna-aero-raba-hublab-conference-18-domestic-destinations-identified/)

Now this would be interesting, and may even offer up some kind of competition to BA at LBA/NCL. easyJet could certainly make it work, as their fares are generally pretty good and thus would attract a wider audience.

[tigertanaka]

Now this would be interesting, and may even offer up some kind of competition to BA at LBA/NCL. easyJet could certainly make it work, as their fares are generally pretty good and thus would attract a wider audience.

Assuming a double daily MME-LHR with a based A319, is it really realistic for Easyjet to sell 300 seats a day each way on this route?

[PDXCWL45]

Assuming a double daily MME-LHR with a based A319, is it really realistic for Easyjet to sell 300 seats a day each way on this route?
Won't the A319s be phased out by then? It'd be A320 surely?

[SWBKCB]

Won't EZY be flying there green Eco-plane by then?

[Fly757X]

Won't the A319s be phased out by then? It'd be A320 surely?

The A319s are not going completely, some were bought by Allegiant Air and then leased back a few years ago until now. Yes there is multiple leaving but they are not on the way "out" as per say. It's more just fleet optimisation.

[oldart]

Assuming a double daily MME-LHR with a based A319, is it really realistic for Easyjet to sell 300 seats a day each way on this route?
As long as the fares were on a par with the train fare to Heathrow, then why not. More passengers are using Heathrow as a hub for connecting flights, not just business but leisure as well.

[GrahamK]

Bare in mind the destinations suggested from LHR are theoretical, and the vast majority of them unrealistic. Why choose MME when you have a base in NCL, why PIK over GLA, who the hell would fly CWL-LHR for example??

[AirportPlanner1]

Actually hypothetically if slots were plentiful you could see the likes of BRS/CWL/NWI to LHR. Very short routes exist at other hub airports for feed eg BRU-AMS, NAP/PIS-FCO, DUS-FRA. Even more so in the USA.

[SWBKCB]

If's, but's and maybe's.
If the runway gets built, if Easy move to LHR, if they operate domestic flights to none base UK destinations...

[EGPO]

Out of curiosity but seeing how easyJet don't pay any fees at Southend and they are about to have Ryanair as competition next year, it begs the question why for now they are not offering all these airports a service to Southend .
After all doesn't the new Crossrail link to Liverpool Street or close enough., Public transport in the capital by year's end is going to be pretty good.
It would prove if nothing else demand for London services , ok it's not direct but Crossrail had the Heathrow link, if they could work with the TFL or whomever operates Crossrail then perhaps some kind of through the ticketing as far as Heathrow.
Trouble is EZY are not linked unlike Flybe to the bigger carriers , so the onus is on the passenger to grab bags and hot foot it to wherever the connection is .
Time had come for them to join the club and be a star alliance member .

[Fairdealfrank]

Pie in the sky but worth a post. Easyjet want a Heathrow base with us as a destination...

easyJet reveals routes for potential Heathrow base at anna.aero-RABA HubLab conference; 18 domestic destinations identified (http://www.anna.aero/2018/06/14/easyjet-reveals-routes-for-potential-heathrow-base-at-anna-aero-raba-hublab-conference-18-domestic-destinations-identified/)

Not necessaily, MME is on BE's list as well. Who knows, maybe BD regional will be back. Third rwy changes everything, it's also a long way off. Everything will be different then.



Now this would be interesting, and may even offer up some kind of competition to BA at LBA/NCL. easyJet could certainly make it work, as their fares are generally pretty good and thus would attract a wider audience.

Indeed!



As long as the fares were on a par with the train fare to Heathrow, then why not. More passengers are using Heathrow as a hub for connecting flights, not just business but leisure as well.

What train to Heathrow? Trains do not run from the north to Heathrow, and never will, despite the fact that the reopening and upgrading of just 4 miles of track could make it possible.

Thr truth is that a MME-LHR link will be the making of the airport.

Bare in mind the destinations suggested from LHR are theoretical, and the vast majority of them unrealistic. Why choose MME when you have a base in NCL, why PIK over GLA, who the hell would fly CWL-LHR for example??

Who knows what will be viable several years hence? Clearly it isn't feasible now, but carriers are looking at the possibilities and they must have good commercial reasons for doing so.

Actually hypothetically if slots were plentiful you could see the likes of BRS/CWL/NWI to LHR. Very short routes exist at other hub airports for feed eg BRU-AMS, NAP/PIS-FCO, DUS-FRA. Even more so in the USA.

Of course the roads are ever more congested, gridlocked, and journey times cannot be guaranteed, the railways are over crowded, expensive, riddled with delays cancellations and strikes, and journey times cannot also be guaranteed. It's entirely possible that air may provide the remedy for many...........don't discount it yet!




Out of curiosity but seeing how easyJet don't pay any fees at Southend and they are about to have Ryanair as competition next year, it begs the question why for now they are not offering all these airports a service to Southend .
After all doesn't the new Crossrail link to Liverpool Street or close enough., Public transport in the capital by year's end is going to be pretty good.
It would prove if nothing else demand for London services , ok it's not direct but Crossrail had the Heathrow link, if they could work with the TFL or whomever operates Crossrail then perhaps some kind of through the ticketing as far as Heathrow.
Trouble is EZY are not linked unlike Flybe to the bigger carriers , so the onus is on the passenger to grab bags and hot foot it to wherever the connection is .
Time had come for them to join the club and be a star alliance member

For some unknown reason crossrail isn't going to Southend! The tracks are electrified, the infrastructure is there and the route is an extension of the line to/from Shenfield. The line is also a major commuter area, so who knows why? This means that Soutend airport will not be on crossrail. Apologies for the thread drift.

