Okay. I am SLF and a frequent flyer to where the oil industry is based so I am working into places such as ABZ, LOS, PHC, LAD and IAH to name a few. I prefer to fly out of LHR where possible. Despite the cost pressures of my firm (they want me to fly to LOS via Tripoli) I still believe in the BA long haul product. The crews do a damned good job and T5 is simply brilliant compared to T3 which to my eyes has simply papered over the cracks.

Short haul is always a problem but the phasing out of the B734's can't come quickly enough. Ok the interiors a bit naff but if you have a/c which are due to go off lease soon why waste more money doing a refurb? I'd much rather BA save this money and freshen up the interiors of the Airbus fleet.

BA's biggest problem is the decrease in J and W traffic where they make their money and the price of fuel. Its a common problem and in the climate was bound to happen. Other airlines are posting large losses so BA is not alone.

I for one will be keeping faith with BA. Those of you out there who want to fly with LCC's are more than welcome but you are missing great service from a great airline. BA will bounce back and in a year we'll be wondering what all the fuss was about. It needs managers and customers to hold their nerve too and realise what great value you get for your money.

Yes but flying to LAS in smart B777's (rather than the worn out B744's of the other acrrier) should do wonders for the loads. Plus of course it will fit in nicely with the interlining and one world alliance traffic. Bring it on.

Exactly right Miles, they're looking at redundancies now simply because people are turning right instead of left when they get on the aircraft. I know it's a bit drastic but if people now want burgers instead of a gourmet meal then give them a burger. Put more economy seats on the aircraft is the answer. Hey maybe we should now get a job in management. We should charge for this bit of advice.:ok:

With all due respect, you don't and that is the problem.

BA is no longer a product worth paying a premium for, the competitive advantage that the innovation typified by flat beds (remember BA was the world leader in introducing these) no longer seems to be there and the company appears to be a follower, these days.

I fly Star Alliance, Emirate and other airlines in business quite regularly. For example, I did some flights to South America with Iberia last year, frankly with very low expectations and found the product and service to be very good (flat bed, good food/wine.) When I price the flights, BA is not often competitive and I don't see the extra value to pay more.

Its a shame, but there you are.

I have no doubt that the pilots are selected and trained to be the equal or better of their peers, but the cabin crew are not as good (consistently) as they used to be, for example I took 2 flights on the 'thigh grabber' in May.

One had an excellent purser (or whatever they are called) who monitored our needs in an unobtrusive way all the flight and the other crew did the very minimum, bfore retreating to read the Mail. To be fair, it was not their fault they had no Campari on board (outbound from LGW), but to be without soda water as well was pretty poor for an alleged 'full service' airline.

I do not understand what BA's strategy is and I get mixed messages from the airline - what I do know is that other airline's have better value propositions at the moment.

This is not BA bashing, as it would suit me to have another viable and vfm choice, I would come back in an instant, but the company has to start providing better value for money.

I heard on the radio earlier that he's refusing his wages for either June or July. (June I think it was). Interesting tactic there - big gesture from the big man, makes joe public impressed at his efforts, but really it won't make much of a difference! And of course, few will realise this.

Yes indeed - cut the bureaucratic layers, not the essential FOH support. Now is not the time for the airline to lose it's footing against it's rivals through worsening quality of service

The quoted legal duty times just go to show how totally out of touch CAP371 is. Plenty of modern and reputable research available but until we have a few more grisly aeroplane crashes nothing much will happen any time soon.

I am very pleased that BA industrial agreements take a slightly more realistic view of fatigue.

As one chief pilot said to me 'If I was a passenger I would like my pilots to be well fed and well rested'. I can reluctantly accept that I am unlikely to die in an air crash due to the slops which pass for crew meals but now that so many of us are bouncing off the legal annual flying hour limits it is hard to make an outsider really understand what it means to be permanently so very, very tired.

Good idea I reckon. Vegas has always been a tough place to get to easily, with only Virgin doing it. Although I think Bmi did it for a while too, as did My travel. It's not a great destination for the charters because it tends to be a 5 day kind of place, rather than a week destination which the charters prefer.

I'm sure Virgin won't be happy about it though!!!

I'm not at all surprised BA are turning to some Leisure routes. All of the business routes (and associated First and Business) are struggling right now. Leisure and Holiday routes are doing well in general - just ask Thomson or Thomas Cook....

M.Mouse,
While agreeing with your sentiment I have to say your attitude is going to kill BA. I work for a charter airline (I know most BA pilots look down their noses at us) that does regular UK LCA UK flights and plenty of UK CALGARY flights.
LCA is quite a long day but not too bad, Calgary with two crew over the atlantic is a BREEZE!!!
BA needs to change and change fast or it will become another failed airline!

He's giving up 1/12th of his £750k wages for the month of July. Like his gesture of no bonus last year he will recoup it back and more in future share options. £62.5k a month is about twice the average yearly wage for BA staff :eek:

We were told last Autumn that fuel hedging had cost us £350 million and that this was a one off cost. Does this mean that really we made a loss of £50 million if you follow on year on year?