[highwideandugly]

Really interesting update on the Prestwick thread re their future.


Its so sad to see a once great airport on its knees and with huge debt.Surrounded by sea on one side and two pretty successful airports to the north/east.
only half a million passengers per year..falling cargo flights and movements.
The possibility of it all being sold for housing developments..in a nutshell unloved and unwanted by the vast majority..
Pinning hopes on a service to London 15 years ahead..

Local pEople who care trying their best but probably treading water....
All sounds very familiar?

[oldart]

Plenty of radio adverts for the Balkan Holidays next year, shame the likes of TUI and Thomas Cook are not there as well.

[N707ZS]

That's the meddling Mayors fault.

[SWBKCB]

That's the meddling Mayors fault.

I thought it was Peel that cancelled the TUI contract?

[Robert-Ryan]

They were ready to base an aircraft if rumours are to be believed

[N707ZS]

I didn't mention TUI. "The likes of".

[SWBKCB]

Make you minds up, guys!

[VentureGo]

Peel cancelled the contracts .. OK! (Thomson ET AL..! ... at the time (TUI UK came later) ... N707ZSzzzzzzzzzzz....IT WAS Peel that ruined prospects of immediate future mass charter flights due to their presiding business model based purely on profitability of operations and a questionable view on the future of their recently acquired asset. - Their main portfolio of business being property development for housing & industry (Media City, Salford, Intu Shopping Centres etc....

[N707ZS]

Venture think you z key is broke mate!

[VentureGo]

No! ........

[N707ZS]

Your . is also broke.

[VentureGo]

No - Minimum response is 10 characters.

[Robert-Ryan]

Peel cancelled the contracts .. OK! (Thomson ET AL..! ... at the time (TUI UK came later) same airline just different name?!... N707ZSzzzzzzzzzzz....IT WAS Peel that ruined prospects of immediate future mass charter flights due to their presiding business model based purely on profitability of operations and a questionable view on the future of their recently acquired asset.Nothing questionable, perfectly sensible business accumen. - Their main portfolio of business being property development for housing & industry (Media City, Salford, Intu Shopping Centres etc....and several ports...
All irrelevant now anyway...

[oldart]

Peel at fault, the councils at fault and the Mayor at fault, whatever, one holiday company for next year will not solve the problem. The blame game is not getting the situation put right, it's either a housing estate or an airport for the use of the public. At approaching one million passengers I found using the airport very enjoyable, now the enjoyment has gone, how sad.

[highwideandugly]

The previous mentioned were all at fault..and so were the public of Teesside for not supporting completely the airport.However you can understand that..cost is a major issue followed by choice and availability..so operators also to blame.

The aviation world has changed..is there really a place for 3 airports within a short distance..include Manchester and Edinburgh then all NE. Airports are being squeezed?

its decision time soon..get your money on the runners and riders...PEEL,Mayor or just maybe..someone else’s??

[highwideandugly]

As Bjork..so beautifully put it..” It’s all so quiet”. is anything happening guys or do we just continue in the malaise that it has become.

ok no news is good news..but surely!

someone mentioned diggers moving in for the houses..haven’t been up for a while...is this ongoing?
even Beafer seems to have hibernated?

i really love a busy summer season..oh well.....zzzz.....

[N707ZS]

Beafer's probably in rehab reading the old papers looking for something that doesn't exist!

[gilesdavies]

With Balkan now flying from Teesside, maybe Wizz Air will take notice and consider opening a base at Teesside Airport.

Especially with flights to Central and Eastern Europe.

Look at what they have done at Luton with now around 50-60 flights a day, they could do the same at Durham-Tees Valley-Darlington-Stockton-Middlesbrough-Hartlepool-Teeside International Airport.

From there they also fly to Italy, Iceland, Croatia, Cyprus and Israel! Teesiders Im sure would love the new routes.

[SWBKCB]

With Balkan now flying from Teesside, maybe Wizz Air will take notice and consider opening a base at Teesside Airport. Especially with flights to Central and Eastern Europe.

Look at what they have done at Luton with now around 50-60 flights a day, they could do the same at Durham-Tees Valley-Darlington-Stockton-Middlesbrough-Hartlepool-Teeside International Airport. From there they also fly to Italy, Iceland, Croatia, Cyprus and Israel! Teesiders Im sure would love the new routes.

Wizz will be put off by the Ryanair flights....

Ryanair pilots to strike with thousands of travellers facing potential chaos (https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/ryanair-pilots-strike-thousands-travellers-14869959)

Thousands of holidaymakers are facing travel chaos after Ryanair (https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/all-about/ryanair) pilots voted overwhelmingly in favour of striking this month. Customers will find out next Tuesday whether their flights will be affected.Durham Tees Valley Airport (https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/all-about/durham-tees-valley-airport) uses the budget airline, as does Newcastle International Airport, and Leeds Bradford Airport - all popular travel points for Teessiders.

Another Gazette triumph :=

[highwideandugly]

Hi guys..in the interest of local pride,airport interest and continuity..can we all check in?

Been nothing on this thread for weeks of interest...others might think it’s closed!


so come on...check in,let’s hope all are well and ready for future battles...commercial,verbal and a touch of humour!...Beafer et al....where are you?

ps...anything happening?


PPS ....... great AMS. Pax figures last couple of months..

[P330]

Checking in...still here! Saw a 737 fly in today....reminded me of summers gone by.

[N707ZS]

P330 that was a horse flight someone's been down to Paris for a couple of days.

[Robert-Ryan]

Highwide don't you worry thread will explode into life before very much longer

[highwideandugly]

Just checking on everyone s welfare!


yep I know...all I can say is...be careful what you wish for....it might not be the yellow brick road some on here want?

[P330]

Is that a tease for 'newsworthy event' pending Robert?😉

[Lancelot37]

Is that a tease for 'newsworthy event' pending Robert?😉



We won't hold our breath!

[something_diferent]

Interesting times ahead? Movement between the mayor and peel? Loganair coming back with tail between their legs?

[P330]

Local rag reporting that an EasyJet flight circuit bashing at MME made an emergency landing at Newcastle due to a bird strike.

[N707ZS]

They possibly pinched the info from the DTVA movements site and didn't give credit!

[Beafer]

DTV Airport is owned by Whittaker who has invested heavily in the INTU Shopping centre empire.
He won't be happy about INTU losing £500 million in the first 6 months of 2018.

INTU company loses £500m in first 6 months. CEO resigns.
https://www.expressandstar.com/news/business/2018/07/26/merry-hill-owner-intu-plunges-into-red-after-fall-in-the-value-of-its-shopping-centres/

The Times report - INTU- Whittaker borrowed heavily.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tycoon-john-whittaker-borrowed-heavily-against-stake-in-intu-qz2d0xxmz

More on the big losses.
https://www.bisnow.com/manchester/news/retail/is-john-whittaker-the-big-looser-from-the-hammersonintu-sale-fail-87623
The Peel group owner may need to tighten his belt due to heavy INTU losses. I doubt he'll be drinking champaign in the Isle of Man ;)

[N707ZS]

Just when you thought you had flushed it and it won't come back, but NO! up it pops!

[No-More-Bullschit]

Ben Houchen launched this yesterday, ignoring the breach of non-disclosure agreement it would seem he's on the brink of success??

https://www.benhouchen.com/campaigns/our-airport

[Beatts]

Could we be looking at a Stobart air jobby or another operator?

[highwideandugly]

It’s what a few have known And suspected for sometime.Long way to go but quite a few on here will probably have to change their allegiance!
new owners? Think more NW ?

[SWBKCB]

Does the mayors statement say anything that hasn't been said publicly before?

[highwideandugly]

Maybe not on the surface..but an outcome is a lot closer.As I also said earlier..be careful what the majority on here wish for.

[No-More-Bullschit]

Nothing new no but very much a change of tone, he's talking as if it's now a dead cert

[N707ZS]

He/they might end up with the airport but not the whole airfield.

[highwideandugly]

N707...what will that mean in real terms though?

[SWBKCB]

The public get the expensive bits and Peel retain the (potentially) money making development land?

[oldart]

The public get the expensive bits and Peel retain the (potentially) money making development land?
Would that be just the housing development or the hangers as well?

[Robert-Ryan]

The usual gossip at work is several variations of the same rumour, we've been told the future is bright no matter what happens

[N707ZS]

You could get yourself into such a speculative mess of BEAFER and X file proportions, we have waited many years to reach where it is now so might as well wait a little longer!

[highwideandugly]

To you..to me...

[Jamesair]

Whoever eventually runs the airport will still have to deal with the Housing estate problem......housing estates and airports don't mix well and generate a LOT of noise complaints

[Robert-Ryan]

Whilst I'm not disputing an increase in noise complaints, to say there are at least a dozen other airports that prove they can coexist perfectly satisfactorily would be a conservative estimate.

Let's not forget, as far as we know this is just a possibility and just because the Mayor is suggesting a done deal that don't make it so. If it does go through, even with Peel retaining some, even say the bulk of the land, at least it will prove there was never a plan to shut the airport!

[oldart]

Surely if you don't like noise, you then don't buy a house near an airport.

[SWBKCB]

If it does go through, even with Peel retaining some, even say the bulk of the land, at least it will prove there was never a plan to shut the airport!

Depends what you mean by 'a plan', but it's clear that Peel have considered it and retained it as an option (negotiating tool?) if losses continued and became unsustainable.


Surely if you don't like noise, you then don't buy a house near an airport.

You'll get nowhere applying logic....:ok:

[shamrock7seal]

Is KLM happy with their performance on the MME-AMS route?

[N707ZS]

Yes! As far as we know.

[highwideandugly]

Looking at the great DTV. Website today..so sad almost nothing happening.
Got me thinking..at what point does an airport become a complete basket case and completely unviable.

surely the losses must be escalating on a daily basis.
i know the rumours..and probably these will come to fruition,but will anything really change?

Staffing levels at an all time low,business at an all time low and even the ancillary input is quiet.

lots of local people want a vibrant go ahead airport..but I fear it’s going to be too little too late?

So sad and Prestwick in a similar position? Manston,Coventry,Blackpool all come to mind.

[N707ZS]

40 movements in total so not that quiet.

[Robert-Ryan]

The general belief is the airport may be in some kind of shut-down/hiatus at management/marketing level until certain on-going matters reach a conclusion one way or another. If true that would affect Consort as a Peel subsidiary and therefore levels of visiting aircraft.

[No-More-Bullschit]

Gazette reporting the north-south link road has been re-applied for today, with no changes to the previously approved application

[N707ZS]

New twist in the saga, I wonder if the mayor will object. I see the Gazette is whipping up the usual idiot brigade in its comments.

[Gunfighter52]

I see PTT Aviation ceased trading yesterday and has entered voluntarily liquidation. NALjets on the other hand continues to operate.

[Nurse2Pilot]

I see PTT Aviation ceased trading yesterday and has entered voluntarily liquidation. NALjets on the other hand continues to operate.Do you have a source for this?