Also the figure of £2.5 million a day bandied about by BA managers doesn't seem to stack up anymore. What is the real truth?

I'm not sure we should be criticising BA for providing a relief pilot on an 11hr 30 day. (I presume it's a 90min and not 60 min report). If only more airlines had such an enlightened view to FTLs. They are a limit, NOT a target. May BA long continue to take this view.

Well they have filed it with company house so it WILL be the figure as said. If not, then HMRC will have something to say I am sure!

If Willy Walsh's salary for July really makes a difference in all this, then he is getting paid way too much. Unfortunately in BA, as in many companies, there remain people on the pay role who do very little but always survive as friends of the right people. Been there and seen it.

I'm sure that wee willy winkle could afford not to be paid for even a year and maybe even several high managements roles could cope with what they get paid.

Even the company i work for, although very small, the owners have not taken their monthly salary since January 2009 just to preserve cash, they are living off their savings in order to protect the business.

Some BA staff need to wake up and get in the real world, yes the company is very generous compared to other airlines but i think now it will affect everyone. No doubt there will be job losses, revised terms of employment and people will be fighting for their jobs. In the cruel world that it is today, you have to be flexbile and make sacrifices.

Take out a few rows of economy seats and install some slot machines and a roulette table, probably make more profit than the seats:)

Last year for three months I could not do a full month's work because I had hit the annual rolling 900 hour total. I disagree that the duties you mention are 'not too bad' and a 'breeze'. In isolation they are. Flown regularly at the annual hours we, and no doubt you and most other UK operators, are flying cumulatively it is fatiguing which is why the pre-amble to CAP 371 states that the limits are absolute not to be considered targets or words to that effect.

If no airlines flew some of the ludicrously long duty days we would all be in the same boat and, therefore, nobody would have a competitive advantage on that score. What has happened is that all operators are forced to compete in a headlong race to the bottom. It has already been highlighted in the USA that fatigue is causing crashes. How long before we start seeing the same in the UK?

I will work as hard as BA require me to in order for the company to survive. It is not my attitude stopping that happening, I have no say over it and am already flying to the maximum I legally can, or very close to it. If less crew on fatiguing sectors is required I will fly them but please don't tell me it is sane or sensible to flog people to the limits.

I might add that I was not lucky enough to be sponsored nor be a career BA pilot. I was a DEP. I worked for a small outfit before BA. I have contemporaries working for Easyjet and Tui? (what was Brittania) and the last thing I, or indeed most of my colleagues, would be is so condescending as to look down our noses at fellow pilots all working damned hard to make a decent living. It is strange (and something I thought before joining BA) that BA pilots do appear to have an air of perceived arrogance. When I joined I was pleasantly surprised to find that they are 99% regular guys and most have a passion for flying like any other pilot working for any other airline.

I agree BA needs to change and change fast, the shame is that it is not just in the simple matter of pilot crewing levels alone where the change is needed.

BA should take 10 Million a put it on black as probably has as much risk in term of a profitable return as flying giving their losses.

ACC switches to 777 for Winter 09
 

Just noticed that the flight to ACC is going from being operated using a daily 767 to a daily 3 class 777 for Winter 09

Guessing with 8 747's and all the 757's being grounded for Winter 09/10 we will be seeing some more capacity changes coming out in the near future.

Whilst you might say this is apples and bananas, Ryanair pilots fly 900 hours a year, work a 5 on 4 off roster with 12 hour days thrown in occasionally for good measure and we rarely, if ever, see posts about fatigue from them. It's a rostering problem, not a deficiency in Cap 371.
For those of us old enough to remember pre 371, who all fought long and hard to get 371 implemented against fierce opposition from the airlines, this fuss looks like a childish hissy fit by pampered children. When 371 became law we all applauded the new regulations as being both reasonable and workable.
What has changed so much in BA that they now argue that 371 is inadequate?
I say again, your rostering department is the problem, not 371.

1987 BA shares float at 125p.
2009 BA shares at 157p.
1997 BA shares peak at 700p.

Now what investor will take another flyer with that sort of an investment track record in any company - let alone the airline.
There are two points that must be done to even start to reform BA.

1. Some of the working practices and the unions especial regarding rostering inflexibility.

2.The £3 billion shortfall of assets against liabilities caused by the pension fund. Althought this is closed to new staff, 35,000 BA employees continue to accrue benefits. (Total staff 41,00(?))

Since in the Britain of today, there is no hope of tampering with either of the above one might as well invest one's money in motor racing and continue to fly Virgin.

BA lost the plot a long time ago when they decided to concentrate on Business Class pasengers and treat economy passengers with overt contempt.

The model worked fine up to last year as London is an International business center and there were plenty of business travelers to fill the seats. This is no longer the case.

Worse for them, their planes are configured with so many business class seats that even full economy sections (with decent yields) will not help them now.