[Gunfighter52]

There's more information in the Newcastle thread, including the letter handed to staff.

[Beafer]

Cant see the problem with building these small units in Urlay Nook on the centre line for DTVA. The site is planned for the empty space next door to the Police gun training centre. Site is behind trees and bushes.
When Yarm fair is taking place travellers tend to park their caravans in the lay-by next to the site.
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/homeowners-shocked-appalled-plan-industrial-15066516

[oldart]

Not in my back yard seems to spring to mind. Could there be a reason for MME to object to these new units?

[SWBKCB]

Sorry, but's what the relevance to MME - or do any planning applications in the general vacinity get a mention now?

[Beafer]

Sorry, but's what the relevance to MME - or do any planning applications in the general vacinity get a mention now?

Yes they do when they are just down the road on the centre line :)

DTV Airport also gets a mention in this planning application a bit further out on the centre line.
More wind turbines. I wonder if Peel object to these turbines like they did during the Middlesbrough Football Club turbine debacle?
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/two-wind-turbines-taller-london-15071196

[Nurse2Pilot]

I think you know more than we do, Beafer. Are the PTT aircraft still in EGNV? Hangar doors were closed last time I was in the airport.

[Beafer]

I think you know more than we do, Beafer. Are the PTT aircraft still in EGNV? Hangar doors were closed last time I was in the airport.

Peel might have the keys to open their hangar. There are more details on the Professional training thread on Pprune from pilots who were training with them.

Today press news re company.

https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/business/business-news/learner-pilots-grounded-durham-tees-15086925

[Beafer]

Rumour in the village is that the Tees Valley Mayor may be looking into leasing the airport buildings, runway and hangars if there are no objections to Peel building more houses.
It would make sense to Peel to offload the expense of paying staff etc. Talks are ongoing according to insiders at the ghost town.

Wonder if this will mean that there won't be any late night flights to keep the neighbours happy if the deal is done?

[N707ZS]

If he leases the buildings I wonder who will be responsible for the repairs? "If the Mayor brings in the flights that everyone want's", you are bound to get late night all night holiday flights, just look at the arrivals at the neighbouring airports.

[Beafer]

If he leases the buildings I wonder who will be responsible for the repairs? "If the Mayor brings in the flights that everyone want's", you are bound to get late night all night holiday flights, just look at the arrivals at the neighbouring airports.

The councils already pay the DTV airport staff pensions, so they would probably pick up the repairs bill.
Noticed Peel are pushing their new warehouses at airport locations such as the old Sheffield Airport site on their Logistics twitter page.
Wonder why they didn't invest in large warehouses at DTVA? Would have thought the rents would have helped the airport. Peek were going to bring cargo into DTVA but it didn't happen?
https://twitter.com/PeelLogistics

[SWBKCB]

Wonder why they didn't invest in large warehouses at DTVA?

You mean like the one's proposed in the Masterplan? :rolleyes:

[LTNman]

The thought of the day is that substantially more people have viewed this thread than passengers passing through this airport in a 12 month period.

Seem to remember that Peel Airports sold the airport back to Peel Holdings in or around 2012. So why would Peel Holdings want to buy a loss making enterprise when its other company could not turn the airport around? It wouldn’t be for the land it sits on would it?

[N707ZS]

At the end of the day land is useless until you actually find someone who actually wants to use it, even the local housing market is flooded.

[oldart]

Social Housing! Somehow I don't think so, that does not make as much profit. Back to the drawing board.

[LTNman]

Airports can be served with an Asset of Community Value order by the council. This means when Peel Airports sold the airport to Peel Holdings in 2012 the council would have had 6 months to match the bid to get control of the airport. Wonder what the sale price was? A community order would have stopped them selling it for a £1 to themselves.

[N707ZS]

Perhaps the council didn't want it and the debt, been done to death on here, you should know as you have been on her since 2002! When the Mayor plan goes tits up they might buy it back for £1 again. You also missed the Canadian saga.

[tigertanaka]

The councils already pay the DTV airport staff pensions, so they would probably pick up the repairs bill.
Noticed Peel are pushing their new warehouses at airport locations such as the old Sheffield Airport site on their Logistics twitter page.
Wonder why they didn't invest in large warehouses at DTVA? Would have thought the rents would have helped the airport. Peek were going to bring cargo into DTVA but it didn't happen?
https://twitter.com/PeelLogistics

I thought the councils had picked up the potential future liability for any deficit in the pension funds? This is quite different to actually paying the pensions.

Normal commercial practice is for the tenant to be responsible for repairs and maintenance of the property that they are renting (normally to the standard it was in when the lease started).

[Beafer]

I thought the councils had picked up the potential future liability for any deficit in the pension funds? This is quite different to actually paying the pensions.

Normal commercial practice is for the tenant to be responsible for repairs and maintenance of the property that they are renting (normally to the standard it was in when the lease started).

Some light reading regarding Peel and the DTVA staff pensions.
Echo DTVA pension news.
£6.5m 'pensions bombshell' part of plans to save Durham Tees Valley airport | The Northern Echo (http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/13719288.__6_5m__pensions_bombshell__part_of_plans_to_save_D urham_Tees_Valley_airport/)

Gazette - DTVA pensions news 2015. Unions concerned.
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/durham-tees-valley-airport-staff-10053614

Update.
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/owner-durham-tees-valley-airport-10071817

DTVA - Deed of variation of Pensions Admission by Durham Council.
https://democracy.durham.gov.uk/documents/s38085/DTVA%20-%20Deed%20of%20Variation%20-%2012%2002%2014.pdf

[tigertanaka]

Some light reading regarding Peel and the DTVA staff pensions.
Echo DTVA pension news.
£6.5m 'pensions bombshell' part of plans to save Durham Tees Valley airport The Northern Echo (http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/13719288.__6_5m__pensions_bombshell__part_of_plans_to_save_D urham_Tees_Valley_airport/)

Gazette - DTVA pensions news 2015. Unions concerned.
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/durham-tees-valley-airport-staff-10053614

Update.
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/owner-durham-tees-valley-airport-10071817

DTVA - Deed of variation of Pensions Admission by Durham Council.
https://democracy.durham.gov.uk/documents/s38085/DTVA%20-%20Deed%20of%20Variation%20-%2012%2002%2014.pdf

So the have (potentially) walked away from their share of any potential historic liability (has this actually been confirmed?), not from paying the pensions of retired employees (as they were always paid by the councils anyhow). Current employees presumably now have a defined contribution scheme that replaced the final salary scheme (as has happened in virtually every other non-government business in the UK).

[Beatts]

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/490x712/capture_7a36685552cd8bdbbc43dff8719aaf9a3c796532.png

[Robert-Ryan]

Saw that earlier, what a kn*b! His three points couldn't be any less true

[N707ZS]

Definitely a joker that one, usually pops up when everything is done and claims it for himself. Teesside doesn't exist so there's nothing to save.

[jensdad]

Teesside doesn't exist so there's nothing to save.

Highways England seem to think it does, if the signs on the A1 (which date from long after the name change) are anything to go by! I know this has been done to death, but the fact that the airport management call the airport by a vastly different name to a large part of the local populace (and HE) is symptomatic of the general shambles the airport has become. I am from Newcastle but it gives me no pleasure at all to say so.

[No-More-Bullschit]

the general shambles the airport has become.
Care to elaborate? Before you do perhaps first acquaint yourself with this (https://dtva.info/pdf/dtva-your-questions-answered.pdf).

[jensdad]

Care to elaborate? Before you do perhaps first acquaint yourself with this (https://dtva.info/pdf/dtva-your-questions-answered.pdf).
I remember when MME had flights to the Dominican Republic when Newcastle had none. Prague was served from MME before Newcastle. AMS, CDG, LHR all served simultaneously from MME, now you're just left with AMS. Taking a view over the last twenty years it is impossible to claim that things have gone anything other than disastrously. As I say, although NCL is my 'local', there is no gloating from me. It genuinely saddens me to see what has become of MME.

[No-More-Bullschit]

Different world, different time, different market place. Several other airports around the country can make the same nostalgic recollections, the insinuation that it is just MME or MMEs fault winds me up

[N707ZS]

Sounds like a job for Beafer, digging into the dirty dead's of routes and marketing in the 80s and 90s.

[Beafer]

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/16859487.loss-making-durham-tees-valley-hotel-facing-closure/?ref=fbshr

[tigertanaka]

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/16859487.loss-making-durham-tees-valley-hotel-facing-closure/?ref=fbshr

Shame as the car parking charges at the hotel are about 1/3 of what it costs to park in the main car park.

Having said that, I don’t know how many times I have tried to call the hotel to pre-book my parking and they don’t pick up or don’t know how to take a credit card payment over the phone.

[Flightrider]

This surely can't come as a surprise to anyone who has visited this millenium. Stayed there last year and whilst friendly, clean and accommodating, it is very dated and the paucity of other guests left you with a very strange feeling.

[Convair 440]

I have followed quite a few coaches in to the Airport going to the George hotel over the last few years
looks like they use the George as a stop off for touring coaches

[Beafer]

MP has suggested that the hotel staff are kept on by Peel. - Peel - no comment.
Whats the betting the housing estate plans change to add a few more houses where the hotel stands. Peel will probably build right up to the edge of the main car park which will become smaller ;)
Councillors will probably know more!
Any news on the new houses from the Peel insiders on here?
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/staff-durham-tees-valley-airport-15153710

[mmeman]

Eastern/Flybe

Such a shame Loganair stopped their service to Aberdeen, the reliability of the Eastern/Flybe services is appalling, 2 out of the 3 flights from Aberdeen cancelled today - wonder how Flybe view all these cancellations and delays? The passenger figures will drop again to the 1100 odd per month before Loganair came on the scene and doubled the number of passengers on the route.

[Flightrider]

I suspect they'd be back if Eastern disappeared. Trouble is that many of the smaller routes aren't worth an expensive fight over until one or the other prevails.

[N707ZS]

Possibly due to the bad weather and workers mainly come home on a Friday afternoon.

[P330]

Anyone heard anything from Sycamore Aviation recently? Unless I've missed it, it must have been a while since I heard of an aircraft coming in to be parted out.

Hope they're doing ok!

[Convair 440]

They have a facillity in Goodyear AZ USA looks like there work has moved over the pond

[Beafer]

Anyone heard anything from Sycamore Aviation recently? Unless I've missed it, it must have been a while since I heard of an aircraft coming in to be parted out.

Hope they're doing ok!

They appear to be doing well in America on their twitter page. Good luck to them. :ok:
https://twitter.com/Sycamoresales

[Scottie Dog]

Thanks for the update on the US operation but, as the posted asked, how are they doing at MME. Are they still alive?

[Robert-Ryan]

I think as an active tenant they've moved out, but from what I'm told if they won any European contracts they would return for the duration of said contract. Not sure how accurate that is though

[N707ZS]

Almost another month gone by and all's quiet, nothing from the mayor, Peel or any development be it houses, roads or hangars. On the up shall we say we gained the JP from Newcastle, they supposedly didn't want it, but hangarage, fuel and fees make money.

[Convair 440]

Almost another month gone by and all's quiet, nothing from the mayor, Peel or any development be it houses, roads or hangars. On the up shall we say we gained the JP from Newcastle, they supposedly didn't want it, but hangarage, fuel and fees make money.

Is that no news is good news
or is it the calm before the storm

[Beafer]

Is that no news is good news
or is it the calm before the storm

Word in the village is that this plan is about to change. More house on the hotel site maybe?
Durham Tees Valley Airport - Fairhursts Design Group (http://fairhursts.com/project/durham-tees-valley-airport/)

[N707ZS]

Wish anything would happen!

[jetstar.8]

Wish anything would happen!

Might DTVA get some cargo flights when a major online retailer opens a warehouse at Morton Park Darlington in 2019

[jensdad]

Might DTVA get some cargo flights when a major online retailer opens a warehouse at Morton Park Darlington in 2019
Interesting possibility. No 'interesting' one-offs I would guess, as their supply and dist chains will be well-established. But it will definitely result in greater numbers of DHL, UPS, or whoever they use, parcels emanating from the Teesside area. Making a nightly flight viable? A possibility I would say.

[N707ZS]

We already have numerous car spares factories and they produce nothing. On the other hand when TNT cargo was operating they occasionally had two aircraft so there was some demand there.

[Beatts]

Peel group making a bid for INTU it seems.

[VentureGo]

Peel group making a bid for INTU it seems.

John Whittaker (Peel Group Chairman) is the largest shareholder of Intu Group and is Deputy Chairman on the Intu board, so possibly going for either a majority share in Intu or a full takeover?

[highwideandugly]

Think it’s all gone quiet again...a few including me were expecting some news this week but..nothing..maybe next?

still so very quiet at the drome..

[Beafer]

John Whittaker (Peel Group Chairman) is the largest shareholder of Intu Group and is Deputy Chairman on the Intu board, so possibly going for either a majority share in Intu or a full takeover?

Saudi money behind the possible purchase. Whitty is just the front man.
Intu Properties surges as consortium mulls offer | Digital Look (http://shareidol.com/news/28098758/Intu_Properties_surges_as_Peel_led_consortium_mulls_offer.ht ml)

[N707ZS]

Come on then, what's Intu go to do with DTVA!

[highwideandugly]

I’m lost too....

my guess 50% housing//retail//schools//offices..all Peel

50%. Mayors airport/airfield with limited connectivity and operations and no chance of growth...take your pick guys..

Airport there..but for how long?

[VentureGo]

Come on then, what's Intu go to do with DTVA!

Whittaker ! - Keep Up.... - He owns control of both! .... well virtually.....

Land is the key! ... then conversion of use?!... maybe!

[Robert-Ryan]

Try as hard as you like to make a connection but Intu has bot all to do with DTVA or this thread

[N707ZS]

Good as comparing Newcastle United with JJB sports then!...

[Beafer]

Whittaker ! - Keep Up.... - He owns control of both! .... well virtually.....

Land is the key! ... then conversion of use?!... maybe!

Whittaker will be looking for cash after the Hammersmith INTU takeover failure as he will need millions to buy the Intu shares to gain full control.
Due to the ongoing search for cash DTVA may find a new buyer if he decides to offload the site, but he's usually in it for the long haul especially with Saudi backers.

Land is key to his plans, airlines and staff are not, especially up north. He must have thought it was xmas when he grabbed DTVA and its 800+ acres for half a million!!
The Masterplan isn't going anywhere if you hadn't noticed......
Question to the Peel supporters/workers on here. How much is costing to run DTVA per year?

[SWBKCB]

The money involved in DTVA is insignificant in terms of the amounts being talked about in terms of INTU etc. The fate of the Peel empire doesn't revolve around what happens to DTVA.

[skyman771]

Good as comparing Newcastle United with JJB sports then!...
Go on then what's JJB sports got to do with anything at all ?

[Robert-Ryan]

Nothing that's the point he was making...

[Convair 440]

Any one know what the low wooden fence around the grass next to the old hanger 4 concrete base is for?

[N707ZS]

Thought at least one would take the bate!

[Beafer]

Any one know what the low wooden fence around the grass next to the old hanger 4 concrete base is for?

Answer A: Putting green.
Answer B: Crazy golf for the management.
Answer C: Waste disposal with FOD containment in mind ;)

[jetstar.8]

Answer A: Putting green.
Answer B: Crazy golf for the management.
Answer C: Waste disposal with FOD containment in mind ;)

might be to keep sheep or goats

[N707ZS]

Looks like hangar 4 concrete is being used for HGV training, so fence might be just a health and safety requirement, keep Beafer and his dog out!

[Convair 440]

Looks like hangar 4 concrete is being used for HGV training, so fence might be just a health and safety requirement, keep Beafer and his dog out!

Thank you for a sensible answer N707ZS

[Beafer]

Any update on the staff at the hotel?
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/staff-durham-tees-valley-airport-15153710

[Cautious Optimist]

Speaking to one of the staff recently they have been offered alternative, similar positions elsewhere within the airport.

[Beafer]

Steve Gill has left Peel, and started a new job at Bournemouth Airport yesterday. Also shown on Linkedin.

https://www.bournemouthairport.com/news/

[Beafer]

Steve Gill has left Peel, and started a new job at Bournemouth Airport yesterday. Also shown on Linkedin.

https://www.bournemouthairport.com/news/

So he hit the ground running it said when he started. He didn't improve things from what I can see. Airport is very quiet today.

https://www.questia.com/newspaper/1G1-267418376/the-man-who-can-turn-round-an-airport-sarah-dale
Wonder who will be the next one on the throne? Its probably been decided at the last lodge meeting ;)

Will the next candidate hit the ground running, or head for another airport after seeing the Peel Master Plans! :hmm:

[Robert-Ryan]

Steve Gill has had nothing to do with DTVA for months, our MD is David Grant

[Beafer]

Steve Gill has had nothing to do with DTVA for months, our MD is David Grant

Steve was the CEO of Peel Airports, which made him Dave’s boss I believe, and in charge of DTVA unless I am mistaken? Dave was promoted in March 2018 after serving as commercial director.
Steve's Linkedin
https://nz.linkedin.com/in/stephen-gill-ba7a9919/de
Linkedin copy
CEO: Peel Airports (Management) Limited, Doncaster Sheffield & Durham Tees Valley Airports
Peel Airports Limited
August 2011 – September 2018 7 years 2 months
Doncaster, United Kingdom. Responsible for the strategic development and general management of Robin Hood Doncaster Sheffield and Durham Tees Valley Airports.


Peel H&S document which was signed by CEO Steve, and shows management layout. Note the DTV logo at the top of the page.
http://dsa.aero/assets/uploads/files/SD_001.pdf

Any idea why Steve left Robert?

[Robert-Ryan]

There may be some kind of accountability to Steve Gill but my understanding is David since being appointed MD reports directly to the Peel board following a breakaway from DSA. Why does any of this matter anyway?

[Beafer]

There may be some kind of accountability to Steve Gill but my understanding is David since being appointed MD reports directly to the Peel board following a breakaway from DSA. Why does any of this matter anyway?

it matters as its not a baggage handler who has left, its the Peel Airports CEO who has departed from the top job at Peel Airports Ltd. Is there something in the wind about where DTV is going, or DSA?

After all this is what Peel said when Steve was appointed. He seems to have been with Peel for a while doing other jobs prior to the CEO number, so why jump ship, or was he pushed? :confused:
Maybe Robert or Robert Hough can answer the simple question??
https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/9205592.BREAKING_NEWS__New_airport_director_for_Durham_Tees_ Valley/

Quote from Peel: The company said Mr Gill had almost 30 years’ experience in the aviation industry and has extensive expertise in airport planning and management. "Steve knows Durham Tees Valley Airport well, having played a key role in the original majority acquisition of the Airport by Peel in 2003 and worked on many of the £30m improvements that have taken place at the airport since then," a spokesman said.

"During his career with Peel Airports, Steve has also held responsibility for a wide range of services including IT, property management, health and safety, corporate and social responsibility along with various outsourced service contracts.

"Steve joins Durham Tees Valley at an important time in the airport’s development and is under no illusions over the challenging times ahead, not just for the airport but the industry as a whole.

"He is, however, confident that the airport can capitalise on the tremendous support that it continues to receive both from the public and organisations across the region, despite what is currently a difficult time for the airport."

Mr Gill said: “Having been involved with the airport in other aspects of its development in recent years, I am now naturally delighted to be able to take the airport forward in this new capacity and to explore all opportunities as we try to develop the business here."

[N707ZS]

Newcastle's CEO left and went to Leeds!

[Robert-Ryan]

You're reading too much into it, maybe they offered him more money, he just fancied a change or he wanted to go down south where traditionally it's far more aviation rich?? Chances are nothing sinister.

[Beafer]

The press covered Steve's departure, and the "Public comments" under the news piece appear to be what the public think of him jumping ship.
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/durham-tees-valley-chief-exec-15293101

[Nurse2Pilot]

Wasn't the plan to bleed DTVA in order to bolster Doncaster?

[highwideandugly]

Another summer gone..more wasted months..to be honest(hurrah say most) I’ve just about given up.Not worth posting rants,praise,potential or anything on the site.Doldrums methinks.All the hopes and promises of the diehard posters have even dried up.

prove me wrong but goodness knows what the next couple of years will bring?

[Cautious Optimist]

A fellow enthusiast recently used the following paragraph regarding the comments under a similar aviation related newspaper article and it could not be more true:

"Don’t worry about exam grades kids....read a few comments from this post (or any) on the chronicle page and just remember these are functioning human beings who live amongst us......worrying isn’t it....."

[Beafer]

Didn't know that Durham Tees Valley Airport had its own Twitter site until it was mentioned in the pub. Shame Steve Gill didn't update it before he left?
Robert Hough might like to update the page with news of another Masterplan number (number 4 or 5) ;)
https://twitter.com/durhamtvairport
Any news on the new buyer, or should that be renter?

[highwideandugly]

Interesting to see all these freight flights using DTV...for such a large industrial area..some might say..it’s about time!,

anyone know what they are for?.

[Gunfighter52]

Car parts apparently, Newcastle are getting some too.

[SWBKCB]

Interesting to see all these freight flights using DTV...for such a large industrial area..some might say..it’s about time!,

anyone know what they are for?.

Nissan - seems to be a mix with NCL getting some as well

[Sharklet_321]

What is being done to try to resurrect a London service?

[highwideandugly]

Interesting Nissan using here..is the tide turning? They loosing more passenger flights than gaining and now freight flights...

you never Know!

[Robert-Ryan]

I was always impressed at how much traffic we're able to attract that is destined for Sunderland (and not just the current freight flights), I'm told it's easier to get to Sunderland from us than it is from Newcastle despite being further away due to better roads. We've had these flights before they'll dry up before much longer no doubt.

Sharklet_321, as much as is possible which is not a lot. They're always talking to airlines* but there are a lack of options, and with City, Gatwick and Heathrow all slot constrained there isn't sufficient point-to-point demand to go to Stansted, Luton or even Southend.

*Probably not at the moment due to on-going takeover efforts by the Mayor; if people think that by following the progress of this airport they know what quiet is then I suspect the next few months will make them realise they don't!

[Nurse2Pilot]

I don't think it's better roads per se but simply less congestion. Up Mill Lane to the A66, then over to the A19, maybe hit some traffic from Thornaby but past Billingham, there wouldn't be too much and even then, it won't be anywhere near what Newcaste would have along the A1 and A1231.

[Robert-Ryan]

Yea that's what I meant upon thinking about it

[N707ZS]

Many years ago something went wrong with engine delivery and DTVA got Belfasts and the one and only IL76 on a few days of activity. Just in time is ok until there is a slip up and you don't have these spares. Strange they use two small aircraft a day instead of one larger one.

[Beafer]

Public comments below the press article make interesting reading, 25 posts up to now.
Will we ever find out why certain council staff allowed Peel to buy 800+ acres for only £500k ? :yuk:

https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/key-elements-durham-tees-valley-15319022

[SWBKCB]

Will we ever find out why certain council staff allowed Peel to buy 800+ acres for only £500k ? https://www.pprune.org/images/smilies/pukey.gif

It's been explained many times on this thread and numerous other places (in simple terms, investment was needed and the councils didn't have the money), but those with 20/20 hindsight insist in trying to re-write history. :yuk: :yuk:

[Cautious Optimist]

And as for the comments under the article see my post #1017

[Beafer]

£500,000 for 800+ acres of prime building land which is probably worth £100 + million... hmmmmm now I wonder who go what to sign that deal :)

Is there a list of names of the people WHO ACTUALLY SIGNED THE SALE OF TEESSIDE AIRPORT TO PEEL??? I dont think anyone has ever answered that question?

[SWBKCB]

800+ acres of prime building land

Really? Says who? Don't remember their being a long queue of buyers.

[Robert-Ryan]

Is there a list of names of the people WHO ACTUALLY SIGNED THE SALE OF TEESSIDE AIRPORT TO PEEL??? I dont think anyone has ever answered that question?
I'd like to see such a list too, so I could thank them for a job well done; for ensuring the airport remained open for decades longer than it would have otherwise, and for doing no worse than anyone else would have.

[canberra97]

What is being done to try to resurrect a London service?

With British Airways reducing capacity on LHR to Newcastle and the impact of better rail connections directly from the northeast to the centre of London how on earth could a Teesside to London service be a viable proposition!

Obviously nothing is being done to try and resurrect a London service for the obvious reasons if that answers your question.

[Beafer]

I'd like to see such a list too, so I could thank them for a job well done; for ensuring the airport remained open for decades longer than it would have otherwise, and for doing no worse than anyone else would have.

So Robert Ryan - you think selling 800+ acres which included a public airport for a fraction of the cost it was really worth was a job well done?! :eek:

DTVA news today. Shame there wasnt more scrutiny in 2003 when Peel got the bargain of a lifetime! A bit like the Sheffield Airport fiasco.
Where you on the council panel at the time Robert? https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/46000-spent-durham-tees-valley-15330799

[SWBKCB]

The sad thing about that article is that the airport is even more starkly in the front line of the battle between the councils and the mayor.

Beefer - can you back up your repeated comments along the line of "the bargain of a lifetime"? Peel have owned DTVA for over 15 years and I can't see that they've made much...

[Robert-Ryan]

So Robert Ryan - you think selling 800+ acres which included a public airport for a fraction of the cost it was really worth was a job well done?! :eek:
That would be the gist of my post, yes...

A bit like the Sheffield Airport fiasco.
No it ain't

[P330]

Back to aviation....

Landed on the 1535 this afternoon and not only was there a freight ATR on the ramp, but also what I assume was a corporate with a handful of black Landrover/Range Rovers parked alongside and some guy In a smart suit. Anyone we know?

[N707ZS]

P330 its Pheasant shooting season so there's all sorts of folk passing through. The freight flight total was four today with two smaller twins and a bizz carrying parts.

[highwideandugly]

Really interesting post on the Blackpool site..is this the way forward for DTV ?

who knows but the quicksand is getting thicker! Here... not on Morecambe Bay!

[SWBKCB]

KLM are the key to the airports future - lose the "global connectivity" selling point and then mayor/local authorities will lose interest, aren't there plenty of better placed "brownfield" sites on Teesside? Planning permission then becomes an issue...

[RoyHudd]

Strange old business. Teesside is not really an airport, just an airstrip. Can't see why it is still open. Government/Regional subsidies?

[N707ZS]

Thought you fell of a roof Government/Regional subsidies? no never only neighbouring airports have been given these. Go back and reed the plot and also take a look at DTV movements.

[Nurse2Pilot]

I think I was hearing about it closing down back in 2014 when I was first looking at flight schools in the area! I do hope it stays open until I finish my PPL!

Cobham operates out of the airport and there are a few commercial flights each week, plus maybe some private ones as well. Not really counting, just based on what I see fly past my window when at home or what flies overhead when I'm in town. A couple of days ago, EasyJet aircraft (two? three?) were doing circuits as well, so it has some use as a practice airfield, perhaps? I also remember before hearing about having aircraft flown into EGNV to be broken for parts, I wonder if that ever happened or if it's still going on?